#1
for example if a guy pushes his friend, and the friend falls and hits his head on the sidewalk (he dies)
#3
An accident?
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#4
Involuntary manslaughter.

But in that case he'd probably get off with it, assuming he can prove it was a complete accident. If say, they got into an argument and he pushed him out of anger, then it's manslaughter. Often carries as high a sentence as murder.
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#6
it would be deemed an accident if it was a friend. i think. or manslaughter. im not sure. cagnius will know.
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#10
Thanks. I know what it was in norwegian but not in english.

It's for homework just for the record - I haven't killed anyone
#11
Pwnage.


Nah only messing.. it's called Involuntary Manslaughter.. what you pushed your friend and he died?

EDIT: Damn too late.
#12
Quote by Simon4392
Thanks. I know what it was in norwegian but not in english.

It's for homework just for the record - I haven't killed anyone


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#14
Quote by spazzymagee417
why do you need to know this?


for his 'homework'.

does homework involve digging a hole and hiding a body to?
#16
If I really had kiled someone, my first action probably wouldn't have been to ask what it was called. Especially not on UG hehe

#17
It's not involuntary manslaughter. At common law, manslaughter is a killing without premeditation, or a killing that occurs from negligence, or a killing that occurs during the commission of a misdemeanor. It would definitely at least be manslaughter. Could also be considered murder, depending on what you planned to do. Unforeseen degree of damage to the victim isn't a defense. It's called the egg shell skull doctrine.
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#18
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Pwnage.

I'm amazed it took so long for that to come up but it was damn funny.
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#19
HAHAHA You Can't Have Manslaughter Without Laughter
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#20
so a murder, where maybe two teenagers were playing war (or something involving hitting) and one of them gets dies from htting his head after being pushed (no harm intended), is called involuntary manslaughter? or just manslaughter?
#21
You're confusing the language. A "murder" is a specific type of killing, as is manslaughter. I told you what types of killings fall into the category of "manslaughter," so you tell me what type of killing it is. "Involuntary manslaughter" is a statutory construct and is more or less irrelevant for these purposes.
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#22
If the death is pre-meditated, that is to say planned, it is murder. If you are acting in anger, or due to a loss of brain power, it is manslaughter. If you do not intend to cause harm, it is still manslaughter, but will probably carry a lesser sentence.
At least, I'm pretty sure those is the rules in the UK...
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#24
Quote by Dirk Gently
It's not involuntary manslaughter. At common law, manslaughter is a killing without premeditation, or a killing that occurs from negligence, or a killing that occurs during the commission of a misdemeanor. It would definitely at least be manslaughter. Could also be considered murder, depending on what you planned to do. Unforeseen degree of damage to the victim isn't a defense. It's called the egg shell skull doctrine.


read the link and differentiate between voluntary and involuntary manslaughter.

If it is an act of 'passion' and was provoked, then it is voluntary manslaughter. Acts of passion inlcluding rages of anger, etc.

Involuntary is from negligence or accidental.

Neither are premeditated.

I checked this with numerous sources.

Quote by Simon4392
so a murder, where maybe two teenagers were playing war (or something involving hitting) and one of them gets dies from htting his head after being pushed (no harm intended), is called involuntary manslaughter? or just manslaughter?


see above.

EDIT:

here are some sources:
Involuntary:
http://www.answers.com/topic/manslaughter-2
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manslaughter
http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/m011.htm
http://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/violent_crimes/involuntary_manslaughter.htm

Voluntary:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manslaughter
http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/m012.htm
http://criminal.findlaw.com/crimes/a-z/manslaughter_voluntary.html
http://criminal-law.freeadvice.com/violent_crimes/voluntary_manslaughter.htm
Last edited by LordSephiroth at Jan 16, 2007,
#25
Quote by LordSephiroth
read the link and differentiate between voluntary and involuntary manslaughter.

If it is an act of 'passion' and was provoked, then it is voluntary manslaughter. Acts of passion inlcluding rages of anger, etc.

Involuntary is from negligence or accidental.

Neither are premeditated.

I checked this with numerous sources.


see above.

