#1
Alright, so I sold my spider 2 75W, which I used along with a boss MT-2.

I am buying a tube amp later this week, but I'm afraid clean tubes won't give me the gain I am looking for. I hear all this talk that in order to play metal with a tube amp, you need an OD pedal NOT a distortion pedal. How does this work? Because that sounds pretty contradictory. Also, any suggestions for pedals/amps will be appreciated. My maximum spending is about $600.

currently looking into:
peavey XXX (if I can find it)
Peavey Valveking
Ashdown fallen angel (if I can find it)

especially with the valveking, I heard the gain is not that great. Would different tubes and a different speaker help? Or just an OD pedal...

I play metal, mostly very high gain stuff. Think Kataklysm, children of bodom. Every now and then I also play more classy stuff, like metallica or sonata arctica.

I am a noob when it comes to tube and distortion, so I apologize if I sound dumb in any way. Appreciate the advice!
WTLTL 2011
Last edited by Mark G at Mar 12, 2007,
#2
Your in the right direction with the XXX.

I thought it was pretty good for metal, but that was about it. It was kinda one dimensional.

I didn't mind the Valveking, but it sounded sort of mushy. I don't know if it would do metal if you're looking for a nice tight type of gain. An OD would probably help this.

I tried the Ashdown Fallen Angel at a store recently, and found out that it was a relitavely low gain amp, so an OD pedal would be necessary.

Hope I helped
#3
Well, some people will say that you can use both pedals with both types of amps. I use both with a tube amp, and get great results. I have a valveking, and the gain isn't exactly amazing. But I haven't found a way to make my OD work well with my gain channel, without feedbacking and creating horrible sounds. I reccomend the XXX over the valveking, but any of those three is a decent choice.
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#4
Go to the guitar center and try for yourself I love the valveking...it beats the pants off the xxx.
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#5
you can play metal with a valve amp stupid boy.
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#6
Quote by SG6578
Go to the guitar center and try for yourself I love the valveking...it beats the pants off the xxx.


That's opinion.

Most find the VK quite mediocre.

But still, go try them, you never know what may sound great to your ears.
#8
alright, so let's say I tried out the valveking and discovered that it does not have enough gain for my metal needs. Would it be best to boost it with an OD or use a distortion pedal instead?
WTLTL 2011
#9
If you're looking into the XXX, then look into the JSX, amazing amp.
OD pedals are generally used for tube amps, because they push your tubes further to naturally break up, which gives you that high gain sound. Basically if you crank your amps gain and you dont find it quite enough, throw in a OD pedal and you'll be soaring before you know it, hugeeeee difference. Distortion pedals emulate the tube breakup sound, but as an emulator it isnt as good as the real thing. For tubes, OD'em, thats the best way. Although some peolpe can use distortion pedals in tube amps, if they're aiming for a fizzy, high end sort of thrash sound, but the tone wont compare to your natural tube sound.
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#10
If you tried out the VK, and it didnt suit your gain needs, pick up a Electro Harmonix LPB-1, and your problem will be fixed without doubt. Boosts the gain sooooooooo much.
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#11
Quote by Mark G
alright, so let's say I tried out the valveking and discovered that it does not have enough gain for my metal needs. Would it be best to boost it with an OD or use a distortion pedal instead?


Most people prefer to use overdrive pedals with tube amps.
#12
Lot of people used Solid State distortion/fuzz boxes into a tube signal to get their tone. Ever hear of Jimi Hendrix or Steve Vai? If you're aiming for a sweet singing tone, you will have to crank your amp really loudly and push it with the OD. But if you're going for more of a modern tone, try your distortion box in front of the clean channel.
#13
alright, so I should definitely get an OD pedal over a distortion pedal with a tube amp. Glad that's cleared up ^-^

I heard a lot of good things abot the EH LPB-1, but also Boss DS-1 and digitech bad monkey.

I suppose I should just try out these pedal, but which do you recon boosts the gain the most without sacrificing tone?

