Page 1 of 12
#1
I bet some of you have noticed that there is no UG classic theme on Forum anymore. I personally know users who preferred Light one (hey, Ximich), but now we all on the dark side.

There is a simple explanation why UG classic theme rests in peace now - we are zaebalis' (russian slang; means "really really tired of something"). In other words, it is hard to support two themes at the same time, it increases development time and probability to mess up with styles.

Here is a recent example, we created new Tab Requests form based on the forum engine. Everything was developed for the both themes and we spent valuable time to make the feature looks good on both. The time that could be spent improving something else here. And more than that, dev team lost tons of nerve cells while trying to fit new feature into the both themes. We had to consider all individual features for each theme (like contrast, for example). Everything that was cool on the Dark theme, looked like shit on the Classic and the other way around.

TL;DR:
The Classic theme was disabled to implement new features faster; it wasn't made to piss you off but for the future improvements.

I know that yesterday h0spid had fun in a chat thread and got some suggestions from you. So, he is super active this morning and trying not to piss off dev team with all his excitement about fulfilling your requests =) so, while we are here and talking about forum features, you can post your feedback and/or improvement suggestions.
#2
Thanks for the communication. Afraid that you're going to see a downturn in people browsing the website then. It's uncomfortable to use and gives me a headache. Pretty mental that you guys have decided to go all black when most other websites on the internet are a black on white format. It's a shame and is only going to quicken the demise of UG.

Honestly it's fucking absurd. I'm getting a headache just writing this post. Can't believe you have thrown users under the bus like this. At least offer an option.

Everything else has been said in other threads but yeah. Very disappointed in this decision.

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#4
Can't believe you can't implement a technical solution to this that eases the burden when implementing new features. Other sites I visit regularly have the option for a light/dark interface as well as changing the layout of the page dramatically.
#5
Quote by EndTheRapture51
Thanks for the communication. Afraid that you're going to see a downturn in people browsing the website then. It's uncomfortable to use and gives me a headache. Pretty mental that you guys have decided to go all black when most other websites on the internet are a black on white format. It's a shame and is only going to quicken the demise of UG.

Honestly it's fucking absurd. I'm getting a headache just writing this post. Can't believe you have thrown users under the bus like this. At least offer an option.

Everything else has been said in other threads but yeah. Very disappointed in this decision.


#7
You'll get used to it.

Many people use UG black and have for years with no issues (eyestrain, headaches, death). I also have astigmatism and its no problem (don't see why it would be).

I wouldnt like it if they changed it to classic only, but I'd be used to it again after a couple of days. It's no where near as big a deal as some are making out ffs

tbh I wouldnt be arsed if they made it classic only, as long as they updated it cause as I remember it, it currently looks like something from the day the internet was created
Last edited by sam b at Feb 4, 2017,
#8
Quote by EndTheRapture51
Thanks for the communication. Afraid that you're going to see a downturn in people browsing the website then. It's uncomfortable to use and gives me a headache. Pretty mental that you guys have decided to go all black when most other websites on the internet are a black on white format. It's a shame and is only going to quicken the demise of UG.

Honestly it's fucking absurd. I'm getting a headache just writing this post. Can't believe you have thrown users under the bus like this. At least offer an option.

Everything else has been said in other threads but yeah. Very disappointed in this decision.



https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/invert-page-colors/hjhdnhiofjddcapmffbllcpaodjmdphn/related?hl=en
#9
Quote by sam b


I wouldnt like it if they changed it to classic only, but I'd be used to it again after a couple of days. It's no where near as big a deal as some are making out ffs

It's pretty awful.

Many people use UG black and have for years with no issues (eyestrain, headaches, death). I also have astigmatism and its no problem (don't see why it would be).

Easy there, snowflake. Just cuz you don't have problems with astigmatism + white text doesn't mean that's how the world works.
#12
I understand the need to simplify matters on your end and don't mind UG Black myself
That being said, I do wonder if it's worth experimenting with the contrast of the UG Black theme itself, perhaps? Or at least that of the post windows?

