#1
Hi Guys. I need help in the search for a replacement to my Vox VT40+.

I want to buy a small combo valve amp, since I just use it in a flat. Since I play diferrent generes from Soft Indie Icelandic stuff to Blues - Rock - HardRock (and mostly) Metal (from sabbath to CoB or Amon Amarth). My budget is limited since I'm from Argentina and everything is so fucking expensive here, but I'm in the sub 500 Euros (Like Under 15000 ARS). I woul like to hace a clean anf gain channel option

I also know that sometimes is better to buy a Head a Cab option, and if the amp has Headphone output I could bare with this till I could buy a cab. (The store is taking my Vox as a part of payment) But this is also more expensive

The options I have look up are:

Blackstar HT 5R Combo (but then I heard like is Hybrid really, not all valve ?) )
Orange Micro Dark Terror + 1x12 Cab (not all valve and single channel but i can think of other options)
Orange Dark Terror (and then some f$%king day buy a cab)

My Guitars Are:
Epiphone Prophecy EM2 with FloydRose
Epiphone DOT ES-339  PRO
Last edited by igtaba at Jun 26, 2017,
#2
PLEASE: Need Help Buying a Small Valve Amp


I thought this was going to be a crowd-funding effort.

For what you want to do with it, an all-tube amp is unlikely to be your best choice, sorry.
There are quite a number of ways to practice quietly (or with no sound at all), and we've covered them in myriad other threads.
#3
Quote by dspellman

For what you want to do with it, an all-tube amp is unlikely to be your best choice, sorry.

 Can you tell me why?
#4
^ how quietly do you have to play? if it's truly whisper volume, then dspellman is probably right. if you can crank it a little (to, say, loud shouting volume) then tube is ok. but the options you picked aren't all-tube (the micro terror and the blackstar are hybrids), plus low wattage amps don't necessarily sound better at really low home volumes. counterintuitively, sometimes higher wattage amps sound better turned right down, so you really have to try a bunch of amps (if possible) at really low volumes to see which you think sound best (and don't forget that they'll sound a lot quieter in the shop!).

Quote by dspellman
I thought this was going to be a crowd-funding effort.


haha that's what i thought
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#5
Yeah, knowing why and how quiet you need to be would be helpful.

Also, it seems to me as if you're wanting to move away from modeling amps. Is this correct?
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#6
Dave_Mc I know that not all are pure-valve, but thats all I can see in the price range, but for example everytime I read anything about blackstar in this forum is bad.

I can crank it up normally, but sometimes I would like to play with headphones or quietly in the night that why I like the Orange Micro and the HT 5R . Also think that 5(valve) or 20(hybrid) watts is pleanty, since my VT40 watts is never played at 40watts
I wanna something simpler than the vox I have, is truth that has more options and effect but is hard to find good HiGain tones, and doest have a lot of features like EffectsLoop , o Headphones Simulated Output (has but sound horrible ). On the effects side, I just use Reverb normally
Last edited by igtaba at Jun 26, 2017,
#7
Yes, that is exactly right.

I would like to start buying some pedals, more old school simplified way. I wouldn't use all the modeling features and buying and iphone or a mac or good computer to use the apps is out of the question here in argentina. 
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Also, it seems to me as if you're wanting to move away from modeling amps.  Is this correct?
#8
As Dave correctly implies, more wattage doesn't necessarily mean more volume. What wattage gets you is more headroom- the ability to play at a given volume without the amp distorting the tone (because it isn't working as hard).

So a smaller amp might not be quieter at a given volume setting, and it may sound worse. And even though many musicians in harder genres have used that kind of amp distortion, there's no guarantees that a particular amp will sound good when pushed. Pedal distortion is in many ways more predictable, controllable, and portable across rigs.

Which is why I- and others- use pedals for our distortion.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#9
dannyalcatraz

Yes I knew that and the effect of the headroom, but more watts normally translate to more money.

I just want a suggestions of a good amp :P
#10
Out of your listed choices I would buy the Blackstar HT-5. The micro dark is only one channel and may not give you the clean sound you are after, same issue with the Dark Terror but it also does not have a headphone out and can't operate without a cab.

The blackstar has two channels, while the clean channel isn't a fender it is clean and takes pedals well so it would do everything that isn't rock to metal. The dirt channel can do rock to metal, although I suggest getting an overdrive to boost the dirt channel for better metal tones. I had a blackstar HT-5 for a few years and always thought it performed well. The speaker in the BS combo isn't the best so down the road you might want to look at replacing it, a Celestion G12H  (or EVH branded speaker) will really wake the amp up.
#11
guitarsngear
so it would better to go after the head version of the HT 5R and then I could buy something like a Orange Celestion loaded cabs in the months after?

