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johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#1
I'm starting this thread to clear up a misconception and to answer a PM. (sorry I didn't answer this before. I didn't know I had any PMs. I'd never checked it, so you should prolly kick my a$$)

Anyway, the misconception is about Nazi Skinheads.
Most people believe that it started with Skrewdriver, but that's not true.

First of all, let's take a look at the history of skinheads.

In the late 60s, the mods were becoming hippies, as mod bands like the Small Faces and The Who, grew their hair and stopped playing R&B, in favor of psychedelia and folk songs.
The remaining mods started cutting their hair shorter,and were called "hard mods" in order to be distinguished from their brothers who were growing their hair longer.
These hard mods still listened to soul music and Jamaican ska, but were becoming especially fanatic about a new type of music called " Tighten Up" music or "Reggae".

Meanwhile the Jamaican rude boys had also been listening to R&B and soul, but ska was starting to be replaced; first by "rocksteady" and then by the slower "reggae" music.

So, what you ended up with at the dance halls were kids who weren't mods, because that was dying, and weren't rude boys, because ska was dying, so a new creature emerged...The Skinhead.

The skinheads liked to stomp their boots in time to the reggae of Derrick Morgan, Desmond Dekker and others and soon enough,even had their own "anthems", "Skinhead Moonstomp" & "Skinhead Girl" by "Symarip"



At this time, politically, most skinheads were apathetic.
They were more interested in listening to reggae, drinking lager and dancing with girls than they were in protesting.
There were a few who thought that the racist Enoch Benn was right in warning people about the rise of immigrants, but most didn't care, because there were plenty of jobs.
A few skinheads even thought that the left wing was the way to go, as most poor people, who did vote, voted Labor. (Labor, prior to Tony Blair, was a very liberal, left-wing party)

After the heydays of reggae (1968-1971), reggae started to become more "African" and the songs became more about "getting back to your roots (Africa)" & "Haile Selassie", the Ethiopian dictator, as more and more reggae bands became Rastafarians.

Skinheads started growing their hair out as skinhead became suedehead became smoothie, until they merged with the emerging "glam" movement, as chronicled in glam band "Mott The Hoople"'s song "Honaloochie Boogie"

"My hair gets longer as the beat gets stronger,
Wanna tell Chuck Berry my news.
I get my kicks from guitar licks.
I sold my steel-toed shoes."


So, essentially by 1973, skinhead was dead, which is why Slaughter & The Dogs were singing "Where Have All The Bootboys Gone?" in 1975.

So, who started skinhead back up and where did the Nazi Skinhead come from?

Well, you can thank Sham 69 for both.



Not only did Jimmy Pursey and a few of the lads dress and look like Skinheads (note the pic above where Jimmy's wearing suspenders), but at a show in November 1977, Jimmy Pursey had yelled, "Skinheads are back!"
By singing songs like "Ulster" - an anti-IRA anthem, "Rip Off" - a song that Jimmy says is about "Kings Row" shops that are selling punk gear at expensive prices, but is also an anti-immigrant song with the line "faces from places I've never been", & "Red London" - a song about an alleged Communist take-over of London, the right-wing found a new image and a new band to promote their agenda.

After riots at shows and realizing that they backed the wrong horse, Sham tried to clean up their image. Jimmy Pursey sang with the Clash at Rock Against Racism gigs and Sham recorded the song "You're a Better Man Than I" (which has an anti-racist message).

They did a good job of white-washing their mistakes, as well. If you look for the lyrics to "Ulster", "Rip-Off" or "Red London" on their homepage or on the internet, you can't find them anywhere.

But they created the Frankenstein monster of the Nazi Skinhead that Skrewdriver tapped into when they reformed in 1982, with a new Skinhead image and racist lyrics.
Last edited by johnnynemo at Sep 26, 2005,
Skrunnch
UG Member
Join date: Sep 2005
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#2
Really nice job. I've always tried to get in to oi, but never really liked it.
newyorkdolls138
min
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#3
Well, you can thank Sham 69 for both.

Aww crap, I never realized Sham 69 did something wrong.
Jizz is where it is
capsfan17
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#4
really good, you should submit this as a guest column, it would help clear up nasty punk stereotypes
WHY DON'T YOU CONSULT EROWID FIRST?
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newyorkdolls138
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#5
Quote by capsfan17
really good, you should submit this as a guest column, it would help clear up nasty punk stereotypes


Indeed. Or I could take the credit.
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ragethesage
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#8
Quite interesting.

Awesome job Johnny.
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
WoodysAFaggot
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#10
Thats my favourite slaughter and the dogs song.
Can i ask where, Erberts, Or Herberts came from, I cant remember what they were called.
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TN_BOOTBOY
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#11
You can also thank the National Socialist party that was always tryin to get voted into power in England for fillin the working class boys heads with propaganda. telling them that the Pakistanis and other immigrants were taking thier jobs and that they should cleanse thier country. Jimmy might have messed up a little like most young people do when they htink they have a cause, but ya really can't lay the whole thing on his shoulders alone.
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johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#12
Quote by TN_BOOTBOY
You can also thank the National Socialist party that was always tryin to get voted into power in England for fillin the working class boys heads with propaganda. telling them that the Pakistanis and other immigrants were taking thier jobs and that they should cleanse thier country. Jimmy might have messed up a little like most young people do when they htink they have a cause, but ya really can't lay the whole thing on his shoulders alone.




True, Sham didn't start the phenomenon of short-haired, boot-wearing, racist thugs who were ready and willing to attack Communists, immigrants, Irish nationalists and anyone else they saw as "the enemy", that goes back to 1934 and Oswald Mosley and his Union of Fascists, or Blackshirts, pictured above.

