why does sheet music show sharp symbols to the far left, when none of the notes are sharp/flat?

Page 1 of 4
#1
meaning that none the notes run into the sharp symbol, throughout any of the measures, for a solo for instance. i notice this for even combination sheet music/tablature that definitely does not show anything sharp/flat being in the tablature. i will see 3 or 4 sharp symbols bunched up to the far left.
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#2
If you're talking about the sharp/flat symbols directly before the time signature, then that's the key signature, which indicates that throughout the piece, you will play every occurrence of those notes as sharp/flat (unless the key signature changes, or there is a natural sign). For example, if there are two flats in the key signature, you are in the key of B-flat, and will play every B and E as flat (unless one of the exceptions occurs). Hope this helps  
#3
To clarify what emailmeplsili1 wrote ( ):

If it looks anything like this:

(this isn't really a common scale, would not recommend - just borrowed from Wiki )

At the beginning of every line (and before the time signature in the beginning - 4/4 in the above case), it shows the sharps and flats to be applied everywhere in the song unless superseded by another accidental within a measure; therefore, every occurrence of these notes is actually sharp or flat

-> the above reads D Eb F# G A Bb C D

This is a common shortcut that points to the key of the song (in most cases, at least we won't get to the exceptions yet, however)
#4
I have nothing of importance to add, but damn it Neo that key signature made me scream internally ^^

However, OP did say that "none of the notes run into the sharp symbol". What exactly did you mean with this line Lloyd?
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#5
Key signatures are used so that you don't need to mark every single sharp/flat individually. For example in the key of E major you can pretty safely assume that you are most likely going to play F#, C#, G# and D#, not F, C, G and D (and this is why the key signature of E major has four sharps).



Using an open key signature in songs that are not in the key of C major or A minor would look messy and a bit confusing (especially if we are talking about a key with lots of sharps or flats, for example F# major that has 6 sharps). To me a sharp or a flat that is not in the key signature indicates an out of key note. If you are using an open key signature and the song is not in the key of C major or A minor, many of the sharps/flats will actually be diatonic to the key, and it's a bit confusing (though sometimes using an open key signature is justifiable, but most of the time you will be playing music that's mostly diatonic and using a key signature would be recommended).
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#6
In both scale example pictures above, notice that the notes progress through the lines and spaces evenly, alternating through the lines and spaces to make a smooth diagonal path. Diatonic scales are comprised of whole steps and half steps like this W-W-H-W-W-W-H. There are two discontinuities where the steps are half steps (smaller changes in pitch) and without key signatures those nice smooth scales would appear crooked and confusing, different scales having their crooked parts in different places.

By enforcing two rules, all diatonic scales in all keys are "normalized" so that they will appear on the staff as even smooth diagonal paths from note to note, which suppresses the discontinuities and makes diatonic music easier to read and read ahead. The two rules are:

Each note letter name is used, and used only once (these correspond to the lines and spaces in the staff).

A key signature with accidentals is provided to indicate which notes (which spaces and lines) will take a pitch adjustment (e.g., Gb, G, G#) throughout, by default.
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#7
Quote by NeoMvsEu

(this isn't really a common scale, would not recommend - just borrowed from Wiki )

-> the above reads D Eb F# G A Bb C D

How is that not a common scale? 
Quote by Kevätuhri
I have nothing of importance to add, but damn it Neo that key signature made me scream internally ^^

However, OP did say that "none of the notes run into the sharp symbol". What exactly did you mean with this line Lloyd?


I've always wondered why that is a thing.  Like why do people have problems with mixed sharps and flats for pieces that are written outside of diatonic scales?
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#8
Because I'm just a scrub bass player who likes jazz which makes me a horrible person.

And I can admit that I'm not familiar with music that uses key signatures like that. I wouldn't say that I have a problem with it, I just don't know a whole lot about it.
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#9
Hi,  Lloyd.

Are you meaning, for example, you might have one sharp in the key signature, but the piece you are playing doesn't have a note ( F#) that falls on the same line as the sharp in the key signature? 

The sharp or flat acts on all the notes that correspond to that ledger line regardless of which register they are in. Eg. All B notes are flatted, or all F's are sharped. Even if there isn't any F# notes in a piece written in G Major, the key signature will most times still have one sharp in it. 

The key signature and the key of a piece of music is 2 different things. The key signature is purely for ease of reading, especially pure Diatonic scales. It just saves cluttering up bars with sharps or flats all the time.

