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#1
Hey I've been looking into getting a nice half stack since I've started gigging with my band and have been looking into a Mesa Single recto head and a ENGL Powerball. I know that these or completely different beasts but since I've only played the Recto I don't really know if the ENGL can give me what I want, and I'm afraid that it's sonic uberness might kill me and my immediate family , anyway I'm looking for a nice tight sound I managed to get close to what I'm looking for out of the mesa but it takes alot of time EQing and some pedals that I probably wouldn't need with the ENGL since I've heard that they are pretty tight. I'm also wanting not a bright glass sun sound but not a dark abyss sound either so is it easier to brighten a mesa or darken a ENGL, bear in mind I like the ENGL bright better than the Mesa dark but I still like the Mesa's tone. So more or less I need a tight, semi-brighter sound but still have low chunking riffs ect. Which one would be better I've been drooling over ENGL since I've heard some sound clips and want to play one so bad but I can't because us country folks in Oklahoma don't like melt your face balls out hi gain amps like ENGL . I did love the mesa's tone but like I said I might like the ENGL better either way I'm going to spend a lot of money on this so I need to know which would be better for what I'm looking for. Another thing is the ENGL is 100 watts so it might be harder to play with at the house and the mesa is 50 so it's would sound better at lower volumes and still be loud without having the police pay me a visit
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Last edited by CodySG at Jun 4, 2006,
#2
I won't chime in too deeply for Engl, since I haven't had a chance to play around with one too much myself... they're somewhat rare here in the states, lol

But you should really consider the wattage difference. Both are tube amps. And the difference is 50 watts of TUBE. That's a lot of LOUDNESS! Really, if you'll be playing in your room a lot, the Engl will be overkill unless you bring in an attenateur like a THD Hot Plate. Hell, the Mesa would still be VERY loud for your room (though obviously it would be easier to manage).

Aside from that... the Single Recto is a great amp, capable of a lot tones and versitility if you take the time to work with it and learn from it. I've had my Mesa setup nearly a year now, and I'm STILL learning all its nuances. All the EQ knobs... huge differences in tones, in all sorts of combinations. And not only that, but utilize the other channels (raw/vintage/modern). Too many people tend to stick inside modern, but there are a lot of useful tones in the other modes that most people never even touch.


And now for the Engl fanatics to come marching in lol...
#3
lol yea I like the Mesa tone it's just I really want to get alot of opinions and think it through. Yea the wattage difference is steep but I'll be willing to play loud for the tone I want , plus I have friends that live in the country and thats probably where my band will be practicing on weekends so I won't have to worry about volume then . I might go up to my guitarcenter and spend some more time with the Mesa they have up there and really see if I can get what I want out of it, plus if push comes to shove I can probably return the ENGL if I decide it isn't dishing out what I need.
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#4
How much are they compared to each other in the US? Personaly I prefer the Engl because with Mesa/Marshall etc I always feel like I'm paying for the brand name rather than what's inside the amp.
#5
I agree about the loudness factor. I have a 100 watt ENGL Sovereign, which is a one speaker combo, and with the preamp up 3/4, I never turn the master past 2, even when gigging... with earplugs.

The only way for you to settle this is for an AB test at a store. Listening to a crapload of soundclips might help if thats impossible (rocksolidamps.com have heaps of engl soundclips).
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
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#6
How much are they compared to each other in the US?


Brand new... the Engl Powerball (head) would cost ~$1800 USD, where as the Mesa Single Rectifier (head) would cost ~$1400 USD.

The problem with Engl in the states is that they're hard to come by. As far as I am aware, there are no major dealers of Engl here, and maybe only a handful of small dealers. And as I understand it, the things are reverse on the otherside of the ocean lol (IE, Mesa costs more than Engl, Engl easier to get than Mesa... right? lol)
#7
Hmm, I thought EnGls are expensive everywhere... the one I saw at a mall in Singapore was 3700 Singaporean Dollars (around 1850USD)....... It was a Savage if Im not mistaken....

