#1
First of all i wanna thank the guys that replied to my previous threads for giving me their personal opinions about the topics I addressed. It would be nice if they could help me with this one too. So here s the thing : i want a tube amp capable of doing metal (mostly high gain stuff) that also have an ok clean channel (not a very crunchy clean like blackstar ht metal 5 has). As i said in my previous threads , I will have the amp 90% of the time in my apartment and 10% in my drummers place. So which of the two would you choose and why? Thanks in advance!
#2
I don't think the engl is all-tube, if that matters.

Personally I'm not sure I'd be that keen on el84s for metal, though that applies to both amps.

EDIT: I haven't tried either, just to point out. High wattage amps often (not always) sound better than lower wattage amps at really low (home) volumes if you need heavier tones.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Jul 21, 2016,
#3
The issue you might run into with either of those amps is headroom - the blackstar clean channel is actually quite clean as long as you playing at a lower volume, when you have to crank it the clean channels starts to break up into a crunchy clean as you mentioned. For playing at home the heads you have suggested would be fine on the clean channel, but if you have to turn them up to jam with a drummer you are likely to have the same headroom issue and start to get a bit of breakup on the clean. They will have more headroom than the blackstar but still have limits.

Depending on how loud you need the clean channel to be and how clean you need it to be you might have to look at a higher wattage amp to increase the clean headroom.
#4
Dave_Mcguitarsngear So you guys saying that a 50 watt head and upwards would do a better job on both high gain and clean stuff? Maybe something like an evh 5150 iii 50w or a peavey 6505 (but 120w isnt a bit too much for home use? no problem in rehearsals though ) ? Thanks for your replies btw
#5
The idea is that you don't want power amp saturation anyway, so you might as well get a higher wattage amp. Both the EVH 5150III and the Peavey 6505(+) will do what you want. The EVH has the better clean channel by far in my opinion.
Last edited by I K0nijn I at Jul 22, 2016,
#6
100/120 watts is pretty much overkill for anything. Pretty much any time you need that sort of volume, everything's going to be mic'd up anyways :P All about the headroom! And yeah the 50w 5153 will do what you want. The combos also come with the ability to dial the power from 50 down to 1W. Kinda wish the 50w head had the same power dial. My boosted 50w + 212 just sounds pretty loose at TV volumes, it doesn't start to sound right until it gets the power section working. Maybe it's the speakers in the 5153 cab? Then again, it's also possible that I got spoiled with my old 6505 & mesa 4x12 and then 4 (?) years with my Kemper. Those sound(ed) great at any volume. I think I'm going to try and find a used cab with vintage 30s to pair up with the 5150 III :P
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#7
you probably won't ever need the 100/120 watt but its more about getting the headroom you need, but that is why they make volume knobs. The 5153 might well be a better choice for your needs, another amp I might throw in the mix is a MESA single Rec, they are 50W and have a very nice clean channel along with the ability to do all the metal you want. They don't make the single anymore its basically been replaced by the mini rectifier line so you will have to get one used, but a nice used one would fall right into your budget window.
#8
Quote by johny0423
Dave_Mcguitarsngear So you guys saying that a 50 watt head and upwards would do a better job on both high gain and clean stuff? Maybe something like an evh 5150 iii 50w or a peavey 6505 (but 120w isnt a bit too much for home use? no problem in rehearsals though ) ? Thanks for your replies btw


i'm not saying it definitely will (some higher wattage amps don't sound good turned down), but it may well be just as good if not better at really low volumes. it just depends on how quietly you have to play (and it's worth bearing in mind that 20 watts are really, really loud too in a home environment, you won't be cranking 20 watts either) and your own preference. you really just have to try a bunch of amps and see which sounds best at the volumes you're most likely to be playing at most of the time. and bear in mind the amp will sound quieter in the guitar shop than it will in your house.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#9
6505 is horrible with cleans, possibly you can mod the preamp tube to a 12au7 instead of 12ax7 for a colder response but that still won't be a clean amp to look for. Maybe the EVH III since that one is said to have a cleaner clean channel.

I'd probably get something like an amp that can do higher and lower wattage. In my case I got the Mesa Mini Recto.
#10
In the big 5150/6505 a 12dw7 works wonders in V2 to enhance the cleans and not alter the red channel.
Guitars:
Jackson Kelly KE3 - MIJ (Distortion/Jazz)
Jackson DKMGT Dinky (EMG 81/85)
ESP E-II Eclipse Custom (JB/'59)
ESP LTD EC-1001FR (EMG 81/60)
Fender MIM Strat

Amps:
Mesa/Boogie Dual Rectifier Roadster 212
Laney IronHeart IRT-Studio
Peavey Vypyr 30
Peavey ReValver Amp Sims
TOOOO many T.C. Electronic Pedals. . .
#11
DarthV So do you think the 50w evh combo might be more worth getting than the head? I heard that the attenuators in all these tube combos dont do really anything and u can get a pretty good high gain tone with keeping the volume knob low. This definately doesnt apply for cleans though :p. Also the combo is too damn heavy
#13
^ it's up to you regarding the combo versus the head. if the circuit's the same (it isn't always, but it sometimes is) it's pretty much down to the weight thing, as you said, plus you have more choice with different cabinets if you get the head.

jet city is pretty good for not too much money.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#14
Quote by johny0423
DarthV So do you think the 50w evh combo might be more worth getting than the head? I heard that the attenuators in all these tube combos dont do really anything and u can get a pretty good high gain tone with keeping the volume knob low. This definately doesnt apply for cleans though :p. Also the combo is too damn heavy


Well the 1x12 isn't _that_ heavy. After moving my old 6505 212 combo, I'll agree on the 212 combos being bitch bitches

And I haven't tried the 5153 combos to know how well the power dial works. With modern high gain amps, you get all the gain you want at any volume. That's not the issue. Every amp has a volume floor at which they start to sound how they are supposed to. In my case, my 5153, OD and 212 cab need to be over 1 for that to happen. That's starting to get into apartment neighbor complain territory. Or more like late evening complaints :P

I also have a suspicion that it's more on the speakers than the amp. My old 6505 sounded pretty good at TV volumes through a V30 loaded mesa 4x12. Actually wouldn't mind finding a 2x12 with V30s to do a comparison with the EVH's G12H speakers.
Fleet of MiJ Ibanez
Couple of Balls
Peavey & EVH Wolfgangs
Eclipse
Fender HM Strat
Kemper KPA
5150 III 50w & cabs