But Sham sang about issues that were near and dear to their hearts, and, perhaps unwittingly, opened the door for the re-birth of Skinheads, this time draped in nazi flags, rather than Jamaican ones.

I love Sham and have two autographed LPs from them, but I'm not letting them off the hook for creating the Nazi Skinheads.

While I blame Skrewdriver for creating an international army of boneheads, it was Sham that opened the door.
johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#13
Quote by WoodysAFaggot
Thats my favourite slaughter and the dogs song.
Can i ask where, Erberts, Or Herberts came from, I cant remember what they were called.


"Herbert" means someone who is undistinguished; a dull person.

It comes from the mods in the 60s, who used it to describe "normal" people, as opposed to the mods who dressed sharply.

During the first wave of punk, it came to mean someone with long hair, as that was what the average person looked like, at that time.

During the second wave of punk, herbert also became synonymous with a street hooligan, i.e. one who was neither a green-haired punk or a skinhead with a "number one crop" (short hair), but who was into the music and football (soccer) and such.
WoodysAFaggot
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#14
Ahh k, Becuase i can remember reading a thing about the Cockney Rejects, & They were having a bit of a argument saying they were the original " Herbert " Band,..
Your Pol-i-Trix Are Pol-iti-Kill
pidevice
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#15
johnnynemo!!! this is the killer well written info, the good stuff in fact! you rule, sah.

I want to stick this thread- for a while at least, it's damn worthy imo
now go play.
misfitsdisciple
Punk Rocker
Join date: Sep 2005
862 IQ
#16
ok im new to most of this herberts and stuff, i've seen skinheads and stuff but i dont know what a "mod" is, could you clear that up for me??

i have heard of them in rancid's songs "jimmy thinks johnny's a mod, and johnny think jimmy's a punk, jimmy listens to ska, and johnny likes last resort"... but other than that, im have no idea
johnnynemo
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#20
Quote by pidevice
johnnynemo!!! this is the killer well written info, the good stuff in fact! you rule, sah.

I want to stick this thread- for a while at least, it's damn worthy imo


Thanks, pidevice.
joe_barge
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Join date: Sep 2004
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#23
You didn't include anything about the SHARP skinheads or really clarify the differences between all the types of skinheads.
Yo
misfitsdisciple
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#24
SHARP = Skin Heads Against Racial Profiling

pretty much, anti-racism skin heads, against the racism, still angry young men who like to fight and mosh n stuff
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misfitsdisciple
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#26
Quote by unseen_punk007
Profiling? Its predjudice. Not profiling.


yeah, thats what i meant... it has been a long day
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CowsWithGuns
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#27
Well, it's about nazi skinheads not the different types of skinheads. Good job johnnynemo. Very informative.
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sargasm
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#28
Skinhead Attitude is a good movie to watch about this subject.
johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#29
Quote by joe_barge
You didn't include anything about the SHARP skinheads or really clarify the differences between all the types of skinheads.


The article was in response to someone sending me a PM asking "where did the whole Nazi Skinhead thing start?"
So, I answered it.

Most people seemed to like it and said so.
I thank them for that.

One person felt the need to point out that I didn't answer questions that weren't asked.

If that person wants to chronicle the different types of skinheads, or write about SHARP, or inform the world that there have been gay skinheads ever since when Judge Dread was hanging out with Elton John, who wrote the song "Jamaica Jerk-off" (which can be found on the Goodbye To Yellow Brick Road LP), then they should write their own thread about it.
johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#31
Quote by RockThe40oz
Pshhh. dammit, johnnynemo, you forgot to mention GASH


HAHAHAHAHAHA!
How silly of me!

GASH - Gay Aryan SkinHeads

RASH - Red Anarchist SkinHeads

BASH - Baltimore Area SkinHeads

and, of course.....
SLASH -
unseen_punk007
Banned
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#32
Quote by johnnynemo
HAHAHAHAHAHA!
How silly of me!

GASH - Gay Aryan SkinHeads

RASH - Red Anarchist SkinHeads

BASH - Baltimore Area SkinHeads

and, of course.....
SLASH -

!
joe_barge
Registered User
Join date: Sep 2004
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#33
Don't shi t a brick because you didn't say anything about SHARPs. I just thought it necessary to point out to other people of the anti-racist skinheads because this is a thread for a large amount of people to view as opposed to your PM which you could have answered privately.
Yo
Roger_Waters
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#34
whos skrewdriver
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pfft... lazy and i just got some kid to kill himself. it's nothing
unseen_punk007
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#35
An oi band that used to make good music but now were reformed into a white power crap band.
johnnynemo
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Join date: Dec 2004
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#36
Quote by joe_barge
Don't shi t a brick because you didn't say anything about SHARPs. I just thought it necessary to point out to other people of the anti-racist skinheads because this is a thread for a large amount of people to view as opposed to your PM which you could have answered privately.


Here's the history of SHARP:

SHARP was founded by a guy named Ishamel in New York City in the late 1980s.
He was alarmed that most people who knew about skinheads, were only aware of the racist skins, due to magazines like Playboy who had written articles about skinheads which omitted any mention of reggae or non-racist skinheads.
He started his group and then went on an ill-fated Geraldo Rivera show to present his side of the story, but after a member of the Congress Of Racial Equality choked a racist by the name of Metzger, and a riot ensued, which injured Geraldo, his message went largely unheard.

Then Roddy Moreno of the Oppressed toured America and Canada, where upon hearing about SHARP, he immediately exported it to England and proudly flew the flag.

MTV ran a special in the early 1990s, which cast SHARP skins in a very favorable light, and the success of the "ska revival", ostensibly started by the Mighty Mighty Bosstones around the same time period, informed more people of the differences between SHARP skins and neo-nazis.

And they lived happily ever after.