#1
I have two mics up against a guitar cab.  Do I pan the balance hard left on channel one and hard right on channel two or do I leave them both centered?  

I'm using Sonar Professional to record and can record many ways.  Just looking for the best option from you pros.  


Best Regards,
Gosss
#3
Quote by Gosss
I have two mics up against a guitar cab.  Do I pan the balance hard left on channel one and hard right on channel two or do I leave them both centered?  

I'm using Sonar Professional to record and can record many ways.  Just looking for the best option from you pros.  


Best Regards,
Gosss

I would not necessarily suggest to pan the same signal (essentially) to hard left and right. If your mics are on different parts of the speaker your mix may be a bit lopsided. Panning two of the same signal would not really do much for you. Panning two different takes left and right is smart, though. Or if you have a stereo signal coming from the amp.
#4
Quote by Will Lane
I would not necessarily suggest to pan the same signal (essentially) to hard left and right. If your mics are on different parts of the speaker your mix may be a bit lopsided. Panning two of the same signal would not really do much for you. Panning two different takes left and right is smart, though. Or if you have a stereo signal coming from the amp.

I disagree. It is of course entirely dependent on the specific tracks in question, but the subtle phase and frequency response differences inherent in multimicing situations can help fill out the guitar sound when hard panned, without having them sound as wide as hard panning different takes

@TS, it's really up to you - both can work well. John Petrucci, for instance often records with two microphones (an sm57 and an md421), these takes receive different eq, and the md421 is mixed under the sm57, and they are not panned. However, panning two microphones can also sound good - these don't have to be hard panned, you may have better luck with some slight panning.

The main thing to be worried about with multi miking is phase relationships. If, when both signals are panned centre, muting one track makes the sound 'bigger' or 'fuller' or just 'better' - especially in the low end, than you probably have phase problems.
RIP Gooze

cats
#5
If you want to create more "open space" in the sound put one of the mics on the cab and the other a few feet way. When it comes time to mix you'll appreciate having the two sounds and with some panning you can create some very "live" sounding guitar sounds. Just another approach.
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#6
Quote by mulefish
I disagree. It is of course entirely dependent on the specific tracks in question, but the subtle phase and frequency response differences inherent in multimicing situations can help fill out the guitar sound when hard panned, without having them sound as wide as hard panning different takes

@TS, it's really up to you - both can work well. John Petrucci, for instance often records with two microphones (an sm57 and an md421), these takes receive different eq, and the md421 is mixed under the sm57, and they are not panned. However, panning two microphones can also sound good - these don't have to be hard panned, you may have better luck with some slight panning.

The main thing to be worried about with multi miking is phase relationships. If, when both signals are panned centre, muting one track makes the sound 'bigger' or 'fuller' or just 'better' - especially in the low end, than you probably have phase problems.

I didn't think about that. I also thought about suggesting panning the same track hard left and right but inverting the phase of one of them, which would be somewhat similar. Would you hard pan two signals from the same speaker that are completely different from where the mic was placed? I.e. one signal on center, one on edge of cone. That was my main concern- that may lead to a lopsided mix. If the mics are relatively close in placement, that would be okay in my mind.

You can also zoom in on the audio waveform and cut short bits of silence to line the signal up if the phase is not exactly 180 degrees off.
Last edited by Will Lane at Jun 10, 2017,
#7
Honestly, try a few things out and see what you like the most. Last time I used 2 mics, I used 2 different mics and blended the 2 signals. Gave a fantastic full tone.
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#8
Quote by reincarnator
Honestly, try a few things out and see what you like the most. Last time I used 2 mics, I used 2 different mics and blended the 2 signals. Gave a fantastic full tone.

Did you do any panning left and right or did you simply tweak the volume levels?
#9
In terms of multimicing one source I usually combine signals to taste on one submix bus or record to one track directly , then place somewhere on the pan picture, I usually don't open panning on 2 mic setup and try to keep the phase as close as possible.

Sometimes I do a wide pan, usually on leads where say I have a big stack in a room and I close mic and put stereo mic configuration from a few feet back in the room. This is something I do in studios only as I don't have the room at home, but it is a very nice natural short ambience/reverb trick.

