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casualty01
Here all along
Join date: Apr 2002
2,622 IQ
#1
ok... the last one was rather old and stagnant, and people are starting to ignore it. most likely cause the last one was so big, they don't feel like sifting through it all, or basically out of selfish arrogance that the rules don't apply to them.

anywho. here's a new one. (the old one has been moved to the archives. if you had an open question going in the old one, please feel free to repost it in here. I apologize for the inconvenience.)

please use this thread and only this thread to post your vocal related questions &advice.

Rules Of The Thread

only 2 rules. failure to heed these rules will result in warnings. no exceptions. so please read them to avoid any confusion.

  • no spam - pretty self explanitory. either post a question an answer or an update (i.e. a thank you if the answer helped, or an update on how everything worked out). that's it.

  • no flaming - people are here to learn and or help others... there is no reason for any nasty comments or hateful posts. if you need further elaboration... read on.

    - no flipping on out some member that tried to help but didn't answer the way you liked. perhaps they didn't understand the question as you intended. if you don't like an answer or think it wasn't very helpful say so but be respectful and perhaps try to re-word or re-explain what you meant.

    - no random insults about someones vocal question or talents, the style of music they're asking about or if you think their question is silly. everyone has their own style pusuits and level of knowledge... so while a question might seem "silly" or "pointless" to you, to them it might be a serious problem they're having. be respectful.



Some Tips For A More Detailed And Helpful Response


Explain your question as clearly and as detailed as possible.

below are some of the more common questions... not complete by any stretch of the imagination, but the more frequent ones have been covered and examples given to help give you an idea of what kind of things need to be related to the users in order to get a much better response to your situation.

remember, this is NOT a FAQ. it is merely a guide to help you ask better questions and therefore, recieve better answers/tips.

a general FAQ regarding vocal tips has been provided below by SingingSabre. .Go To FAQ


How can I sound like *insert singer here* - if you want help with sounding specifically like someone don't just say "yeah, how do I sound like axl rose?!?"

try being more specific.

  • what about his vocals do you want to imitate? - if you really want to achieve his falsetto approach, say that. if you love his vibrato, say that as well. include as much about the stylings of said artist and the sound you're trying to achieve as possible.

  • an example of said artist - while some singers are very well known, plenty aren't. present some examples of the artists work (just provide the name of a song people can listen to in order to give a listen and help you out.) again this will help people get a feel for what exactly you're trying to achieve. and hell, even if it is a well known singer, provide what you think is the prime example of what you're looking for. many vocalists do have a range of different approaches and sound that you could be talking about.

  • how do you sound right now? - wouldn't hurt to give an example, or better yet, post a recording of you singing. this'll give everyone a much better ideaof what you have to work with or what you need to improve on.

  • don't get pissy - the fact of the matter is, it's a rare breed that can imitate someone perfectly. after all is said and done, you might never be able to achieve anything remotely close to who you want to sound like. accept that and don't get all ticked off if someone tells you that or their advice doesn't miraculously change your voice.


how do I improve my singing? - ok, first off... could you GET anymore broad?? if you're wondering how to go about "improving" don't just ask "how do I improve my singing?" lol... there's a whole host of specific areas you could tackle. when asking such a broad question, try and narrow it down a bit and include things like

  • what specifically you'd like to improve - some things to consider are

    - Range
    - Tone/Timbre
    - vibrato
    - falsetto
    - intervallic jumps
    - hearing the key
    - power/volume
    - breathing
    - etc..

    and try and include some details ABOUT the area you think you need work on, or would like to improve.

    wanna improve your range? ok, what is your current range? want to improve vibrato? what is it like now? ... you get the idea.

    again. a recording would help a great deal.

  • how long you've been singing and or studying vocals - it'd be nice to know your experience level and how long you've been singing. wouldn't do you any good to get advice that is basically beginner exercises if you've been taking vocal lessons for 5 years. and it certainly won't help the old self image to be given an extremely advanced vocal exercise technique and then fall flat on your face because you're only a beginner.

