Page 1 of 2
#1
so i really want to get a marshall halfstack but i do have a lower end budget so im thinking of getting a used one. i was just wondering what a cab and head in decent shape thats only maybe a few years old would approximately cost me? i was also wondering if most marshall heads are tube. i am a little afraid of buying a tube head because if the tubes are old and in bad shape i wont be able to tell and then i will end up having to pay alot more money to replace the tubes. not to mention i would have to replace them later on. so i was kind of steering away from a tube head. what are my choices? and if i have to get a tube head what are signs to look for that will tell me if the tubes are in need of replacing. also what is a good cabinet to look for.
P.S. i am planning on buying the amp and cab seperately
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#2
I suggest buying tube if at all possible. It just plain sounds better, plus they're louder for the wattage rating. A used all-tube could run you anywhere from $2000 to $500 USD, depending on where you get it and which model it is.
#3
assuming you want an AC/D like tone youll probably want a JCM 800 you can probably get a halfstack for $1500 US if youre lucky. you wont find any that are only a few years old thoug, except for the reissues.
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#4
take it from previous instances....i used to have a marshall mg 100 dfx.......crappy amp......then i thought wow line 6 amazing....wrong...i had a line 6 spider 2.........another crappy amp.....all ss amps sound the sames and they are all digital so you cant dial in the tone you want......so finally....for 500 bucks.....i bought a used b52 all tube at212........best money ive ever spent........tubes are worth it and if wasted so much money buying those other tube amps......a combo for a tube amp will do u well and then if u want a stack...there is always room for expansions with the combos.......id get a tube combo.....
#5
Quote by prs-b52at212
...all ss amps sound the sames and they are all digital so you cant dial in the tone you want....


thats pretty much completely untrue.
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#6
Quote by prs-b52at212
then i thought wow line 6 amazing....wrong...i had a line 6 spider 2.........another crappy amp.....


ahaha i love how u called it a peice of $h|t then you see it for sale in ur sig.
also you used sooo many periods
Gear:
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Washburn D10S Deluxe (electric acoustic)
#7
Yeah, best bet for the price would be a B-52. At series 1x12 or 2x12 would be a great selection, otherwise, if you wanted to stick to a half stack, I would go with either the B-52 LG 100 half stack or the Randall Rx120 half stack. Both are the same price and offer a wide variety of tones.(B-52 especially for AC/DC.)
Quote by LuthierofTexas
You have no experience with racks??? What kind of guy are you?
#8
Ok first off if you don't want tube then forget Marshall, the only good Marshalls are tube Marshalls. Having said that tubes are pretty easy to own and you'll know when you need new tubes, tube amps just sound wrong when the tubes have had it.

The most important thing if you want advice is your budget and your taste in music, pretty much makes it impossible to suggest something without that info. Also, what did you want a half stack for? Doesn't sound like you're gigging yet and if it's just for looks then your giving up tone to do it cause when on a strict budget you'll nearly always get a better quality combo for the same amount you'd pay for a crappy half stack but once again budget will figure into that too.
#9
ya we play gigs all the time but i dont have a big amp cuz i have been saving all this time so i just run my guitar into my multi effects pedal into the p.a. our bassplayer owns that we use for gigs.
Gear:
Epiphone SG Vintage
Digitech RP 100A
Kustom Quad 100 DFX
Washburn D10S Deluxe (electric acoustic)
#10
You could get the Peavey Windsor. I've heard thats a pretty good Marshall copy and cheap as hell too. Check it out. I think its like $400 american
#12
Quote by angusyoung_sg
ya we play gigs all the time but i dont have a big amp cuz i have been saving all this time so i just run my guitar into my multi effects pedal into the p.a. our bassplayer owns that we use for gigs.

mate focus on this bit

"The most important thing if you want advice is your budget and your taste in music"

EDIT: Also if your band is using a PA then my guess is you could mic up yeah? If that's the case then a 15W tube combo would be plenty. Obviously it doen't have to be just 15W but yeah doesn't sound like you need a halfstack, but once again, budget!
Last edited by treagar at Mar 21, 2007,
#13
Quote by treagar
mate focus on this bit

"The most important thing if you want advice is your budget and your taste in music"

EDIT: Also if your band is using a PA then my guess is you could mic up yeah? If that's the case then a 15W tube combo would be plenty. Obviously it doen't have to be just 15W but yeah doesn't sound like you need a halfstack, but once again, budget!


