#1
I've been playing acoustic for a long time now so not a guitar beginner. Now, I've decided to buy an electric one (a good beginner guitar, which would probably run with me for a long time without a need for questioning it against higher ends anytime soon). So i've been researching for a while and got to a few models. First one is [Ibanez RG350DXZ](http://www.ibanez.com/products/eg_detail.php?year=2016&area_id=3&cat_id=1&series_id=1&data_id=276&color=CL01) or [Ibanez RG421EX](http://www.ibanez.com/products/eg_detail.php?year=2016&area_id=3&cat_id=1&series_id=1&data_id=286&color=CL01) and the other ESP LTD EC-1000 FM.

I mostly listen to hard rock and heavy metal (country as well). Slash, led zeppelin, guns and roses, eric clapton, Iron Maiden .. then keith urban, george strait (country). I'm preferring an HSH, Mahagony body (read somewhere to be better than basewood for metal).

So i had a few questions:

* Firstly, which one should i buy among the above mentioned (All are mahagony but only one is HSH) or are there any other guitars that could offer better sound in about the same beginner price? (Epiphone les paul standard, or any in Cort/Schecter low ranges? How about Yamaha Pacifica 112v for metal?).
Although i don't prefer the les paul style but would go with ESP in case it has a better sound.

* Secondly, should i stick to HSH configuration? Will HH provide me brighter/clean tones (with middle position i.e one in each neck and bridge humbucker, for country etc) since the ESP LTD M1000FM and 421EX i mentioned are HH.

* Third is the floating bridge (whammy). Although not important really, still could it cause problems with the tuning etc (for a beginner)? Although i'm ready to learn/solve any problems that could occur in case.

Again which would be best among the three?
#2
EC-1000 probably sounds the best of those three, but be aware that there are different models, some are with EMG active pickups, some are with passive Seymour Duncans, if you're gonna play lots of rock and country you should consider getting the one with passives. If you don't want a floating bridge, then don't get a guitar with one. If you do want it, then get it, but otherwise, it's not worth it.
#3
Quote by thefrozenshore

I mostly listen to hard rock and heavy metal (country as well). Slash, led zeppelin, guns and roses, eric clapton, Iron Maiden .. then keith urban, george strait (country). I'm preferring an HSH, Mahagony body (read somewhere to be better than basewood for metal).

I also read somewhere that paying a company $50 a month for a sugar pill will detox my liver.

What you 'read somewhere' is wrong most of the time.

'Tonewoods' are something that in a realistic playing setting, don't exist to the extent that it's actually worth thinking about. I'd largely ignore what people say about one 'tonewood' sounding better than another and I wouldn't base your purchase of a guitar on what wood it's made from, unless it's solely for weight and aesthetic reasons. And if you're getting a guitar that's in a solid colour, aesthetics don't matter. What matters so much more are pickups. And then even that is academic if you don't have a good amp.

What amp are you running?
So i had a few questions:
* Firstly, which one should i buy among the above mentioned (All are mahagony but only one is HSH) or are there any other guitars that could offer better sound in about the same beginner price? (Epiphone les paul standard, or any in Cort/Schecter low ranges? How about Yamaha Pacifica 112v for metal?).
Although i don't prefer the les paul style but would go with ESP in case it has a better sound.

You're talking about guitars from entirely different price ranges here. Of course the EC1000 is the best guitar of what you've listed but that guitar is substantially more expensive than any of the others. Get a body style that you find comfortable. One body style doesn't sound better than another one. Depending on how they're put together (such as routing) they might sound different acoustically, but that's neither a good thing or a bad thing. Get a superstrat if you find it comfortable. Don't get a Les Paul styled guitar because you think the shape sounds better. That's nonsense.
* Secondly, should i stick to HSH configuration? Will HH provide me brighter/clean tones (with middle position i.e one in each neck and bridge humbucker, for country etc) since the ESP LTD M1000FM and 421EX i mentioned are HH.

Entirely depends on the rest of your setup and how important having the middle single coil is to you. HH in the middle position sounds like 2 humbuckers in the middle position. a single coil in the middle sounds like just that. So no. They don't sound the same. You won't have so easy a time finding a guitar with an HSH config. Really only Ibanez does that. If nothing else, you can listen to sound clips of what the basic tonal differences are and that'll give you a very rough idea. But the best thing to do is to simply go play a bunch of guitars in different pickup configs and see what you find to be the most useful.
* Third is the floating bridge (whammy). Although not important really, still could it cause problems with the tuning etc (for a beginner)? Although i'm ready to learn/solve any problems that could occur in case.