  • what have you tried so far - have you tried anything yet? or is this your first foray into techniques to improve your vocals? if you have... what did you try and how has it helped/not helped?

    all these things will really help any answers you may get.


How do I scream better? - ok.. lol. well, suffice it to say "screaming" isn't just "screaming". like anything, there's different styles, approaches and techniques. so it'd help to know what kind of style you're looking for.

things we need to know to help you better...
  • gutteral growls on occasion?

  • full out screaming like a little girl, ala. emo/screamo?

  • hardcore? death metal? grind core? etc..


suffice it to say, and a surprise to many, there are diffent styles/levels/types of "screaming" give as much detail as possible about what kind you're looking to achieve.

editing your own vocal tracks. - "how do I edit my vocal tracks??".... while they may seem like a simple question.... um, no. hell, if it were, the simple answer would be "just edit them"

some things to include

  • what are you using for your editing software? - it'd help a great deal to let everyone know whatyou're using. someone's bound to know the interface (and the limitations/advantages of said program) and can possibly direct you alot more specifically if they know what you're working with.

  • experience with the software you a newb when it comes to the software or not? how about editing in general? let us know.

  • specifics regarding your vocals - oook... now that we know you want to edit your vocals and what program you're using, now how about telling everyone what you want to do? do you think you're too nasally? the P's and S's sounding too percussive and hissy? do you want to double it? tweak it a specific way? etc..etc..
    whatever it is you want, let us know, and be as specific as possible.

  • provide a recording if possible - like every other question regarding the status of your vocals, try and provide with the genuine article if possible (which it should be, as you obviously have a recording of yourself if you want to edit.)


Finally.. One simple FAQ

what are some good things to do for my voice? before a performance? after a performance?

I have no idea, but I know this question gets asked alot.

will one of you (or several) of you Vocal thread regulars (singing sabre, phi, cor, whoever else is in here all the time and knows their shit) please write out a thorough list of things and items that singers can use to prepare/mend/upkeep their vocal chords/throat/etc.. also the methods if it involves taking something, gargling, exercising the muscles, deepthroating the drummer, whatever. please provide the instructions of said methods when you post them.

you can PM them or post them here. once those are in, I'll post them in this post.


this obviously isn't all the bases, but it should give you plenty of ideas on how to write out a well thought out clear and concise question in order to help us help you better.

also, again, for you regulars, if you see anything I missed in what I wrote that you think should be expanded upon or have something else you think I should add, please feel free to say so. but remember, this isn't a FAQ by any means. just a tutorial on how to use the thread for the best results.

thank you and enjoy

Cas-

thanks to Corwinoid for providing some of the more commonly asked questions for me to address.
SingingSabre
Epic
Join date: Feb 2003
124 IQ
#2
I?ve compiled a general FAQ for the Vocal/Singing Tips thread. Please read it before posting questions.

Please remember, this isn?t meant to take the place of a vocal coach or teacher, but to give answers to common questions and help out beginners.

How do I sing?
Well, that?s easy. You expel air through your mouth while making a noise pleasant to behold. It?s the specifics that?ll catch up on you!

I have written these articles as a beginner?s guide on how to sing. Read them from the beginning and don?t underestimate the importance of breathing.
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_1.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/junkyard/singing_part_2.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_3.html
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/general_music/singing_part_4.html

Fi (Fuzzybunny) also wrote some very wise and brief words which can help you learn to sing:


"Right, I just had to explain this to someone AGAIN, so I thought I'd paste it in here. Before you go playing with your soft palette/attempting that E above the stave/trying a Pavarotti-like vibrato - try this. :p

1. Sing from your diaphragm. Take a deep breath in and feel where it is just under your ribs - sing from there. Don't let yourself start forcing sound from your throat. Listen to 'Sarcophagus Saura' at http://fi.dmusic.com for a decent example... A very diaphragm heavy voice at about 1:20 (hey, I may as well get a bit of advertising in while I'm at it )

2. Anchor the sound. Imagine it going down and back, not up and out. Totally psychological, but works a charm.

3. Yawn. Feel how everything opens up in your throat? You've just opened your nasal cavity - well done you. It's a good thing - close your mouth and keep the back bit that you've just opened open. When you sing, let the sound pass through there.