Anyway, here's an advice, you may like the Recto tone today, but you probably won't in the next 3 4 years. So, get an amp with "versatility" written on its tubes (which is kinda hard :lol: ) like a Stilleto or sumthin (they're supposed to be able to go recto with an OD)...

Heck, I'm still lookin for an IBanez VBG in my feckin country, and still empty handed as of this moment, pray for me, kay ??
Tone is all ...... well probably 75%, in your fingers.
The rest depends on your wallet's thickness !!

Keep the faith, baby!!
#8
Quote by bluespunkmetal
Hmm, I thought EnGls are expensive everywhere...


Not in Germany/the rest of Europe.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
Don't question the X.
<Frenchy> I'm such a failure
#9
lol not really here in sweden they are real hard to find n not so very cheap compared to the UK :S screamer combo: 1414 US dollar
#10
^ same as the UK, ours come to about $1400 as well for a new Screamer combo as well

What does a screamer cost in the US?
id sig you but i have no room lol. so ill just bow down to your username

deg0ey
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#11
Well I vouched for a Dual Rec... but my singer has the single. The 50Watt action is loud, man. Now, I don't think he has tweaked it right yet, but that thing still sounds really good. What kind of cab were you going to be playing out of?
Mesa Dual Rec/ Mesa 4X12 cab
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06 PRS Singlecut Ann.
1965 Fender Mustang
Ibanez acoustic
AceFrehley Epiphone LP
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tr-2 tu-2 / EHX DMM / MXR Script Phase 90 / SMM w/ HAZR
WH-1 Whammy / 535Q Crybaby
#12
Quote by CyBerAliEn


But you should really consider the wattage difference. Both are tube amps. And the difference is 50 watts of TUBE. That's a lot of LOUDNESS! Really, if you'll be playing in your room a lot, the Engl will be overkill unless you bring in an attenateur like a THD Hot Plate. Hell, the Mesa would still be VERY loud for your room (though obviously it would be easier to manage).


And now for the Engl fanatics to come marching in lol...


No. ENGL = Great low-Volume practice amps. They arent really 'loud.' I know that for me, to get a decent tone with my rectifier its TOO LOUD for band practice. With my Powerball I can get the tone I want at any level.

My Mesa is the loudest amp I've ever owned. Its gay. I hate it.

A Powerball wont get you a very close tone to your Rectifier. As far as the whole tone thing goes, I couldn't read most of it because my eyes started bleeding halfway through the giant block of text. The Powerball kicks much more ass than the rectifier, though. Just use the "Open" Mids and you'll be well on your way to rhythm asskickery.
#14
ENGL Screamer combos are 950ish here.

Ha ha.

Anyway, IMO Rectos are awesome rhythm amps, but ENGLs are awesome rhythm AND lead amps.

So... ENGL si bettar.
#15
Quote by Tarzan_man
Could buy an EQ for the ENGL if you get it, to make it sound darker.


Have you played an ENGL Powerball?

the "Open" Mid setting will get you a very rectifier-esque tone.

Gah, people on this forum...
#16
Mesa FTW.
Quote by I_am_spartacus
thats so stupid it made my left testical infertile...thanks...asshole
#17
ENGL FTW.

seriously, powerballs dish out every kind of ass kickery concievable, and even seriously amounts of ass kickery beyond the relms of human comprehencion.

plus theres also the fact that everybody and their mother plays a recto, and since ENGL are a smaller company, you'll have more "original" tone. (if you buy into that kind of thing. )
Quote by ClassicAxe

consider anything derek suggests, He IS a gain VVhore you know
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#18
Never used an ENGL before but I used to own the Single Rec and I believe that you should go with it and get a cab that allows for a tighter tone. Marshall 1960A perhaps, and then a simple EQ could allow you to add more treble at your beck and call. Plus 100 watts is hella loud.
#19
^ but you have to crank a mesa to get them going. ENGL sound good at lower levels as well as cranked.

so you'll get better tone at lower levels with the ENGL.

powerball ftw.
Quote by ClassicAxe

consider anything derek suggests, He IS a gain VVhore you know
Quote by jj1565
derek, will you go out wt me?

