#1
Hi

I have to make a decision between two options

1) I could buy the Line 6 Amplifi FX100 as an amp moddeler
2) I could buy a amp with pedals and mic it up

I would like to use this rig to play small gigs and practice at home. I'm quite new to this so I would as much advise as possible. My main issue is I've heard people say line 6 gear disappears when it is mixed with the whole band(Drums, other electric etc...)

Thanks
#3
My opinion (and it is just my opinion, don't mistake this for fact) is that modellers are good practice tools, and can be useful in the studio, but I'd choose a "real" amp for the live situation every time.

That said, without knowing what amp you're talking about we can't answer. For all we know you might be talking about mic'ing up an MG.....

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#4
Real amp is always better. It will motivate you to play more when you can "feel" the notes punching through the air. I get bored with line-in play
#5
Quote by eugene.j.lero
My main issue is I've heard people say line 6 gear disappears when it is mixed with the whole band(Drums, other electric etc...)


Ignore that.
That's someone's individual issue and lack of control, and not assignable to a whole manufacturer's line of gear.

Quote by Sayonara6String
Real amp is always better. It will motivate you to play more when you can "feel" the notes punching through the air. I get bored with line-in play


There are always those who need to feel their pants flap.

And, of course, the two are not mutually exclusive. I have modelers and use them both with headphones and with powered speakers or power amps plus speaker cabs right up to arena-class. I routinely use a pair of KRK Rokit 8 studio monitors (100W each, 35Hz - 35Khz response, max 109 dB). I have 18W and 50W tube amp powered speakers (Atomic Reactor 112-18 and 212-50), a pair of 2x12 (plus tweeters) cabinets and four cabinets based around 15"LF, 6.5" mids and 1"HF drivers powered by 1500W power amps. All of them work with my modelers (for both bass and guitar) and with keyboards.

The FX100 you've specified is extremely versatile as a practice and live tool.

If you go the other direction, have you figured in the costs of the individual pedals and the mike (and have you ever miked an amp)? Note that if you mike an amp, your ability to have your sound show up when mixed with the whole band is, in large part, dependent upon whomever is actually at the mixer controlling the overall sound. Your sound will also depend on mike placement, ambient stage noise around the mike, etc. I usually feel I have a lot more control with a modeler/preamp and its output directly to the mixer.
Last edited by dspellman at Oct 10, 2016,
#6
Arguably, modeling has gotten to the point where it is a viable option over physical amps. However, most of the really good modelers are expensive (Kemper, Axe-FX, Helix). You can get good results with other units, though. In the price range of the Amplifi unit, I think the POD HD500X (used) will be a better buy for you. In that same price range, you can get tube amps that will have their own focused sound, but they will be much less versatile and you will end up spending much more for pedals methinks. For modelers, you can always get a powered wedge monitor for volume, but send a direct out to PA.
#7
what kind of music?
what is your budget?
what are some of your target tones?

etc...
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#9
i would like to bring up the fact that even if you use an amp modeler you will still need an amp if you want to play live. the amp may just be a power amp with monitor speakers, but the crowd still needs to hear you and that necessitates an amp. mind you, if the venues you are playing at provide a PA and monitor then you are set for gigs, but you still have to consider practice situations.

so if you plan on going the amp sim route then make sure you have enough for a small PA more a powered monitor in your budget.

sims don't 'dissappear' in the mix as long as you know how to dial in an amp and standalone amps aren't strictly better. an amp sim is an acceptable alternative imo and can actually be more flexible by providing multiple models with one setup. i personally use traditional amps, it's what i prefer but i wouldn't discount the extensive use of amp sims.
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Last edited by gumbilicious at Oct 10, 2016,
#10
I think it really comes down to your playing preferences and the styles of music you play in your situation.

If you don't require a ton of different tones and effects, perhaps going the route of an amp and a decent pedal or two would suit you best. There are some good options for amps, IMO, in the 15-30 watt range that should fit well in your price point. A lower wattage tube amp (either one or two channel) plus a decent OD pedal to boost it into leads/heavier territory covers plenty of tonal range, if that's what you need.

