#1
Hello,
as I said in the title, I need a new amp and I need some advice on which one I must pick.
I want it to play with my band (we play psychedelic rock, with influences of progressive, folk and blues) and doing concerts. My style is bluesy and I like a lot the classic late 60's sound, but I love also to experiment with textures and effects (I don't have effect pedals yet, just a Wah, but I play with them on Guitar Rig with my guitar connected to the PC), and my fav guitarists are Jimmy Page, David Gilmour, Clapton, Rory Gallagher... My budget is 300€ (315$ more or less). My current main guitar is a Vintage V100. I've been looking on internet the Fender Champion 100, the Boss Katana and Laney LV100, but I'm open to new options.

Thanks in advance!
Last edited by Miralles19 at Jan 11, 2017,
#2
Is your budget flexible at all? Personally I'd say go tube for that, and thomann (for example) has several tube combos just over between the 300 and 400 Euro mark.

Or there are the Laney Cub 10 or 12 or 12R which are under budget but I haven't tried them (but I think they're quite well-regarded).
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

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#3
Dave_Mc
I've just searched that Laney Cub 12R you mentioned, but I'm afraid because of that 15w, do you think it will work well to play in clubs with medium size, to 100-200 people, even more?
#4
Miralles19 all amps are different (volume vs Watts), but you typically need at least 40W to play with a band.
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#5
You might be best served with a low wattage tube amp to get the sounds your after. That may be tough on your budget. I wouldn't worry so much about high wattage for playing clubs...a lot of people prefer miking and utilizing the club PA system and foregoing dealing with a big heavy head and 4x12.
#7
Miralles19 nope, applies to tube amps too. Again, it depends on the amp (some 20W tube amps are really loud), but in general I wouldn't gig with anything less than about 40W. If you have a quiet drummer and the amp is mic'd you can get away with fewer Watts.
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#8
if you are mic'd i wouldn't worry much about wattage, UNLESS you want pristine cleans, then you can roll off the volume knob on the guitar a bit too. i gigged with my 5E3 clone mic'd and was fine. i needed a monitor to be sure i could hear myself.

it seems like i have been recommending it a lot which is probably its in my head since i am modding one, would be a Peavey Valve King 50 combo. in the states $200 would get you one. or i would recommend jet city at your budget, but i personally don't care for them, and you won't get cleans unless you step up the budget a little bit.
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#9
Quote by Miralles19
Dave_Mc
I've just searched that Laney Cub 12R you mentioned, but I'm afraid because of that 15w, do you think it will work well to play in clubs with medium size, to 100-200 people, even more?


I'm not sure, I don't actually gig. As far as I'm aware, most people seem to say 15-20W is ok (assuming it does the types of tone you want) as long as you don't need cleans. If you need cleans (unless you know you're going to be miked, I guess) more wattage is better.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#10
Well, and what do you think about Vox AV30, it would be loud enough to give concerts and gig?
#11
For pub gigs (30-60 people) a 15w tube amp or 60w SS is a sweet spot. Just enough to run with the drummer and lots of squishy compression for solos. I gig often with a SuperChamp for those and it covers Doors, Clapton, Gilmour, Harrison quite well. For larger clubs with 100-200 people you will nearly always have your amp mic'd regardless if you are running a small 15w tube amp or a 120w 5150. Just the way it is.

Laney Cub 12, Super Champ, Blues Jr. are all solid amps used by experienced pros for typical pub gigs. On a limited budget, great tone is always more important than watts.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Jan 12, 2017,
#12
There is no way you can play Pink Floyd cleans with a 15w tube amp and be heard over a drummer. At those levels it would start to break up. a 40W (65-100w SS) tube amp is ideal. 40W will have enough clean headroom to be heard over a drummer and will push more bass as bass frequencies require more power to be projected. If you are happy with the sound of a compressed tube amp, you can go with the 15W (I would not suggest SS breakup). You will be able to achieve great tones but you are likely to notice some breakup.

Your favourite players are from the tube amp era, so your best bet is a tube amp. Most decent tube amps cost 500-600 new for a 15W and around 700-800 for a 40W. With your budget you should hold your money or go used. If you can mic the amp you may be able to get away with a smaller amp.
#13
Quote by Gab_Azz
There is no way you can play Pink Floyd cleans with a 15w tube amp and be heard over a drummer.