President Gain Whore -group on profile
#21
No. ENGL = Great low-Volume practice amps. They arent really 'loud.' I know that for me, to get a decent tone with my rectifier its TOO LOUD for band practice. With my Powerball I can get the tone I want at any level.


Hmmm... makes me want to look at an Engl even more.... damn GAS lol


But to the threadstarter...

What kinda cab do you plan to get? That's gonna affect your tone as well. I would consider looking at some Bogner cabs... I got to try a couple about a month ago and I loved them, I'll probably get one of them for my "right-side" cab.
#22
Sounds like ENGL is indeed FTW , just the fact that genocide said that you could get a good tone at any volume more or less sealed it, if I can practice at bedroom levels with a good tone and I know that cranked I can get a good tone thats the amp for me. Thanks for all the help guy really appreciate it

EDIT

I was looking into Bogner or going all out for a matching cab, ENGL in this case.
All Hail! The Kala-Kala Chieftain!
#23
Quote by CodySG
Sounds like ENGL is indeed FTW , just the fact that genocide said that you could get a good tone at any volume more or less sealed it, if I can practice at bedroom levels with a good tone and I know that cranked I can get a good tone thats the amp for me. Thanks for all the help guy really appreciate it

EDIT

I was looking into Bogner or going all out for a matching cab, ENGL in this case.


Don't believe the hype, this forum is just ENGL fanboys and accessories.
Quote by I_am_spartacus
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#24
Maybe, but if the thing wasn't good for anything then no one would like it and thus no fans
All Hail! The Kala-Kala Chieftain!
#25
Quote by Kurt~CobainRIP
Don't believe the hype, this forum is just ENGL fanboys and accessories.


Except for teh part where you forget I own a Powerball, Single Recto, and 5150, right?

I'm pretty against fanboyism, but the ENGL kicks the **** out of my single rectifier.
#26
One thing I am confused about is it has 4 channels but the controls work for 2 at the same time? Can you buy a foot switch to go from clean to crunch to low gain lead to high lead? Or wil it just go from either clean/crunch to lowlead/high?
All Hail! The Kala-Kala Chieftain!
#27
Quote by CodySG
One thing I am confused about is it has 4 channels but the controls work for 2 at the same time? Can you buy a foot switch to go from clean to crunch to low gain lead to high lead? Or wil it just go from either clean/crunch to lowlead/high?


Uh, you get the footswitch man. They have a couple, but the Z-5 controls everything, from each individual channel, the mid-voicing button, and master volume.

Its got 4 channels that you can switch between, and but two sets of shared controls.
#28
Quote by CodySG
One thing I am confused about is it has 4 channels but the controls work for 2 at the same time? Can you buy a foot switch to go from clean to crunch to low gain lead to high lead? Or wil it just go from either clean/crunch to lowlead/high?


yeah, you can buy a footswitch.

I don't agree with the fanboyism either, and many will argue that I started it, but I always said I liked both mesa and engl.

It's down to your preference- i tried a dual recto the other day, took a bit of time dialling in, and I thought it kicked ass. pretty low volume too. And you know I think engl kick ass too.

I'd say the engl is more versatile, the non-high gain tones are better, IMO. More natural sounding. The recto also sounds a little like it's a recto, just with the gain turned down a bit, for the non-modern tones. But it was better than I remembered (damn gibbo ceramic pickups which suck!) Also, you can't access a lot of the options of the recto (i'm talking dual here, I haven't tried a single) remotely unless you fork out for midi, which is quite a lot.

It's really up to you, which is a pain as it's difficult for you to try them out.

For the high gain, it really depends which tone you like better. If you like the mesa/recto tone, you want the recto. If you want the engl tone, you want the engl. But as geno says, with the powerball you have open/focussed mids to add a bit to the versatility.

Up to you, in other words.