4. Your nose is for breathing, smelling, humming and dribbling. Not singing. Don't let the sound come out of there! Sure, Ns and Ms have to, but otherwise keep the sound in the nasal cavity and coming out of your gob."

So what about breathe?
First off, it?s ?breath.? ?Breathe? is a verb, ?breath? is what you take when you breathe.

You need to learn how to take a proper breath using your diaphragm. If you don?t breathe properly, you won?t resonate properly. Read what Fuzzybunny and I wrote.

So what about resonating?
Resonating is using the bones of your head in conjunction with your voice to deepen the sound. I like to think of my head like an acoustic guitar and my voice as a guitar string. You can make the string vibrate, but without the body of the guitar to resonate the sound and push it out the sound hole, you can?t get noise.

Do this to learn what resonance feels like:
Loosely close your lips.
Let your teeth part slightly.
Place the tip of your tongue right behind your two front lower teeth.
Open your soft palate to a relaxed, comfortable position.
Hum.

Now hold that hum and focus in through your nose, it'll start to tickle your nose and lips.
That?ll produce a very nasal resonance. Now focus it through your forehead. A lot of it comes through your soft palate.

What about the soft palate?
You want to learn how to raise it. You don?t always need it to be fully raised, or open, but you?re going to want to know how to get it there. A partial opening of the soft palate will make your voice sound fuller and less whiny.

Snort. That vibration is your soft palate. Read the aforementioned articles and what Fuzzybunny wrote to learn how to use it.

How can I sound like this guy/girl?
You can get close, but unless you?re an impressionist, you cannot sound exactly like them. Everyone?s voice has traits and characteristics, some in common with others? voices, but in the end everyone has a different voice.

The best thing to do is to practice altering your tonal capabilities via your soft palate, breathing, resonance, etc. until you learn what it all sounds like. Then you can answer your own question and other similar ones to this in the future.

How can I scream or growl?
Don?t attempt to do this until you have well learned how to control your voice in a melodic manner. It can be dangerous to your voice.

If you need to ask this, you haven?t trained enough to know how to do it safely.

Screaming/growling is good for your voice!
No, it?s not. If done ?correctly? it won?t hurt you, but it is not good for your voice.

How can I improve my vocals so I can hit 4 octaves above middle C? or I want to hit higher notes in my chest voice. How?
There are basic exercises you can do, however to extremely improve your range that far (in regards to the first one) is practically impossible.

Vocal expansion exercises are usually a simple octave or half-octave scale sung up and down and increased a half-step each time done. The articles I linked in the beginning have some of these exercises listed and explained.

Another way to increase your vocal ability is to train and sing. The more you sing properly, the better you become! A vocal coach will be able to help you leaps and bounds over what I can do via the internet.

So should I sing in my falsetto? How? What is it?
Your falsetto is your ?false voice.? It?s that voice men use when they imitate girlie voices. You can utilize your falsetto to sing higher notes than you would normally be able to hit.

Men and women both have falsettos. Women just don?t need theirs as much.

How do I take care of my voice?
Don?t consume dairy (cheese, milk, yogurt, chocolate, etc.) the day you sing. Drink warm water, perhaps some green or white tea. Avoid black tea, coffee, soda, and alcohol as those will actually take water out of your body. Avoid cold water, sugary drinks, and alcohol as they will hinder your vocal cords.

Also, don?t smoke. It?s bad for you, kids.

Proper warm ups and exercises will keep your voice spry and limber (yes, limber) so you can be adaptable to whatever you need it for.

What about my vocal chords?
A ?chord? is three or more notes played at the same time.