There are no rules that say a piece written in G major must have one sharp in the key signature. It can be in the key of G, with no sharps or flats in the signature. All the F's would be played natural, unless they had an accidental on them.
There are no rules that say you can't have a score in E minor with two sharps in the key signature. F# and C#. This would be likely called  E Dorian, but the two sharps are standard for the key of D Major. 

Likewise, there are no rules to say you can't mix sharps and flats in the key signature. Whatever is the easiest. 
Two transcribers could notate the same piece. The Key would stay the same, but the key signatures could be different. Both would still be correct however.

The notes   D Eb F# G A Bb C D  are a very common scale. 5th mode of  G Harmonic minor or  D Phrygian dominant. Pretty common to write it like this. You don't want to mix up the normal G with a G flat, so you just sharp the F.

If I score all the notes of the C major scale from E To E, I would have the E Phrygian, with no sharps or flats in the key signature.
But if I place a sharp on the G ledger line, now all G's are played as G#. We have the G Phrygian dominant. The one sharp does not mean we are in the key of G Major, which usually has one sharp on the F ledger line.

So the takeaway from this I guess is, just because a key signature has 4 sharps, doesn't mean it's in the key of E, and just because a key signature doesn't have 4 sharps doesn't mean it isn't in the key of E. 
#10
Quote by theogonia777
How is that not a common scale?
It's a common scale (G harmonic minor), but a very uncommon key signature.  As I suspect you know - - the key of G minor is normally shown with a 2-flat key sig, and the F#s are shown as accidentals when they occur, because the 7th degree is variable.
Quote by theogonia777

I've always wondered why that is a thing.  Like why do people have problems with mixed sharps and flats for pieces that are written outside of diatonic scales?
Maybe because pieces are very rarely written outside of diatonic scales.
The "problem" I'd have with it (as someone who never plays music written in such scales) is wondering whether the writer really meant that, or had made a mistake.
I.e., I have no problem with the existence and use of custom key signatures. One just has to be sure of the writer's intentions (and competence).
Last edited by jongtr at Mar 11, 2017,
#11
How o you accidentally through in a sharp in with that key signature though?
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#12
Quote by theogonia777
How o you accidentally through in a sharp in with that key signature though?

I think your asking.."how do you throw in a sharp in with that key signature though?" .. let's assume it was not an accident...perhaps the person that wrote it has a very limited knowledge of music theory and key structures in general..so to be kind I would consider it a "hybird" signature..and it would apply to just this one piece of music..and as jongtr  pointed out this particular scale structure is a "harmonic minor scale" which is an altered natural minor scale..in and of itself it has no key signature as it is not in the 12 key diatonic based structure..many "scales" are not in the given formula but are valid scales..diminished/augmented/wholetone etc. they are not reflected in any established key signatures..and..modes are NOT keys !
.
my take: to arbitrarily post sharps and flats in an already valid key signature is defeating the purpose of key signatures..kind of like musical anarchy..something along the lines of a John Cage composition.."..Breaking Glass in G major with 3 flats and a Blender on Frappe speed"

Ironic..I just started to play a Bach chorale #3 .. now back in the day the key signatures were a bit different..yikes
play well

wolf
Last edited by wolflen at Mar 11, 2017,
#13
Quote by wolflen
my take: to arbitrarily post sharps and flats in an already valid key signature is defeating the purpose of key signatures..

How so? 
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#14
I think that was a very bad example and only made it more difficult to understand the OP's question. Yes there are anomalies in music but I wouldn't use something so rare to explain a very basic question about key signatures.  
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#15
Quote by theogonia777
How so? 

ahhh Kristen...no offense..but sometime you are very difficult...but Im sure if you try just a bit harder,,,you can be impossible...
play well

wolf
Last edited by wolflen at Mar 12, 2017,
#16
That thing with two flats and a sharp is bullshit and I'd punch the person who put that fake music in front of me. You normally only see that crap in weird ethnomusicology classrooms because it's for goofy music that actually harmonizes those scales modally.
Last edited by cdgraves at Mar 12, 2017,
#17
I don't understand why this is even an issue for people.  If the entire piece of music is going to use an F# and stick almost exclusively to that, why shouldn't you throw it in there?  Like nobody seems to be able to offer an explanation other than "I don't like it" or "you just can't do that" or the like.  
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#18
Quote by theogonia777
I don't understand why this is even an issue for people.  If the entire piece of music is going to use an F# and stick almost exclusively to that, why shouldn't you throw it in there?  Like nobody seems to be able to offer an explanation other than "I don't like it" or "you just can't do that" or the like.  

