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xAestheticx
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#1
So the madness will stop. I found my old thread and redid some stuff on it.


Starting at square one:

Hardcore
Also known as hardcore punk. This genre was initially started in the 80's. It's a form of punk with a little bit more "oomph" to it. It's a faster and "heavier" form of punk. Some with breakdowns or "hard breaks". The lyrics are usually very sincere and in your face about things affecting the writer or things around the writer.

Some Example Bands: Black Flag, Verbal Abuse, Gorilla Biscuits, Bad Brains, Circle Jerks, Minor Threat, Comeback Kid, Modern Life is War, The Warriors, With Honor, Guns Up!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_punk

-Post-Hardcore
This genre is considered a rendition on traditional hardcore. This genre is heavily based on hardcore DIY ethics, with a bit of influenced melody and tempo. This music has more depth and texture than traditional hardcore and is generally more technical in terms of guitar parts, drumming, and song structure.

Some bands in this genre include: Fugazi, Bear Vs Shark, Thrice, Alexisonfire and As Cities Burn
.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_hardcore

Metalcore/Deathcore
Metalcore is hardcore punk with a larger thrash and european metal influence. The music is fast, but not in the same vein as its hardcore predecessor. It utilizes alot of double bass drumming with some blast beats, various chord progressions and tremolo picking, and vocals usually are usually "harsh", ranging from high screams to low growls. The songs are usually in verse-chorus-verse format with a breakdown placed somewhere in the song. The genre has become very popular and the range of sounds is very wide. Their are basically 3 branches of the genre. Standard metalcore, metalcore with a little more technicality and metallic edge, then its newest spawn called "deathcore" which is metalcore with a very large influence from death metal and thrash.
Deathcore - This genre is fairly new. Basically, melodic death metal mixed with metalcore = deathcore. It's a bit of a silly title, but it's a pretty interesting genre. The bands have very crunchy breakdowns and pack alot of blast beats and grindy type parts in their songs.

Some Example Bands: Killswitch Engage, As I Lay Dying, Bullet for my Valentine, Parkway Drive, Botch, August Burns Red, Converge, Between the Buried and Me, Coalesce, Whitechapel, With Blood Comes Cleansing, Job For A Cowboy, Animosity, Through the Eyes of the Dead, Beneath the Massacre, Misericordiam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metalcore
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deathcore

Tough Guy Hardcore
Hardcore with a dab of metal influence. More aggressive vocals and heavier sounding guitars than that of traditional hardcore. These bands have the same DIY ethics and song structure as traditional hardcore, but have a generally "heavier" feel to them. Bands in this genre tend to get confused with metalcore because of the guitar sound and drumming, but the genres are seperated by the meanings of songs.

Some of the bands in this genre include: Hatebreed, Agnostic Front, Terror, Blood for Blood, Madball, and Remembering Never.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moshcore

Grindcore
Starting out as music with no defined structure, short blasts of music, and lots of time changes using standard instruments in the hardcore/metal genres. Vocals range from high shreiks to low growls and inverted guttural squeals. This type of music never followed any kind of verse/chorus pattern. Some subgenres of this type of music include tech metal; which is metal music with progressive/jazz as well as grindcore influences, and mathcore/spazzcore which is generally the same thing as techmetal with more random structure or complexity. This subgenre also has a heavy free-jazz influence.

Some bands in this genre(s) include:The Dillinger Escape Plan, Napalm Death, Agoraphobic Nosebleed, Daughters, The Sawtooth Grin, and Pig Destroyer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grindcore


Emo
Emo, also known as "emocore", is hardcore music with a more sensitive, emotional side to it. Some bands in the hardcore scene started writing about more personal issues, involving heartbreak and love and it spun off into it's own branch of music. These bands usually have a little lighter sound than most hardcore bands and, as noted before, write about things a little closer to heart. Alot of bands today get confused as emo bands, but they're normally just pop-punk or something of the like.

Some bands in this genre include: Rites of Spring, A Day In Black and White, Embrace, Moss Icon, and Sunny Day Real Estate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emo_%28music%29
-Screamo
Screamo is often referred to as borderline grindcore. Complex rhythms and less traditional song structures. Given the name, the genre is loosely emo music with aggressive vocals. The guitars are usually melodic and harmonized. The songs are usually fast paced and have less generic sounding breakdowns, more of an introspect. This genre is fairly underground and the scene isn't very spread out. Bands in this genre tend to be a bit epic and have very notable perfomances.