With a 15-30 watt tube amp, you probably won't need to worry about running your amp through the PA at a small, indoor venue if you don't have the equipment to do so. At an outdoor gig you would want to mic up, but depending on the gigs you're playing, there is hopefully a sound guy running the PA. If not, a decent mic, cable, and stand is a pretty small investment to make.

If you're the type who wants to use and/or experiment with a variety of effects or want a number of different amp models to tinker with, then maybe a decent multi-effects is the route for you. I would still invest in some sort of cab/monitor to use for practice and stage volume if you do choose this route, though. I'd also add that there is a significant gap between your high end modellers and the more affordable units which are going to fall in your price range. In my experience playing a number of those units through the years, I think each of them has their strengths and weaknesses in terms of the tones they offer. Some do high gain better than others, while some might best used for their clean sounds. I would do your homework and if possible, try before you buy.

On the topic of Line 6/modellers in general and not sitting well in a mix, more often than not the problem lies with user error either on the part of the player (who scoops his mids and has no concept of fitting into a mix) or a fairly incompetent sound man.
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#11
If grab a used flextones or better yet vetta before the amplfi.
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#12
Quote by dspellman
Ignore that.
That's someone's individual issue and lack of control, and not assignable to a whole manufacturer's line of gear.


There are always those who need to feel their pants flap.

And, of course, the two are not mutually exclusive. I have modelers and use them both with headphones and with powered speakers or power amps plus speaker cabs right up to arena-class. I routinely use a pair of KRK Rokit 8 studio monitors (100W each, 35Hz - 35Khz response, max 109 dB). I have 18W and 50W tube amp powered speakers (Atomic Reactor 112-18 and 212-50), a pair of 2x12 (plus tweeters) cabinets and four cabinets based around 15"LF, 6.5" mids and 1"HF drivers powered by 1500W power amps. All of them work with my modelers (for both bass and guitar) and with keyboards.

The FX100 you've specified is extremely versatile as a practice and live tool.

If you go the other direction, have you figured in the costs of the individual pedals and the mike (and have you ever miked an amp)? Note that if you mike an amp, your ability to have your sound show up when mixed with the whole band is, in large part, dependent upon whomever is actually at the mixer controlling the overall sound. Your sound will also depend on mike placement, ambient stage noise around the mike, etc. I usually feel I have a lot more control with a modeler/preamp and its output directly to the mixer.


If you are talking about not hearing or feeling yourself LIVE, I can attest that it can be something hard to get used to. I moved to IEM a year or so ago and they are custom molded to my ears so they block a LOT of sound. It took me a LONG time to get used to hearing it in my head, as opposed to all around me, even with my amp and guitar mixed into my monitor mix (in my ears). I don't think that is a me thing, so it might just be something you have to get used to (if you don't have a live amp on stage or a monitor). Just my very strong opinion on that.

THAT BEING SAID I often play with an LIVE amp and no cab, just direct out to my board then the FOH board. Yea it helps having monitors but I can make it work either way. It took some time but it's fine for me. I love hearing myself though, great tone all around!
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#13
as far as them sitting in the mix, usually it is a bit more uphill battle than with amplifiers. A lot of users first tend to put on too many effects as "all the effects are there, why not use them" mentality. That starts clouding the guitar attack and washes off.

Then the other problem is monitoring vs FOH sound. If you don't carry some kind of amp with you, you're at the mercy of the venue, and usually the sound guy will mix instruments low as not to damage his stage monitors, or just because they can't handle it well.

The other big issue that maybe wasn't mentioned is that processor patches are usually written at home with headphones and haven't been properly tested at stage volume.

It is mainly knowledge of the gear. For the most part I can make myself sound OK in both situations, amps or processors, much easier to tweak an amp fast and get it done as you'd have 3 channels at most. With processors you'd have to change all your patches and save them, compare, re-save, etc.