#1
Okay, I'm learning theory know, but i need to know where to start, any good suggestions?

And, does anyone know any techniques I should learn? I'm pretty good at alternate picking, vibratos, hammers/pulls/bends, and I'm kinda okay with a whammy bar. Any kind of picking methods or tricks I should learn?
Last edited by Happy Taco :D at Jun 16, 2006,
#2
oh my god ive hurd it all, your just bigging yourself up, i bet they turn out to be better than you :P
#3
The way I look at it is, know theory so you know what you 'should' and 'shouldnt' do, but also dick around and experiment so you know when to say 'fuck theory'.
You know the bitter comes out better on a stolen guitar
You're the BLESSED, we're the Spiders from Mars!

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Last edited by FadingRoots at Jun 16, 2006,
#4
Your wording of the question is completely FUCKED.

Asking, "is it ok to be original and experimental and write really cool riffs, or should I learn music theory instead" is just nonsense and appaling.

Learning music theory won't hinder your ability or creativity; it will instead make it easier for you to know what will work and what most likely won't work.
#5
It sounds like the typical excuse for not wanting to put in the time to learn the "boring stuff" like music theory.
#6
i you're username.
Quote by Dogruitag
i think he wants to dream theater to be considered more metal, so he dyed his beard.


...

Quote by LookAlive
Lmfao, this is the best thread ever, aside from the fact that it involves a girl being harpooned through a tent.
#7
Dude, you've been playing for 3 years and you've made it without learning any theory?

I'm 7 months in, and even I know how important theory is. Seriously, I don't think you can even start soloing without scales to begin with, let alone everything else, like chord progression. Anytime now would be a good time to start paying attention to the MUSIC aspect of playing an instrument.
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#8
[quote="'[ Lunar Tear "]']Dude, you've been playing for 3 years and you've made it without learning any theory?

I'm 7 months in, and even I know how important theory is. Seriously, I don't think you can even start soloing without scales to begin with, let alone everything else, like chord progression. Anytime now would be a good time to start paying attention to the MUSIC aspect of playing an instrument.


You dont NEED theory, it just helps a lot. And surely the MUSIC aspect of an instrument is the expression, not the study behind what you're doing?
Quote by Dogruitag
i think he wants to dream theater to be considered more metal, so he dyed his beard.


...

Quote by LookAlive
Lmfao, this is the best thread ever, aside from the fact that it involves a girl being harpooned through a tent.
#9
No offence, you probly sound better to yourself than to anyone else. But theory is like guide lines, not a strict rule book. If you want to be succesfull learn theory
Member # 2 of the Kiss Sucks and Has Too Much **** They Hock as Merchindise Club Pm DoTheEvolution to join.
#10
almost anything u write most lickely, wether u realize it or not, already has the basic principal of theory in it. most sounds u can make with a musical insturment have been logically organized. so it would be extrememly rare to make a rifff that dosent have any throery behind it . wether ur playing ina a key(scale) or just playing chromatically. just because u dont know any theory and think ur being unique and expiramental dosent mean ur playing something entirly new. u should learn some theory cause then when ur playing and u make up a lil riff u can be like "oh hey thats in the key of c" and then u can make up more riffs in the key of c. and once u get the basics down u can start to learn hoe to go from say playing in the key of c to switching to the key of g and then back to c, and not have it sound like crap. and as for the kids who are learning theory and learning correct postuer and suck, well maybe ur naturally gifted at playing music. and maybe they rnt. just because ur better and u havent learned theory dosent mean ur discovering a whole new set of musical discoveries. haha it basically sound like ur saying i dont need to learn theory ill make up my own. lol thats like trying to reinvent the wheel man. music has been around for thousands of years, and depending on ur theological beliefs millions( cave man bang on the ground with sticks and yelling is considered music if rap can be considered music) so chances are of u creating a whole new musical system that hasnt been discovered all ready is slim to none. i suggest u quit blowing ur own horn about how u dont know any theory and ur better then ur lil buddys who do know it. because think of how much better u would be if u did know theory?
#11
Quote by mullet0023
almost anything u write most lickely, wether u realize it or not, already has the basic principal of theory in it. most sounds u can make with a musical insturment have been logically organized. so it would be extrememly rare to make a rifff that dosent have any throery behind it . wether ur playing ina a key(scale) or just playing chromatically. just because u dont know any theory and think ur being unique and expiramental dosent mean ur playing something entirly new. u should learn some theory cause then when ur playing and u make up a lil riff u can be like "oh hey thats in the key of c" and then u can make up more riffs in the key of c. and once u get the basics down u can start to learn hoe to go from say playing in the key of c to switching to the key of g and then back to c, and not have it sound like crap. and as for the kids who are learning theory and learning correct postuer and suck, well maybe ur naturally gifted at playing music. and maybe they rnt. just because ur better and u havent learned theory dosent mean ur discovering a whole new set of musical discoveries. haha it basically sound like ur saying i dont need to learn theory ill make up my own. lol thats like trying to reinvent the wheel man. music has been around for thousands of years, and depending on ur theological beliefs millions( cave man bang on the ground with sticks and yelling is considered music if rap can be considered music) so chances are of u creating a whole new musical system that hasnt been discovered all ready is slim to none. i suggest u quit blowing ur own horn about how u dont know any theory and ur better then ur lil buddys who do know it. because think of how much better u would be if u did know theory?


