#1
Let's just make sure that you're adventure into here  is not a guide in anyway to build a rig, I just want to build my first  one and I have absolutely no idea how. So now that, that is covered  let's dive into this.

In my last post I discussed my tragedy of ripping the strap button out of my guitar you can find that discussion here (
https://goo.gl/4R0azo )
if you are interested. 

But  today I'm going to tackle the beast of building my first guitar rig. I  have watched a few videos and picked up enough to know that I need a  black and silver box, a power supply (surge protector?) and then all the  rest. I also know that I need a amp head or an Axe FX but sense this is  my first rig I don't really want to drop 2k on a new Axe FX. So can we  try and keep that out of the picture? I want a rig that will be as  simple as John Petrucci's, but small enough I can fit it in the back  seat of my 2008 Subaru Impreza. So yeah, thanks for stopping by and if  you have any information that will help me or maybe a link to a "Perfect  guitar rig building" thread on Pintrist please give me that link.

EDIT: Made the mistake of calling John Petrucci's rig simple but I actually understand that compared to some of the other rigs I've viewed
Last edited by ImAnEwok at Apr 4, 2017,
#2
You've given us really little to work with. Answer these questions to help us help you.

Budget?
Genres?
New or Used?
Home or Gig?
Closest City?
Current Gear?

If you see yourself in the future getting an Axe FX and you have the $ for it now, go ahead and do it. They are good bits of kit, you'd likely never need to bother with amps again.
#3
Will Lane Budget 1500-1650 max Genres, Metal Heavy Rock Progressive shred (Polyphia) New or Used, new perfered but I can get away with used Home or gig, gigs closest city, Kansas City current gear none besides guitars and a fender mustang IV
#4
What guitars?

Also, Petrucci's rig isn't exactly simple:
http://equipboard.com/pros/john-petrucci/#effects-pedals

A Carvin V3M (50w), V3 (100w) or Vai Legacy 3 (100w) can all be had under $1000, especially used. Very versatile amps. The Mesa Transatlantic 30 (30w) is likewise a versatile amp that could suit you, but I bet there are better Mesas in your price range for what you want to do. Someone will probably drop in and enlighten us.

A tuner, plus a quality Overdrive and Distortion pedal would be important. I would want a delay, flanger, phaser & wah, too. So, a non-exhaustive list of suggestions...

Korg Pitchblack Tuner

Red Witch Famulus; TruTone Jekyll & Hyde V2 or V3; Emma Pisdiyowat; Empress Heavy

Earthquaker Devices Disaster Transport, Disaster Transport Jr, or Disaster Transport Sr.; Catalinbread Belle Epoch or EchoRec

Subdecay Starlight MkII; Mr. Black Shepherd's End; Catalinbread Zero Point

Keeley Phase 24 or Jimi Hazel Echophase;

Morley optical wah; T-Rex Shafter wah
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#5
I think we still need more info on your playing and what you prefer guitar-wise. If WE are building YOUR rig it kind of helps to know more about you.

Danny covered a lot of ground but I will chime in with some more amps under budget that allows for room to buy other equipment.
Peavey JSX 
Marshall JCM 2000 DSL
Mesa Single/dual/triple rectifier- single will probably be had at the cheapest of the bunch
Randall Thrasher
EVH 5153

Need more info still though. The JSX will be the cheapest of the lot and leaves plenty of room for a cab, guitar and effects.
Gibson LP traditional and DC standard, PRS S2 Custom 24, MIA Standard Strat, Charvel So Cal Pro Mod, Schecter Banshee 7
EVH 5153, Mesa DR Tremoverb combo 2-2x12's
Line 6 M13
#6
bobafettacheese

