#1
Hello! I just have one quick question.

I have an old Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier head and I found a 1x12 Avatar Cab at my local music store. Is it safe to use a 100w amp head on a 112 cab? I don't know exactly what speaker is in it yet but I'll find out when I go back this weekend. I just know it's some kind of Celestion.

Thanks for your help.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#2
I would definitely check the wattage of the speaker before pumping any real volume through it, but if you keep the volume down low to be safe, you shouldn't have an issue.

You amp does not put out its full 100 watts at all times, just if you're really cranking it to the max.
#3
Depends on the speaker. Speakers like the Eminence Delta Pro 12A will handle 400W easily, and the EV-L (depending on the version) will handle nearly the same, depending on the version.
#4
Need the speaker rating.  A Celestion V30 is rated to 60w so a 100w amp will almost certainly cook it.  It there is a 100w JBL, Emi, or EV in there you are golden.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#5
Guess the big question, are you planning on diming a 100w tube head? Hell, you'll need earplugs much before you have to worry about pushing more power than a 112 will handle :P

And how good of a deal is that cab? Right now Avatar has a pretty sweet deal on their 2x12 budget contemporary, $349 with free shipping in the US. Uses Vintage 30s and looks to be built like a tank. With one of those, you'd just have to worry about your hearing with the Dual Rec
Fleet of MiJ Ibanez
Couple of Balls
Peavey & EVH Wolfgangs
Eclipse
Fender HM Strat
Kemper KPA
5150 III 50w & cabs
#6
So I guess at the moment I'm not really in a position where I absolutely need to be cranking my recto so keeping the volume down wouldn't be a problem, but I am a bit concerned about longevity. If and when I am in a position to turn the volume up I guess I'd like the option.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#7
DarthV the 112 is priced at $250 but the owner of the store is pretty chill and I feel like I can probably talk him down to about $200. I've also seen some 212 avatars online for as low as $300 not including shipping. Tough decision.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#9
I just found out that the wattage on the speaker is 60w & 8 ohms. About what I expected.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#10
Ippon but those are expensiiiiiiiive
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#11
Quote by robertsanidiot
Ippon but those are expensiiiiiiiive


Check with Rick at Rawoods (http://rawoods.com/?page_id=221 ) -- he'll build you a Thiele in bare wood (or completed). You need to ask him the price directly.
If you buy the bare wood version, I'd suggestion finishing it with Acrytech's Duratex -- Acry-Tech now offers a Trial Size bag (1 Pint) of roller grade and a 3" roller for $29.00 (including shipping) that will give you enough DuraTex® to coat a couple 12" speaker cabs. A one-quart kit is around $40.

The Eminence Delta Pro 12A speaker itself is about $129 at Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Eminence-Professional-DELTA-PRO-12A-Speaker/dp/B0009HBHD8/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1502395572&sr=8-2-fkmr0&keywords=Eminence+Delta+Pro+%212A )
#12
Well you probably will end up paying $50 to ship the 70lb 212, so I'd just buy new at that point. Comes down to money and space. Then again, you'd going to need to handle the width of the head no matter what. So you'd be no worse off for space...unless you are planning on standing the recto on its side :P

Other question, what speaker does the 1x12 come with?
Fleet of MiJ Ibanez
Couple of Balls
Peavey & EVH Wolfgangs
Eclipse
Fender HM Strat
Kemper KPA
5150 III 50w & cabs
#13
dspellman that sounds like a fun but possibly expensive and problematic project. I'd love to try something like this but wouldn't even know where to begin going about diy-ing my cab. I also don't even know a thing about Thiele cabs :/
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#14
DarthV I think I've decided that the 1x12 isn't an option since I've at least discovered that it isn't high enough wattage to handle the recto at full power. So I guess at this point it comes down to whether I'd rather have a new cab with v30's or try my luck with a used cab with slightly more contemporary speakers. Whatever that even means.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#15
Quote by robertsanidiot
dspellman that sounds like a fun but possibly expensive and problematic project. I'd love to try something like this but wouldn't even know where to begin going about diy-ing my cab. I also don't even know a thing about Thiele cabs :/


The Rawood cabinet is already constructed. You'd just paint it (rather than tolex) and attach hardware. It really couldn't be simpler. He can also supply you with a completed cabinet.

The Mesa Thiele cabinet is a modification of an electrovoice cabinet design that was designed specifically for the EV-L speaker using its Thiele-Small characteristics to produce the best sound from that specific speaker. It's compact but produces great sound with both that speaker and with the Eminence Delta Pro 12A. It's not really designed for any other speaker (though you can put others into it). It's worth learning about.
#17
Quote by robertsanidiot
DarthV I think I've decided that the 1x12 isn't an option since I've at least discovered that it isn't high enough wattage to handle the recto at full power. So I guess at this point it comes down to whether I'd rather have a new cab with v30's or try my luck with a used cab with slightly more contemporary speakers. Whatever that even means.