And I'm sick of people saying engls are cheap here. They're roughly the same price as in the USA here. It's mesas being double the price here which makes engls seem such good value.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
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#29
Yea and another thing is why I want the ENGL is because Mesa's ARE easier to get over here like I said my GC has a single dual and triple so idk I might buy one later on down the line but from what I've heard and listened to with ENGL I can get the tone that I'm looking for easier and I've been lusting over a Powerball since I first heard of them, on this website lol, so powerball for now and maybe some time way down the road I might pick up a mesa but as for now ENGL is giving me what I want so ENGL is what I want
All Hail! The Kala-Kala Chieftain!
#30
Quote by bluespunkmetal
Hmm, I thought EnGls are expensive everywhere... the one I saw at a mall in Singapore was 3700 Singaporean Dollars (around 1850USD)....... It was a Savage if Im not mistaken....


$1850 for a Savage?. . . Quite cheap isn't it?

I'm kinda stuck in the same position. I want an ENGL with a darker tone, which maybe it'll do with that Open mid or whatever the hell geno is talking about.

I heard the Ritchie Blackmore ENGL's are pretty dark.
#31
^ can you afford an se?



also, the savage can sound darker in smooth mode. But that's darker more like sounding like a marshall, rather than dark like a recto.

Meh, I get a darker tone just by turning the treble down to about 3.

Still doesn't sound like a recto though.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#32
well the invader has hi and low mid controls. so you could make that one dark/bright as you wanted.
Quote by ClassicAxe

consider anything derek suggests, He IS a gain VVhore you know
Quote by jj1565
derek, will you go out wt me?

President Gain Whore -group on profile
#33
Also is their any difference between the Powerball version 1 and 2?
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#34
Quote by CodySG
Also is their any difference between the Powerball version 1 and 2?


They changed the treble control and made the noise gate a bit better, other than that no.

Uh..

To mascot:

The Powerball has a mid-voicing feature. You can change the styling of the mids. If you have it on "Focused" you get a more punchy, round sound, Open reminds me of a MK-IV or Rectifier, alot more of a flat, agressive, in your face kind of tone ideal for rhythm playing.

In all honesty if you wanted to make your Powerball sound like a Recto just get a small OD pedal to fatten it up and use the "Open" mids setting.

I like my ENGL more, It sounds like an ENGL but It can nail a couple other tones pretty well, ranging from a marshally to a kind of mesa tone. I get a great hotrodded marshall tone for stuff like Alice in Chains (one of my favorite bands) or older 80s rock/hair
#35
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
They changed the treble control and made the noise gate a bit better, other than that no


What do you mean changed the treble control? Like did they give it more treble or just made it a bit easier to control or something?
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#36
Bros and brunettes, which one has higher gain, Bogner Uberschall (I'm pretty horny for Lynch's tone) or the Powerball ??


Thx again...
Tone is all ...... well probably 75%, in your fingers.
The rest depends on your wallet's thickness !!

Keep the faith, baby!!
#37
Not sure really. All I do know is the Bogner is REALLY dark and the Powerball is bright, but the powerball probably has more gain but both should have enough gain so if you can try them out if not try to get as much info and sound clips you can of each amp.
All Hail! The Kala-Kala Chieftain!
#38
Quote by gpderek09
well the invader has hi and low mid controls. so you could make that one dark/bright as you wanted.



Probably so, but I don't think we should be hyping that one so much until one of us gets to play it.

That said, I've heard it being demo'd, and it could do, like, ANYTHING.
#39
Quote by CodySG
What do you mean changed the treble control? Like did they give it more treble or just made it a bit easier to control or something?


They basically refined it a bit. They changed the way it effects the tone slightly, made it alittle bit less overbearing in comparison to the other controls.

Either version of the powerball sounds great.

The powerball has more gain than the Uberschall. The Powerball has more gain than any amp I've tried... which is quite a few.
#40
Quote by CodySG
What do you mean changed the treble control? Like did they give it more treble or just made it a bit easier to control or something?


i think they changed it from a linear sweep to logarhythmic. This means that the treble covers a much larger range now than it used to- according to engl, you can make a V2 powerball sound like a V1 by setting the treble to 3-oclock or higher.

I haven't tried a V2 though.

Quote by Danno13
Probably so, but I don't think we should be hyping that one so much until one of us gets to play it.


agreed.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
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