word.................................................
#12
Do whatever you want, if you don't want to learn theory that's your choice.

But I have to say that I think that you probably know some theory "without knowing it" if you understand what I mean.. You've "played" around and experimented for say 400 hours to get to the point where you can just improvise a riff, something you probably could do if you had spent 40 hours on learning some music theory

The people that have written everything down for the last... well a long time probably experimented aswell

Save time - Learn your music theory.

I have just recently started with it btw so I am far from an expert myself but I regret that I ignored it for so long, should have taken it up when I started playing
#13
Okay, I guess what I meant to say came out totally wrong or something :/

First of all, thanks ToolBass_dude, seems to be the only thing positive in here. And well FadingRoots too, thanks for not getting offensive in your response.

@globetro: I'm not tryign to avoid it or get evade it in any way, if I wanted to learn it I would, it just seems to easy to me to have a book given to you like here, use this, I'd rather challenge myself by going blind, or maybe I'm just stupid.

@[ Lunar Tear ]: Like ToolBass_dude said, why does the MUSIC have to come from theory, can't trial and error also bring results? I may not "learn" chord progressions but after playing with **** after a while you tend to know what sounds good where and with what, and of course always trying new things out.

@SlashandClapton: Maybe so, or maybe not. But "If you want to be succesfull learn theory" sounds like the same worn out tired ass excuse to assimilate I've heard since I began. It has no real influence to it, just do it or else you fail. By saying that someone can interpret it in wrong ways, like I did. Believe it or not everything I've ever seen or heard about theory (including the teacher I had and the other players) was all about learn it or else, never a why, never an explantion, lame I know... I sortta feel like crap now, now I have to start cause I can't stand being behind anyone. FadingRoots, seems to have cleared that up for me.

@mullet0023: I know that no matter what I play, it can sound like it is from scales and stuff, some of it is pretty simple and basically right beside each other, and comes naturally. But by saying that I played experimental I meant something different, like I didn't think of theory, like trying to make sure some is technically perfect, but something that is appealing yet at the same time something complex in a different form. If there is a different term for this then I don't know what it is called, sorry for any confusion. Wasn't trying to make myself seem bigger or better or anything like that. I'm still young and still trying (and now learning) I'm not like a little Vai, or Petrucci here, haha I wish... but it is resolved now, kinda, I was never aware of any real reason, nobody has ever told me, and nobody around here knows either evidently, I've been asking for quiet a while now. =/

Uhh.. god now I feel like such an idiot. Alright, now that some things have been cleared up (some not all) I feel like I need to learn it now, I don't to be below anyone, i'm gonna learn it now. Jesus... after all that time... that teacher really did suck...

Well, anyone have any suggestions where to begin? and still, I have one question, whay do some players feel that using effect pedals to enhance your sound is cheating? (Maybe I stated that better)

Anyways, sorry if I came off as a dick or anything, didn't mean to piss anyone off or anything, I just didn't know.

[edit]Yeah, I know what you are saying Rocu, one of the clearer posts in here. Yeah I'm gonna be learning like tommorrow, I feel like crap right now...
Last edited by Happy Taco :D at Jun 16, 2006,
#14
Quote by Happy Taco
@[ Lunar Tear ]: Like ToolBass_dude said, why does the MUSIC have to come from theory, can't trial and error also bring results? I may not "learn" chord progressions but after playing with **** after a while you tend to know what sounds good where and with what, and of course always trying new things out.