If you're in any respectable venue they have their own sound tech on hand every night.

They wont let you use your PA there, you'd have to get it miced there, in which case you wouldn't have to buy a mic or PA or anything.

Doing DI/Line out for guitar absolutely SUCKS. It sounds like total garbage.

Not to mention 15w tube amps are total garbage for anything other than bedroom practice, too.
#14
yeah, i think most people that tell you to use a 15 watt tube amp for gigging have never actually tried doing that.

But i do have to say little 15 watters can be great for recording.
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#15
Quote by Kid_Thorazine
yeah, i think most people that tell you to use a 15 watt tube amp for gigging have never actually tried doing that.


Definitely. They're batshit insane. For any kind of headroom you're going to want at least a 40-50w 1x12 combo, preferred 2x12 for gigging.
#16
Damn you guys are like a bunch of old hens sometimes, all I'm trying to say is that if you have a PA available, whether it be yours or the venues that you don't need some super powerful amp then do you? And a 15W tube is too loud for bedroom practice too if you want to get the thing humming, a 1/2W tube is ideal for bedroom practice. Remember a 15W tube is gonna sound about as loud as a 40W SS when cranked which when miced is fine for gigs, not perfect but will get the job done specially if the PA has monitors.

I know I'd rather have a quality 15-30W tube amp than some crappy MG half stack any day. And as for headroom, I did say tube amp and they sound best when cranked you don't want headroom unless you need cleans.
#17
yeah, and most people need cleans at some point or other, having headroom at gigging volume is important.
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#18
^ Metallica have used an AC30 live for cleans in the past. The volume comes from the PA not the amp.

Anyway you both missed my point, the guy has access to a PA, he doesn't need a crappy half stack. I've said it plenty of time sure half stacks have their advantages but when you don't want to spend anything you have to comprimise somewhere and in these cases I would comprimise volume for quality especially if I had a PA available.
Last edited by treagar at Mar 22, 2007,
#19
an AC-30 is a good bit louder than a 15 watt combo, plus AC-30s are known to break up late. Trust me ive tried gigging with a low wattage combo before, it doesnt work all that well. a 50 watt combo sure, but not much smaller.
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Last edited by Kid_Thorazine at Mar 22, 2007,
#20
^ bet it still sounded better than an MG though huh? Thats my point. I'm not saying the TS should get a 15W amp cause they are the best for gigging all I'm saying is he could get by with one and probably sound better than a cheap ass SS half stack, 30-50W tube would be ideal with a PA. Is that clear enough?
#21
What kind of 15w amp has the kind of features to be a quality gigging amp?

None, that's how many.

So, what's the point in suggesting a small useless tube amp over a small useless solid state amp for gigging.

None.

</thread>

So basically there's no point in mentioning anything about a 15w tube amp at all in a thread that has anything to do with any kind of gigging.

You can go on stage and mic up an MG or Spider II just as you can mic up a Blues JR.

Things that are important for gigging: Effects loops (verb and chorus is nice live), footswitchable channels with volumes for both (so you can balance them) this, in turn, makes gigging much easier. You don't need that shit, but its nice to have.

Apparently you're the one missing the point. Suggesting a 15w 1x10 combo over some kind of amp with an effects loop or multiple channels is pretty retarded. Anything is better for gigging than a worthless featureless combo. Unless of course all you want to do is play mildly distorted classic rock and blues.
Last edited by xxgenocide98xx at Mar 22, 2007,
#22
OMG! I never suggested he goes and buys a 15W amp damnit. All I'm saying is with access to a PA a 15W tube amp would be plenty loud enough (note: nothing mentioned about enough features, clean headroom etc) hence you don't need a half stack. I'm not suggesting the TS should buy a 15W amp, I did actually mention that in my very first post that it "obviously doesn't have to be just 15W" but you must have chosen to ignore that bit, all I'm friggin saying is volume wise a 15W tube amp would be enough to gig with, with the help of a PA.

