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#1
does anyone else get un-believably annoyed at well-produced, manufactured, poser black metal bands
such as
dark funeral, dimmu borgir and cradle of filth.

what is happening to black metal?
its becoming mainstream which defeats the whole object.

techinically, these bands aren't even black metal anyway as the dont ft the conventions of the genre. they're more, extreme nu-metal

and

did you know
poland have banned black metal, and any other form of music that promotes satanism (for those of you who do not know, this isn't devil worship or the worship of any other diety) from performing live anywhere in poland

and

of the whole 2007 gorgoroth european tour they're only making 2 uk shows?
#3
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#4
Quote by Black-Metal
does anyone else get un-believably annoyed at well-produced, manufactured, poser black metal bands


No.


and

did you know
poland have banned black metal, and any other form of music that promotes satanism (for those of you who do not know, this isn't devil worship or the worship of any other diety) from performing live anywhere in poland


It was on the main page of the site, can't see how people could miss it.


and

of the whole 2007 gorgoroth european tour they're only making 2 uk shows?


Yeah, wouldn't want them to become too mainstream by playing too many shows. Gotta stay gr1m and tr00.
#5
Lucky Poland
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Originally Posted by shreddin_frets
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#6
Quote by Black-Metal
does anyone else get un-believably annoyed at well-produced, manufactured, poser black metal bands
such as
dark funeral, dimmu borgir and cradle of filth.

what is happening to black metal?
its becoming mainstream which defeats the whole object.

techinically, these bands aren't even black metal anyway as the dont ft the conventions of the genre. they're more, extreme nu-metal


I kind of agree with what you're saying but I still love me some Dimmu and Dark Funeral. I don't really get annoyed with the fact that it's well produced but I think it has lost it's meaning. Real black metal died in the 90's I believe. Yes, their still are bands that keep tradition alive but it's not nearly as wide spread.
FAN OF EMPEROR ?

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#7
noone cares. i hate black metal. its just noise really, and this is coming from a metalhead. Like i hate saying that about music, but i'll listen to rap over black metal. Hell, ill listen to Maroon 5 and Coldplay(who i hate more than anything) over black metal, most extreme death metal, and **** like that. And if ur wondering, My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth. I lke heavy, but it has to have some melody , good vocals, and creative guitar work, or else its nothing new, or really musical. You cant pick out notes, it just sounds like loud noise covered by some guy doing some "corpse-grinder" vocals over, which arent even vocals to me. Its actually sort of funny. So no, i dont care about your stupid black metal complaints.
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#8
dude quit with this true black metal elitist crap. just cause you listen to ultra cultist black metal from the coldest regions of norway it doesnt make you cool, tough or metal it just makes you a close minded metal elitist who wants all his favorite bands to sound like **** and play a club with like 3 people there. COF and dimmu arent black metal anyways. Black Metal has been banned because of the actions toward christianity and semitism and there is an inteview with Gaahl from gorgoroth where he says that their music is fueled and inspired by satan so it was only a matter of time before it was banned just like cannibal corpse album covers are banned in places like australia. although i dont believe it should be banned i also dont believe that they should cause social distortion with their actions, and dont try and come up with new sub-genres to apply to the bands that you dont believe are true. Its people like you that come up with all those sub-genres like extreme nu-thrash metal core. just listen to your bands that are mainstream in the underground and be happy with that. no offense just my opinion of course
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#9
^x2^ lolz


I couldn't give two shits about BM having good production if a band feels that that better production would benefit themselves, by all means they should use it. I don't think any band says 'OMG! We shud totallee have good productionz so wee can b teh mainstreamz!' They know their fanbase top well. I feel sorry for anybody who passes up a quality BM release because it has good production.
#10
did you know
poland have banned black metal, and any other form of music that promotes satanism (for those of you who do not know, this isn't devil worship or the worship of any other diety) from performing live anywhere in poland

Wrong, fool. Some Catholic organization wants to, though, but nothing is actually banned.
لا إله إلا الله محمد رسول الله
#11
Quote by LynchMobster
noone cares. i hate black metal. its just noise really, and this is coming from a metalhead. Like i hate saying that about music, but i'll listen to rap over black metal. Hell, ill listen to Maroon 5 and Coldplay(who i hate more than anything) over black metal, most extreme death metal, and **** like that. And if ur wondering, My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth. I lke heavy, but it has to have some melody , good vocals, and creative guitar work, or else its nothing new, or really musical. You cant pick out notes, it just sounds like loud noise covered by some guy doing some "corpse-grinder" vocals over, which arent even vocals to me. Its actually sort of funny. So no, i dont care about your stupid black metal complaints.

umm....