Alright, first thing I want to say is, I didn't want that to come out harsh. I know how it is to not know a lot about theory too, cuz that stuff REALLY confuses me considering I was in band for 1 year in elementary school. Learning about music itself does help a lot, and I don't think learning it will hurt in ANY way. Thats why I would suggest looking into it ASAP, especially if you're in a guitar slump.
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#15
i think u missed my point. every sound u can make on a instruement has theory behind it . u can be as experimental as u like and make up new songs and have them sound cool. but the songs that u have made up there IS theory behind them. u just dont know what that theory is because u dont know theory. cathch my drift. that is why it is important to learn theory. because once u know theory u can take the songs that u have created find the theory behind them and expand on them. im not trying to be condscending or sound preachy. but i dont think u understand what exactly theory is. IT IS MUSIC. and it isnt like there is a different set of theory for different instruments. cause once u know ur theory u can play any instrument. all u need to know is where the notes are. i suggest u save up some money and buy "Billy edwards fret board logic" that is probably the best way to learn theory fast and efficiently. u can get it from musicians friend.
#16
@[ Lunar Tear ]: I know, I hope nothing I said came out aggresive or anything, just trying to learn. Oh well, got some stuff to catch up on now. I'm just glad I found out now, being summer time and I have no job, I'm free for a while.

@mullet0023: I know what you mean I just couldn't get it to come out right. But yeah, I gottcha.
#17
I can think of 2 reasons to learn scales.... there you are, jammin' at your fave bar on open jam nite eyeing the babes thinking you're the ****z in yer shorts. Meanwhile....
1) the rest of the guys your jamming with are all confused 'cause their playing some heavy blues and your zipping along thinking how hot you sound but your playing in the major scale tones when it should be minor.
2) again they get confused because you don't seem to know what root note to end your solos on or for turnarounds, etc.
#18
I know, I gotta fix the first post, I figured out I'm a tard cause nobody around me knows anything...
#19
I reccomend looking around this site to get some theory tips. I took a class on it, im not sure if your high school offers it, or if your even in high school, but if you can get a class on theory that would proabably be best.
Member # 2 of the Kiss Sucks and Has Too Much **** They Hock as Merchindise Club Pm DoTheEvolution to join.
#20
No, my High School sucks. And I don't know of any good teachers, I'll poke around the site I guess, until I can run inside a Guitar Center or Sam Ash sometime.
#21
Quote by Happy Taco
No, my High School sucks. And I don't know of any good teachers, I'll poke around the site I guess, until I can run inside a Guitar Center or Sam Ash sometime.

dude im tellin u billy edwards fret board logic. that some good ****. its like crack
#23
This thread has actually made me start to wonder... since when does EVERYTHING you play have to be thought out and made using scales/theory? Ok, so it will help you immensesly, but is by no means absolutely neccessary to be musical. you don't have to know your notes to know your fretboard and your instrument- there are people out there who know no theory at all, but can jam along for hours, and it'll sound great.

The only reason i can think of is that because now everyone has access to internet and forums, they are immediately bombarded with the idea that scales=music. in reality, if you have the commitment and passion to KNOW your instrument, or even just have a good ear, you can play music.

thats my thoughts anyway.
Quote by Dogruitag
i think he wants to dream theater to be considered more metal, so he dyed his beard.


...

Quote by LookAlive
Lmfao, this is the best thread ever, aside from the fact that it involves a girl being harpooned through a tent.
#24
Quote by ToolBass_dude
This thread has actually made me start to wonder... since when does EVERYTHING you play have to be thought out and made using scales/theory? Ok, so it will help you immensesly, but is by no means absolutely neccessary to be musical. you don't have to know your notes to know your fretboard and your instrument- there are people out there who know no theory at all, but can jam along for hours, and it'll sound great.

The only reason i can think of is that because now everyone has access to internet and forums, they are immediately bombarded with the idea that scales=music. in reality, if you have the commitment and passion to KNOW your instrument, or even just have a good ear, you can play music.

thats my thoughts anyway.