I will now make it simple enough for a simple minded person like yourself cause you seem to be having trouble with reading.

You don't need a halfstack to gig!

There, now if you can't understand that then god help you through the rest of your life cause you're gonna need it.
Last edited by treagar at Mar 22, 2007,
#23
YEAH!!!! Or, Ah, Whatever. Its true you dont need a halfstack to gig. But, if the stage presnce is what you want, I still say go with the B-52 LG series or RX120 Randall series. I, on the other hand, don't have to mic my amp, because it is friikken loud the way it is!(Traynor YCV80 2x12, owns all Marshalls btw). Therefore, go out to Guitar Center or whatever, and ask for a good sound you could gig with.
Quote by LuthierofTexas
You have no experience with racks??? What kind of guy are you?
#24
Look, simply put...TS what genre do you play, and how much is your top budget?
#25
Quote by Hakanku
Look, simply put...TS what genre do you play, and how much is your top budget?


This will be the most important piece of information in this whole thread
#26
Treagar is taking a useless and unnecessary beating in this thread.

He's 100% right, you don't need a half stack to gig. The 15W example may not've been the best, but a 30W combo is plenty. Especially, as he says, when you have a PA to mic it into.

And Angus, tubes are nothing to be afraid of, and a halfstack will not make your penis any bigger. These are two common misconceptions with young guitarists.

You want a good Marshall-like sound, on something of a budget, that's suitable for gigs? Try out the Traynor YCV50 Blue. Great little Marshall impersonator on the crunch, and probably better cleans.

Tube amp maintenance is not a huge deal. You'll change out the tubes every couple of years or so, and once you're into it, you'll look forward to it! You'll get new advice, and pick out the tubes to help your amp get the exact sound you want. And when you replace 'em, the amp'll sound brand new! It's awesome!
You Don't Need a halfstack.

You Don't Need 100W.

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#27
wow am i sorry i ever started this thread. f@#$ what a b|tchfest. well anyway i have changed my halfstack idea after talking to my bandmates. I decided to get a marshall 100 watt head and run it into the P.A. one of my bandmates was in a band and the lead guitarist did that and it worked great. thanks for the information...well there wasnt much info mostly b|tching
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#28
wow am i sorry i ever started this thread. f@#$ what a b|tchfest. well anyway i have changed my halfstack idea after talking to my bandmates. I decided to get a marshall 100 watt head and run it into the P.A. one of my bandmates was in a band and the lead guitarist did that and it worked great. thanks for the information...well there wasnt much info mostly b|tching


If it's the MG100 head then you'll regret it for the rest of your life...it sounds bad enough through a cab, it'd be god awful going straight through the PA.

Just buy a combo, don't settle for a shitty sound just so's you can brag to your mates about having a 100 watt amp...loud shit is still shit at the end of the day.
Actually called Mark!

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#29
Lets see:
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
They wont let you use your PA there, you'd have to get it miced there, in which case you wouldn't have to buy a mic or PA or anything.
Wrong.
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
What kind of 15w amp has the kind of features to be a quality gigging amp?
Tone.
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
So, what's the point in suggesting a small useless tube amp over a small useless solid state amp for gigging.
Tone.
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
You can go on stage and mic up an MG or Spider II just as you can mic up a Blues JR.
Tone.
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
Things that are important for gigging: Effects loops (verb and chorus is nice live), footswitchable channels with volumes for both (so you can balance them) this, in turn, makes gigging much easier. You don't need that shit, but its nice to have.
What about tone?
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
Apparently you're the one missing the point. Suggesting a 15w 1x10 combo over some kind of amp with an effects loop or multiple channels is pretty retarded. Anything is better for gigging than a worthless featureless combo. Unless of course all you want to do is play mildly distorted classic rock and blues.
Hendrix turned every knob on his amp (which didn't have an effects loop) to 10 and controlled everything with his guitar. He seemed to to pretty fine.

