TheCrimsonKing3
Banned
Join date: Jun 2006
70 IQ
#1
I use to hate all that stuff santana did with michelle branch and rob thomas, but the other day i found a santana 8-track titled "santana" from 1969 and i have to say i learned to appriciate how well he played on his own and how well he can improvise, he's a very sloppy player but i love to watch him on the wodstock video. what do you people think?
distilledspirit
Fat Old Sun
Join date: Aug 2005
463 IQ
#2
Sloppy? Santana is one of the greatest players ever imo. He's was great at Woodstock and I like his older stuff far better than his newer stuff although his guitar work is sill amazing on his new albums.
danilo19
Registered User
Join date: Feb 2004
624 IQ
#3
i think all his stuff aound more or less the same. Hes like malmsteen....good but after a while it all sounds the same.
TheHeartbreaker
The Pope of Zeppelinism
Join date: Apr 2005
1,584 IQ
#5
I don't think Santana is sloppy, but I think I understand what you're intending to say.

If you listen to his solos, or just any real leads in general, you'll occasionally notice that the consistency of his notes isn't very high - some notes will be loud enough to hear, then he'll "fade out" and then come back in.

I've never thought of him as being Page-sloppy though.

The original Santana line-up was absolutely amazing, and their show at Woodstock was mindblowing. I have a live album of them at the Fillmore in, I believe, 1968, and it is great. The band isn't entirely together yet, but compared to many other live albums I give it much higher regards.

Some of my personal favorite albums by Santana are Abraxis, Santana, Blues for Salvador, and Inner Secrets.

Though many people claim few good albums were released by the band besides Abraxis and Santana, I tend to disagree.

However, I feel in recent years that Santana has tried to remain popular, and in doing so has sold out. I thought that "Smooth", done with Rob Thomas, was decent, but apart from that his more recent stuff has been, in my opinion, total garbage.

While on subject, I'm in the process of learning the great "Incident at Neshabur" from Abraxis.
Sextimus
Rabid Lizzy Fan
Join date: Sep 2005
54 IQ
#6
On some of the early stuff I've heard, his playing is absolutely amazing. And I would never really call him sloppy, but I guess with the "fade out" description I can see. While his more recent albums are a bit too poppy and have way too many rappers and hip hop artists guesting on them, he still has some pretty cool guitar parts. Also, the Rob Thomas, Chad Krueger, Steven Tyler and Bo Bice collaberations were all pretty decent for radio pop songs.
TheCrimsonKing3
Banned
Join date: Jun 2006
70 IQ
#7
I've never thought of him as being Page-sloppy though.

Jimmy Page is my favorite guitarist, i'm offended
Last edited by TheCrimsonKing3 at Jun 15, 2006,
The Iron Man
Guitaring
Join date: Dec 2005
3,362 IQ
#8
I've never thought of him as being Page-sloppy though.


Jimmy Page is my favorite guitarist, i'm offended

Doesent mean hes bad.. Hes just sloppy. Like you wont get perfectly clear notes all the time.
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ufossuck
Delighfully twisted
Join date: Mar 2005
1,186 IQ
#9
I hat Santana, but he's on all the good stuff. We watch parts of The Crossroads Guitar Festivel in guitar class, he's on it. I just bought a John Lee Hooker DVD today, he's on it.
"There's Jimmy Page, one of the biggest thieves of American black music to ever walk the Earth."
add45
Adam "UG's Brigyptian"
Join date: Feb 2006
133 IQ
#11
Santana is a great guitarist, I like his older songs, but the new ones aren't my thing.
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psychodelia
Defensive Specialist
Join date: Feb 2004
2,298 IQ
#12
Santana can be a bit sloppy on his fast runs, at least on the recordings I have. Still a great player though. I have a cd of him and Buddy Miles live, I definitely recommend it... it has a version of Evil Ways that's a lot better than the original.
Resiliance
Acta est fabula
Join date: Jul 2003
449 IQ
#13
Not going to make myself popular in here by saying this... But I think he's fairly bad.

I don't like his tone or playing. Add bad technique to that, unimaginative vibrato (imo ofcourse), and you've got yourself a boring as hell player (imo again...).
He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt.
He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice.


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Dirk Gently
Exorcising my angels
Join date: Dec 2005
1,234 IQ
#14
^^^ Are you supposed to trickle over from the Metal forums? Santana's one of those guys who believes you're born a good guitarist and he tries to play with soul. Something gets lost in the translation and he can be a bit boring to listen to, but all-in-all I think he's decent.
Hi, I'm Peter
TheCrimsonKing3
Banned
Join date: Jun 2006
70 IQ
#15
his old tone is like high pitch and squaky but now it's real low and smooth which one do you hate because i think there both great.
Resiliance
Acta est fabula
Join date: Jul 2003
449 IQ
#16
Quote by Dirk Gently
^^^ Are you supposed to trickle over from the Metal forums? Santana's one of those guys who believes you're born a good guitarist and he tries to play with soul. Something gets lost in the translation and he can be a bit boring to listen to, but all-in-all I think he's decent.