And you're absolutely right too.
But combine that passion and commitment to your instrument with a good knowledge of music theory and you're just a little bit better
#25
Well I?ve been playing for about 18months now and for 12 of them I did fine with no theory, But then I thought to my self this solo, this chord pro I?ve just learnt what was going through the mind of the person who developed it? Theory may be a little boring and some people believe its constricting, because it?s a set off rules you MUST follow, but it isn?t. And anyhow everyone knows rules can be bent or broken, yes? Theory is a great place to start and it will help you along the way music isn?t all about Hammer-on?s, Pull-offs, Bends and Your Picking. Music has so many aspects just because you can do certain techniques doesn?t make you a great musician, I respect your confidence, and that?s what you need to become great, many highly talented players lack confidence to share their talent with others, so this will help you a lot. But in the end theory is a great thing if you are good at theory is will help you learn a lot faster, and if you practise your technique, there will be no stopping you. My advice to you is to go to your local music store and buy a book on theory depending on how much you already no. there are also some great CD-ROMS out there to which are great tools for learning. But if you get to know your theory, learn more techniques, more songs etc you can?t go wrong, just practise put your heart into it, and just enjoy yourself. Do this and you will be able to achieve anything. Hope this helped, Good Luck.

Carl 

O yeah and as for a picking technique you should try sum hybrid picking, it gives you great versatility.
#26
Quote by ToolBass_dude
This thread has actually made me start to wonder... since when does EVERYTHING you play have to be thought out and made using scales/theory? Ok, so it will help you immensesly, but is by no means absolutely neccessary to be musical. you don't have to know your notes to know your fretboard and your instrument- there are people out there who know no theory at all, but can jam along for hours, and it'll sound great.

The only reason i can think of is that because now everyone has access to internet and forums, they are immediately bombarded with the idea that scales=music. in reality, if you have the commitment and passion to KNOW your instrument, or even just have a good ear, you can play music.

thats my thoughts anyway.


Yeah, thats why when I started I just went and tried to get the feel of the instrument rather than learn by a book. But if i say I can play that evidently that means I'm bragging myself up, but i can play for hours, and I work with some of my buds write music with them even though I'm not even with their band.

But yeah, I'll look into hybrid picking, I've never heard of it so it should be interesting, so my goal for this next two weeks is to get better at pinch harmonics and learn hybrid picking
#27
^ Hybrid picking is like finger picking, except for the you use a pick and your fingers.

I do it all the time, it brings a more cleaner, brighter tone from the thicker (E A D) strings than when you use yourfingers.
Been away, am back
#29
Aye, SD sold out.


Quote by Dogruitag
i think he wants to dream theater to be considered more metal, so he dyed his beard.


...

Quote by LookAlive
Lmfao, this is the best thread ever, aside from the fact that it involves a girl being harpooned through a tent.
#30
I've been thinking a lot lately, about whether I should "learn" theory or stay the way I'm going

And I'm gonna stay the way I am...

I feel like challenging myself, going blind. Its the way I am with everything, the only way I learn. And I feel like I'm progressing and growing pretty well. And since theory is a natural thing, I should be able to "learn" it naturally by playing and expirence. And just because I won't learn it won't make me a horrible player just people won't take me seriously, but whatever I deal with that crap anyways.

Anyways, laugh at me, flame me, whatever I just feel a lot better now.
#32
Quote by Happy Taco
I've been thinking a lot lately, about whether I should "learn" theory or stay the way I'm going

And I'm gonna stay the way I am...

I feel like challenging myself, going blind. Its the way I am with everything, the only way I learn. And I feel like I'm progressing and growing pretty well. And since theory is a natural thing, I should be able to "learn" it naturally by playing and expirence. And just because I won't learn it won't make me a horrible player just people won't take me seriously, but whatever I deal with that crap anyways.

Anyways, laugh at me, flame me, whatever I just feel a lot better now.


Dude, whatever makes you happy is what's best for you
Afterall it's your guitarplaying we're talking about not mine or anyone elses. We just gave you the positive sides of learning theory and you don't want it, that's fine. You can still be a good guitarist.

I'd still say learn theory but since you've already made up your mind: good luck, I'm sure you'll have fun anyway

We're all artists in some way, so just go the way you want to go.
Last edited by Rocu at Jun 19, 2006,