You could also play around with miking weird things, like capturing slapback echo from a side of the room that is not facing amp, etc. I used to do a lot of work with PZM mic/mics slapped on the studio piano and capture that resonating when an amp is playing in the room, even had several different wood boards that I used to mount at level facing a drum kit and put a pzm mic on these, or two pzms in stereo, then crush with a compressor (or distressor) and touch of tape overdrive and bring a bit of that into a mix for instrument cohesion. Great trick with studio drums, if you want to try.
#10
Quote by Gosss
Did you do any panning left and right or did you simply tweak the volume levels?

I double track my guitars, so was only tweaking levels.
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Ibanez RG350mdx w/ SD TB-6
Ibanez RG7321 <3
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Ashdown EB 12-180 EVO II Combo

7>6!
#11
The question I think you need to ask is what do you hope to achieve by using a second microphone? Are you not satisfied with your tone with just the one mic? Are you just trying to find a way to use both mics because you can?

If you are recording anything vaguely in the genre of rock music then you will likely want to doubletrack, as in play one take and pan it left and another and pan it right. I see no reason to use a single take and pan each microphone left and right because you will end up with a lopsided mix which will likely be very distracting.
#12
Quote by Random3
The question I think you need to ask is what do you hope to achieve by using a second microphone? Are you not satisfied with your tone with just the one mic? Are you just trying to find a way to use both mics because you can?

If you are recording anything vaguely in the genre of rock music then you will likely want to doubletrack, as in play one take and pan it left and another and pan it right. I see no reason to use a single take and pan each microphone left and right because you will end up with a lopsided mix which will likely be very distracting.

One is reason is I get a stereo sound without a lot of tinkering around in Sonar.  The second is I get to see which mic sounded better between the two.  
#13
Gosss if you want a stereo sound then the way you usually would do it is to record the same part twice and pan each take hard left and right. This is precisely what double tracking is. There isn't really any point in using one take and panning each mic left and right. Even if you use the same mic and somehow get exactly the same tone through each one (which you won't) it is still the same take. Double tracking doesn't work with a single take.

You can absolutely use both mics at once, but you should always have some kind of goal in mind when you do this. Maybe record two different parts of the speaker cone and then decide which one you like better in the mixing phase. Maybe blend them together. Maybe decide one sounded like ass and delete it. The point is, don't feel like you need to record and use two microphone tracks purely because you own two microphones.
#14
Well...Dimmu Borgir kinda do this but it is one guitar thru two different amps hard L and hard R and then then other rhythm guitar center, at least that's what they described in one of their interviews.
#17
Quote by Random3
There isn't really any point in using one take and panning each mic left and right.

Why not? It will give you a stereo effect that isn't as pronounced as double tracking. Mic choice and placement is vital for getting a balanced sound - ranging from really subtle spread to a heavily lopsided mix
Quote by Random3
Even if you use the same mic and somehow get exactly the same tone through each one (which you won't) it is still the same take. Double tracking doesn't work with a single take.

You wouldn't want exactly the same tone through each; that's half the point.

Consider micing up an acoustic guitar. You could place a single mic aiming at the 12th fret, or whatever your favourite position is. You could also use two microphones in an xy pair, and pan the result - giving you some stereo spread due to frequencies captured, but minimal phase (timing) differences. Alternatively, you could use a spaced pair of microphones, and get stereo spread and phase differences. This will result in a wider stereo image.

These techniques do not use double tracking, but will result in a stereo image result. The same thought process can be applied to micing electric guitars.

The techniques utilized will of course be a bit different when micing a cab. There are many routes you can go - you can use two of the same microphones, at the same part of the speaker at the same distance to get as mono a sound as possible [probably still with some slight width if hard panned]. But each aspect can also be varied. Two of the same microphones at different parts of the speaker, or even different speakers can work. As can using two different microphones. 

If the sound captured from the two mics is different, than panning them is gonna give you stereo....
RIP Gooze

cats
Last edited by mulefish at Jun 18, 2017,