You have vocal cords

How can I stay in tune?
Practice with other instruments, preferably live, so you learn what in tune actually feels like. This comes best with sheer practice.

That?s what I have so far. Am I missing anything?
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#4
^On the infamous and overmentioned page 44... Not that anyone ever bothered to go looking Thanks Cas, the old thread was getting obese and needed dealing with. SingingSabre was freaking out cos he thought you wouldn't bring it back
RobbieMac2002
All Hail To The Thief
Join date: May 2002
118 IQ
#5
ok... ill throw my hat into the ring here... and see what i can get out of it... but im currently on holiday, so i apologise if i dont reply straight away with follow up questions or results...

ive read through this thread's FAQ and thought long and hard (well, it wasnt that long, but *really hard ) about what is the one thing i wish i could realistically improve about my singing...

i have never had any lessons, but i do self designed (following advice of others) training exercises, and have regular band practices for three years which have allowed my voice to develop to the point where i have a lot of confidence in it as long as i stick to what i know i can comfortably acheive... i sometimes take a few risks and go for higher notes/different types of vocal styles... but rarely do these on proper songs or recordings with my band until im fully confident in doing them live every time...

Ive been told by my bass player (who sings back up but was lead in his previous band and is very accomplished as singing, especially in a higher range than me which is a great compliment to my lead vox) that i have a very strong singing voice, and a low range...

this is good, except sometimes, due to singing in this low range, i might need to sing a verse near the bottom of the range i can comfortably acheive due to the nature/key of the song...

my problem isnt so much with hitting the low notes... its just that when i do hit them, i lose a lot of power... they come out quieter then if i was singing for example an octave higher...

sometimes this doesnt matter... but it becomes more apprant if im doing this in the middle of a band's song... and suddenly my vocals become very low down in the mix...

due to the way i sing, i sing quite close to the mic anyway, moving closer simply makes the sound more muffled/distorted and not to my liking... also, simply trying to force the notes out and sing them louder affects my ability to hit the notes which i dont like...

what exercises or vocal tecniques (mouth shapes etc) should i use to make the notes ar the lower part of my range just as powerful (or close) as the rest of my range...

if you need an example ill find one and let you know... but any advice would be most helpful
Originally posted by guitarkid27
RobbieMac2002 gives good advice.
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#6
^It sounds like the notes are only just in your range and they don't really want to come out... Hence why they're so quiet. The only thing you can do for the moment is sing them with gusto and hope you stay in tune

Otherwise...

Aunty Fuzzybunny's tips for going low...
(and it's not half as kinky as it sounds)

1. Practice humming downward scales, starting at a lower but comfortable part of your range. Once you think you can hum them, sing them (and not through your nose, damnit! See the FAQ if you think you could be nosing it!!) and gradually, you'll find that it becomes easier to go deeper.

2. Yawn and make a silly downward "yaaaah" sound as you do. Keep that passage open and keep on "yaaah"ing downwards, getting lower each time. You're not singing, but you're seeing how low you can go. If you can 'yaaah' it, you can sing it with just as much confidence.

3. Once you have scales and yawns down, try arpeggios. They sort of force you to make the intervals bigger and keep the same volume and force (hopefully... If not, keep trying) so again, you should notice your range gradually growing.


It won't happen at once... It could take months - but don't force anything and keep practicing!!
slash_pwns
I'm baaaaaack
Join date: Oct 2004
1,983 IQ
#7
How do you get background vocals like "Home" by Dream Theater?

Do you set the mics lower and just sing normally? This is killing me because I'm trying to get this song for a school preformance thing and can't get the bg vocals :\
casualty01
Here all along
Join date: Apr 2002
2,622 IQ
#8
Originally posted by fuzzybunny
Thanks Cas, the old thread was getting obese and needed dealing with.


yw darlin


yeah, that's right steve, I said it!! .. what?! what!?

