#1
hy everyone,
does it make sense to buy an epiphone les pual standard and put a bigsby b7 on it? Or should i just buy a gibson les paul tribute t 2017 with the same money?
Thanks
#2
Folks have been putting Bigsbys on all kinds of guitars. It's fine to do that, though more expensive than buying a guitar that already has one installed.
But if you're saying that the alternative is simply another brand that does NOT have a Bigsby, then it seems obvious that the Bigsby isn't much of a requirement. You can certainly put a Bigsby on a Tribute T at some point as well.

You're likely to find that the Tribute T isn't a significantly different guitar from the Epi LP Standard, but that's more a personal choice than a gear-based one.
#3
You're asking to put a Bigsby on a guitar but your other option costs more than an Epiphone + Bigsby + install and also doesn't have a Bigsby.


So what exactly do you want? Budget? Location? New or Used? Genres you play? Sounds you want? Preference in neck profiles, shapes, bridges etc... All of that stuff would be nice so that we can help you better. 
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#4
This seems like a very odd decision to have to make. The Gibson Tribute T is about twice the price of an Epiphone LP Standard. Are Bigsbys really that expensive?

Bigsbys really aren't very good vibrato systems. They're very limited in movement and have terrible tuning stability. Most people that I know who own a guitar with a Bigsby have one just for the look more than anything else and hardly use it because it keeps taking their guitar out of tune. And it can't be that important to you for the guitar to have a Bigsby when you're considering buying another guitar that doesn't have one.

If you have the budget to get a Gibson Tribute T, I think you can do better with your money with other brands. Does it have to say Gibson on the headstock? There are other brands out there that are seriously worth considering. Like the LTD Deluxes like the EC1000-T with Dimarzio 36th anniv. pickups, or if you want to go Japanese, one of the lower end FGN guitars like the Neo Classic LS10 or LC10 depending on if you want a Standard or a Custom. Or a lower-end Edwards or Tokai.
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#5
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You're asking to put a Bigsby on a guitar but your other option costs more than an Epiphone + Bigsby + install and also doesn't have a Bigsby.


So what exactly do you want? Budget? Location? New or Used? Genres you play? Sounds you want? Preference in neck profiles, shapes, bridges etc... All of that stuff would be nice so that we can help you better. 

sorry i didnt explain well what i meant. I am wondering if the gibson is that much better than the epi to jistify the purchase of it even if i would like a tremolo system and a les paul guitar. I know they are similar guitars, but if the gibson is quite better i'd go fo it and wait for the tremolo.
#6
Quote by thob30041
sorry i didnt explain well what i meant. I am wondering if the gibson is that much better than the epi to jistify the purchase of it even if i would like a tremolo system and a les paul guitar. I know they are similar guitars, but if the gibson is quite better i'd go fo it and wait for the tremolo.


If you're able to, try them and see what you think.


Personally, I don't really think the lower end Gibsons are that much better than an Epiphone to justify them almost being double in price. If I had the choice between the two I'd probably rather an Epiphone Les Paul Tribute vs a lower end Gibson LP. IMO a lot of what you're paying for with a Gibson is the name and in that price range it just isn't worth it.
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#7
That depends how bad you want the Bigsby It's a cool thing to have, but if it's just decoration then maybe don't bother since it's a lot of money. Equally, if you mean to be doing plenty of that Bigsby vibrato, it might be the right investment for you. That said, from my recent experience of buying a Gibson (and I'm sure plenty of other people on here can back this up with their own more substantial experience), you can pay three times what you'd be dropping on a 2017 Tribute T and still get a "meh" guitar. With Gibsons, you really need to see them in person, ideally somewhere where you can try several of the same model. A good one will generally be worth all of its price tag, at least, but you need to find that one first. So as far as what's worth the money, the Gibson can be better, but you can't guarantee it will be unless you get your hands on it beforehand. If you really like having "Gibson" on the headstock, that may be worth it, otherwise as counter-intuitive as it may seem, I honestly find Epiphones of the Standard's price range to be more consistent in terms of quality. Epiphone also have the Tribute Plus, which is a great Les Paul between the two in terms of price. There are definitely more than two horses to consider in this race, even if you just want a Les Paul.

