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#1
People have been saying some people gig with a 15W Tube amp, and I was thinking, you could never do that with a SS, so whats the ratio from Tube to SS?
#2
well i know my 15w Fender blues jr is louder than my other 30w Marshall MG30.
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#3
A good rule of thumb is that 15w valve is pretty similar to 50w solid state.

I know my 30w valve is a shed load louder than my mates 100w solid state.
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#5
Quote by mr_hankey
There are exactly 37845 threads on this subject; use the search.


Sorry, I"ll remember next time.

Thanks for thoes who answered. I just bought the Peavey Valveking 112 50W Tube Combo :O
#7
Quote by tr3nt
Sorry, I"ll remember next time.

Thanks for thoes who answered. I just bought the Peavey Valveking 112 50W Tube Combo :O



Unless your playing at a big gig, you will probably never be able to crank it to get it's full potentional.


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#9
Quote by Lordoflax
Unless your playing at a big gig, you will probably never be able to crank it to get it's full potentional.


It was the best buy.
#10
Quote by fragydig529
So a 65w Valve is = to what on a ss?


120-150: AKA too much.
#11
isn't this paticular to the specific brand you have?
I know Tube-amps are louder then SS-amps but still....
#12
Quote by fragydig529
So a 65w Valve is = to what on a ss?


200w or so. I.e. rediculous.
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Boss GE-7

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#13
Fender is mostly louder than the same wattage Marshall.
but if u go up to more than 50 watts tube... u won't even need the last 3 tickmarks on ur volume control... so... who cares?
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#14
Are Tube Amps louder than solid state amps of the same power?
Yes and no. If you put a power meter on the output of a tube amplifier and a solid state amplifier that have been matched for total output power, then the meter will read almost exactly the same power for equivalent drive conditions - so in this sense, the answer is no, they are not louder. However, if you LISTEN to the two amps, you'll find that the tube amp does indeed sound louder to your ears, in opposition to what the meter is telling you. Why?
It's tied up in the sensing instrument - that is, your ear. The way the human ear works is that it is very sensitive to the harmonic content of a sound. A tube amp is less linear (that is, has more distortion) at signal levels below clipping than a solid state amplifier. The distortion will increase slowly, and then more rapidly as the amp starts to clip. In fact, the distortion increases so gradually and is of such a benign nature that the onset of audible distortion has no easily defined threshold. The solid state amplifier on the other hand has no such gradualism. It is almost perfectly non-distorting right up to the point that it clips, and then it clips HARD. It's easy to hear the threshold.
This sudden onset of distortion is also composed of relatively harsh sounding distortion, not like the subtle second and third harmonics of the tube amp. The human ear hears the sudden harsh distortion as clipping and harshness. It interprets the low order distortion of the tube amp as a louder sound, not as distortion. In effect, the tube amp fools the ear into thinking that its early distortion is more loudness. They therefore sound louder or more powerful than the actual measurements show are really there.
#15
Quote by metalhead296
i got the peavy xxx 120 watt tube. that things loud as hell.


Wow..
#16
Quote by Schecter1277
Are Tube Amps louder than solid state amps of the same power?
Yes and no. If you put a power meter on the output of a tube amplifier and a solid state amplifier that have been matched for total output power, then the meter will read almost exactly the same power for equivalent drive conditions - so in this sense, the answer is no, they are not louder. However, if you LISTEN to the two amps, you'll find that the tube amp does indeed sound louder to your ears, in opposition to what the meter is telling you. Why?
It's tied up in the sensing instrument - that is, your ear. The way the human ear works is that it is very sensitive to the harmonic content of a sound. A tube amp is less linear (that is, has more distortion) at signal levels below clipping than a solid state amplifier. The distortion will increase slowly, and then more rapidly as the amp starts to clip. In fact, the distortion increases so gradually and is of such a benign nature that the onset of audible distortion has no easily defined threshold. The solid state amplifier on the other hand has no such gradualism. It is almost perfectly non-distorting right up to the point that it clips, and then it clips HARD. It's easy to hear the threshold.
This sudden onset of distortion is also composed of relatively harsh sounding distortion, not like the subtle second and third harmonics of the tube amp. The human ear hears the sudden harsh distortion as clipping and harshness. It interprets the low order distortion of the tube amp as a louder sound, not as distortion. In effect, the tube amp fools the ear into thinking that its early distortion is more loudness. They therefore sound louder or more powerful than the actual measurements show are really there.