My suspicion is, of the ones you listed, those Mesas will be closest to the tones being sought. Petrucci is pretty keen on Mesa, after all.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#7
bobafettacheese dannyalcatraz So to answer your guy's questions and learning more about me I am a intermediate guitar player I love heavy distortion but a lot of tone, I really want a beefy sounding guitar with some crisp mids. I also need something portable, like I said I drive a 2008 Subaru Impreza and  something that won't kill me I'm a pretty small guy and don't wanna kill myself, but if my price range isn't possible I can probably go a bit higher. I also need something that I can use, like I said I'm a pretty intermediate guitar player and I don't want more than I can handle but I want to be adventurous and try to get some better tone for live events and some alone jam times. I updated my guitar list if you guys wanna check out what I have to work out and I have a Fender Mustang IV. If you guys need anymore help just let me know I am just learning all these new things and I still don't know where to start.
#8
And quick question what the hell really is an Axe FX I kind of get it, but I kind of don't if you could clear that up for me as well that would be awesome
#9
I'd say that your Ibanez & Jackson are perfectly fine for what you're doing. You COULD upgrade, but you probably don't need to. This means your amp & pedal budget is pure gold.

Your best bet for fitting in your car is getting a combo amp or head with a cab no bigger than a 1x12 or 1x15.

Amps with a power between 30-60w will be sufficient to most tasks you're likely to face. But 100w or bigger amps can have additional features and capabilities that make them desirable even for players who never push the volume,

A brand I didn't mention before is Quilter, even though they're high on my shopping list. They're solid state, but sound great. Unlike many SS amps, they're not modelers, and take pedals like tube amps do- even overdrives, distortions and fuzzes. I bring them up now because they're VERY small and lightweight, and with the right pedals, you can get some good prog rock/neoclassical metal type tones.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#10
Building a rig as you put it never really stops,  You might settle in for awhile but the GAS always returns, Or at least at this stage of your journey.  Myself, I basically just use a 2 channel 2x12 combo or 3 channel head and cab with their foot switches a good Multi FX processor and guitar.  And with the processor I use very few of its effects, The amps take care of any distortion/overdrive needed,  So maybe just a bit of delay and compression is all that's required to get what I'm looking for,  But I know what I'm looking for,  You on the other hand have nary a clue,  So you need to search, as you may not like what I like, I find it doubtful but it is possible even if within your budget,    So me suggesting Mesa's, Soldano's, Matchless and so many others may just be a waste your time, as you may get them home and discover,  Nope not what I was looking for,   Same would apply to peddles and different software applications,  Although I am a proponent of choosing a good Multi FX peddle if not familiar with all the various effects and what they do,  I just use one because I'm a lazy Bastard,  But if you want to start a peddle board collection the size of your Subaru more power to you,  I've known guys like that, Hell I can set up in about 10 minutes if that, They're still screwing around with their gear trying to figure out why something aint working right for another 20 minutes in most cases, while I'm having another beer and hitting on their girlfriends,  Then by go time my minimalist rig sounds better anyway,  
#11
Any decent used Mesa 1x12 amp will make a fine gig rig you can put in the back seat of a compact car and yet peel the paint off the back wall at your local pub.  Go play through a few and find one you like.  A 50 Cal or F-50 can be found for $600-$800.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#12
nastytroll Would a Peavy 6505 head be a good option, I'm coming close to spring break and I'm going to work my ass off over the summer so I'll have some money. My main question is what do you need in a rig, what are all the parts you need. Like in a computer you need a case, a power supply, the mother board, processor ram and all the others and I suppose that rig building would need the same. 
#13
If you go the route of an amp head then you'll need a cabinet to go with it, a speaker cable to connect the two, and instrument cable to run from the amp to the guitar. IF you go the way of effects then you'll need multiple instrument cables (depending on using the FX loop or not) and smaller 3"-6" cables to hook the pedals up together (and a power supply for the pedals if you don't want to use 9v batteries). 
I would go and try as many amps as you can. We can give you suggestions and most would be great options but its your money and gear.
Gibson LP traditional and DC standard, PRS S2 Custom 24, MIA Standard Strat, Charvel So Cal Pro Mod, Schecter Banshee 7
EVH 5153, Mesa DR Tremoverb combo 2-2x12's
Line 6 M13
#14
Since size is a concern... aside from going axe fx... I'd suggest looking into the Carvin V3M and a Mesa vertical 2x12 cab.  Plenty of power and gain from the Carvin, and the Mesa cab is going to be top notch in quality.  Would be perfect for both home and gig.  Small size makes them easy to transport and they won't take up much space in your home.  Both can be found used for under your budget leaving room for whatever pedals you might need.  I can't really recommend pedals, though I have some odds and ends ones, I don't use them much.  
Gear: Gibson Les Paul Studio, Gibson SG Special, Fender Stratocaster, Fender Telecaster, Fender Jazzmaster, Gretsch Pro Jet, Carvin C350, Epiphone ES-339 P90, Epiphone ES-335 Pro. Peavey 6505, Sovtek MIG-100, Vox AC30, Peavey XXX.
#15
given the information you have supplied, that you are an intermediate player who knows almost nothing about amp gear I would suggest a simple metal rig for gigging and once you get a better idea of what gear and sound you like then spend the bigger bucks on upgrading.