I'm not supposed to trickle over from the Metal forums, I don't think I've posted more than 10 times in there ever.

Anyway...

Quote by Dirk Gently
who believes you're born a good guitarist


What BS.
He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt.
He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice.


Remember: A prudent question is one half of wisdom.

Click.
Dirk Gently
Exorcising my angels
Join date: Dec 2005
1,234 IQ
#17
Quote by Resiliance
What BS.

I completely agree with you, or else there's no hope for me...
Hi, I'm Peter
Prophet of Page
Registered User
Join date: May 2005
258 IQ
#18
Santana is sloppy, so is Page, so was Zappa, so was Hendrix. I can't believe so many people have trouble accepting these things.

I agree with Resiliance, Santana is dull.
My name is Tom, feel free to use it.
TheHeartbreaker
The Pope of Zeppelinism
Join date: Apr 2005
1,584 IQ
#19
Maybe he just isn't what you guys are into.

I find his music to be excellent and fascinating.

For any fans, does anybody else own his album with John McLaughlin called Love Devotion Surrender?

It's really good, and I'd recommend it to jazz fans.
Prophet of Page
Registered User
Join date: May 2005
258 IQ
#20
Quote by TheHeartbreaker
It's really good, and I'd recommend it to jazz fans.



I wouldn't, plenty of better guitar based Jazz ablums.
My name is Tom, feel free to use it.
Prophet of Page
Registered User
Join date: May 2005
258 IQ
#22
Quote by TheHeartbreaker
^^You are quite an ass, aren't you.

Of course there's better albums, in my opinion, but I still really enjoy this one.



Not really, no. I just know alot more about Jazz than most, and I know that most Jazz fans wouldn't recommend that album.
My name is Tom, feel free to use it.
Resiliance
Acta est fabula
Join date: Jul 2003
449 IQ
#23
^I'll second that.
He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt.
He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice.


Remember: A prudent question is one half of wisdom.

Click.
TheHeartbreaker
The Pope of Zeppelinism
Join date: Apr 2005
1,584 IQ
#24
Quote by Prophet of Page
Not really, no. I just know alot more about Jazz than most, and I know that most Jazz fans wouldn't recommend that album.


Keyword = Most

If I recall correctly, I mentioned the album once in the Blues/Jazz Forum and it was well-recieved.

Obviously people have different tastes. I'm not going to try and disprove you wrong just because you and other people don't like it.
Jarrett Moore
Lucid Wise Man
Join date: Jun 2005
56 IQ
#25
its latino type rock though you could call it jazz if you felt like calling it that. Santana's earleir stuff is amazing like persuasion or hope your feeling better for example are some early really good ones. as for his later stuff it seems that he did indeed try and stay popular by switching to the more popular types of music, this is where people get that santana sucks which if you regard only the new stuff it does, but their electrifying old stuff far out-weighs they're ****ty new stuff.
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freewheelinbird
UG Addict
Join date: Apr 2005
2,222 IQ
#26
i only have like 4 albums by him, early stuff, but i think my favorite of them is caravanserai
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TheHeartbreaker
The Pope of Zeppelinism
Join date: Apr 2005
1,584 IQ
#27
^^Good album.

I'm sure that if the original line-up had stayed together their music would've remained awesome over the years and Santana wouldn't have sold out.
sirpsycho85
selfstyled voice o reason
Join date: Feb 2004
858 IQ
#28
Quote by Resiliance
Not going to make myself popular in here by saying this... But I think he's fairly bad.

I don't like his tone or playing. Add bad technique to that, unimaginative vibrato (imo ofcourse), and you've got yourself a boring as hell player (imo again...).


ya don't need to say IMO so much. or maybe you do, but ideally people will realize that most ideas posted here are opinions and you don't have to put up flame-shields just because you state your opinion.

however, i do disagree wholeheartedly. i've never heard a bad word about his tone before. as to the other criticisms, i just disagree, and i personally find his playing incredibly spiritual. when i hear him play i get the same type of feeling i get from hearing coltrane play, only not quite as great.
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Any day now, any day now I shall be released"

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TheHeartbreaker
The Pope of Zeppelinism
Join date: Apr 2005
1,584 IQ
#29
^^:cheersL

I agree with pretty much everything you said.

If you ever watch him live, he gets really into the music.

Here's some videos of Santana...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCr_keMairE&search=carlos%20santana

Soul Sacrifice

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95Sc8A_tJgY&search=treat%20santana

Treat