*excessive posturing*


Originally posted by fuzzybunny
SingingSabre was freaking out cos he thought you wouldn't bring it back



jesus, it was down for like an hour lol ... do you guys like sit here waiting for a vocal question?

makes me think of the lonely girl sitting by the edge of the bed staring at the phone... just hoping a boy calls lol..

Cas-
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#9
Originally posted by casualty01
jesus, it was down for like an hour lol ... do you guys like sit here waiting for a vocal question?

makes me think of the lonely girl sitting by the edge of the bed staring at the phone... just hoping a boy calls lol..

I was greeted with an irate PM from him saying "THEY CLOSED OUR THREAD!!!"... Hard to believe he has a life outside the vox thread

Originally posted by slash_pwns
How do you get background vocals like "Home" by Dream Theater?

Do you set the mics lower and just sing normally? This is killing me because I'm trying to get this song for a school preformance thing and can't get the bg vocals :\

Try turning it down and adding more reverb... I think. I'm not a technical expert
Corwinoid
UG Monkey
Join date: Nov 2004
435 IQ
#10
Originally posted by slash_pwns
How do you get background vocals like "Home" by Dream Theater?

Do you set the mics lower and just sing normally? This is killing me because I'm trying to get this song for a school preformance thing and can't get the bg vocals :\
You're talking about the booming background behind the lead vocals?

Up until 4:something It's a wide seperated stereo reverb 4 or 5 echoes deep, maybe a touch over a third stereo seperation, and rapid decay...

You'll need a good reverb unit for that :/
Quote by les_kris
Corwinoid is God
I'm not even God-like... I've officially usurped the Almighty's throne.
Click here to worship me.

Member #3 of the Corwinoid Fan Club
LazyGuitar
Caramelised
Join date: Mar 2002
1,921 IQ
#11
Originally posted by casualty01
yw darlin

yeah, that's right steve, I said it!! .. what?! what!?


That makes me so mad... i'm your darlin' damnit! You 2-e-timing bastard.
An eye for an eye leaves everyone a pirate.
Punkarse
UG's Sarcastic Vigilante
Join date: Jul 2004
25 IQ
#12
Does anyone have any tips about applying effects to vocals? I'm uncomfortable with my voice at the best of times, but really get nervous about leaving my voice dry when recorded. I've noticed I tend to react and overdo effects and eventually end up distorting it utterly 'till it sounds nothing like me.

What are the best, most tasteful, and best sounding things you can do to vocals without destroying them utterly?
The above user has physical deformities, which make any crude, sarcastic or offensive comments actually the fault of the threadstarter. Honest.
JmP's Evil Picnic (you know you want to...)
RobbieMac2002
All Hail To The Thief
Join date: May 2002
118 IQ
#13
Originally posted by Punkarse
What are the best, most tasteful, and best sounding things you can do to vocals without destroying them utterly?


reverb... i think is the healthiest thing you can add to your vocals... from my limited experience recording vocals at home... adding a simple reverb is best... dont overdo it... if its noticable (like 'woah thats reverbing') then youve probably added too much

also, a lot of artists double track their vocals...

this means they record them once... then on a seperate track they record themselves singing the whole song again... this takes a lot of skill and patience because you need to make sure you hit the same notes at the same time in each recording... but after they are done, you can add a touch of reverb to each... pan one a bit left, one a bit right and there you go... deep sounding stereo vocals


edit: thanks for the tips Fi... i recognise that it will take a long time... ive been working over the past year on slowly but surely expanding my higher range, and have gained about 6 or 7 semitones... but ive been neglecting my lower range barriers... ill try your exercises... if i do them in my underwear will that make them kinkier?
Originally posted by guitarkid27
RobbieMac2002 gives good advice.
Last edited by RobbieMac2002 at Sep 10, 2005,
Corwinoid
UG Monkey
Join date: Nov 2004
435 IQ
#15
^ Its the backup(s) singing a third or fourth higher carrying just the first word of each line in the chorus; the reverb/chorus effect is cut to a much more milder effect, and two lines are carries.
Quote by les_kris
Corwinoid is God
I'm not even God-like... I've officially usurped the Almighty's throne.
Click here to worship me.

