#1
I was just thinking, how important is a good tone to your development as a guitarist? I've been messing with my Cube + pedals for about an hour now and just can't get the tone I want anymore. Especially if I'm turning the amp a fair bit (past 10 o'clock).

I'm currently looking for a valve amp that will suit my styles better, as I hardly play any metal and the Cube is basically a metal amp. You can argue the point but basically if you don't play metal it's not really the right amp.

So anyway, after twiddling with the dials on my Cube and pedals I eventually gave up and came online. Is the fact that I can't get the tone that I want all in my head and is stopping me playing well? Or does not having the tone you want actually hinder you as a guitarist?

Discuss... or whatever.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#2
It does hinder i would say, a great easy tone will make you feel better and make simple things you do sound better.

If i had John Sykes tone, i would faint if i started playing, same with Maidens.

Just get a nice valve amp or combo.

These nice people here will give you some options, i cant be bothered!
#3
I don't think tone affects your ability to play as such, but if you find an awesome tone then you'll want to play far more than if you're playing with a crap one. You've got an interesting theory there.
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#4
I've got my shortlist of amps just gotta find some time to get out and try them.

My main annoyance at the moment is my lack of a smooth tone. I don't play anything high gain but at the moment if I play multiple notes together with a slight 'overdrive' it will sound horrible and harsh, not what I want at all. I'm looking for a nice natural, mellow tone similar to the Strokes and The Zutons on their most recent albums. It's hard to describe but it almost doesn't sound like a guitar, because it just fits together so well, almost sounds unnatural but not the point where it sounds fake and digital.

Haha went on a bit there...
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#5
if i can't get my amp to sound good it just annoys me. theres a real sweet spots in the pre amp volume on my DSL, and i knocked it out of place (all the knobs got moved) and i had to re-EQ the whole damn thing. i just gave up and played my acoustic. today, though i got it to sound perfect. and i rocked out for some time.

Tone matters. alot. it depends on how much you care. i care alot. some people i know couldn't care less if there amp sounded ass or not.
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#7
Not important. While you have to atleast EQ it well and not put the gain up full. You'll notice that when you put on a backing track the sound depends on your playing rather than your tone.
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#8
Quote by Erc
Having a poor tone won't keep you from playing well, but it might keep you from playing.



aye.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

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#9
is that you new response for everything dave?
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#10
^ yes.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#11
^aye
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#12
^ i think dave has atleast (since ive been here) 100+ posts of just "aye" lol
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#13
Good tone makes you play better. Fact.

Well, not really. But, with my old 5150 II, I couldn't shred for ****, because it really seemed to resist it, and it wasn't easy to play in that way at all. However, with the Mark IV, its a breeze, and it really makes me sound like I'm a lot better. And because of that, it would make you a better player, since you would play like that more often, and the more you practice, the better you become.
#14
Poor tone does affect your playing because you won't want to play as often and therefore not be as good as you could if you played more.
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#15
^ I didn't mean it affects you like that tho. I mean if you can't acheive the kind of tone your playing needs (needs is maybe too stronger a word), then your playing may not sound as good as it could, and hense you probably won't progress as well as you could with a decent tone.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#16
Tone is critical to the point where the amp can at least create sounds suitable for the genre of music (undistorted cleans for jazz, distortion for rock&metal, etc), past that it depends on how much it matters to you personally. Years ago when I was starting out I had absolutely no ear for tone - I'd even let the other guitarist in the band dial up my amp for me. But if there wasn't enough distortion for shredding that's when I had a problem. That's an extreme case though, caused by never hearing music on anything other than a clock radio before.
#17
Or does not having the tone you want actually hinder you as a guitarist?