I've run a 100W 1x12 combo with two different speakers for a long time. In fact, the amp is a twin to an early Mesa (four EL34s). Carvin made a 100W "British" voiced speaker that lived in it for a long time. At some point I swapped it out for an EV-L (which will handle up to 400W) and later swapped the Brit speaker back in. I'm not sure what's in there at the moment, but a 1x12 is perfectly capable of handling your amp depending (as mentioned in post #3, above) on the speaker. It's also a helluva lot easier to cart around.
#18
Quote by ExDementia
dspellman Do you happen to know ballpark what one of those cabs cost unloaded? Curious about these myself.


I just emailed Rick about something else (securing an amp head onto a 2x12 if you're using a tilting amp stand or Fender-style tilt-back legs) and asked him that question. I'll post it when I have a reply.
#20
Quote by dspellman
Check with Rick at Rawoods (http://rawoods.com/?page_id=221 ) -- he'll build you a Thiele in bare wood (or completed). You need to ask him the price directly.
If you buy the bare wood version, I'd suggestion finishing it with Acrytech's Duratex --  Acry-Tech now offers a Trial Size bag (1 Pint) of roller grade and a 3" roller for $29.00 (including shipping) that will give you enough DuraTex® to coat a couple 12" speaker cabs. A one-quart kit is around $40.

The Eminence Delta Pro 12A  speaker itself is about $129 at Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/Eminence-Professional-DELTA-PRO-12A-Speaker/dp/B0009HBHD8/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1502395572&sr=8-2-fkmr0&keywords=Eminence+Delta+Pro+%212A )

An alternative cab maker is TRM Guitarcabs. He used to have an eBay presence when I bought his 212s and Thiele cabs. He builds them with Pine and all have been bullet-proof.  

As far as EVM-12Ls, you can snag them for ~$100 from CraigsList if you're patient.
#21
Quote by Ippon
An alternative cab maker is TRM Guitarcabs. He used to have an eBay presence when I bought his 212s and Thiele cabs. He builds them with Pine and all have been bullet-proof.  

As far as EVM-12Ls, you can snag them for ~$100 from CraigsList if you're patient.


TRM's version of the Thiele is $169 plus $40 shipping with a 3 week wait, made of pine.

The finished, completed version (no speaker) is $399 (shipped( with a 4-5 week wait, tolexed, wired, with hardware and speaker cloth.

Pine is fine for small cabinets. It's not so great for larger cabinets, however -- it doesn't have the impact resistance or strength of plywood.

I think you're going to need quite a lot of patience to snag a $100 EVM-12L from Craigslist, or you're going to settle for a pretty old speaker. EVM-12Ls are $289 new at Sweetwater, $265 on Amazon, and are mostly $200-250 (and some of these are...um...."vintage") on the Los Angeles area Craigs.
#22
One of these days I have to stick a watt meter in line to see how much a 100 watt head is pushing at  volume of  say 5-6. I'd bet it was less than the 60 amps a Celesttion speaker is rated for. 5-6 through a tube amp is louder than my normal gigging volume and way too loud for home. 

I can't imagine you would have an issue for just home playing 
#23
Quote by dspellman
TRM's version of the Thiele is $169 plus $40 shipping with a 3 week wait, made of pine.

The finished, completed version (no speaker) is $399 (shipped( with a 4-5 week wait, tolexed, wired, with hardware and speaker cloth.

Pine is fine for small cabinets. It's not so great for larger cabinets, however -- it doesn't have the impact resistance or strength of plywood.

I think you're going to need quite a lot of patience to snag a $100 EVM-12L from Craigslist, or you're going to settle for a pretty old speaker. EVM-12Ls are $289 new at Sweetwater, $265 on Amazon, and are mostly $200-250 (and some of these are...um...."vintage") on the Los Angeles area Craigs.

Shoot, I didn't realize his Thiele cabs got pricier, specially with the shipping.  

The 212s made of Pine are fine (rhymed) although the 412s would not be ideal.

I got most of my EVM-12Ls, 15Ls, and 15Bs from the SF/Bay Area CL. This pair of "Classics" came from an Oakland musician (and duct tape fan) who had too much gear for $200!
#25
IpponGreat snag on those EV's!

For some reason that 15s are a LOT cheaper here than the 12's. Supply and demand, I guess.
#26
I never did get a response to my email about the homemade Thiele cab so I might just go with an avatar 2x12. $350 isn't a bad deal at all. I'm just not sure if Vintage 30s are the right speakers for me. Although I'm not totally sure what speakers would be the right speakers for me.
Quote by Fat Lard
ur an idiot Robert.


Quote by Duffman123
STUPID SEXY FLANDERS robertsanidiot
#27
Quote by Ippon
Get a Thiele cab with an ElectroVoice EVM-12L (200W).  Sounds huge with the Recto.


wannnt
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/