Some of the bands in this genre include: Circle Takes The Square, Saetia, Angel Hair, Joshua Fit For Battle, City of Caterpillar, The Fall of Troy, and The Kodan Armada


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screamo


Mathcore by Craigo
Mathcore is a genre which is normally easier to hear examples of to be showed, rather than to be told. The genre is normally built on complex time structures, time signitures and sometimes gets mixed up with grindcore. It may also contain some characterics of grind, such as unpredictablity in songs and change in tempos. You may also find some hardcore characteristics, including breakdowns. Like grind, it's main influences are older forms of hardcore/punk, but sounds very distant from what it is. Mathcore is also famous for bringing in ideas in from other out stretched genres, such as jazz. Some people may even dub some forms of mathcore as jazz-fusion, although this is inaccurate due to jazz-fusion can be interepted in many different ways. You will commonly find mathcore assosicated with hardcore because of it's roots, but also because many of these bands are mistakedly named metalcore. More accurately, assosiated with the sub genre of hardcore because of where influences clash. (such bands are Converge and Botch).

I've put songs in brackets for people to check out if they are interested, looking for recommendtions, or just want to define the genre.

Bands: Converge (Conduit), Dillinger Escape Plan (Baby's First Coffin), Daughters (X-Boner Ray) , Coalesce (Mouthbreaker), The Number Twelve Looks Like You (If These Bullets Could Talk), Botch (Japam), HeavyHeavyLowLow (Tell Shannon Her Crafts Are Ready), Sikth's older stuff (Such The Fool), Ion Disonance (The Death Of One Is A Tragedy, The Death Of 10,000 Is A Statistic)

Also Known As: Spazzcore, Techcore, Noisecore.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mathcore_bands

Feel free to add parts to this, I'll edit them into the main post and give you credit for them. We just need to educate these kids who come in here calling BFMV and Trivium hardcore. It's beyond annoying now, it's just getting sad.

EMO/POWER VIOLENCE, POP-PUNK CROSSOVER COMING SOON
Last edited by xAestheticx at Nov 7, 2006,
Disco Vietnam
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#2
Excellent post, but if you don't mind I'd like to point out a few minor errors.

Converge isn't Grindcore. It's more Chaos/Thrash along the lines of Charles Bronson or Spazz. Also, I wouldn't put Dillinger Escape Plan in Grindcore either. They'd be better in a Metalcore/Mathcore/Tech with bands like Into the Moat.

The Fall of Troy isn't Screamo and would be better suited in Post-Hardcore. You could do to put At the Drive-In and Planes Mistaken For Stars in there too.

I personally don't like a lot of your Deathcore references but I'd reccommend putting Elysia, Excoriate and Whitechapel (thanks to you). I'm still learning about Deathcore so forgive me if the bands I mentioned don't fit.
Craigo
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#3
Screamo, grind and emo needs sorting out mate. DEP and Converge should not belong in grind, along with daughters and botch. I'm afraid mate, it probably won't get stickied until you sort it out. Good effort though.

Grind is a offspring of metal which appears in the hxc scene... Remember that. There must be metal hints in it. If it doesn't go in there, ask yourself "should it go in mathcore?", a genre you should definately mention.

Ohh, also, if you want, mention in other names for the same genre, like spazzcore and emo violence (gay names, I know.) You also forgot sythcore.

Disco Veitname knows his ****.

Good effort though. If you want, delete it and I reckon we should spilt genres for different lads to do; asking guys in the espeicallist subjects. I volunteer in mathcore and grindcore. Hardcore and the offsprings should go to Dai, Spence should do post hardcore, Ducan could do emo and emo violence/screamo... LedZep could do grind and deathcore.

Just a suggestion. Sorry to nag mate, but you did put in some execellent effort.

EDIT: Just read your edit. If no-one has decided to do mathcore by Saturday, I will. For now, edit the band listing to what me and Disco said.
Last edited by Craigo at Nov 1, 2006,
opivy21
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#4
The Hardcore bands you listed are fine examples except for Gorilla Biscuits. I don't know where else to fit them, but they're not really similar to those other bands musically and they came around a lot later. Maybe like a second wave of hardcore.
Craigo
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#5
They came later bro, but count, and are a good example of earlier hardcore. Good point though bro.

I think we should split the genres evenly between the regulars who are okay with it and know their stuff. We'd also manage more information, links and bands that way.
StuartR
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#6
Some of your Grindcore reccomendations are totally wrong, The Dillinger Escape Plan, Botch, Converge, Daughters are all metalcore. (And this is before any one says Daughters aren't metalcore, well they sound like the previous bands abit more manic but that does't make it Grind or anything else.) Some better Grind reccomendations would be Terrorizer, Carcass, Repulsion & Extreme Noise Terror.