Also, I know the VK isn't a very good choise for metal. I was using it as an example of a tube amp where more gain might be desired. I will look into the JSX, and pray a shop around here sells it or the XXX.

thanks for the advice guys, been a big help so far for sure

*edit*

holy sh$t the JSX combo is like $1500. I think ill stick with the XXX lol
WTLTL 2011
Last edited by Mark G at Mar 12, 2007,
#14
Quote by Ngawtfizjuice
Lot of people used Solid State distortion/fuzz boxes into a tube signal to get their tone. Ever hear of Jimi Hendrix or Steve Vai? If you're aiming for a sweet singing tone, you will have to crank your amp really loudly and push it with the OD. But if you're going for more of a modern tone, try your distortion box in front of the clean channel.


Ever hear of read what I typed, I said MOST, not all!

I know you can use a distortion box as a boost, but many people PREFER OD pedals.

#15
it makes sense that the original in general is better than a similation ( OD pedal > distortion).
WTLTL 2011
#16
Quote by Mark G
it makes sense that the original in general is better than a similation ( OD pedal > distortion).


Distortion pedals aren't exactly simulations of OD pedals. They produce a different sound entirely, and clip the signal differently.
#17
Quote by wylde_overdrive
Ever hear of read what I typed, I said MOST, not all!

I know you can use a distortion box as a boost, but many people PREFER OD pedals.


You must be pretty insecure to take that as a personal attack when I wasn't even paying attention to anything you said in this thread. I was simply informing him, since the majority of people in here are just going "OMGz, b00zt ur Vk w17 4 ODEE LOLZ" when he's looking for a brutal scooped out tone. And I never claimed anywhere that you said "ALL" hell, I wasn't even addressing you.
#18
Quote by Ngawtfizjuice
Lot of people used Solid State distortion/fuzz boxes into a tube signal to get their tone.

Actually, just about everyone uses solid state pedals. Some have tubes, yes, but the vast majority are SS.
#19
To wylde overdrive:

Quote by Tensorspencer
If you're looking into the XXX, then look into the JSX, amazing amp.
OD pedals are generally used for tube amps, because they push your tubes further to naturally break up, which gives you that high gain sound. Basically if you crank your amps gain and you dont find it quite enough, throw in a OD pedal and you'll be soaring before you know it, hugeeeee difference. Distortion pedals emulate the tube breakup sound, but as an emulator it isnt as good as the real thing. For tubes, OD'em, thats the best way. Although some peolpe can use distortion pedals in tube amps, if they're aiming for a fizzy, high end sort of thrash sound, but the tone wont compare to your natural tube sound.


This guy seems to disagree lol. Either way, in general OD do sound better with tube amos than distortion pedals. (from what I gathered in this thread)

everyone else: there is more confusion around this topic than I thought lol.
WTLTL 2011
#20
hahahah yeah the JSX can list pretty high, but if you're like me, I went into Steves Music in toronto, and walked out with a JSX head and marshall 1960B cab for 2000$ flat, so the head was basically 1100$ CAD, which is a good deal if I bought it used, never mind brand new.
Haggling is how I roll hahaha.
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Framus Cobra modded
#21
Quote by Ngawtfizjuice
You must be pretty insecure to take that as a personal attack when I wasn't even paying attention to anything you said in this thread. I was simply informing him, since the majority of people in here are just going "OMGz, b00zt ur Vk w17 4 ODEE LOLZ" when he's looking for a brutal scooped out tone. And I never claimed anywhere that you said "ALL" hell, I wasn't even addressing you.


I just really don't want him to make a mistake and buy some shitty distortion box with a tube amp. Some are fine, most are complete shit.
#22
Quote by wylde_overdrive
I just really don't want him to make a mistake and buy some shitty distortion box with a tube amp. Some are fine, most are complete shit.

Have you tried most? If not, stfu.
#24
/endhate plz

I think I now know enough about OD pedals and their effect on tube amps to make a fairly good decision on what to buy this weekend. I will look into several amps, and if I cant gind enough gain for my price range I will add an OD pedal. Thanks everyone!
WTLTL 2011
Last edited by Mark G at Mar 12, 2007,
#25
Quote by wylde_overdrive
Yes I have.

On every possible amp, guitar, and in every playing situation? Rightttttttt.
#26
Quote by Mark G
/endhate plz

I think I now know enough about OD pedals and their effect on tube amps to make a fairly good decision on what to buy this weekend. I will look into several amps, and if I cant gind enough gain for my price range I will add an OD pedal. Thanks everyone!


Cool, no problem.