Member #3 of the Corwinoid Fan Club
daft
Fool On The Hill's Mate
Join date: May 2002
167 IQ
#17
I was looking at information about different singing classes on wikipedia.
It has a list of tenor/baritone/bass singers in popular and it says that John Lennon and George Harrison were both tenors, but Paul McCartney is a baritone. From listening to alot of Beatles I always thought Paul sang the highest out of them all.

Can anyone shed any light on this?
Lets All Goto Mars: The I The FLAMING LIPS Club
SingingSabre
Epic
Join date: Feb 2003
124 IQ
#18
Originally posted by casualty01
jesus, it was down for like an hour lol ... do you guys like sit here waiting for a vocal question?

makes me think of the lonely girl sitting by the edge of the bed staring at the phone... just hoping a boy calls lol..

Cas-


Shhhhh!


Robbie: if you want to strengthen those low notes, try frying bacon. It's an exercise I talked about in article 3 or 4. You basically sing that low note at the very bottom of your range and hold it for a few minutes (between breaths). This can, and usually will, strengthen the bottom of your range.

Also, I like a tiny bit of reverb. The slightest amount so that you think "Hey...is that reverb? Nah, couldn't be!"
Balsamo
Writes way too long posts
Join date: Jun 2004
174 IQ
#19
Are there some good quick warm-up excersises that can be done in 5-10 minutes and that actually work? I'd need to sing at this at my school and I'll have just the break before the class to do my warm-ups. (assuming I don't start humming scales at my physics class)
"Alot of people that are in bands think you have to preach against every other kind of music in the world to be "hardcore," but that, to me, is just Hitler bull****." -Dime
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#20
^I used to sit in class before performances and hum I could get away with it though cos everyone knew I was a bit eccentric

I see another opportunity for Fuzzytips...

Aunty Fuzzybunny's tips for a quickie...
(and again, it's not half as kinky as it sounds)

Ok, so you have 5 minutes...

0:00 - 2:00
Try 'brr'ing in scales (you know, blowing out through your lips and making a brrr noise) and then swapping to 'rrr'ing (rolling your tongue) in scales and arpeggios. This'll help you to keep any nasal sounds away. Do it both staccato and legato (short and punched, and long and slow).

2:00 - 3:00
Start doing some slow scales. Use vowel sounds like 'oo', and make sure that the sound isn't coming out through your nose. Start in a comfortable part of your range and move up, then start doing them down.

3:00 - 4:00
Do the same as before, but with arpeggios. Now use more open vowel sounds like 'ah'. Make sure you're doing everything with confidence, else warming up is pointless.

4:00 - 5:00
Have a quick run through bits of the piece(s) you're singing. Do the bits that you're not so confident about, and then do bit that you are confident about. That way, you'll feel better about the whole thing.


And ta-daaah, you've just about sort of warmed up, given the circumstances
Balsamo
Writes way too long posts
Join date: Jun 2004
174 IQ
#21
Thanks! I'll try that. Not that my singing would be listenable anyway but atleast now (hopefully) people will seperate it's actually a human voice, not a strangeling cat.
"Alot of people that are in bands think you have to preach against every other kind of music in the world to be "hardcore," but that, to me, is just Hitler bull****." -Dime
petrina_678
UG's thread starter!
Join date: Apr 2005
3,335 IQ
#22
singing sabre...i always thought you were a guy no offence ...i'm a girl too!! Till i visited ur d music page and realised you were a girl!!
LOL!well yea i got a question i realised when i drink milk it creates phlegm(sp??) and i actually makes growling easier...has anyone else ralsied this??
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#23
^SingingSabre is a guy I'd run a mile if I heard a girl look or sing like that.