Dirk's an attorney (sp?), he doesn't need the link.
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#27
^ Yep, I read your link. The voluntary/involuntary distinction is useless and is basically for lay people, just like getting into vehicular manslaughter and all that. Statutes can create as many distinctions as people can dream up. Actually, it's funny because I'd argue that the example they gave as involuntary manslaughter was actually common law murder - i.e., a killing resulting from the commission of a felony or from a criminally reckless act, recklessness being a wanton disregard for human life.

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that page just happens to be from the state and county that i live in. what a coincidence.

I think that does that for everyone, unless you also happen to live in Albany County, NY.
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Last edited by Dirk Gently at Jan 16, 2007,
#28
I posted some others, some of them mention that the definition is different or vague depending upon where you are.

Most unintentional killings are not murder but involuntary manslaughter. The absence of the element of intent is the key distinguishing factor between voluntary and involuntary manslaughter. In most states involuntary manslaughter results from an improper use of reasonable care or skill while performing a legal act, or while committing an act that is unlawful but not felonious.

Many states do not define involuntary manslaughter, or define it vaguely in common-law terms. Some jurisdictions describe the amount of negligence necessary to constitute manslaughter with terms such as criminal negligence, gross negligence, and culpable negligence. The only certainty that can be attached to these terms is that they require more than the ordinary negligence standard in a civil case. With this approach the state does not have to prove that the defendant was aware of the risk.


from http://www.answers.com/topic/manslaughter-2

EDIT:

Quote by Dirk Gently
^ Yep, I read your link. The voluntary/involuntary distinction is useless and is basically for lay people, just like getting into vehicular manslaughter and all that. Statutes can create as many distinctions as people can dream up. Actually, it's funny because I'd argue that the example they gave as involuntary manslaughter was actually common law murder - i.e., a killing resulting from the commission of a felony or from a criminally reckless act, recklessness being a wanton disregard for human life.


oh ok, I wasn't aware of that. The only legal stuff I keep up with is related to cybercrime.

Good info, thanks.
#29
Quote by Simon4392
well that's all I need, thanks!

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much appriciated


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#30
Quote by Simon4392
so a murder, where maybe two teenagers were playing war (or something involving hitting) and one of them gets dies from htting his head after being pushed (no harm intended), is called involuntary manslaughter? or just manslaughter?


given that example (if what i understand is correct) then, in the UK at least, thats not murder - since there is no intent to cause serious harm, or the apreciation of the fact that serious harm was almost certain to have been caused.

with that said, voluntary manslaughter is no longer an issue, since it is a defence to a murder charge. involuntary manslaughter is what could be claimed, but since a simple push intended as part of game is unlikely to be considered an unlawful and dangerous act, i would argue that it was not even constructive (involuntary manslaughter). and thats just about all the charges (that i know of) that can be aimed at the defendant, my thought is that in a court of law that is an accident.

hope that makes sense

turns out coming on to UG was good for my law revision, i would never have thought it...
#31
read the link and differentiate between voluntary and involuntary manslaughter.

Dude, Dirk is an attorney...
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#32
Quote by Smokey Amp
Dude, Dirk is an attorney...


And that somehow makes my arguement less factual?

For one, I wasn't aware of that fact, but it still wouldn't have changed the way I approached it. I work in information security and follow virtually every vulnerability and release, however people still try to refute my claims. It is why I have started posting sources to anything that I post. You can't simply assume someone is infallible because they work in a given profession. I'm not trying to point out Dirk in this case, however don't immediately assume that someone working in any given profession is always correct, especially on the internet.

Now, I'm not saying he's wrong and if you read his post you'll find he is saying the same about mine (unless i misunderstood).
#33
Quote by LordSephiroth
And that somehow makes my arguement less factual?

For one, I wasn't aware of that fact, but it still wouldn't have changed the way I approached it. I work in information security and follow virtually every vulnerability and release, however people still try to refute my claims. It is why I have started posting sources to anything that I post. You can't simply assume someone is infallible because they work in a given profession. I'm not trying to point out Dirk in this case, however don't immediately assume that someone working in any given profession is always correct, especially on the internet.

Now, I'm not saying he's wrong and if you read his post you'll find he is saying the same about mine (unless i misunderstood).


Oh, I was not insinuating that you were wrong, I just thought it was strange to correct an attorney about a law issue.
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#34
Is it just me or does manslaughter sound alot worse than murder?

Also, I'm surpirsed it is still called manslaughter in our politically correct world. Shouldnt it have been changed to personslaughter by now?