Of course. Not liking your sound discourages you from playing and enjoying playing.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
#18
get an mxr ten band equalizer. if you think your sound is good now, get one of these and get a sound you want, awh man, this thing makes a huge difference.
#19
^ I don't have an FX loop. But not having the right tone at the moment is not a problem as I intend to get a new amp very soon. If I'm still having problems with tone down the line I'll take you up on your advice.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#20
^you dont need an fx loop

my peavey classic 30 has one but i prefer to run my wah straight through the front

i would say get a nice fender tube amp (bassman, vibroverb, deluxe/super reverb)

and then a power attenuator so you can overdrive it at moderate levels
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#21
Quote by ssguitar
^ i think dave has atleast (since ive been here) 100+ posts of just "aye" lol


I also have about 6000 of ""
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#22
Apparantly EQs don't do much running straight into the amp.

What makes you suggest a nice fender tube amp? And I was looking to only spend up to £600. My choices at the moment are a Fender Blues Junior, a Laney VC15/VC30 or a Vox AC15/AC30.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#23
Holy crap, Dave. I had no idea you'd made so many posts! :O
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#24
Quote by electrik
Good tone makes you play better. Fact.

Well, not really. But, with my old 5150 II, I couldn't shred for ****, because it really seemed to resist it, and it wasn't easy to play in that way at all. However, with the Mark IV, its a breeze, and it really makes me sound like I'm a lot better. And because of that, it would make you a better player, since you would play like that more often, and the more you practice, the better you become.

Or maybe it just covers up your mistakes. If you want to become a better player you play clean.
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#25
Yeah, also in a band situation when your tone sucks and doesn't cut through then you can hear yourself. When its hella muddy and you can even distinguish notes and it covers everything up, that's when tone matters.
#26
Quote by xifr
Or maybe it just covers up your mistakes. If you want to become a better player you play clean.


Exactly. i ALWAYS play on my acoustic or my electric unplugged when i'm praticing scales and such, and it rreally helps.
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#27
Quote by Connorcore
Yeah, also in a band situation when your tone sucks and doesn't cut through then you can hear yourself. When its hella muddy and you can even distinguish notes and it covers everything up, that's when tone matters.


Well if you don't cut through or are muddy then you just need to mess with the EQ.

In a band situation, these are the factors in your tone (from most to least important)

1. Playing
2. EQ
3. Rig

While your rig has to be atleast suited to your style and loud enough, apart from that it really doesn't matter that much. You notice how amps sound when you play them by themselves, but as soon as you get in a band all that goes away. All the hours you spent in your bedroom tweaking the EQ also go away when you realize your scooped mids sound like mud.

Also keep in mind the controls on your guitar. I can go from a harsh blues tone to a jazzbox tone from just switching between bridge and neck and rolling the tone knob down.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
Don't question the X.
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#28
In a band situation, these are the factors in your tone (from most to least important)

1. Playing
2. EQ
3. Rig


QFT. that's a kickass post man.
"The fool doth think he is wise, but the wiseman knows himself to be a fool." - W.S.
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#29
Quote by SamDking
Apparantly EQs don't do much running straight into the amp.

What makes you suggest a nice fender tube amp? And I was looking to only spend up to £600. My choices at the moment are a Fender Blues Junior, a Laney VC15/VC30 or a Vox AC15/AC30.


some traynors might be in your pricerange too, check those out if you can.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#30
Haven't seen any Traynors in any shops I've been in in my local area. And I imagine they're not very good value for money in the UK. I've seen amps that go for $700 ish in the US, being sold for £700 on ebay in the UK.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#31
^ aye, well they'd be just about squeezing into your price range. you're right, they aren't as good value over here as in the states.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#32
Dude, Vox all the way! The new AC-30's really impressed me I must say. Great vintage rock sound and modern tones. It also allows you to blend the tones of 2 seperate channels together to get a Brian May-like sound!
#33
^ Yeh Vox is pretty high up on my list, especially with all the praise it gets. I tried one a while back and didn't think it was anything special, but I was serious n00blet back then, so I'm looking forward to trying one again in the next few weeks when I've got a bit of spare time.