I think you should take a look at duncang's post...that's all I'm going to say to respond to this.
#12
Yeah I have to agree i hate how a lot of bm is going mainstream.
but there is a solution my friend:


1349
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#13
Quote by LynchMobster
noone cares. i hate black metal. its just noise really, and this is coming from a metalhead. Like i hate saying that about music, but i'll listen to rap over black metal. Hell, ill listen to Maroon 5 and Coldplay(who i hate more than anything) over black metal, most extreme death metal, and **** like that. And if ur wondering, My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth. I lke heavy, but it has to have some melody , good vocals, and creative guitar work, or else its nothing new, or really musical. You cant pick out notes, it just sounds like loud noise covered by some guy doing some "corpse-grinder" vocals over, which arent even vocals to me. Its actually sort of funny. So no, i dont care about your stupid black metal complaints.


Was it Varg that said that you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera? At first I couldn't stand it either, I tried listening to Gorgoroth and stuff, and just like you I ignorantly considered it ''just noise''. By now I've grown to love it, I love everything about it, mostly the unique atmospheres it has which I can't really find in most other genres apart from Dark Ambient etc.

You've actually proved yourself to be quite an effing idiot regarding your ignorant comments which I won't actually bother responding to.

P.S. Right now I'm listening to Ulver's Nattens Madrigal, great stuff
#14
Your a tool. Music dosent have to sound like a wall of fuzz and treble to be black metal.
#15
Limbonic Art = well produced to the core. And it's still black metal, and good black metal at that.

Emperor = well produced, good black metal.

Anomalies, anyone?
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#16
Pff, if it's well produced, all the better.

The nasal treblesaw is not the mark of good black metal.
Get baked, study theory.

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Why are you bringing Cm into this?
#17
What makes a band "true"?
Crappy production, members killing eachother, burning churches etc?
I think that most people that complains about black metal not being true enough doesn't have a clue what makes a band "true" in the first place.
Last edited by Guitarmike123 at Jun 30, 2007,
#18
I can understand where you are coming from, but if you search, there are still plenty of true black metal bands out there.
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but not,

I hope,
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Vi doede ikke... vi har aldri levd
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Civilization is unnatural

It is a whim of circumstance
an unenlightened one
#19
The thing is black metal elitists are tired of all these black metal bands becoming "mainstream" or well known and they would prefer that black metal remains underground only for the true black metal fans. Those who know and listen to black metal know that there are over 67267268268x black metal bands and that there are ****loads of great underproduced, or raw, or atmospheric black metal bands out there. The fact that you do not know them and get stuck with Dark Funeral, Dimmu, CoF or other well known bands probably means that you need to listen to more black metal and discover other great bands.
I'm entitled to double post, so fück off!!!
#20
*sigh*

Once again, elitists bithcing about how their genre is getting more coverage...when will it end?

If you like a band, you are helping towards them getting more coverage so if you want to save your precious little underground bands there is but one solution.

Don't listen to them.
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#21
Quote by LynchMobster
noone cares. i hate black metal. its just noise really, and this is coming from a metalhead. Like i hate saying that about music, but i'll listen to rap over black metal. Hell, ill listen to Maroon 5 and Coldplay(who i hate more than anything) over black metal, most extreme death metal, and **** like that. And if ur wondering, My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth. I lke heavy, but it has to have some melody , good vocals, and creative guitar work, or else its nothing new, or really musical. You cant pick out notes, it just sounds like loud noise covered by some guy doing some "corpse-grinder" vocals over, which arent even vocals to me. Its actually sort of funny. So no, i dont care about your stupid black metal complaints.

Oh lord, you don't know what noise is if you think black and death metal are noise.

Learn up.
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#22
Quote by LynchMobster
My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth.


Wow! I never would have guessed a 'classic' "metalhead" bashing black metal? NO WAIIIII!!!!!


Threadstarter:


...