The fact that there's more phlegm would make it easier to growl, basically because there's more shit to vibrate. Makes it sound more throaty and generally 'grrr'ish.
SingingSabre
Epic
Join date: Feb 2003
124 IQ
#24
Erm...I am a guy. Not a bearded lady, mind you, but a genuine male, complete with protruding genitals (that's right, an outie, not an innie).

Phlegm makes it easy to BS a growling sound. One of the reasons I drink White Russians at karaoke.

How did you think I was a girl from my dmusic page? I'm confused...

*Disclaimer: the above post does not condone underage drinking. It simply encourages it...to be avoided...or something like that.
one trick pony
Registered User
Join date: Jun 2005
556 IQ
#25
Originally posted by RobbieMac2002
reverb... i think is the healthiest thing you can add to your vocals... from my limited experience recording vocals at home... adding a simple reverb is best... dont overdo it... if its noticable (like 'woah thats reverbing') then youve probably added too much

also, a lot of artists double track their vocals...

this means they record them once... then on a seperate track they record themselves singing the whole song again... this takes a lot of skill and patience because you need to make sure you hit the same notes at the same time in each recording... but after they are done, you can add a touch of reverb to each... pan one a bit left, one a bit right and there you go... deep sounding stereo vocals




I'm just starting to experiment with recording home vocals and these seem like good tips. I have a question on double tracking. Is it best to record two seperate vocal tracks or just duplicate the original and tweak the effects (reverb and such)?

I kind of liked the sound of doing one track with mild distortion or overdrive and then another track clean.

Thanks for any help. Both vocal threads have been interesting and helpful.
SingingSabre
Epic
Join date: Feb 2003
124 IQ
#26
Originally posted by one trick pony
I'm just starting to experiment with recording home vocals and these seem like good tips. I have a question on double tracking. Is it best to record two seperate vocal tracks or just duplicate the original and tweak the effects (reverb and such)?

I kind of liked the sound of doing one track with mild distortion or overdrive and then another track clean.

Thanks for any help. Both vocal threads have been interesting and helpful.


Try doing both and see which you like more.

As far as I know, neither way is more correct than the other.
Desk Jocky
Theorist in Training
Join date: Jun 2004
106 IQ
#27
Doubles sound best when they are very similar but not exactly the same. They have to have the same tone but they don't always have to be the same exact notes. Also if you just double your track you won't be able to do harmonies in the doubles.

But....
If you want to hide the fact you recorded doubles just use the original track...
kcfshorty
I like happy things...
Join date: Aug 2005
91 IQ
#28
ok well ive been singing forvever...in tons of chorus' and ive done this youth all-state chorus thing for the last three years...three years trying out and three years making it and singing...i have no problem with pitch or nething and i like to consider myself a accomplished vocalist even though im...pretty young...ive just started a band and we really dont know who is going to sing...me and my drummer (right now we are the only guys, i do have a freind who can play bass i just dont know how good he is) decided that i was going to sing...we dont know whats going to happen, whether we are going to look for someone else to sing or stick with me...but right now when i sing im failing to get a good rock sound...then again i havent been able to really listen to myself...but my freind says i sound "TOO CHORUS" how in gods name can i get a more "rock sound" from my classically trained voice and make it sound good...
am i just paranoid...or am i just stoned?
petrina_678
UG's thread starter!
Join date: Apr 2005
3,335 IQ
#29
Oh now i feel like a FOOL FOOL FOOL!
I was refering to fuzzy bunny!!!!!!!!Ahhh
I'm slapping myslef right now so sorry to singing sabre!
SingingSabre
Epic
Join date: Feb 2003
124 IQ
#30
kcfshorty: Play with your emboushure. Try closing your soft palate a tad, sing a little more through your nose or in your throat. You are at the opposite end of the spectrum of the people we help out here. Congrats!
ElectricMonk
ElectrostaticHairshirtTM
Join date: Jan 2005
125 IQ
#31
As to recording doubles tracks...

You can do it either way quite succesfully with (apparently, to the relatively untrained ear) very similar results.