Interesting. Thank you. but you could say, at the end of the day. Tube amps sound 2X Louder then the same power outage of SS?
#17
Tubes sound louder than SS of 3-4 times the power. I practice with a kid with a 150w SS and I have turn down my 15w.
#18
Quote by Schecter1277
Tubes sound louder than SS of 3-4 times the power. I practice with a kid with a 150w SS and I have turn down my 15w.


I'd say 2-3 times.
#19
Quote by Schecter1277
Tubes sound louder than SS of 3-4 times the power. I practice with a kid with a 150w SS and I have turn down my 15w.


Thats disgusting.. lol
#20
Quote by Schecter1277
Are Tube Amps louder than solid state amps of the same power?
Yes and no. If you put a power meter on the output of a tube amplifier and a solid state amplifier that have been matched for total output power, then the meter will read almost exactly the same power for equivalent drive conditions - so in this sense, the answer is no, they are not louder. However, if you LISTEN to the two amps, you'll find that the tube amp does indeed sound louder to your ears, in opposition to what the meter is telling you. Why?
It's tied up in the sensing instrument - that is, your ear. The way the human ear works is that it is very sensitive to the harmonic content of a sound. A tube amp is less linear (that is, has more distortion) at signal levels below clipping than a solid state amplifier. The distortion will increase slowly, and then more rapidly as the amp starts to clip. In fact, the distortion increases so gradually and is of such a benign nature that the onset of audible distortion has no easily defined threshold. The solid state amplifier on the other hand has no such gradualism. It is almost perfectly non-distorting right up to the point that it clips, and then it clips HARD. It's easy to hear the threshold.
This sudden onset of distortion is also composed of relatively harsh sounding distortion, not like the subtle second and third harmonics of the tube amp. The human ear hears the sudden harsh distortion as clipping and harshness. It interprets the low order distortion of the tube amp as a louder sound, not as distortion. In effect, the tube amp fools the ear into thinking that its early distortion is more loudness. They therefore sound louder or more powerful than the actual measurements show are really there.

very nice description.

my epi valve junior is so close to being drowned out during practice, but at least it sounds better than my crate when it's loud enough to be heard.

sigh, i wish there was a 10watt valve junior head
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#23
so basically ... a tube amp is 40x louder than a S.S. 3.85x the wattage of the tube amp divided by a quater of the setting on both amps all together mulitplid by the amount of times i sh@gged the threadstarter's mum last night ... according to john-jacob-jingle-heimer-schmitt ...


XD
erowid has your answers
#24
Quote by si!
while we're on the subject, if i have say a 40 watt tube amp, would i need an attenuator to practice at home, i don't want to piss the neighbors off too much, but i want to be heard over my drummer.


it's in YOUR house isn't it. tell them to gtfo :O, and by what i've been reading, 40W Tube could get over your drums at a low volume setting. but i've never played anything over a 20W SS
#26
Quote by tr3nt
it's in YOUR house isn't it. tell them to gtfo :O, and by what i've been reading, 40W Tube could get over your drums at a low volume setting. but i've never played anything over a 20W SS

well i live with my parents so if i tell them to **** off....
#27
Quote by si!
well i live with my parents so if i tell them to **** off....


haha.
#28
Quote by si!
while we're on the subject, if i have say a 40 watt tube amp, would i need an attenuator to practice at home, i don't want to piss the neighbors off too much, but i want to be heard over my drummer.


Well the glorious thing about any amp is that it has a volume control...
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Boss GE-7

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#30
Quote by Kurapica
Well the glorious thing about any amp is that it has a volume control...

+1

Eh, kurapica, aren't our amps about 50 tube watts?

And yeah, quiet honestly, if you're going to be playing in some gig outside or something without a PA system or if one (in that matter) You're going to need a tube amp. (Heard these guys play at my school and their tone sounded like wet farts when they turned it up...ugh)
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#31
It's not just a simple question of loudness when you're looking at tubes. It's the dynamics of the tubes. 30 watts tube is pretty versatile, saturates well, gives you enough clean for smaller venues. 60 watts is what I have, and honestly, it's too much sometimes. It's hard to get to that "sweet spot" where the tubes start to sing without getting too loud for smaller venues. Way back when I was first getting into tube amps, I wanted a Fender Twin. Today, I couldn't imagine why anybody needs 100w of tube power unless you want a LOT Of clean head room at high volumes.