If what you want is a good Les Paul, you should be able to find a good Les Paul in either price range. If what you really want is a good Les Paul with a Bigsby, an Epiphone (be it the Standard or something else of a similar price) would be a pretty decent way to achieve that. I would check around to see if there are any other models available with factory-installed Bigsbys, though, just to avoid the whole ballache of installing one. Possibly even a second-hand Gibby with an aftermarket one might be achievable in your price range, since mods like that tend to drop the resale value.

EDIT: I guess while I was typing all that all the sensible people came along and had a whole discussion. Probably listen to them also, they're smart. At least when it comes to guitars

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
They're very limited in movement and have terrible tuning stability. Most people that I know who own a guitar with a Bigsby have one just for the look more than anything else and hardly use it because it keeps taking their guitar out of tune..
I object that when used sensibly (that is, for vibrato), the Bigsby on my Tele really doesn't do very much to the tuning at all (as in, with liberal use you'd probably throw it off enough for the strobe function on my Polytune to notice but not enough to sound out unless you really kept at it in two or three consecutive songs of vibratoing). I know that wouldn't necessarily be the same deal with a Les Paul, though, since they have the issue of strings going through the nut at weird angles.
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Last edited by K33nbl4d3 at Sep 22, 2017,
#8
T00DEEPBLUE

I agree they don't have the range of other trems, but my Bigsbys have never been a problem regarding tuning stability.
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#9
Quote by dannyalcatraz
T00DEEPBLUE

I agree they don't have the range of other trems, but my Bigsbys have never been a problem regarding tuning stability.


If you set them up right and you aren't doing crazy dives (not what a Bigsby is for anyway) then they stay in tune fine I find as well. Bigsbys are more for subtle vibrato anyway and that's generally what I used them for. You can be crazy like Neil Young I guess but I probably wouldn't

It's nothing like a Maestro or the Sideways Vibrola Gibson did. Those things are disasters.
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#10
Quote by thob30041
sorry i didnt explain well what i meant. I am wondering if the gibson is that much better than the epi to jistify the purchase of it even if i would like a tremolo system and a les paul guitar. I know they are similar guitars, but if the gibson is quite better i'd go fo it and wait for the tremolo.

Between the two specific guitars you're looking at, the Gibson is better. But there are other Epiphones that are IMO better than the Gibson Tribute T. Such as the Epiphone Tribute Plus.  I think that would be a more fair comparison. A lot of the features on the Epi Tribute are really nice for the money and it's overall a pretty well made guitar.

Every Epiphone I've ever played required some fretwork to be done to get them playing their best though. But the exact same can be said for the low-end Gibsons. If not more so. You're paying an awful lot for the name with Gibsons and when you have a limited budget, you can't really afford to pay the headstock tax without the quality taking a hit as well.
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Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Sep 22, 2017,
#11
dannyalcatraz H4T3BR33D3R

I'm glad I'm not the only one who gets on fine with Bigsbys I don't use mine all the time because most songs don't call for it, but it's really a wonderful trem for making seventh chords shimmer prettily and I can do that plenty without issues.
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#12
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I object that when used sensibly (that is, for vibrato), the Bigsby on my Tele really doesn't do very much to the tuning at all (as in, with liberal use you'd probably throw it off enough for the strobe function on my Polytune to notice but not enough to sound out unless you really kept at it in two or three consecutive songs of vibratoing). I know that wouldn't necessarily be the same deal with a Les Paul, though, since they have the issue of strings going through the nut at weird angles.

The fact that it's on a Gibson is the reason why Bibsbys have terrible tuning stability. The headstock break angles are a major pain.
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#13
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
The fact that it's on a Gibson is the reason why Bibsbys have terrible tuning stability. The headstock break angles are a major pain.
Yeah, I mean I think you (plural, as in the regular posters) know I'm relatively new to the world of Gibsons (besides the fact that for years ~2 to ~4 of me playing guitar I was using an Epi SG, but I forget things) so frankly I don't know how big a role that stuff plays, but I can well believe that that would be the reason for the reputation Bigsby tailpieces have, since they're usually on Gibbies and Gretsches.
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#14
Quote by K33nbl4d3
Yeah, I mean I think you (plural, as in the regular posters) know I'm relatively new to the world of Gibsons (besides the fact that for years ~2 to ~4 of me playing guitar I was using an Epi SG, but I forget things) so frankly I don't know how big a role that stuff plays, but I can well believe that that would be the reason for the reputation Bigsby tailpieces have, since they're usually on Gibbies and Gretsches.