"Screamo is often referred to as borderline grindcore." That might be but it's wrong, Screamo and Grind sound nothing alike apart from the fact they can both be fast. Grind doesn't have the melodic breaks like Screamo and the vocals are never anything like each other. The riffing is compleatly different and Screamo is structured more thoroughly. This section should be put under Emo though as it is a direct off shoot.

I also think that Deathcore should be included in the Metalcore section as it's not all that different, either way you should change Basically, melodic death metal mixed with metalcore to just Death Metal as the recent metalcore bands like KsE and ALID are more like MDM and JFAC are more in the vein of normal or brutal Death Metal

Quote by Craigo
Grind is a offspring of metal which appears in the hxc scene...


I know what you're saying here but Grind grew out of Crust punk and Hardcore more than it did Metal, if you've ever heard the Napalm Death demo "Hatred Surge" you'd hear, it's alot slower and more like Hardcore. Also the bands which influenced them like Crass, Conflict, Discharge, Doom, Heresy & Larm are all really punky, the metal aspect in Grind came a while later.
Last edited by StuartR at Nov 1, 2006,
xAestheticx
Banned
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#8
Yeah I know all of my listings weren't 100% on point, but I was in my Web Page Design class and my teacher kept zooming through the class and I had to act like I was working on my stuff. Anyways, thats not a good excuse.
The grindcore stuff is kind of math metal/tech/grindcore all rolled into that one little paragraph. I put the the little (s) in parentheses to show the genre(s), but I could see how you could look over that.
I know screamo isn't borderline grindcore when it comes down to comparing bands like Pg 99 to Napalm Death, but they have some of the same aspects of song structure, riffs, etc.
I'll do some more work on this and with you guys helping we'll make it something that the little idiot kids will learn from.
martyr
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#9
I think we should assign obvious UG members in the know to a sub-genre, one they preferably know a lot about, enjoy, and will best work for the forum.
Listen to my music here
Prepare To Burn
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#10
That's great, but I think for this to be stickied you'll need a wider range of genres. Hopefully it does get stickied, this forum needs one of these.
StuartR
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#11
It's a very good start anyway, the only thing that could be covered is Power Violence & Emo Violence and possibly pop-punk corssovers like SYG & NFG.

If you do want to make the metalcore bit bigger you could go through each stage from bands like Integrity to more technical bands like Coalesce/Botch and Shai Hulud/Poison The Well to AILD/KsE type bands and then the newest style Deathcore. Just a thought.
xAestheticx
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#12
Yep. I'm about to do some editing. A little better layout for it.
J Lock
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#14
No such thing as tough guy hardcore.
Dillinger and Daughters belong in tech-metal.
Hatebreed and Terror in metalcore.

I can help you out with Post-hardcore if you would like.
Taking Back Sunday = Sensitive Hardcore
Craigo
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#15
No. No. No. Tough Guy has been around for decades now. Dillinger and Daughters are mathcore. HB and Terror's old stuff is tough guy, more morden is metalcore.
martyr
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#16
So can I just go ahead and "dibbs" emo/screamo/emoviolence..
Listen to my music here
J Lock
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#17
Unless you only put in In/Humanity as emoviolence than yes.
An if you throw bands like Fall of Troy or UnderOATH in screamo and Hawthorne as emo than no.

I refuse to accept Tough Guy as a form of Hardcore.
It's just hardcore.
Or metalcore.
Taking Back Sunday = Sensitive Hardcore
Last edited by J Lock at Nov 2, 2006,
StuartR
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#18
Quote by J Lock
Unless you only put in In/Humanity as emoviolence than yes.
An if you throw bands like Fall of Troy or UnderOATH in screamo and Hawthorne as emo than no.


Obviously.

Martyr knows what he's talking about.
J Lock
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#19
Jus checkin
Taking Back Sunday = Sensitive Hardcore
Cedence
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#20
For the hardcore section, you listed a lot of older hardcore bands. Nothing against that, but perhaps you should add some modern hardcore bands or make a new section for them. I'm talking about bands like Bane, Modern Life is War, Have Heart, American Nightmare, Guns Up!, the list goes on.

other than that, pretty good thread.
xAestheticx
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#21
^Yeah I was meaning to do that when I was making the thread yesterday but it today slipped my mind.
An yeah Martyr go ahead with it.
martyr
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#22
Quote by xAestheticx
^Yeah I was meaning to do that when I was making the thread yesterday but it today slipped my mind.
An yeah Martyr go ahead with it.


Thanks. Are other people going to be assigned to seperate ones, because mine's going to be pretty comprehensive, and if no one else wants it, I'll take Post-Hardcore as well.