Problem is the AC30 is renowned for its classic tones. However nice they may be, it might not be the tone I'm looking for. I've got a quite specific tone in my head that I'm looking for and I'm not sure if the Vox will be able to get it, but I may be pleasantly surprised.
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
#34
Could you describe the tone? Because the Vox should be able to get very smooth hi-gain sounds if you put a nice overdrive in front of it. (And using the modern sound settings of the Vox).
#35
I need to create some sort of musical montage of examples of songs that I like the tone of . But for the time being, I can describe it as the tones on the albums 'First Impressions of Earth' and 'Room on Fire' by the Strokes. Their first album's tone is a bit raw and low gain, not really what I'm looking for. But the latter two have such a great tone IMO.

Secondly, The Zutons. Whether you like their music or not is debatable. But the tone of the lead guitar IMO is just orgasmic. On their new album it's mostly evident.

If that doesn't help I might be able to put together a few clips to help you. In fact, it seems like a good idea, I've got a bit of spare time I'll throw one together, gimme 10 mins.

Edit - Ok so it turns out I can't attach anything above 50KB after waiting for 10 minutes for it to upload (damn dialup internet)

Anyone, can anyone make any assumptions based on the info I gave at the start of the post?
- Gibson Les Paul Studio
- Squier Standard Strat
- Roland Cube 60
- Visual Sound Jekyll & Hyde
- Boss OD-3
- Behringer EQ700
Last edited by SamDking at Aug 14, 2006,
#36
In a band situation, these are the factors in your tone (from most to least important)

1. Playing
2. EQ
3. Rig


Playing is 0% of your tone. The way you articulate the notes will change the way a riff sounds, but it won't affect the tone one bit. Your gear determines your tone.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
#37
Quote by Archeo Avis
Playing is 0% of your tone. The way you articulate the notes will change the way a riff sounds, but it won't affect the tone one bit. Your gear determines your tone.

I don't agree with that statement at all. The way a riff sounds is part of your tone, the way you fret, the way you pick, they way you mute, etc... , all have an effect on your tone. I could hand you the exact same rig as Eric Johnson, and I guarantee you wouldn't sound like him. If it wasn't already on his EQ settings, you wouldn't sound anything like him. Of course your gear makes up a large part of your tone, but it can only project what you are giving it. You can have the best gear in the world and still sound like ****.
"The fool doth think he is wise, but the wiseman knows himself to be a fool." - W.S.
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#38
I think the best thig to do is get one of them semi- tube modelling amps. Great variety of tone and that sweet tube sound. I also play an epi les paul as well as my strat (new thread, custom building) i think it will sound good through a vox ad50vt or marshall avt or summat
#39
Quote by xifr
Well if you don't cut through or are muddy then you just need to mess with the EQ.

In a band situation, these are the factors in your tone (from most to least important)

1. Playing
2. EQ
3. Rig

While your rig has to be atleast suited to your style and loud enough, apart from that it really doesn't matter that much. You notice how amps sound when you play them by themselves, but as soon as you get in a band all that goes away. All the hours you spent in your bedroom tweaking the EQ also go away when you realize your scooped mids sound like mud.

Also keep in mind the controls on your guitar. I can go from a harsh blues tone to a jazzbox tone from just switching between bridge and neck and rolling the tone knob down.


lol i just learned that after i went and saw Lamb Of God live....best tone ever and lots of mids....i always had mids at like 0..now there a good 4-6 at band practice
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#40
Quote by Archeo Avis
Playing is 0% of your tone. The way you articulate the notes will change the way a riff sounds, but it won't affect the tone one bit. Your gear determines your tone.

You obviously do not have much live experience. Tone is not only what you hear when you play one note without any vibrato or anything. It is about your complete sound. Listen to a crappy player play something, then a good player play something.

EDIT: A better example. People like Slash and Santana have awesome tone, but say you were to get to play through their rig, even playing their songs, you will not sound as good.

Playing also has to do with how good you are at soloing and phrasing. How well you can follow the chords, and all that jazz.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
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Last edited by xifr at Aug 15, 2006,