If having a vibrato is not important to you then avoid them. Simple as that. They introduce their own problems even when they're not being used such as detuning on double bends, more of a pain in the ass to set up, tuning issues depending on the vibrato system you're talking about etc. If you're not going to use them, then it makes no sense to buy a guitar with one.
Quote by Axelfox
Please understand how little we as a community care
#4
T00DEEPBLUE

Thanks for the input! Actually i'm getting a new ESP LTD EC1000 FM, about 100$ cheaper than the RG350DXZ. But again you got me wrong, i wasn't relating the shape to the sound. Its just that i don't find Les Paul much aesthetically pleasing compared to a strat. But then, those are just the looks and i might decide to buy ESP if it sounds significantly better than the RG (the big problem with me is since i'm new to playing the electrical sound i can't differentiate the minute sound difference in the stores right now which i might later once i start playing. That's why i'm asking to make a decision beforehand).

The amp that i'm thinking to buy "initially" would be either Roland Microcube/ Vox pathfinder or the Blackstar 20W that i really liked while testing in the stores.

Now i read about the mahagony body producing heavier sound than Basewood in the UG forum itself. There are way too many references that are preferring MH over Basewood.
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=311930
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1545723
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=353526
Besides these i still remember a thread in which someone said MH produces heavier sounds comparatively. Can't find it right now.

So finally the thing is if both humbuckers in the middle position give the sound similar to a single coil or atleast are suitable for playing some non heavy music ( other than hard rock/metal like brighter country etc), well i woudn't feel the need for a single coil and would go with Ibanez 421ex (mentioned above) since it is fixed bridge as well. The only thing that's stopping me is its HH config.

Would any decent amp work these models? Or are they divided as well depending on the genre you play i.e some more suitable for heavy stuff etc? Thanks though!
Last edited by thefrozenshore at Oct 23, 2016,
#5
Deepblue is pretty much spot on.....I do like floating trems for tuning stability. If you set a Floyd properly & it's a 1/2 decent unit they stay in tune for ever. Unlike my non Floyds which have to be tuned & retuned during a decent practice session. I check my Ibanez every time but I may need a fine tune 1 or 2 strings every couple times but for the most part it's ready to roll. have had numerous different Floyds from 80's Charvels new MIJ So-Cal's & MIJ & indo Ibanez & find that to be the case with all of them.

The EC more than likely is the better of the couple choices but I don't mind the Indo or MIJ Ibanez RG's at all. I have only owned a couple new ones 2012 or above. RG1550 MIJ & RG2XXXX I hot rodded up to Vai style since it was neon yellow. I bought this Indo JEM with all intentions of gutting & modding it like the RG2 I did with Evo's and all of that but honestly after playing it for a couple months now it really isn't needed. Stays in tune as good as any guitar I have owned and plays like butter! I got it for 1/2 price because the trem arm was missing. I don't use them much so not a big deal,I do want to get one for it though.
16' Gibson SG Std.
15' Ibanez JEM Jr.
OD9 Pro+>CM-2>BC-2>Wylde Phase>Gravy>Flashback
Marshall JCM800>V212(Vet.30/ET-65)
Ibanez TSA15H>1x12 (G12n-65)
Randall RVC5>1x12 (G12n-65)
#6
^ HH in the middle position doesn't sound anything like a single coil, but it probably is a setting that is useful for lower gain tones. it just depends on what you prefer.
Quote by crownegamers
I saw in a couple of pictures that on Bucketheads Les Paul (only some pictures) that his neck pickup is painted in white. Can anyone explain to me why he would do this, and if there are any pros and cons.

Quote by dspellman
The guy wears a KFC Bucket and a white mask during performances, and you're interested in the color of his pickup covers?