Because key signatures are typically used to indicate keys, not scales. Most music published on paper is built around functional harmony rather than harmonized scales, so it's more useful to know what the key is than what specific notes you'll use. Plus you're probably going to use many notes outside the key signature, so there's little point in trying to indicate more than key with the key signature. 
#19
Quote by cdgraves
Because key signatures are typically used to indicate keys, not scales. Most music published on paper is built around functional harmony rather than harmonized scales, so it's more useful to know what the key is than what specific notes you'll use. Plus you're probably going to use many notes outside the key signature, so there's little point in trying to indicate more than key with the key signature. 

That's kind of making an assumption, isn't it?  Why should you just assume that most music is going to have outside notes?  Besides, even if there are outside notes, what if they are only notes other than the 7th (ie all of the F notes are sharp)?  And anyone that looks at that key signature would know that it's Bb/ anyway, just with a sharpened F throughout.  It's still perfectly obvious what key you are in.  
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#20
My son is a computer software nerd. When I ask a simple question he is likely to launch into a complicated and in-depth technical answer that often leaves me sorry I asked. I just wanted a simple answer to a basic question.

This discussion has moved away from the original OP's question which was quite simple. Because of a less than useful example it has become a discussion on something that you will rarely if ever encounter. I was taught that any note that wasn't part of the original key signature should be marked as an "accidental" when any note occurred in music that differed from the original key signature and is only valid within that measure. Any re-occurrence should be marked as an accidental for any measure that requires a change in that measure. Simple and basic. 
 
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#21
Quote by cdgraves
Because key signatures are typically used to indicate keys, not scales. Most music published on paper is built around functional harmony rather than harmonized scales, so it's more useful to know what the key is than what specific notes you'll use. Plus you're probably going to use many notes outside the key signature, so there's little point in trying to indicate more than key with the key signature. 


Okay. this whole thing reminds me of "Monkeys in a cage" Because that's the way it's always been done.
I just checked the date on my computer and it says the year is 2017. We now have computers, we have amazing software that can write any type of score. We realize now that being left handed is not a handicap, most people suffer some  form of Dyslexia, and a lot of people approach and learn things differently, yet still end up with same result. 

Key signatures. Why bother? If you have a set of 4 sharps in the key, you say to yourself, this is in the Key of E Major. That means every time I play a F, C, G or D, I have to sharp them.  When you look at the signature, you see the sharps are on the correct ledger lines for those notes. 
But, you have to know without hesitation that those notes are sharpened, you don't go back to the key signature and check every note to see if it is affected or not. That means you "know" the E Major scale. So why bother with those 4 sharps at all? Why not just write "this is in E Major, idiot, you know what to do" If you know The E Major scale, this is all you need. Hell, just E would do, because as a musician, you have to work out whether it is E Major or Db minor, because the key signature doesn't tell you that. This is why writing the correct number of flats or sharps for a Diatonic scale, regardless of any continuous accidentals, is redundant. 

I have seen it stated many times that Key signature and Key are 2 completely different things. The key signature is purely an aid to your reading of the score.
It is common to see the key signature match the key, but it is not a rule that it must.

In the end it is up to the reader of the music how he wants it written for him. You are  quite welcome to have your score written in traditional monkey in a cage format, key signature following key, if that is what you want. I would have that same score written with different sharps and flats in the key signature, because that what suits me and makes it easier for me to read. That's the way I look and interpret written score, not you.

All the composer of the written score has to do is go into his program, click a few things, and you get yours how you want it, and I get mine. Guess what, if we are both competent players it will come out exactly the same. Like I said. we are in 2017, not too many guys write out music with parchment and quill and ink with a candle burning nowadays. Have a look at the score sheets of orchestral musicians. They aren't all neat and pretty. They have notes and markings jotted down all over. So that it works for them, not you.

When playing a piece of music, why do you need to know how the composer was thinking? I don't give a crap if he was thinking harmonically or he'd eaten too many burritos and need  to fart when he wrote the score.  All I need is what he played and how, so I can duplicate it to the best of my abilities. 


In the end, I agree with theogonia777 ,there is no reason not to have mixed key signatures, or any variant you want.

Just checked International laws, and it appears it is not a crime against humanity to mix key signatures, and we won't get shot.
However, if you try to punch me for handing you a score that doesn't suit you, instead of asking me to change it to a way that does suit you, well, I wonder if balls down a throat trumps a punch? Since when does violence become an answer for differences of opinion on how a score should be written or its legitimacy?