Example:


Maybe slightly less contrast between the background and the white letters is a tad easier on the eyes of those not used to dark backgrounds, without decreasing legibility. Plus it wouldn't necessarily have to negatively impact any of your other layout decisions.
Last edited by ultimate-slash at Feb 4, 2017,
#14
Perhaps (tho I personally disagree), but I'm just trying to go for an easy solution/compromise here.
#15
So here are the two most common criticisms of both themes:


1) They look like something outta the late 90s tech boom.
2) They're painful to look at.


How about instead of choosing one, UG updates into a theme that's neutral when it comes to reading and pretty nice to look at? No more Classic or Black, not one or the other. Plus the mods only have to work on one theme.


Path of least resistance. Just saying.

EDIT: I mean per your suggestion ulti they'd have to make alterations to the theme anyway. So come up with a new third option instead of trying to polish this er, theme.
Last edited by ali.guitarkid7 at Feb 4, 2017,
#16
Well, transition from very dark grey to slight less very dark grey (which has no noticeable bearing on anything else) shouldn't be as much of an issue as transitioning from grey to another colour (which affects everything else), but I do agree with your point
#17
Slightly less bright standard font colour might also be easier on the eyes, perhaps?
#18
sam b

Well Sam, in post #5, you were cavalier enough to "like" your own post. Which is sort of sorry
& cheesy, since it mocks the membership voicing its opinion. "Whaa", we're all just babies, right? We'll get used to it, right?

If I understand it, many of these "improvements" you're making, are to combat traffic loss. It seems counter productive, and counter intuitive to force said "improvements" on many of your regular contributing members, who don't want them, can't see the pages.

One of your "improvements" thus far, the teensy tiny little non-expandable posting box, is another PITA. You have to scroll up and down the "page" if you want to attempt to actually see continuity in what you've written. And NO, it really isn't an improvement.

Hey, back in the day, people read too much into my screen name, and I've been written up for what I truly believe was a lot less than the surly garbage you put up in post #5.

It seems, the "Ten Commandments" were written in white, on a black stone background, who knew?

And no, I don't think quite a few of us will ever, "get used to it".
Last edited by Captaincranky at Feb 4, 2017,
#19
The effect I'm assuming would be the same but it'd just be less noticeable with a similar palette, but they'd eventually have to address that anyway when the major stuff's outta the way, right?


How birds in one stone is that?

Quote by ultimate-slash
Slightly less bright standard font colour might also be easier on the eyes, perhaps?

Or yeah, that works okay too. Off-tone whites and light greys with a thinner font too to avoid that feeling of letters seeping into each other.
Last edited by ali.guitarkid7 at Feb 4, 2017,
#20
Every other big website on the web uses black on white - Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, the BBC, all other big news websites, Reddit, YouTube, so it's mad that they're dead set on this weird dated early 00s look still.

Making it look modern will get more traffic in than tab request forms.

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
Last edited by EndTheRapture51 at Feb 4, 2017,
#21
Quote by ali.guitarkid7
It's pretty awful.


Easy there, snowflake. Just cuz you don't have problems with astigmatism + white text doesn't mean that's how the world works.

eh.. likewise with you and having problems with it
#22
Quote by Captaincranky
"Whaa", we're all just babies, right? We'll get used to it, right?

exactly, now you're getting it
#23
Quote by EndTheRapture51
Every other big website on the web uses black on white - Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, the BBC, all other big news websites, Reddit, YouTube, so it's mad that they're dead set on this weird dated early 00s look still.

Making it look modern will get more traffic in than tab request forms.

Look at the grey text under your post in the edit info field. Does that look better to you, ignoring the small text and italics?

Especially if the text box got a matching tone to the grey instead of this weird, deep black.
#24
Quote by sam b
exactly, now you're getting it
No, it's a physical reality many of us won't be able to get used to it.

You do realize there's a difference between UG I.Q. and actual I.Q., don't you?
#25
It looks better because the contrast is much less and its easier to read but it will still be a pain.

Btw Twitter has something called night mode. You toggle it and it changes the CSS so the colours don't blind you at night. A feature like that would be great.

At the moment though browsing at night is painful. Going from UG Black to Facebook or YouTube just fucks your head.

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#26
Quote by Captaincranky
No, it's a physical reality many of us won't be able to get used to it.