My suggestion would be a Peavey 6505+ 112 combo, a replacement Celestion Vintage 30 speaker for it, and an overdrive pedal (not distortion) to use as a boost. Your rig is done and if you go used you`re probably around half your budget.

now for some helpful information.

Amps - the term is kind of thrown around loosely but if you know what people are talking about from context the usage of the word becomes clear. SO...a typical Amp head is made up of two parts 1) the pre-amp where the tone shaping takes place (bass, mid, treb etc controls) 2) the power amp which amplifies the signal to give you your volume and drives the speakers.

A combo amp has the amp head (pre-amp and power amp) and the output speaker in the same enclosure.

An Axe FX is essesially a really good pre-amp in a box that models the pre-amps of various other amps really well to give you multiple amps in a box. So to run an Axe rig you need some type of power amp and speaker because the Axe FX is just the pre-amp.

How you run the output of the Axe FX is another discussion. Guitar amps are designed to be filtered through a speaker - if you were to just take the output of an amp and listen to it without it passing through a speaker or a speaker emulation it would sound like crap. So speakers are required in the signal path somewhere and different speakers provide huge changes in tone, which is why there are so many speaker options to choose from. The Axe FX offers speaker simulation, whether you use it or not depends on the setup you choose.

If you use the Axe speaker simulation then you want to run it through a power amp into a Full Range Flat Response (FRFR) speaker such as a PA speaker because you are using the Axe speaker simulation to shape your tone, you don`t want the output speaker to also color your tone. The benefit of using the speaker sim is the ability to change speaker and cabinet type without having to own all the different speakers and cabinets yourself. To use the speaker simulators the setup would look something like one of the following

guitar-->Axe FX preamp--> Power amp --> FRFR Speaker    or   guitar-->Axe FX preamp--> active FRFR Speaker

(an active speaker is one that has the power amp built into the speaker so a separate power amp is not required)

If you have a cabinet that you like the sound of and don't require the speaker simulation then your setup would look something like this

guitar-->Axe FX--> Power Amp--> guitar speaker cabinet (like a typical marshall or mesa 2x12 or 4x12 cabinet)

So if you are wanting to upgrade to an Axe FX in the future if you decide how you want to run it you can buy your current gear to have some pieces reusable with your Axe rig later. For example you could use a Line 6 Helix or Line 6 Pod HD500X (pre-amps - just like the Axe but cheaper) and then simply exchange the pre-amp you are using with an Axe later. But as stated above, given your inexperience with gear a simpler amp setup is probably the best for you at the moment.
#16
I'll chime in a vote for a Mesa combo, I have a 2X12 Roadster which will most likely be outta your budget, i got lucky and scored mine new on clearence for $1100 but the cover and footswitch were not included because the dolts at GC couldn't find them so add another $250 for those and taxes and I am all in for around $1300, it also weighs in at just under 100lbs.

A 1X12 should be both more affordable and easier to lug around.