Last.fm

WE ARE THE MUSIC MAKERS
AND WE ARE THE DREAMERS OF THE DREAMS
Last edited by Dirtydeeds468 at Jun 30, 2007,
#23
Quote by LynchMobster
noone cares. i hate black metal. its just noise really, and this is coming from a metalhead. Like i hate saying that about music, but i'll listen to rap over black metal. Hell, ill listen to Maroon 5 and Coldplay(who i hate more than anything) over black metal, most extreme death metal, and **** like that. And if ur wondering, My fave bands are metallica, alice in chains, iron maiden, tool, and megadeth. I lke heavy, but it has to have some melody , good vocals, and creative guitar work, or else its nothing new, or really musical. You cant pick out notes, it just sounds like loud noise covered by some guy doing some "corpse-grinder" vocals over, which arent even vocals to me. Its actually sort of funny. So no, i dont care about your stupid black metal complaints.


**** off, You are an ignorant piece of **** that has probably listened to a couple black metal bands.
#24
Was it Varg that said that you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera? QUOTE]
That's pretty dumb. Opera doesn't make babies cry, it doesn't send people into violent frenzies where they have to beat each other up to enjoy it, it doesn't make teenage boys wear only black and forget about personal hygene. BM is occasionally fun, but be realistic. It's not training the ear, it's a complete detatchment from what your ears tell you that makes BM sound good.
#25
Quote by bobslip
Was it Varg that said that you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera? QUOTE]
That's pretty dumb. Opera doesn't make babies cry, it doesn't send people into violent frenzies where they have to beat each other up to enjoy it, it doesn't make teenage boys wear only black and forget about personal hygene. BM is occasionally fun, but be realistic. It's not training the ear, it's a complete detatchment from what your ears tell you that makes BM sound good.


You also have no idea what the hell you are talking about, listen to some black metal then you may open your mouth till then shut up.
#26
Quote by bobslip
Was it Varg that said that you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera? QUOTE]
That's pretty dumb. Opera doesn't make babies cry, it doesn't send people into violent frenzies where they have to beat each other up to enjoy it, it doesn't make teenage boys wear only black and forget about personal hygene. BM is occasionally fun, but be realistic. It's not training the ear, it's a complete detatchment from what your ears tell you that makes BM sound good.


Hooooooooooooooooly shit.

That post...was fucking hilarious.

Please, keep making more of them. I haven't laughed that hard in a while.
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WE ARE THE MUSIC MAKERS
AND WE ARE THE DREAMERS OF THE DREAMS
#27
Meh. There's so many different types of black metal, it doesnt really matter to me. Why must so many people think "The ****tier I sound, the more hardcore I am (or gr1m and tr00 in this case)"

Under produced stuff has its place, but doesnt make a band black metal.
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#28
A good show of black metal was like venom they were black metal they inbodyed it man and immortal too and i kno there are more....there are alot of black metal bands that are stillcarrying black metal with very hard work on ther backs while lack(black Metal wanna-bes)metal bands like cradle and dimu are sneaking on the carry item with is black metal.....i bet they are goign to be the metallica of black metal soon
#29
Quote by ZootCst

That's pretty dumb. Opera doesn't make babies cry, it doesn't send people into violent frenzies where they have to beat each other up to enjoy it, it doesn't make teenage boys wear only black and forget about personal hygene. BM is occasionally fun, but be realistic. It's not training the ear, it's a complete detatchment from what your ears tell you that makes BM sound good.


You're sounding like an idiot here.

Many people like black metal because it sounds raw and chaotic, but that doesn't mean it's just loud noise good just for "fun sometimes...". A lot of black metal songs are technically interesting and compelx compositions and there are certainly many interesting melodic aspects to the music. Case in point, Black Seeds on virgin Soil by Old Man's Child or I am the Black Wizards by Emperor.

Also no one said anything about beating people up to enjoy it, and I don't know anyone who's ever been sent into a violent frenzy by any kind of music...

And to the threadstarter, just ecasue it's well-produced doesn't mean it's not black metal or made by posers. Newer Immortal is well-produced..are immortal psoers? FAIL
Last edited by flame843 at Jun 30, 2007,
#30
Quote by bobslip
Was it Varg that said that you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera? QUOTE]
That's pretty dumb. Opera doesn't make babies cry, it doesn't send people into violent frenzies where they have to beat each other up to enjoy it, it doesn't make teenage boys wear only black and forget about personal hygene. BM is occasionally fun, but be realistic. It's not training the ear, it's a complete detatchment from what your ears tell you that makes BM sound good.