I think you're the one missing the point. With all your talk of channels and volume and effects loops and shiny frontplates and lights and stuff you're forgetting that the amp should actually sound good. Who gives a shit if an amp has 20 channels if they all sound crap. The most important thing about an amp is what it sounds like, that's the difference between an MG15 and a BJ.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
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#30
Quote by xifr

I think you're the one missing the point. With all your talk of channels and volume and effects loops and shiny frontplates and lights and stuff you're forgetting that the amp should actually sound good. Who gives a shit if an amp has 20 channels if they all sound crap. The most important thing about an amp is what it sounds like, that's the difference between an MG15 and a BJ.


i can only agree with what jinskee said

Don't Question the X...he's always right

Whodicted



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#31
Quote by xifr
The most important thing about an amp is what it sounds like, that's the difference between an MG15 and a BJ.


also a BJ is much more enjoyable
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#32
Ahck, TS is a lost hope, theres no point trying to convince him otherwise.

When he finally realises that his tone = shite if running through the soundboard of venues (which lets face it, he probably will have the marshall mg100 head) he will be back for advise, hopefully that time we wont have 12 year old twunts that think because you have a bigger (size and wattage) amp that you automatically look cooler.
#33
Quote by xifr
Lets see:
Wrong.
Tone.
Tone.
Tone.
What about tone?
Hendrix turned every knob on his amp (which didn't have an effects loop) to 10 and controlled everything with his guitar. He seemed to to pretty fine.

I think you're the one missing the point. With all your talk of channels and volume and effects loops and shiny frontplates and lights and stuff you're forgetting that the amp should actually sound good. Who gives a shit if an amp has 20 channels if they all sound crap. The most important thing about an amp is what it sounds like, that's the difference between an MG15 and a BJ.

*high fives xifr for wailing on xxgenocide98xx, which is a really wierd username in the first place, and for saying exactly what I wanted to*
#34
Quote by xifr
Lets see:
Wrong.
.

actually hes right, ive never played at a venue that lets you use your PA if they have a house PA, unless you really need it for like synths or something.

and have you ever gigged with a 15 watt combo before? in say a 500 person venue?
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#35
Quote by Kid_Thorazine
actually hes right, ive never played at a venue that lets you use your PA if they have a house PA, unless you really need it for like synths or something.
That's obviously dependant on venue, but a lot will let you.

Quote by Kid_Thorazine
and have you ever gigged with a 15 watt combo before? in say a 500 person venue?
Nope, but I have a friend who constantly gigs a Cube 15 or 30. Maybe not a 500 person venue, but ~300. He's also done outdoor gigs with the same amp.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
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#36
most venues wont let you, or will discourage it, because its a major pain in the ass for the venues sound people to work with getting another PA set up when they already have one.

and with the cune, does he mic it or does he run the line out to the PA? if you have a loud band and you mi small amp like that you would get so much bleed through from everything else on stage it would sound horrible.
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#37
Quote by xifr
Lets see:
Wrong.


How am I wrong? I've NEVER played a venue with a house PA
that will let you use your own. Hell, I've never even BEEN
to a venue with a house PA that will let you use your own.
So in my relative experience being 7~ years of going to
gigs recreationally and gigging, I've never seen ONE that
will let you play your own PA.
So, as far as I'm concerned, unless you've found the point
one percentile and you REALLY want to split hairs...You
basically aren't ever going to find a venue that wants to
let you drag your own PA in and set it up for use during
YOUR set. That's right, because the sound tech really wants
to unplug everything he's got, set up -your- PA, mic your
equipment to -your- PA, plug -your- pa into HIS (house)
board, and then become accustomed to how shitty your PA is
compared to the house equipment while he tries to get
decent levels from your equipment?