I need to look up if the head version can take the headphones without a cab connect tough
#12
get the combo now and upgrade the speaker or get a different cab later, the combo can also run an external cab and disconnect the internal speaker, so you aren't loosing out on anything by getting the combo, but you gain being able to play right away.
#13
guitarsngear

Since you had own one, could you tell me if really is a good amp (without taking into acount the speaker), coz i have even read now that it cant take pedals (specially TS808 type) in front.

There's really a bad reputation for Blackstar in the forum.
#14
I could also stretch the butged to a Marsahll DSL5C, but i dont know anything about them
#15
I thought it was a decent amp, I boosted mine with a tube screamer clone all the time and it sounded fine, also used it for a worship guitar setup running several pedals - compressors, ODs, delays and verbs into the front end and it worked fine.

Most of the hate on the blackstar amps comes from the marketing of the amps where they were advertised as all tube but are in fact hybrid with some ss components in the signal clipping circuits, but that isn't about the tone of the amps. I'm not sure where they are at now, but I know when they first came out the hype train was running hard and their prices were a bit inflated.

Play one and see what you think yourself, the store should have some pedals for you to try in front of it as well.

I'm not familiar with the DSL5C so I can't comment.
#16
igtaba

The Quilter 101 head is a non-modeling solid state amp. Your favorite music store probably doesn't carry them, but several online retailers do.
http://www.quilterlabs.com/index.php/dealers/static

It has a headphone jack, and is a good pedal platform. Depending on setting, it hdelivering 50-100w. It's voiced for mainstream stuff, but with the right pedals, it will also do metal. Their universal power supply tech & adapters means you can use it with virtually any country's voltage.

They retail for @$299 in the USA, and @€380-400 in Europe.*

http://www.quilterlabs.com/index.php/productpage/101-mini-head



* if that's too pricey, Quilter's Microblock 45 is $150 USD, is similarly voiced, takes pedals, and has a headphone jack...and is the size of a pedal.
http://www.quilterlabs.com/index.php/productpage/microblock-45
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#17
The store doesn't even store the blackstar to try, is all pay and then they get it. So I'm searching for one to test. I wanna do a A/B between the Blackstar and the Orange Micro Dark. I would update you guys, and thanks for the suggestions adn I would accept  more.

The quilter looks good, but buying outside the country cpuld br a problema in customs taxes (shittty country)
#18
igtaba

I suspected as much, which is why I focused on the smaller, less expensive models.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#19
Laney IRT-Studio.   My favorite completely silent setup is this amp with a V30 impulse / Cabinet Sim through the computer.  

or just go with all computer software.  I like the touch and feel of the Laney better than 100% software.  
Guitars:
Ibanez RG1570 Prestige
Jackson Kelly KE3 - MIJ (Distortion/Jazz)
Jackson DKMGT Dinky (EMG 81/85)
ESP E-II Eclipse Custom (JB/'59)
ESP LTD EC-1001FR (EMG 81/60)
Fender MIM Strat

Amps:
Mesa/Boogie Dual Rectifier Roadster 212
Laney IronHeart IRT-Studio
Peavey Vypyr 30
Peavey ReValver Amp Sims
TOOOO many T.C. Electronic Pedals. . .
#20
igtaba Well you didn't say why you're getting rid of the vox but my suggestion is too keep it, you will regret selling it later.
If it's too loud then get a load box for it.

If this was already covered my apologies as I didn't read anything but your initial post.
Seriously though do not get rid of your vox.
#21
33db Why you suggest that I should keep the Vox? I'm want to sell/change it because I dont like most of the preset amp sounds especially the HiGain ones (Is the old one), The headphone output is shite basically (nor emulated nor usable to recording) when I listen with my DT770. The Distortions/FX (with the exception of the delay and reverb) are bad, and you can have much/any control over them. I cant put other cab. Is modeling but doesnt have MIDI output or anything of that

But yesterday I was doing some financial maths :P and I think It would be better for my to:

Buy first a 1x12 Cab
Then save more money and buy the orange Dark Terror 15watt Head (or try some other HiGain rock/metal heads)
Keep the vox if I can, coz the cleans amp sound are good, with the delay and reverb on it. And for the soft indie icelandic thing (like soley) is more than enough
#23
Quote by igtaba
Dave_Mc I know that not all are pure-valve, but thats all I can see in the price range, but for example everytime I read anything about blackstar in this forum is bad.

I can crank it up normally, but sometimes I would like to play with headphones or quietly in the night that why I like the Orange Micro and the HT 5R . Also think that 5(valve) or 20(hybrid) watts is pleanty, since my VT40 watts is never played at 40watts
I wanna something simpler than the vox I have, is truth that has more options and effect but is hard to find good HiGain tones, and doest have a lot of features like EffectsLoop , o Headphones Simulated Output (has but sound horrible ). On the effects side, I just use Reverb normally


yeah. as danny says, i'm not sure setting an arbitrary limit on wattage is a great idea, since the higher wattage ones often sound better (and if you ask me the argument about not using the thing to its full potential is iffy... i mean you could argue that unless you're playing the amp 24 hours a day you're not using it to its full potential ). But the cost may well be a problem, I have no idea what pricing in argentina is like (from what you said, expensive ).

and yeah if you need headphones that will limit your options quite a bit unfortunately, so you probably know better than I do what's available and suitable.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#24
Quote by igtaba
guitarsngear

Since you had own one, could you tell me if really is a good amp (without taking into acount the speaker), coz i have even read now that it cant take pedals (specially TS808 type) in front.