Quote by J Lock
Unless you only put in In/Humanity as emoviolence than yes.
An if you throw bands like Fall of Troy or UnderOATH in screamo and Hawthorne as emo than no.

I refuse to accept Tough Guy as a form of Hardcore.
It's just hardcore.
Or metalcore.

You obviously don't know who I am.
Listen to my music here
J Lock
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#23
Nope.

So, wait, do I have post-hardcore?
Taking Back Sunday = Sensitive Hardcore
opivy21
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#24
Quote by Cedence
For the hardcore section, you listed a lot of older hardcore bands. Nothing against that, but perhaps you should add some modern hardcore bands or make a new section for them. I'm talking about bands like Bane, Modern Life is War, Have Heart, American Nightmare, Guns Up!, the list goes on.

other than that, pretty good thread.

I suggest that you make a separate section for "Modern Hardcore". Those bands deserve a place, but I personally can't see how they fit with the original hardcore bands - at least not musically.
Craigo
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#25
I'll take up a write of mathcore and a rewrite of grind. Sorry mate, but your grind is a bbit out sketched. I volunteer. It might be a bit longer, and I'll add the approapriate bands and links.
UraniYum
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#26
Quote by martyr



You obviously don't know who I am.


who are you then?
Horseness is the whatness of allhorse.
We are all Neil Lennon
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Craigo
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#27
Dude, martyr is the skizz digs when it comes to alternitive forms of music in the 'core' genres. His knowledge of abolsutely anything that belongs on these boards is beyond God's.
xAestheticx
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#28
Yeah Martyr knows his stuff, just let him do it and shut up.
Craigo you can have the tech/math and grind stuff. I'm not really keen on the genres cause I don't listen to them much.
Once you guys get these parts written just PM them to me or post them on here and I'll edit them into the post.
Gomorrah
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#29
Grindcore: StuartR
Screamo/Emo Violence: Martyr
Post-Hardcore: J Lock
Hardcore Punk: ?
New School Hardcore: ? (I'd be willing to do this)
Mathcore: Craigo
Metalcore: ?

For Metalcore we should have at least 3 people do it. One for the 80's NYC tough bands, one for the 90's Converge, Rorschach, Botch etc and one for todays scene.
Quote by JobForACowboy
um, yes it is.

sry if you havent heard of it, death metal bands that wear girl jeans = emodeath
martyr
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#30
Quote by Gomorrah
Grindcore: StuartR
Screamo/Emo Violence: Martyr
Post-Hardcore: J Lock
Hardcore Punk: ?
New School Hardcore: ? (I'd be willing to do this)
Mathcore: Craigo
Metalcore: ?

For Metalcore we should have at least 3 people do it. One for the 80's NYC tough bands, one for the 90's Converge, Rorschach, Botch etc and one for todays scene.


Ah, the sad shape it's in..
Listen to my music here
dead_kennedy
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#31
Quote by opivy21
I suggest that you make a separate section for "Modern Hardcore". Those bands deserve a place, but I personally can't see how they fit with the original hardcore bands - at least not musically.


I agree with this. Gomorrah seems the man to do this.
rites of nothing.
J Lock
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#32
Do you want me to take another one?
Taking Back Sunday = Sensitive Hardcore
mr.joopy987
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#33
I'll do today's metalcore scene, if none of the regulars want to do it.
Disco Vietnam
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#34
I too would be more than happy to do Early, 90's and current Metalcore.
Arsenix
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#35
THANKYOU. very nice of you to clear that up.
Craigo
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#36
Quote by Gomorrah
Grindcore: StuartR
Screamo/Emo Violence: Martyr
Post-Hardcore: J Lock
Hardcore Punk: ?
New School Hardcore: ? (I'd be willing to do this)
Mathcore: Craigo
Metalcore: ?

For Metalcore we should have at least 3 people do it. One for the 80's NYC tough bands, one for the 90's Converge, Rorschach, Botch etc and one for todays scene.


+1, but I've covered up Botch and Converge giving reference to metalcore.

I'll write it up now.

EDIT: FINALLY posted
Last edited by Craigo at Nov 7, 2006,
shai_savant
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#37
not to spam or **** up this thread but am i the only one that for some reason thinks that the "breakdown" isn't something hardcore influenced....referring to craigos thing on mathcore
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xAestheticx
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#39
If we're going to be assigning who does what, I'll happily take this generation of metalcore and deathcore, and I'd like to do Modern Hardcore also.
opivy21
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#40
I'm not a regular here, but I'd be happy to do hardcore punk if no one minds.