Quote by Ngawtfizjuice
On every possible amp, guitar, and in every playing situation? Rightttttttt.


Fuck you're stupid.

I never said I tried them on every possible amp, guitar, and in every playing situation, just that I have tried an assload of pedals.
#27
Quote by wylde_overdrive
Cool, no problem.


Fuck you're stupid.

I never said I tried them on every possible amp, guitar, and in every playing situation, just that I have tried an assload of pedals.

I never said you that you tried them in all of these situations. But let me dumb it down for you, since you're such a simpleton. You can't claim every pedal sucks, because you haven't played it on every amp, guitar, or in every playing situation/style. They may not have had any use for you personally, but to say that for every other player on the planet is just ****ing arrogant, stupid, and plain retarded. And you seem to be getting very angry for some reason. Hmmmmmmm.
#28
Quote by Ngawtfizjuice
I never said you that you tried them in all of these situations. But let me dumb it down for you, since you're such a simpleton. You can't claim every pedal sucks, because you haven't played it on every amp, guitar, or in every playing situation/style. They may not have had any use for you personally, but to say that for every other player on the planet is just ****ing arrogant, stupid, and plain retarded. And you seem to be getting very angry for some reason. Hmmmmmmm.


I never claimed every pedal sucked, now did I?

You haven't contributed 1 useful suggestion for this entire thread. I and many others have. Get out.

Oh, *reported*
Last edited by wylde_overdrive at Mar 12, 2007,
#29
Quote by wylde_overdrive
I never claimed every pedal sucked, now did I?

Douchebag.

Oh, *reported*

Lololol, did I hurt your feelings? I'm sorrrrrrrrrry. LoLololol owned.
#30
Quote by wylde_overdrive
I don't think "Lolololol" is a real argument, therefore you lose. I win.

Fail. Seriously, you're done. That last statement just shows you're trying to live up some inadequacy you have on these forums. Good luck though. Lolololol. Lulz.
#31
I have a VK and I play hard rock/metal on it. I don't think the gain is that bad, but I still bost it with a Digitech Bad Monkey, which is a good bargain on a good analogue OD. I suggest trying this combination out. I wish I had some decent clips recorded for you.
Quote by Zeppelin71
Umm. . .uh. . .your mom touched sjones' dick. YOUR MOM TOUCHED OUR GUITARISTS GENITALS IN A CAMPER AT A BIKER FESTIVAL! truth.
#32
Quote by sjones
I have a VK and I play hard rock/metal on it. I don't think the gain is that bad, but I still bost it with a Digitech Bad Monkey, which is a good bargain on a good analogue OD. I suggest trying this combination out. I wish I had some decent clips recorded for you.


I tried that side to side with a SD-1 and a Keeley modded BD-2, and found the Bad Monkey to be quite a bargain.

Pretty good pedal
#33
ive heard more good things about this Digitech bad monkey, which is surprising to me because I always associated digitech with DIGITAL lol. Anyway, I will try this pedal out for sure. Thanks for the suggestion
WTLTL 2011
#34
I also like super-heavy distortion... with plenty of low end.

Overdrives are designed to overdrive the tubes, producing more distortion/gain... hence the name overdrive.

Distortion pedals just change the sound of your guitar signal.

The XXX sounds too much like a "normal metal sound"... it sounds like a distortion pedal or just generic metal... I don't like it.

I really like the Valveking... maybe the used one I played at Sam Ash had different tubes or something, but I played it with a Dave Mustaine LTD (the one with his loud-ass Duncan Livewires), and it sounded amazing.
#35
'Tis strange, how one person can hate and the next love the same amp. Preferance is a big issue. My schecter c1 has original duncans, which are pretty damn tight for metal. I'm going to try out every tube amp in my price range, see which has the best tone. If the gain is not enough ill buy an OD pedal. on a side note, B-52 seems to make very affordable all tube amps. Just saw a b-52 stealth 112 combo for 500...tri-rectifier something lol. If its similar to the mesa rectifiers I'm gonna go apeshit
WTLTL 2011
#36
Quote by ArcherTheVMan
you can play metal with a valve amp stupid boy.

Idiot, the thing is practically built for metal
Gear:
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2003 Tom Delonge Fender Strat Seafoam Green
Traynor YCV40