Ok, I'll admit, that's highly rational. Nevermind me, then.


Tone.
Tone.
Tone.
What about tone?
Hendrix turned every knob on his amp (which didn't have an

effects loop) to 10 and controlled everything with his
guitar. He seemed to to pretty fine.
I think you're the one missing the point. With all
your talk of channels and volume and effects loops and
shiny frontplates and lights and stuff you're forgetting
that the amp should actually sound good. Who gives
a shit if an amp has 20 channels if they all sound
crap
. The most important thing about an amp is what it
sounds like, that's the difference between an MG15
and a BJ.


A 15w 1 channel tube combo meant for playing clean to light
rock is not a solution for someone who is looking for a
giggable amp.

No matter WHAT you say, I wasn't arguing about tone.
Functionality. Its something VERY important in gigging.

My talk about channels, volume, effects loops and shiny
front plates with lights and stuff is VERY important and it
is VERY to the point. You can GET all of that and still have
good tone.

I wasn't saying buy a Spider, because that's ****ing stupid, but retarded replies like

"OMFG DONT GET *larger SS amp that isn't that bad here* get A BLUES JUNIOR BECAUSE ITS TUBE"

are completely retarded and useless. If you REALLY want to think you served me, go ahead and pat yourself on the back. To be entirely honest, you didn't really make any headway.

My point, which is what you missed, is that suggesting a pointless and futilely weak and pathetic amplifier is a bad idea regardless of if its tube or not. People coming in here and snobbing up a thread because they think their 15w hunk of junk TUBE amp is better than someone's 15w hunk of junk SOLID STATE amp is just ****ing retarded.

An amp is not the answer because it has tubes. Sorry. You can't just come into a thread and say "Tube Amp" "Blues Junior" etc and have the thread be the slightest bit helpful.

Incase you are BLIND, I already suggested a LARGER tube amp, which would be a much more reasonable suggestion for gigging than a stupid **** Blues Junior.

Learn to play at the internets, Mr Mod.
#38
To get back on track (double post because its not long enough to accept my 5 page long posts) I'll go back to the OP.


Quote by angusyoung_sg
so i really want to get a marshall halfstack but i do have a lower end budget so im thinking of getting a used one. i was just wondering what a cab and head in decent shape thats only maybe a few years old would approximately cost me? i was also wondering if most marshall heads are tube. i am a little afraid of buying a tube head because if the tubes are old and in bad shape i wont be able to tell and then i will end up having to pay alot more money to replace the tubes. not to mention i would have to replace them later on. so i was kind of steering away from a tube head. what are my choices? and if i have to get a tube head what are signs to look for that will tell me if the tubes are in need of replacing. also what is a good cabinet to look for.
P.S. i am planning on buying the amp and cab seperately


Not all marshall half stacks are expensive. To buy the signature, traditional MARSHALL tone, you're going to have to buy a tube amp.

The good thing is you can buy used, which will save you a great deal of money. The main worry in buying a used amp really isn't quality, IE, marshalls are built like tanks and they're pretty hard to just out and out break, its moreso the condition of the tubes.

Generally, you have to replace the tubes in a well used amp only once every couple of years for poweramp tubes, and usually about once every year and a half to two years for preamp tubes. This is if the amp is used regularly (several times a week) for the entire span. So obviously if you only bust it out once a week or less you wont have to replace them as often.

Signs of worn tubes will basically be alot of feedback, alot of hiss or hum coming from the amp and a generally dull tone.

Now as far as marshalls go they range in $500 (minimum) to around $1500 used. You can get anything from a modern marshall to a vintage amp for that price.