Don't bother looking for loudness. Look for tone. Solid states sound the same no matter what volume you set them at. But I would never want to play on an SS on a live show, honestlly, so I don't see the point of a loud SS. Tubes have awesome sounds when you get them cooking, but honestly I can't imagine a setting where you would need to crank an 80-100w tube amp up to it's sweet range. If the venue is that large, you probably have a full PA anyway.

IMO, a GOOD 30-45 watt tube amp is the ultimate in performance, and if you need it to be loud, mic it. Quality, not quantity when looking at amps. Always.
#33
Quote by si!
while we're on the subject, if i have say a 40 watt tube amp, would i need an attenuator to practice at home, i don't want to piss the neighbors off too much, but i want to be heard over my drummer.

I wouldn't use the attenuator. Volume control should be good enough, especially if it's just for practice.

Attenuators allow you to drive the tubes harder (thus improving tone) at lower volumes by limiting the power that gets to the speakers. While this may be good for your tone, it isn't good for your tubes. Driving them hard a lot will shorten the lifespan considerably. If you're just practicing, it's not worth it to sacrifice your tubes for tone.
#34
Quote by Schecter1277
Are Tube Amps louder than solid state amps of the same power?
Yes and no. If you put a power meter on the output of a tube amplifier and a solid state amplifier that have been matched for total output power, then the meter will read almost exactly the same power for equivalent drive conditions - so in this sense, the answer is no, they are not louder. However, if you LISTEN to the two amps, you'll find that the tube amp does indeed sound louder to your ears, in opposition to what the meter is telling you. Why?
It's tied up in the sensing instrument - that is, your ear. The way the human ear works is that it is very sensitive to the harmonic content of a sound. A tube amp is less linear (that is, has more distortion) at signal levels below clipping than a solid state amplifier. The distortion will increase slowly, and then more rapidly as the amp starts to clip. In fact, the distortion increases so gradually and is of such a benign nature that the onset of audible distortion has no easily defined threshold. The solid state amplifier on the other hand has no such gradualism. It is almost perfectly non-distorting right up to the point that it clips, and then it clips HARD. It's easy to hear the threshold.
This sudden onset of distortion is also composed of relatively harsh sounding distortion, not like the subtle second and third harmonics of the tube amp. The human ear hears the sudden harsh distortion as clipping and harshness. It interprets the low order distortion of the tube amp as a louder sound, not as distortion. In effect, the tube amp fools the ear into thinking that its early distortion is more loudness. They therefore sound louder or more powerful than the actual measurements show are really there.


schecter1277 is a plaigariser. Behold,
http://www.geofex.com/tubeampfaq/beginner_tube_amps.htm
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#36
tube amps arent really louder they just cut thru more, and sound 80x better

i had a 50 watt rect-o-verb it had more than enough volume
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#37
Quote by mw7
schecter1277 is a plaigariser. Behold,
http://www.geofex.com/tubeampfaq/beginner_tube_amps.htm


I figured that would be apparent, but thanks for that blinding flash of the obvious. Now, please go back to Babylon 5 reruns and fondling yourself.


As for the amp, the most versatile tube I've seen is my crate palomino. I played all of the normal amps in that range, and couldn't find the "do-it-all" tube. Tubes, by their nature seem to be very limiting. However, the palomino seems to be a good everything amp. It is vintage voiced, it doesn't say but it says celestion on the speaker, I'm thinking it's a vintage 30. But, if you mess with the EQ you can get most anything out of the amp.
I have the 15w version, it was only 399 and a great buy, it makes an awsome practice amp at home, or a good band practice. Since most people want you to stay under a certain level, it helps to be able to blast it, so you get that power tube breakup. You don't want an amp you have to turn down, or you just don't get what you pay for.
Which is part of the reason with my new 100w I am only using an open back 2x12, so it's not as loud and I can crank it more.

Oh, and because I just bought it today, here is all my amps(because I can )
Last edited by Schecter1277 at Mar 19, 2007,
#38
asswipe
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#40
Quote by mw7
asswipe


Figured you were pathetic and would stoop to such low level insults.
Another flash of the obvious.


Quote by TheDev01dOne
Is 200W all tube enough for bedroom practice? Like I dunno if it will be loud enough.

Should I fullstack it to make it louder?

How am I gonna play gigs with it? I'll need to mic it right?.........


You'll probably need like 4 mics for each speaker, 12'' isn't a very big speaker, it's only good for headphones. (picture that in your head a moment)

I still maintain that even 30-40w youre going too loud. Like I said, it's better to max the volume, and you'll be outblasting the drums anyway on a 15w.
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