Don't think I'm stupid either, I only do this when for example the whole lot is in say E  Hungarian minor. If I have a score that is say in E minor and briefly touches E harmonic minor, of course  I write it with 1 sharp in the key sig, and an accidental for the D# in the bars. This is the easiest. If it was ALL E harmonic minor, it would get 2 sharps, F and D in the key sig. Any half competent muso would know what this meant, especially if " hey you, this is all in B Phrygian Dom, check the key sig sharps" was written on the score. You are allowed to do that you know.

My apologies to the OP. This got a bit off topic.
Last edited by Vreid at Mar 14, 2017,
#22
Vreid ..It is common to see the key signature match the key, but it is not a rule that it must.---Bach would  agree---

I agree..your take is valid..for you..if you consider a two sharp key signature to be E harmonic minor..go for it..but it begs the question..what if you were to "teach" a beginning student of music..would you tell them key signatures are only suggestions?..would you use the circle of 5ths to show the relationship of sharp keys and flat keys and their relative minors..and what of the major scales in those key signatures and the embedded chords within the scales..does all of that go into the "if you feel like it dept.."?

perhaps if your doing "frank zappa" type material and working with steve vai level of musicians you can pen in the margins..the next 14 bars are three flats and two sharps...and not get any flack about it..but for the large majority of musicians..your going to have a mini-class and explain what you mean..and in some manner "draw" a harmonic/melodic map..

I have worked with "musicians" that didnt know one drop of theory..and could not explain what they wanted other musicians to play...it was pitiful..musicial sharades - (sounds like..) 

using modes as "keys" today is not unusual .. to hear "this piece is in B dorian.." and it may turn out to be in the key of D major that uses B minor as the "B section" 

Your reference to E hungarian minor...would you be using the chords from that scale..or using the scale to play over other chords..diatonic etc?? real question ! and would that alter your version of a key signature..?

In jazz-years ago..George Russell developed "the lydian chromatic concept"  it was received with lukewarm interest..but one musician that found it interesting was Miles Davis..and it is said  he used some of that material in his "Kind of Blue" album...

music is an evolving art..alot of music today is played via electronic effects..some traditional instruments can been replaced by such effects..should the key signature system morph into another form of information..like DOS to Windows..I am sure we will adjust..but until then .. my take..Four sharps is the key of E Major / C# minor..
play well

wolf
Last edited by wolflen at Mar 14, 2017,
#23
Quote by wolflen
[perhaps if your doing "frank zappa" type material and working with steve vai level of musicians you can pen in the margins..the next 14 bars are three flats and two sharps...and not get any flack about it..but for the large majority of musicians..your going to have a mini-class and explain what you mean..and in some manner "draw" a harmonic/melodic map..


You're talking about it like you have to be a genius to understand that the key signature is telling you that E and B are flat and F is sharp, which is what is clearly displayed. What's confusing about that?
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#24
Quote by wolflen

Your reference to E hungarian minor...would you be using the chords from that scale..or using the scale to play over other chords..diatonic etc?? real question ! and would that alter your version of a key signature..?


Most definitely.  The reason for Hungarian minor is it allows for 2 minor chords a semitone apart and 2 major chords a semitone apart. I use a made up term of 1 down 1 up a fifth apart. Helps me remember. The Hungarian minor is the 4th mode of the double harmonic or gypsy Major, or Byzantine etc. There are so many alternate names, and a lot of the names are getting muddled. However, when I write a score in E Hungarian minor, the chords are also from the scale.  I don't write it with 1 sharp ( E minor), then fill in a ton of accidentals, I use 3 sharps, F, A and D. I end up with a clean score, I know it has the relevant notes sharpened. If there is any chromatics that deviate from the scale, only those have the accidental in bar applied. I am not thinking "modified minor scale, lots of accidentals to interpret" I am thinking, E Hungarian minor, I know that scale, easy. I very rarely use this scale over anything purely diatonic, if ever.

The thing is though, that's for me , and makes sense to me, and I find it easy. I am not saying that you can't have a score written in standard key sig = key format, with accidentals,how you want it to be. I am just saying don't say my way, (and many others) is not valid or "fake" music. Referencing cdgraves .

If you want to score out in pure D major, you would write with a Key of 2 sharps.  You have a beginner student. Do you teach him the D major scale, show them on their particular instrument, explain the sharps, 1 extra , C# in this case over G major with one sharp,  and how it relates to the circle of fifths. Then give him a piece of written music in D, with its 2 Key Sig sharps and tell him to go for it. Or just put the score in front of him and tell him to work it out because it has the sharps in the key sig? Then just when he thinks he has it worked out, you tell him he has to work out himself whether 2 sharps is D Major or B minor.