There's really a bad reputation for Blackstar in the forum.


i'm not sure it won't take a tubescreamer up front- it may well take one just fine. just you'd want to check it did (since it has solid state stuff at the input, which is where the tubescreamer boost hits it first) before buying one.

to be fair, blackstar has a bad rep because of its shady (in my opinion) marketing. i've never tried the ht series, they may sound great- i never say they sound bad, for example. ironically enough, i've only tried the artisan 15- which is genuinely all-tube, and I didn't much like it. LOL.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#25
Quote by igtaba
33db Why you suggest that I should keep the Vox? I'm want to sell/change it because I dont like most of the preset amp sounds especially the HiGain ones (Is the old one), The headphone output is shite basically (nor emulated nor usable to recording) when I listen with my DT770. The Distortions/FX (with the exception of the delay and reverb) are bad, and you can have much/any control over them. I cant put other cab. Is modeling but doesnt have MIDI output or anything of that

But yesterday I was doing some financial maths :P and I think It would be better for my to:

Buy first a 1x12 Cab
Then save more money and buy the orange Dark Terror 15watt Head (or try some other HiGain rock/metal heads)
Keep the vox if I can, coz the cleans amp sound are good, with the delay and reverb on it. And for the soft indie icelandic thing (like soley) is more than enough

Because people almost always regret selling gear, although now that I looked up your amp and saw it was solid state not tube *shrug* maybe not.
Still if you keep it you can leave that at a practice somewhere.

yes buying a separate cab opens up using different heads.
This the route I went instead of combo amps, bought an Orange Micro Dark Terror and a 1x12 cab, I now have 3 heads which were cheaper than buying combos and take up less room.
#26
LOL you changed your title, we were only joking about the crowdfunding thing, we knew you didn't mean that

^ the only problem with that logic is that you get like me and then never sell anything
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#27
Dave_Mc Here the prices are not only different for importa stuff but by brands to. Gibson doesnt have a Official Dealer anymore since '15, so everything gibson/vox related is stupidly priced, for example:

And Epiphone ES-339 Pro that I have cost in thomman 359Euro. And here you pay the equivalent to 805Euro if the store as good prices, sometimes they charge even more.
The Orange Micro Terror, that is suppose to be a cheap head, is 189Euro is thomman, and the price here is 306Euro, so for me that I'm a student/worker is funcking hard to buy gear or guitar. If wasnt for Import Custom that are a bunch of asshole to let things through , I bet it would be cheaper to buy in thomman and import than buy here to the dealers. Only PRS have like a dealer that put prices in tune with the world.
Sorry, too much talk about my anger at prices :P

33db Im going to try the Micro Dark, to see if I can get enough Gain to get like Amon Amarth tones with definition. We well see. There is any other recommendation for head to get a metal tone, for the cleans/and all I would keep the vox for now
#29
yeah i suspected it'd be something like that, that sucks about the prices
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#31
diabolical Yes, Im going to try a few in a store tomorrow. We'll see what happends, for the youtube review and all the micro terror isn't a bad option, and I would like to know really if there is a lot of diference with the all valve dark 15w head. But yeah, is going to be an orange i believe, everytime I heard a review or a comparison, the orange always blows the others by far
#32
Marshall DSL. Get the biggest one you can afford. Preferably a DSL40c if you can find a way to swing it. That way you have plenty of reserve volume if you ever decide to play out. 
#34
Jeffh40 A dsl40C is like really too much money sadly, maybe someone smaller (5c) be in the price range, but we'll see

diabolical This afternoon I'm going to try the orange, in the youtube videos I couldn't hear a lot of difference, but could be 19201902thousands factor from recording and compresion
#35
I managed to test the micro dark terror guys and i don't know if my ears are working bad, 'coz I couldn't hear the gain that the demo videos had. It was way softer the gain that what I'd expected
#37
For home playing I believe nothing beats some sweet software and a nice pair of studio headphones.  It's so nice to wail and have awesome tone and not at all be concerned about your volume.  Being anxious at home about your playing is counterproductive to the goal of learning, developing, and writing (imo).  If you're at all in that situation a budget amp (that is not going to do soft indie and Amon Amarth at the same time) aint gonna hit it, and you'll just be on here in 2 months asking about software anyways
"I definitely don’t write all my music in a blackout, like I used to, although I did come up with some good stuff in a blackout."
-Matt Fucking Pike