#7
16' Gibson SG Std.
15' Ibanez JEM Jr.
OD9 Pro+>CM-2>BC-2>Wylde Phase>Gravy>Flashback
Marshall JCM800>V212(Vet.30/ET-65)
Ibanez TSA15H>1x12 (G12n-65)
Randall RVC5>1x12 (G12n-65)
#8
Quote by thefrozenshore
T00DEEPBLUE

Thanks for the input! Actually i'm getting a new ESP LTD EC1000 FM, about 100$ cheaper than the RG350DXZ. But again you got me wrong, i wasn't relating the shape to the sound. Its just that i don't find Les Paul much aesthetically pleasing compared to a strat. But then, those are just the looks and i might decide to buy ESP if it sounds significantly better than the RG (the big problem with me is since i'm new to playing the electrical sound i can't differentiate the minute sound difference in the stores right now which i might later once i start playing. That's why i'm asking to make a decision beforehand).

Are you sure you're not referring to the EC100, and not the EC1000 because if you did, then it would make a lot more sense to get that guitar $100 cheaper than an Indonesian-made RG350. You can get an RG350 for about £300 here. An EC1000 costs more than twice that in the UK.

Can you link me to where you have seen someone sell such a guitar so cheap? At that low a price for a brand new EC1000, i'm leaning towards it being a counterfeit.
The amp that i'm thinking to buy "initially" would be either Roland Microcube/ Vox pathfinder or the Blackstar 20W that i really liked while testing in the stores.

To be honest those are pretty crappy amps. When it comes to amps so cheap you get what you pay for. I'd suggest looking at the Peavey Vypyr amps, one with at least a 12" speaker in it as I honestly think they're the best overall as a budget modeller.


Now i read about the mahagony body producing heavier sound than Basewood in the UG forum itself. There are way too many references that are preferring MH over Basewood.
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=311930
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1545723
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=353526
Besides these i still remember a thread in which someone said MH produces heavier sounds comparatively. Can't find it right now.

2 of those threads are from over 10 years ago, the UG community has grown up a bit since then. Just because a couple of users from UG have said it in the past doesn't make it true. Suffice to say that outside of placebo you're really not going to notice anything significant whatsoever. And given that you've admitted that you aren't experienced enough to hear nuances anyway, I really wouldn't count on yourself hearing any difference either. So don't worry about it.
So finally the thing is if both humbuckers in the middle position give the sound similar to a single coil or atleast are suitable for playing some non heavy music ( other than hard rock/metal like brighter country etc), well i woudn't feel the need for a single coil and would go with Ibanez 421ex (mentioned above) since it is fixed bridge as well. The only thing that's stopping me is its HH config.

Play a bunch of HH guitars in a store and see for yourself. Then play a couple of HSH guitars. Though the pickup in all of them are going to be different, it'll give you some basic idea of what the differences are. And that's really the only way you're going to know how important it'll be to you.
Would any decent amp work these models? Or are they divided as well depending on the genre you play i.e some more suitable for heavy stuff etc? Thanks though!
Yes. There's nothing to prevent you from playing any style on any guitar. It's isn't the case that a certain guitar will wholly prevent you from playing a certain style. That's just not how it works. They're all planks of wood with strings on them at the end of the day. If you think a certain guitar will facilitate your needs better than another guitar, then that is the guitar you should buy any day of the week. Regardless of what anyone on the internet tells you about 'this guitar can only play metal and nothing else.'
Quote by Axelfox
Please understand how little we as a community care
#9
Quote by thefrozenshore
T00DEEPBLUE

Thanks for the input! Actually i'm getting a new ESP LTD EC1000 FM, about 100$ cheaper than the RG350DXZ. But again you got me wrong, i wasn't relating the shape to the sound. Its just that i don't find Les Paul much aesthetically pleasing compared to a strat. But then, those are just the looks and i might decide to buy ESP if it sounds significantly better than the RG (the big problem with me is since i'm new to playing the electrical sound i can't differentiate the minute sound difference in the stores right now which i might later once i start playing. That's why i'm asking to make a decision beforehand).

The amp that i'm thinking to buy "initially" would be either Roland Microcube/ Vox pathfinder or the Blackstar 20W that i really liked while testing in the stores.

Now i read about the mahagony body producing heavier sound than Basewood in the UG forum itself. There are way too many references that are preferring MH over Basewood.
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=311930
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1545723
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=353526
Besides these i still remember a thread in which someone said MH produces heavier sounds comparatively. Can't find it right now.