If the student has learnt and understands the D major scale, when he sees the Key sig of 2 sharps, it isn't telling him anything he doesn't already know. 
He knows that D Major has F# and C#, He knows B minor has F# and C# also. 

If D was written instead of the 2 sharps, or Bm, he already knows the sharps, but now he doesn't even need to work out minor or Major keys.
You really can't play a piece of music until you have a reasonable grasp of that scale used on your instrument. When you do, the key sig sharps or flats are redundant. It is really just an unnecessary code. 3 sharps is Amajor. just write A, 2 flats is Bb major. Just write Bb. 

So, if I presented you with a score written in E major, maybe a few accidentals thrown in as well,  and in the key sig, I just wrote E Major, would you have trouble understanding and playing it?  I think you wouldn't. It is for that reason why I don't understand why so many jump up and down because of mixed or non standard key sigs. They actually tell you something. 
#25
Vreid I just did a mini study of the Hungarian min scale and four note chords..wow..fun stuff...my main style is jazz/fusion/blues..but for the last few years i have studied diminished/augmented theory/ symmetric harmony .. just playing some symmetric lines over a few of the chord progressions in that scale gave me several new ideas...

Now if I were to compose something just using that scale I would leave the key sig blank and notate that the piece is using the hungarian minor scale..or to make it more familier call it a harmonic min scale with a #4..( al la john mclaughlin songbook)
 
so perhaps a mixed "note signature" would survive the theory wars...but it would need some sort of reference to the musican unfamilier with this system..the obvious question to a signature out of common keys is going to be..."..ahhh what key is this in,,??"

BTW..I noticed your new here..welcome abord..
play well

wolf
#26
The issue is just what information you're expecting to be conveyed by the key signature and how it relates to the music itself.

In the context of like 95% of music written on paper, the key signature is expected to tell you only the tonic and tonality (major/minor). It's sort of a holdover from when the key signature was actually proscriptive of all the notes, and was often modal. But these last few centuries, the key signature is not meant to be a list of the notes, because most pieces of music move outside the key signature frequently. It would be impractical and confusing.

Modal music is the exception, and that's how this "fake" key signature is being used. A lot of folk music is modal and actually harmonizes those scales. It makes sense, it's just definitely not something most people are going to encounter very often.

The irony is that if you're really into Eastern European balalaika music, you're probably not learning songs from sheet music. Just about the only time this kind of thing is written down is to represent to/within the western music writing tradition, hence my sarcastic dig at ethnomusicology classrooms.
#27
Quote by cdgraves
The irony is that if you're really into Eastern European balalaika music, you're probably not learning songs from sheet music. Just about the only time this kind of thing is written down is to represent to/within the western music writing tradition, hence my sarcastic dig at ethnomusicology classrooms.
Writing things down can't be all that bad, even when crossing cultural traditions; sometimes, it was the only way to preserve tradition (across millennia)
#28
Quote by cdgraves You normally only see that crap in weird ethnomusicology classrooms

You actually don't that often.

In ethnomusicology, it's very common to approach different cultures and their music from their own perspective, and learn the music in their terms, not ours. A musicologist studying Eastern European balalaika music would probably study it by doing a field trip to Eastern Europe and learning it from a local teacher in the traditional way. That is, at least, the goal.

Not saying that we wouldn't write these things down in standard notation, but we do realize the shortcomings of this approach and use it with caution.
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#29
Quote by MaggaraMarine
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>
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the sheet music here has a line and a space with a note on each one. and that space and line run right into one of the sharps to the far left, making it a sharp for the C# and D#, right? but the sheet music i have has these sharp symbols the same, but none of the lines that the notes are on, run into those sharp symbols. the sharp symbols are not on the same lines that the notes are on. so i figure what's the point of the sharp symbols. maybe i better just study this more. might be too complicated for the simple answer i was hoping for. i'm still wondering what's the point of sheet music, if tab could maybe be evolved good enough. unless site reading can't be done as well with tab. 
anyway, thanks. 
begginer geetarest.
#30
Lloyd_rogers

The key signature is shorthand

F#, G#, C#, and D# in ANY octave will be sharps in E major; it's not just the specific lines/spaces they're assigned to.
#31
Lloyd_rogers 

Actually, that question gets to the heart of the keys discussion., which has been asking, "Why not add accidentals to the key signature if all occurrences of a note takes an accidental in the score, because it's not in the key signature?"