You do realize there's a difference between UG I.Q. and actual I.Q., don't you?

damn forgot to like my post
#27
We nahuevertili tut (rus slang; means 'did something really fast') and want to get your opinion on that.

Ximich and h0spid got a "black is a new classic" meeting and discussed "latest studies about dark characters on a light background and light characters on a dark background". Both were Classic theme users, btw, and now spending working Sat to find a way to make the Black theme better.

So, here is what we have: black and jet black =) we made it more like a new UG news

right now



slightly modified

#29
Yeah this page alone was arduous enough to read through.

I know development has been working pretty hard to improve the forum, and the dedication is admirable.

That being said, it's not the first time I say this, but you guys are showing a bit of carelessness when assuming a stand and, more importantly, showing that you have no idea how this forum works.

Classic vs. Black is an ages old discussion, and taking an unannounced decision would surely stir up discussion and divide the already small community we have here. A side would always end up unsatisfied, and, in terms of themes, this was a very 50/50 decision.

If you guys wanted one theme, and since themes were always debated, this was one of those cases where the community should've been consulted.

I agree with Ali. If you want to go for the one theme solution, you need to find something in the middle. If anything, the Classic look would always be the less problematic one because its problem is that it "looks ugly", whereas white text on black is problematic on different accounts, which is why no site ( well, no big website ) adapts this look. It was careless, if I may say so.

All that being said, the truth is that, with some exceptions ( the large avatars, the improvements on the comments section, the forum reorganization ), I am not a fan of some layout changes you've been applying ( the reddit-lookalike news section is particularly dreadful, imo ), so maybe the whole look of this website is not for me, but being on the forums for quite some time has taught me that this theme change was not the way to go.

I am terrible at design though, so I have no suggestions regarding how the forums should look, though, and I am sorry for such a long post without offering a solution, but, to me, the best suggestion is to find a new theme altogether, like Ali said.
#30
Quote by Shura_FYI
We nahuevertili tut (rus slang; means 'did something really fast') and want to get your opinion on that.

Ximich and h0spid got a "black is a new classic" meeting and discussed "latest studies about dark characters on a light background and light characters on a dark background". Both were Classic theme users, btw, and now spending working Sat to find a way to make the Black theme better.

So, here is what we have: black and jet black =) we made it more like a new UG news

right now



slightly modified

I like the second one better, but it's still very painful to the eyesight, especially when changing through tabs from other websites.
#31
I like the jet black with less bright text, but I'm fine with either one.
I guess the goal here is to find a happy medium and listen to the people who genuinely have a problem with it (hurting eyes and such).
Other users will get used to it, I've never noticed anyone complaining about the dark theme on the articles.
#32
Quote by UltimateGuizar
Other users will get used to it, I've never noticed anyone complaining about the dark theme on the articles.
A shot in the dark here, but that's probably because the time spent on the arcticles is usually very short, whereas the forums are a place to "hang out" regularly.

I just realized that it's not a problem alone with changing through tabs. Most softwares are light, and changing from dark to light is awful.
#33
Yeah, agreed with others on here, I find UG black a bit of a strain to read, so I'll probably be using this forum a lot less now.

Also, where's the 'last page' button when clicking on a thread now? Do I really have to open a thread on the first page, click on the box, then manually type in the last page number every single time? That's the bigger joke here if that's a permanent thing.
Last edited by matt bickerton at Feb 4, 2017,
#34
Quote by seventh_angel
A shot in the dark here, but that's probably because the time spent on the arcticles is usually very short, whereas the forums are a place to "hang out" regularly.

I just realized that it's not a problem alone with changing through tabs. Most softwares are light, and changing from dark to light is awful.


I guess it's a tough one.
I do actually remember checking out classic during one of the "which is best" threads in the pit and the change from black to classic was horrible.

#35
Quote by UltimateGuizar
The bias from having the background white

I liked 4.5 the most though
#38
i still prefer something more on the black on white side, but i could settle for anything in the 4.5 ratio.

seems like a fair compromise.
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#40
UG black is great imo


This is a problem tho
Quote by matt bickerton

Also, where's the 'last page' button when clicking on a thread now? Do I really have to open a thread on the first page, click on the box, then manually type in the last page number every single time? That's the bigger joke here if that's a permanent thing.
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