Not to mention that they're usually fitted to standard TOM bridges and not roller ones as well.

On the MLP forum, the pinging you hear from the bridge when you sneeze on the bar is considered mojo.
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#15
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Not to mention that they're usually fitted to standard TOM bridges and not roller ones as well.

On the MLP forum, the pinging you hear from the bridge when you sneeze on the bar is considered mojo.
I mean in all fairness, mine is paired with what the guitar world seems to have decided is The Worst Bridge Ever Made Of The Year, and while I have had to inundate several screws with blue Loctite, it's never given me tuning problems
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#16
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I mean in all fairness, mine is paired with what the guitar world seems to have decided is The Worst Bridge Ever Made Of The Year, 

Rhythm in Jump Dancing Close To You would like a word.
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#17
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Rhythm in Jump Dancing Close To You would like a word.
Have you ever used one? Could be the best Floyd on the market
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#18
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Have you ever used one? Could be the best Floyd on the market

Maybe so if it wasn't for the POS guitar it's attached to.
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#19
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Maybe so if it wasn't for the POS guitar it's attached to.
I mean he must've got it from somewhere, right?

There's probably some fucking fantastic Chinese Frankenstrat or something somewhere with that tremolo and it's a secret known only to former residents of the Kowloon Walled City but it dives and keeps tuning like no other
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#20
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I mean he must've got it from somewhere, right?

There's probably some fucking fantastic Chinese Frankenstrat or something somewhere with that tremolo and it's a secret known only to former residents of the Kowloon Walled City but it dives and keeps tuning like no other

Still a better tuning system than G-Force.
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#21
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Still a better tuning system than G-Force.

How can that be possible?!?!

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#22
Quote by K33nbl4d3


If what you want is a good Les Paul, you should be able to find a good Les Paul in either price range. If what you really want is a good Les Paul with a Bigsby, an Epiphone (be it the Standard or something else of a similar price) would be a pretty decent way to achieve that. I would check around to see if there are any other models available with factory-installed Bigsbys, though, just to avoid the whole ballache of installing one. Possibly even a second-hand Gibby with an aftermarket one might be achievable in your price range, since mods like that tend to drop the resale value.


I object that when used sensibly (that is, for vibrato), the Bigsby on my Tele really doesn't do very much to the tuning at all (as in, with liberal use you'd probably throw it off enough for the strobe function on my Polytune to notice but not enough to sound out unless you really kept at it in two or three consecutive songs of vibratoing). I know that wouldn't necessarily be the same deal with a Les Paul, though, since they have the issue of strings going through the nut at weird angles.

I agree with this. I have Bigsby vibratos on two Epiphone Les Paul's, a standard and a Tribute Plus (I used the Vibramate also on the Tribute Plus so I didn't have to screw anything into the guitar). I don't have any tuning issues with either but then I am only using it for some gentle vibrato not any kind of heavy-handed diving. I also have a a Dusenberg Les Trem on a Les Paul that needs no drilling or mods. It works well also and is 1/2 the price of a Bigsby B7 (especially if you also have a Vibramate under the B7). I actually own two Epi Tribute Plus LP's. I liked my first one so much that when I saw another one in another color on EBay at a nice price, I bought it.
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Last edited by Rickholly74 at Sep 22, 2017,
#23
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I also have a a Dusenberg Les Trem on a Les Paul that needs no drilling or mods.
I wish I hadn't Googled that. I saw this:
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#24
K33nbl4d3

Mmmhmmm. And how did that make you feel?
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#25
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K33nbl4d3

Mmmhmmm. And how did that make you feel?
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#26
Quote by thob30041
sorry i didnt explain well what i meant. I am wondering if the gibson is that much better than the epi to jistify the purchase of it even if i would like a tremolo system and a les paul guitar. I know they are similar guitars, but if the gibson is quite better i'd go fo it and wait for the tremolo.


I have half a dozen LPs with Floyd Rose trems, some of which are less expensive than the Gibson, some far more. And at least one IS a Gibson.
None are Epiphones.