I also agree with Danny your Ibanez/Jackson guitars will be more than sufficient , the only thing I'd change on those is maybe the INF pickups on the Ibanez with some better passives but you could do that after getting your rig together.
"A well-wound coil is a well-wound coil regardless if it's wound with professional equipment, or if somebody's great-grandmother winds it to an old French recipe with Napoleon's modified coffee grinder and chops off the wire after a mile with an antique guillotine!"
- Bill Lawrence

Come and be with me
Live my twisted dream
Pro devoted pledge
Time for primal concrete sledge

Last edited by Evilnine at Apr 5, 2017,
#17
Evilnine

With that budget & not needing an axe, a pickup upgrade could probably be squeezed in.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#18
Evilnine 
I despise Guitar Center with a passion.

Are we actually building this persons pedal board?
Buy an inexpensive multieffects unit and after using that for a while you will come to know what effects you will use, and which ones are generally useless (phasor).
#19
33db

Meh the only thing I like about GC isthe return policy, I can buy used guitars/amps and take them back after 45 days no questions asked (which I have done several times) that way I can put an amp through it's paces or give a guitar a set up and play the crap out of it then take it back if I end up not liking it and only be out maybe some gas or a set of strings.

And of course the deal I got on the Mesa

I don't really like GC much either I use them for what I want and l laugh about the employees.

Once my brother and I were there on Saturday night to grab some picks and asked one of the workers whay they closed so early on Saturday pm and he said in a smart assed tone "we are all musicians and have gigs" I asked where he was playing that night and after he told me I looked to my brother and said "lets be sure not to go there."

LOL I have a phase shifter it's a Joyo MXR90 clone I bought from Craislist for $10 I think just for shits and giggles.
"A well-wound coil is a well-wound coil regardless if it's wound with professional equipment, or if somebody's great-grandmother winds it to an old French recipe with Napoleon's modified coffee grinder and chops off the wire after a mile with an antique guillotine!"
- Bill Lawrence

Come and be with me
Live my twisted dream
Pro devoted pledge
Time for primal concrete sledge

Last edited by Evilnine at Apr 5, 2017,
#20
Evilnine
Bought on amp from them, it went bad immediately, bought 2 foot pedals allegedly brand new upon opening the box one had a boot print on it, the other clicked constantly.
Brought a guitar in for their "luthier" (laugh) to do a basic set up (I didn't have any tools or time to do it) got it back with 2 chunks missing from it, took 2 months but finally I got their regional manager and got a new guitar out of it.
Had to drive to a completely different GC to pick it up because I told the regional "If I see that guy that chunked my guitar I'm afraid I'll punch him" manager says "Yeah I don't like him either".
.....

All that and their counter help are either breathtakingly stupid, or as you pointed out, socially inept.

I bought a phase 90 and now I'm wondering why I did, it's too repetitive sounding.
#21
I want one for classic rock with a budget of 400 dollars, I already have the guitar I just need the amp, and it can be just the head I've found big cabs for around 100 bucks
Last edited by jacob.wegier at Apr 5, 2017,
#22
Quote by jacob.wegier
I want one for classic rock with a budget of 400 dollars, I already have the guitar I just need the amp, and it can be just the head I've found big cabs for around 100 bucks


Marshall.
#23
Quote by ImAnEwok
nastytroll Would a Peavy 6505 head be a good option, I'm coming close to spring break and I'm going to work my ass off over the summer so I'll have some money. My main question is what do you need in a rig, what are all the parts you need. Like in a computer you need a case, a power supply, the mother board, processor ram and all the others and I suppose that rig building would need the same. 