If you duplicate you track, then slice it up into regions (sentances without breaths) that contain whole unbroken phrases, you can nudge one track forwards or back along the timeline a few ms here and there to create the illusion of a true double track. You can also use your software to EQ or verb it as you suggested - you can ever buy a program now that creates an automatic double track from a single vocal track. You can even set it to create harmonies, with each vocal track having their own vibrato depth and speed - aswell as subtle differences in their attack and pitch! Software is by the masters of vocal tweeking - Antares (course) look 'em up. Not everyone can afford it (me included) but I always thinks its interesting to know what the pro's use - it will effect your recording psychology if nothing else!

For most people though, its a matter of taste and ease of recording (dependant on your timeframe/budget/set-up). I always record at least three tracks of each vocal part, even if I plan not to use two of them. When in the digital domain, you have the option of doing that type of thing and whether you use it or not, its always better to have it there - just in case. I often make one super-steroid-enhanced-super-take from three good takes, if I have the time and the option, by cutting the good phrases and sewing them together into one coherant track. A little adjustment in levels, a bit of EQ and some compression will allow you to create ace vocal tracks using this method - but it is very time consuming and detail-intensive, not really appropriate for demos. The added plus is it gives you raw material to work with - for doubling or whatever you wish, and when you listen to a vocal track 100 times you will always appreciate it, as you will start getting really annoyed with very minor blips in the takes.

Doubling isn;t something I really like though, I have to admit. Its always far better in my opinion to get your vocal strength from a great central vocal track and good harmony.
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2) My Favorite Dress - ~King_Of_Foolz~
3) She Once Was My Playmate - Tj1
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5) Cold Dark Room - Ditda
frd_marshll
i am not your friend
Join date: Nov 2004
2,264 IQ
#32
i have a question on witch i am pretty clueless about

what equiment do i need i want to become a singer i know a mic and cable that is about it please help me
Corwinoid
UG Monkey
Join date: Nov 2004
435 IQ
#33
Err... a voice.

You don't really need a mic and cable?
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frd_marshll
i am not your friend
Join date: Nov 2004
2,264 IQ
#34
^ a voice i already have one of those and its pretty good
but what do i need to start a band
Corwinoid
UG Monkey
Join date: Nov 2004
435 IQ
#35
^ Other people to make noise?
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Caressing Death
Virtuoso in training
Join date: Oct 2004
1,176 IQ
#36
I cant find a good singer so Im gonna start it. I like Ozzy, Dickinson and Phil Anselmo; is it possible to sing like them and be able to play guitar doing them both fleuntly? Also how much does singing limit your playing?
Originally posted by WlCmToTheJungle "you have just received the amish computer virus. Since the amish dont have computers it's based on there honor system so please delete all of your files immediatly. thank you
fuzzybunny
foxwithfender.
Join date: May 2003
61 IQ
#37
^Graaaaaah!!!

If they can do it, it must be possible.

It depends on the person as to how much singing limits their playing - some people find it to be second nature to play and sing at the same time, and others think there must be something wrong with them because it seems so difficult.

Practice usually does it - the more you practice, the better you'll get (simple logic, really). Start with songs with easier timing and rhythm, then try the things that you really want to play.
ridcullylives
UG's McCartney Defender
Join date: Sep 2004
490 IQ
#38
Originally posted by Corwinoid


You don't really need a mic and cable?


Apparently in an early Zep gig Plant's mic broke and he had to just sing over the band. He managed to do it....
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Corwinoid
UG Monkey
Join date: Nov 2004
435 IQ
#40
Not the audience... they're shouting against you and can't hear themselves. The band obviously wasn't too loud to be heard over; or no-one really noticed. Hell, half the time you can't hear the vocals anyway, so everyone probably heard the guy next to them shouting in their ear and thought it was Plant.
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Corwinoid is God
I'm not even God-like... I've officially usurped the Almighty's throne.
Click here to worship me.

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