I personally don't care for the quality of the cheaper Gibson LPs, though there are those who own them who dote on them. Even when you get into the Gibson price range that I *do* like (over $3K) in those guitars, I'm not convinced that there's enough there to really justify the cost of the expensive spread. It's more, "If you've absolutely gotta have it, then fork over the money."
#27
K33nbl4d3

I can't see the image: "No Hotlinking".
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#28
Quote by dannyalcatraz
T00DEEPBLUE

I agree they don't have the range of other trems, but my Bigsbys have never been a problem regarding tuning stability.


It's just that you have no problem with tuning instability, period
#29
I've been fortunate. So far, any time I've had tuning issues, it's been because thevstrigs were dying.

(Which reminds me...got to change some strings.)

But I'm also not a whammy wizard or bendoholic, so that probably helps.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#30
Quote by dspellman

I personally don't care for the quality of the cheaper Gibson LPs, though there are those who own them who dote on them. Even when you get into the Gibson price range that I *do* like (over $3K) in those guitars, I'm not convinced that there's enough there to really justify the cost of the expensive spread. It's more, "If you've absolutely gotta have it, then fork over the money."

I agree. Up until recently I owned a 1973 Gibson LP that I gigged constantly for about 35 years. It is a wonderful guitar. A few years ago I bought my first Epiphone (1960 Tribute Plus) with the intention of leaving my Gibson home and retiring it from gigs. While I play different guitars based on the requirements of the gig, when it came to rock gigs I always took my Gibson LP and either a Strat or a Tele for variety. When I started using the Epi Tribute I found I really enjoyed playing the Epiphone Tribute for it's feel and sound. Is it better than my Gibson? No, but then depending on other factors like your playing style, technique, amp and other issues the difference will be so subtle to the average player or maybe not even noticeable. That's when you have to question whether there is enough of a difference to justify the $2000-3000 price difference for a Gibson LP (Standard or above). 

If money is not a factor in the decision, then buy the Gibson. If your heart is set on having a real Gibson Les Paul (we all know that "gotta have it" feeling), then buy the Gibson. If you just want a quality Les Paul I recommend the higher level Epiphones (Standard and up) or an Agile (but that's another story). I am not a fan of Gibson's lesser modals that don't have all the binding, finish, inlays etc. For me it's not a matter of how they play or sound but if I am going to buy a Gibson Les Paul, I want all the bells and whistles, not a stripped down version. By the same token stay away from the lower end Epiphone Les Paul's. Only Standard and up. That's my opinion.  
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Last edited by Rickholly74 at Sep 23, 2017,
#31
I've seen second hand Epi Les Pauls with retrofitted Bigsbys a few times, you should be able to pick one up for less than £200, there might be one available now if you look. That would seem to me definitely the best course to take.

Just as other people have been saying, I'd be very wary of the low-end Gibsons; they have all kinds of problems. In my experience I prefer a decent Epiphone.
#32
That said, if what you're after is just a Les Paul shape with a tremelo, well there's some Korean PRS in your price range which fit that description, like the Tremonti custom, and have all the same specs as Gibson in terms of fret size, pretty much the same scale length, etc. I think they might have a slightly different radius, can't remember.

LTD does some as-well but they're quite different in both specs and style. Longer scale length, bigger frets, etc, and they're not usually subtly or traditionally styled. LTD is more hit and miss, they have a range of models, some good, some not.
#33
Is it really a necessity for you to have a poorly designed trem bridge on your guitar that will make it get out of tune even quicker than your regular LP? If you want a trem-equiped guitar there are much better options for that budget; if you just like the looks then there's not really another way around then.
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#34
sorry for my late reply. During these days i came across another option: the epiphone wildkat. I really like the design of it, but i'm not sure if i would be able to play pink floyd on it (which is what i play most). If it can be helpful, my amp is a cube 20gx
#35
I have wanted a Wildcat for some time and since it comes with a Bigsby that may be your answer.
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#36
A friend of mine has a Wildkat, not a bad guitar, but its pickups are a bit aggressive. Probably not the best option for capturing the subtleties of DG's playing.
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Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#37
For the budget you could probably grab one and change out the pickups. I'm sure someone does a P-90 sized whatever-you-want. Wildkats are nice for sure.
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