So finally the thing is if both humbuckers in the middle position give the sound similar to a single coil or atleast are suitable for playing some non heavy music ( other than hard rock/metal like brighter country etc), well i woudn't feel the need for a single coil and would go with Ibanez 421ex (mentioned above) since it is fixed bridge as well. The only thing that's stopping me is its HH config.

Would any decent amp work these models? Or are they divided as well depending on the genre you play i.e some more suitable for heavy stuff etc? Thanks though!

If you don't need a middle pick up then you don't need it. Plenty of famous guitar players don't have a middle PU. Some of your choices actually have split coil PU's & truthfully there isn't a right guitar or tone wood for any style of music. Sure some may be better than others but you can play any style on any style of guitar depending on your skill & other gear. Just remember all this advice is all that person's preference. I tried out & owned ALOT of guitars deciding which I liked best. Something may feel great now but a couple months later you change your mind what you want or you get a different amp,it all effects each other.
16' Gibson SG Std.
15' Ibanez JEM Jr.
OD9 Pro+>CM-2>BC-2>Wylde Phase>Gravy>Flashback
Marshall JCM800>V212(Vet.30/ET-65)
Ibanez TSA15H>1x12 (G12n-65)
Randall RVC5>1x12 (G12n-65)
#10
T00DEEPBLUE

Just rechecked the model. What i'm talking about is this one. EC 1000 QM. https://www.amazon.com/ESP-LTD-EC-1000QM-Black-Cherry/dp/B0002GUDPO
I guess i was mistaking this one with the FM.

In the amps i was suggested a Marshall MG15 CM by the shopkeeper. If you suggest Peavy (considering im going for a 15-20 W amp) i already had this in mind. Is it a decent amp?
https://www.amazon.com/Peavey-Vypyr-15-Modeling-Amplifier/dp/B0035GWSV0/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8


Or are they divided as well depending on the genre you play i.e some more suitable for heavy stuff etc Actually i was talking about the amps here (don't know if these are also categorised (or are more suitable) according to a particular style)

If a floating bridge in this range could be a pain (even without using the trem), i would go with a fixed bridge then (probably 421ex) and make the choice after deciding between the middle pickup position sound (in hsh and hh) then.
Thanks!
Last edited by thefrozenshore at Oct 23, 2016,
#11
thefrozenshore Where are you finding an RG350DXZ that costs more than an EC1000? That's a complete ripoff.

For the love of god do not get a Marshall MG. Those things sound abominable.

If you're going to get a modelling amp, it is imperative that you get one with at least a 12" speaker. They're the standard size for guitar speaker cabinets. Smaller speakers cannot physically emulate the frequency response of the 12" speakers and you will always have problems with trying to reproduce bass notes and controlling mids and treble with smaller speakers. Even if it costs you a bit more to get one with a 12", its importance cannot be stressed enough. Smaller ones will always hold you back.
Quote by Axelfox
Please understand how little we as a community care
#12
T00DEEPBLUE Actually the ESP one, i'm not getting it online but in a nearby store. The person says its last until the stock refreshes. So maybe. I'l still reconfirm the next time. The 12'' amp will then be way too over my amp budget (almost twice the initial amp budget). Peavy Vypyr VIP 2? i might have to wait a little while then for that.
#13
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
thefrozenshore Where are you finding an RG350DXZ that costs more than an EC1000? That's a complete ripoff.

For the love of god do not get a Marshall MG. Those things sound abominable.

If you're going to get a modelling amp, it is imperative that you get one with at least a 12" speaker. They're the standard size for guitar speaker cabinets. Smaller speakers cannot physically emulate the frequency response of the 12" speakers and you will always have problems with trying to reproduce bass notes and controlling mids and treble with smaller speakers. Even if it costs you a bit more to get one with a 12", its importance cannot be stressed enough. Smaller ones will always hold you back.



+1 something is wrong with OP's numbers.

an EC1000 used goes for $500-$600 (US), and a used 350dx is maybe $200 (US)

I think you are thinking EC100 and a 350dx.

avoid the MG's like the plague. seriously flat out trash.

if you are buying a guitar in the cost range of an EC1000 i would get a cheaper guitar and get a better amp.

tone woods don't weigh heavily on tone. i own enough guitars and have had enough to tell you that.

+1 to a 12" speaker. vypyr 30w are nice for the money.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.


***9V BATTERIES ARE FROM HELL!*** (updated 2016-11-27)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/