I'm sorry, but how the hell did you get the idea that he was comparing the lifestyles and effects that black metal had on people to those of opera by saying ''you have to train the ear to listen to black metal, similarly to opera''?
#31
This thread is full of ignotant pieces of **** that need look up more than one band and stop generalising, stupid ****s.
#32
Quote by Dirtydeeds468
Wow! I never would have guessed a 'classic' "metalhead" bashing black metal? NO WAIIIII!!!!!


those are just my faves. I like some heavier stuff like slayer, mastodon, in flames, shadows fall, , KSE, down, pantera, and a bunch more.

in fact i like on black metal band, but they aren't considered "true" . some say its melodic death metal. i dont really know what it is. But its good. Not great, but i like them. Why? They are musical. THe know how to use melody along with their heaivness. The vocalist is actually that, and can sing in a good clean along with the screaming. they have a pretty good guitarist.

And with most(im saying most, becuase im sure there are exceptions) "true" black (and this goes for most death, but not melodic death metal) really only contain musical talent in the form of a drummer. guitarist are usually decent, some times sh|tty and sometimes really good. THe bassist you cant hear, so it doesnt really matter. And the "singer" lacks any form of talent at all.
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Last edited by LynchMobster at Jun 30, 2007,
#33
Quote by flame843
Case in point, Black Seeds on virgin Soil by Old Man's Child or I am the Black Wizards by Emperor.


Thanks, that's actually constructive. I'll look into it.

For the most part, I was just having fun with my last post because of the comparison to opera. I listen more to thrash and industrial metal than black, but I do have a bass student who is a black metal maniac, so I listen to the stuff he likes to help him learn and I've been a fan of Dimmu Borgir for awhile. I'm very impressed by the rhythmic complexity of metal in its varied forms so I wouldn't say it's not musical, just more chaotic.
#34
Quote by LynchMobster
those are just my faves. I like some heavier stuff like slayer, mastodon, in flames, shadows fall, , KSE, down, pantera, and a bunch more.

in fact i like on black metal band, but they aren't considered "true" . some say its melodic death metal. i dont really know what it is. But its good. Not great, but i like them. Why? They are musical. THe know how to use melody along with their heaivness. The vocalist is actually that, and can sing in a good clean along with the screaming. they have a pretty good guitarist.

And with most(im saying most, becuase im sure there are exceptions) "true" black (and this goes for most death, but not melodic death metal) really only contain musical talent in the form of a drummer. guitarist are usually decent, some times sh|tty and sometimes really good. THe bassist you cant hear, so it doesnt really matter. And the "singer" lacks any form of talent at all.


Uh. And KSE are brilliant musicians?

Seriously, what does technicality and musicianship have to do with how good a band is?
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#35
Man go listen to Vesperian Sorrow, or Tvangeste, and then you will understand that well produced black metal is just as good as your "true" black metal.
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#36
I think LynchMobster should be banished from the metal forum. Im pretty sure that you should have at least some idea of what you are talking about before you open your mouth.
And to TS: There are plenty of great BM bands with good production. ie. Limbonic Art and Drudkh - if you cant appreciate those 2 bands, then I dont know whats wrong with you. ****ty production can be good (ie. Filosofem by Burzum) but its so overdone nowadays that it is seriously more of a poser-like thing to do rather than have good production quality.
#38
Oh god....


First of all, search, and you will find yourself plenty.

Second of all, it's obvious that if it weren't for Dimmu's faggoth promo pics and the fact that they're getting recognition, nobody would give a ****. Obviously there are the asshole fans who like it because it's cool and don't know what the hell they're talking about, then there are genuine people who like Dimmu's music (like me), who have heard a fair bit of metal to determine what is good and what is not.

Third off, again, it helps if you know what you're talking about. A minority group can speak louder than the majority on the behalf of the whole, because people are twats who like to generalize and sit there inside their coccoon convincing themselves things that aren't true.

And four....get a life.
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#39
I like Black metal a bit raw, but i hate it when its so unproduced it sounds like it has been recorded in a garden shed and is so unashamedly grumby that it probably hasn't washed since Aerosmith headlined Download.
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Indeed.
#40
Well produced Black Metal is some of the best music out there,

Behemoth, Keep of Kalessin, Dødheimsgaard, Newer Immortal stuff, Gorgoroth's newer stuff etc etc.
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