Amazingly, what you just asked is, "Why not remove an accidental from a key signature if there are no occurrences of its operation in the score?"

 
Quote by reverb66
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#32
The key signature tells you what key you are in. That's it's main function. It's a fairly accepted language of written music. They could have written "Bb" or "F" at the start instead but then it would not be universal symbols it would be based on different languages and alphabets around the world. The sharp or flat symbols work well in any language to let anyone know at a quick glance the key of the song. If you are not familiar with theory it also reminds the player which notes are affected throughout the song.  

Why re-invent the wheel or complicate it further. As far as I can tell it's been working fine for a few hundred years.
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#33
I think what his point of confusion was was notes in different octaves than the key signature showed

So, question, Lloyd_rogers - this is a really repetitive portion of a song, so what are the notes in the second line?
#35
NeoMvsEu the song i am doing is 'walk of life' by dire straights. 
there is sheet music for the intro organ part, made for guitar that i am using. which it sounds like i am playing it right on my guitar from that sheet music. however, none of the notes are sharp/flat. yet, these sharp symbols are to the far left on the first line. the second line is where the verse and vocals start. 
none of the chords are sharp/flat either for the rest of the song. 
begginer geetarest.
#36
Lloyd_rogers

You didn't answer my question, which is relevant to your question and will be more helpful than making a tab request like you just did
#37
Quote by Lloyd_rogers
NeoMvsEu the song i am doing is 'walk of life' by dire straights. 
there is sheet music for the intro organ part, made for guitar that i am using. which it sounds like i am playing it right on my guitar from that sheet music. however, none of the notes are sharp/flat. yet, these sharp symbols are to the far left on the first line. the second line is where the verse and vocals start. 
none of the chords are sharp/flat either for the rest of the song. 

ok..now we have sheet music...the song is in the key of E major...its basically E A and B chords with an E7 at points...the key signature is correct...the chords are correct..the notes on the staff are correct...it seems you should learn how to read sheet music and how the key signature affects the notes on the staff lines..the CHORDS of songs do NOT have to correspond to the key signature notes 


in your question the song is in the key of E major.. notice in the key sig there is no alteration to the E note the A note or the B note - the notes in the key sig are NOT referring to CHORDS in the song..they are referring to NOTES in the KEY of E major -- (scale)  = E  F# G# A B C# D# E--see: the four sharp notes within the E maj scale are the notes in the key signature..thus-there will NOT be a sharp # in front of these notes on the staff as the key sig is telling you when you see  these notes on the staff..they are to be sharped-#...

a study of how to harmonize chords from the major scale may help you ALOT .. and how they are applied in written music...

hope this helps 

BTW Lloyd...welcome aboard..
play well

wolf
Last edited by wolflen at Mar 17, 2017,
#38
Quote by theogonia777
How is that not a common scale? 


I've always wondered why that is a thing.  Like why do people have problems with mixed sharps and flats for pieces that are written outside of diatonic scales?


Urgh. 

It's not a common scale because it is, very obviously, not a major or a minor scale.

Key signatures deal with Keys. Not scales. This is why you will rarely, if ever, see a key signature with mixed sharps and flats. There is no practical reason why you should have a key signature like that, everything can be notated in an easy to read way, and failure to do so suggests very poor musicianship to everyone who sees it.

I've just read this topic, no one here is an advanced sight reader or deals with classical musicians. The fact that one post claims that E harmonic minor needs a different key signature says it all, please, research theory, get some form of education under your belt before you spread misinformation.
#39
Quote by CelestialGuitar
Urgh. 

It's not a common scale because it is, very obviously, not a major or a minor scale.


Of course it's a common scale. That scale is the basis for the entire Ottoman Empire.

There is no practical reason why you should have a key signature like that, everything can be notated in an easy to read way, and failure to do so suggests very poor musicianship to everyone who sees it.


Putting that extra sharp in there is definitely the easiest way. Otherwise you have to write it over and over again. Let me tell you a little something about musicianship. I've played with some of the greatest virtuosos on their instruments and most well respected musicians in their genre and they can't read a note of music. I work with multi-platinum, Grammy winning engineers and singers. Can't read music. So there.

It's like you're so sophisticated that you have to keep up a silly counterintuitive tradition because "all the good musicians are doing it" when that's completely untrue.

I've just read this topic, no one here is an advanced sight reader or deals with classical musicians.


Nice assumption there.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
Last edited by theogonia777 at Mar 17, 2017,
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