Personally I'm not a big fan of the Chinese made amps, Which all Peavey's are these days, But I really like James Brown's design work,  He's the guy behind the 6505, 5150, JSX, XXX, and several other Peavey amps,  He moved to Kustom for awhile where we see the Coupe, The Defender, Double Cross, and a few others,  All rare and very underrated,  So there could be some good deals if you look to the Kustom badge rather than the Peavey badge for certain models,  Made in USA as opposed to Made in China so to say,   Peavey is a household name and just a few know about Kustom,  Just don't bother with Kustom these days, Made in China just like Peavey,  So your looking on the used market in this case,  If your hearts set on a new amp then save your pennies and buy a Mesa, Soldano or whatever,  Even most all Marshalls are made in China these days and the same applies to Vox and the other Brit amps.  Which I'm not a fan of either,   As to the 6505?  Yea sounds pretty good, for about 5 years, Then it breaks down and no one wants to work on it and its cheaper to just buy a new amp anyway.  Sorry kid but we live in a Made In China throw away world these days,  
#24
Quote by 33db
Evilnine
Bought on amp from them, it went bad immediately, bought 2 foot pedals allegedly brand new upon opening the box one had a boot print on it, the other clicked constantly.
Brought a guitar in for their "luthier" (laugh) to do a basic set up (I didn't have any tools or time to do it) got it back with 2 chunks missing from it, took 2 months but finally I got their regional manager and got a new guitar out of it.
Had to drive to a completely different GC to pick it up because I told the regional "If I see that guy that chunked my guitar I'm afraid I'll punch him" manager says "Yeah I don't like him either".
.....

All that and their counter help are either breathtakingly stupid, or as you pointed out, socially inept.

I bought a phase 90 and now I'm wondering why I did, it's too repetitive sounding.


I've never had that bad of an experience at GC every purchase that i returned was because i just changed my mind, not that I'm defending them by any means, i have heard horror stories about their techs so i have never taken a guitar to them if i need some tech work done I take mine to the local independent music store that has been around since before i was born.

I would want to kill a tech if they chunked my guitar so I'm with ya on that one!
"A well-wound coil is a well-wound coil regardless if it's wound with professional equipment, or if somebody's great-grandmother winds it to an old French recipe with Napoleon's modified coffee grinder and chops off the wire after a mile with an antique guillotine!"
- Bill Lawrence

Come and be with me
Live my twisted dream
Pro devoted pledge
Time for primal concrete sledge

#25
Quote by nastytroll
Personally I'm not a big fan of the Chinese made amps, Which all Peavey's are these days, But I really like James Brown's design work,  He's the guy behind the 6505, 5150, JSX, XXX, and several other Peavey amps,  He moved to Kustom for awhile where we see the Coupe, The Defender, Double Cross, and a few others,  All rare and very underrated,  So there could be some good deals if you look to the Kustom badge rather than the Peavey badge for certain models,  Made in USA as opposed to Made in China so to say,   Peavey is a household name and just a few know about Kustom,  Just don't bother with Kustom these days, Made in China just like Peavey,  So your looking on the used market in this case,  If your hearts set on a new amp then save your pennies and buy a Mesa, Soldano or whatever,  Even most all Marshalls are made in China these days and the same applies to Vox and the other Brit amps.  Which I'm not a fan of either,   As to the 6505?  Yea sounds pretty good, for about 5 years, Then it breaks down and no one wants to work on it and its cheaper to just buy a new amp anyway.  Sorry kid but we live in a Made In China throw away world these days,  

Strange, I've had my 6505 for quite a few years with no problems at all.  In fact, I've never had to 'throw-away' any tube amplifier regardless of its origin.  Nor have I run into the issue of an amp being more expensive to repair than it is worth. 

My main amplifier was built in Russia... it's 20 years old.  No problems with it.  I'm fairly sure that anything built in China with Peavey's name on it is going to be built to a higher standard of quality than my Sovtek was.  

I'd venture to say that if the made in China thing is such a big problem, keep in mind that at this point, probably 90% of the 6505 amps on the used market are built in the U.S.A.  And it's not hard to look on the back to see where it was built.  If one is still worried, 100% of the used 5150 amps on the used market were built in the U.S.A.  The number of old Peavey Ultra amps that are still up and running on the market are a strong indication as to the durability and longevity of Peavey products.  If the OP wants a 5150, he would be totally safe buying a used one... which makes more sense price wise than buying a new one anyhow.  
Gear: Gibson Les Paul Studio, Gibson SG Special, Fender Stratocaster, Fender Telecaster, Fender Jazzmaster, Gretsch Pro Jet, Carvin C350, Epiphone ES-339 P90, Epiphone ES-335 Pro. Peavey 6505, Sovtek MIG-100, Vox AC30, Peavey XXX.