If you're looking for an AC/DC-esque tone, a JCM 800 should cover it. You can pick them up for around $800 +shipping for the head. I've seen some JCM 800 1x12 combos go for relatively cheap lately, too.. around $600+ shipping. A used marshall 4x12 cab can be picked up for $350 or more depending on the location, condition, etc. A 1960 or matching JCM cab is the most affordable solution.

that SHOULD be in a step in the right direction. If you want more help you're going to have to tell the forumgoers what kind of tone you're looking for.
#39
Quote by xxgenocide98xx
How am I wrong? I've NEVER played a venue with a house PA
that will let you use your own. Hell, I've never even BEEN
to a venue with a house PA that will let you use your own.
So in my relative experience being 7~ years of going to
gigs recreationally and gigging, I've never seen ONE that
will let you play your own PA.
So, as far as I'm concerned, unless you've found the point
one percentile and you REALLY want to split hairs...You
basically aren't ever going to find a venue that wants to
let you drag your own PA in and set it up for use during
YOUR set. That's right, because the sound tech really wants
to unplug everything he's got, set up -your- PA, mic your
equipment to -your- PA, plug -your- pa into HIS (house)
board, and then become accustomed to how shitty your PA is
compared to the house equipment while he tries to get
decent levels from your equipment?

Ok, I'll admit, that's highly rational. Nevermind me, then.

You don't unplug their speakers and plug in your pa, you bring your own stuff, such as mixer and all, so that you essentially are running sound. Many bands will do this so they don't have to worry about having a shithouse sound guy.
A 15w 1 channel tube combo meant for playing clean to light
rock is not a solution for someone who is looking for a
giggable amp.

No matter WHAT you say, I wasn't arguing about tone.
Functionality. Its something VERY important in gigging.

My talk about channels, volume, effects loops and shiny
front plates with lights and stuff is VERY important and it
is VERY to the point. You can GET all of that and still have
good tone.

I wasn't saying buy a Spider, because that's ****ing stupid, but retarded replies like

"OMFG DONT GET *larger SS amp that isn't that bad here* get A BLUES JUNIOR BECAUSE ITS TUBE"

are completely retarded and useless. If you REALLY want to think you served me, go ahead and pat yourself on the back. To be entirely honest, you didn't really make any headway.

My point, which is what you missed, is that suggesting a pointless and futilely weak and pathetic amplifier is a bad idea regardless of if its tube or not. People coming in here and snobbing up a thread because they think their 15w hunk of junk TUBE amp is better than someone's 15w hunk of junk SOLID STATE amp is just ****ing retarded.

An amp is not the answer because it has tubes. Sorry. You can't just come into a thread and say "Tube Amp" "Blues Junior" etc and have the thread be the slightest bit helpful.

Incase you are BLIND, I already suggested a LARGER tube amp, which would be a much more reasonable suggestion for gigging than a stupid **** Blues Junior.

Learn to play at the internets, Mr Mod.

Dude, chill. Seriously, getting all defensive doesn't help, considering that popular opinion seems to be against you anyway.

I have an amplifier with 4 channels, plenty of wattage and shiny knobs. Out of those channels I generally only use 1. Maybe a second in a couple songs. I rarely turn the master volume past around 1 (that's with the preamp cranked), and I don't use the effects loop. Now I know that you're going to come out and say 'oh, that's just you', however, I will say that your thing about channels and stuff is just you.

You're also forgetting your original contention, which is that if the amp is only going to be a featurelss 15 watts, you may aswell go for a crappy SS amp (MG) than a good sounding tube amp. Yes my friend, this is an argument about tone, no matter what you say. I've given examples of small amps being used effectively in large venues, and all you've done is ranted your own personal view with little evidence to back it up.

While it can be nice to have all the extra buttons and volume of a large, expensive tube amp at your disposal, its not necessary, especially considering you're probably gonna get miked anyway.
"A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment." - Frank Zappa
Quote by Jinskee
Don't question the X.
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#40
Quote by xifr
You don't unplug their speakers and plug in your pa, you bring your own stuff, such as mixer and all, so that you essentially are running sound. Many bands will do this so they don't have to worry about having a shithouse sound guy.
y.


that would still require displacing thier PA then you would have to break all of your crap down in order for the next band to go on. I know lots of bands that tour, and none of them bring thier own PA along because venues wont let you use them, unless you really need one for like a synth rack or something.
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