I do all the time but it does depend on your drummer and his ability to use dynamics. For reference, a 40w tube amp is only 4db louder clean headroom than a 15w. Approximately 116db vs 112db clean RMS headroom with a similar 100db spl speaker. Not very much louder.

YMMV
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Jan 12, 2017,
#14
Quote by Cajundaddy
I do all the time but it does depend on your drummer and his ability to use dynamics. For reference, a 40w tube amp is only 4db louder clean headroom than a 15w. Approximately 116db vs 112db clean RMS headroom with a similar 100db spl speaker. Not very much louder.

YMMV


Yes the speaker efficiency plays a huge role in the volume. Then cleans are quite subjective. Cleans need headroom, but a compressed signal with some harmonic distortion can be considered clean sound and even better for some as it adds sparked to the guitar tones. Also, please note that db is not a linear scale but a logarithmic scale so 4db difference is more than 30% increase!
#15
Quote by Gab_Azz
Yes the speaker efficiency plays a huge role in the volume. Then cleans are quite subjective. Cleans need headroom, but a compressed signal with some harmonic distortion can be considered clean sound and even better for some as it adds sparked to the guitar tones. Also, please note that db is not a linear scale but a logarithmic scale so 4db difference is more than 30% increase!


Of course. 60db is library quiet and 110db is Rolling Stones concert loud. How loud does one need to be for a typical pub gig? We used to regularly get warned or flatly kicked-out of Hollywood clubs because we were "way too damn loud". Those were the days when I ran a 50w Marshall or 40w Super Reverb wide open. EVH had a similar experience back then prompting the use of a variac to control his volume. Venues in LA are much more SPL sensitive these days requiring a lot lower stage volume and running everything through the PA. This makes my big amps pretty unnecessary so a 15-20w 1x12 seems just about right. I do still own the Super Reverb but she doesn't get out much. The Plexi is long gone because she was only really sublime when dimed.

Choose the right tools for the job at hand. Often for me these days that means a small 15-20w tube amp, volume 1/2 way up, and an SM57 in the gig bag just in case. YMMV
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Jan 15, 2017,
#16
Quote by Cajundaddy
Of course. 60db is library quiet and 110db is Rolling Stones concert loud. How loud does one need to be for a typical pub gig? We used to regularly get warned or flatly kicked-out of Hollywood clubs because we were "way too damn loud". Those were the days when I ran a 50w Marshall or 40w Super Reverb wide open. EVH had a similar experience back then prompting the use of a variac to control his volume. Venues in LA are much more SPL sensitive these days requiring a lot lower stage volume and running everything through the PA. This makes my big amps pretty unnecessary so a 15-20w 1x12 seems just about right. I do still own the Super Reverb but she doesn't get out much. The Plexi is long gone because she was only really sublime when dimed.

Choose the right tools for the job at hand. Often for me these days that means a small 15-20w tube amp, volume 1/2 way up, and an SM57 in the gig bag just in case. YMMV


If you have a good PA available or the club has a decent PA, that would be great. SM57/SM58 is a great asset to have for any musician. Most amps at full volume will distort. Actually at around 60% of the full volume they will start distorting. That is why a 40W amp is better suited for cleans.
#17
Cajundaddy has the right of it, at least for LA. It's really gotten to the point where you may as well cart a modeler like an HD500x into the venue and have them point a monitor at you (or take your own powered monitor along).

For home use, I have some old Atomic Reactor 18W and 50W tube powered cabinets (they were actually designed specifically for the little "bean" style modelers) and a pair of KRK Rokit 8 powered monitors. I can cart the 50W 1x12 Atomic Reactor into a venue with a Pod HD installed and have them run a line out to the mixer from the Pod so that the sound guys can run everything through the PA. There's a separate volume knob on the Atomic so that I can control my own stage volume.

In the past, I've carted a 50W 2x12 or a 100W 1x12 combo amp around for those gigs that really don't fit the "club" norm. For example, the LA area has a lot of cruise ship gigs (Google Hornblower Yachts), a lot of wedding venues, a lot of small college parties, etc. And those don't have PA systems (you bring your own) or sound guys. Very old school.