#1
can anyone point me in the direction of a good site that i can start learning on?
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#3
can you afford a teacher? thats your probably best and quickest way to learn. this site actually isn't that bad considering it's free.
#4
no
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#6
To a shredder, a second is a long time.

Member of the UG Gentlemen of Higher Thought Establishment.

Invite only, if you want to be considered, contribute well to UG, and respect others as much as possible!
#7
i learned some basic stuff and i just printed out some blank sheet music and wrote out a c major scale, i then used powertab to check it by typing it in the tab part and seeing if it was correct in standard notation, i did this again with a c minor scale, but i noticed on the standard notation part that on the descending c minor none of the sharps or flats were on the notes and it put a "natural" sign next to the G. could someone explain this to me?
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#8
In music notation, an accidental (sharp/flat) is maintained for the whole bar on any of the notes it affects. This is why accidentals are not needed on Cm descending. I couldn't tell you why G is natural, normally there is no Gb in C minor... It shouldn't write out C minor with sharps, they should be flats, since it's the relative minor of Eb major, which has no sharps, only flats.
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#9
man... this would be a lot easier if i had someone in person haha

EDIT: in the key signature, does it matter whether you use sharps or flats? i always find myself going to sharps lol
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
Last edited by C.C. Deville at Jul 2, 2007,
#10
Quote by C.C. Deville
man... this would be a lot easier if i had someone in person haha

EDIT: in the key signature, does it matter whether you use sharps or flats? i always find myself going to sharps lol

i tend to do that also. but in keys such as f major(f g a Bb c d e) you dont say f g a A# c d e because it's diatonic and not chromatic. same thing with g major ( g a b c d e f#) you dont say g a b c d e gb g because its diatonic
To a shredder, a second is a long time.

Member of the UG Gentlemen of Higher Thought Establishment.

Invite only, if you want to be considered, contribute well to UG, and respect others as much as possible!
#11
Quote by C.C. Deville
man... this would be a lot easier if i had someone in person haha

EDIT: in the key signature, does it matter whether you use sharps or flats? i always find myself going to sharps lol


YES! In fact there is a standard way to write the key signature for each key, that not only takes into account whether to use flats or sharps, but also which order they are written starting from the left of the clef to the end of the key signature.

The reason is that in any scale, all the note letters must be used, with any accidentals.
Consider the Fmajor scale. You can write it as:

F A Bb C D E F

which is the correct way, or you can write it as:

F A A# C D E F

This is incorrect, because you are using A twice, and not using B. Imagine using that key signature in a piece, and then you go on and write an A note in your sheet. How is a person reading the music supposed to know whether its an A or an A#? So you must always use each letter once and only once, with the necessary accidentals to trasform it to the proper scale.

As I said each scale has a very specific key signature, with a very specific way of writing it, and its either using flats or sharps. Half of all scales use sharps, and half use flats.

the sharp scales are:
G major
D major
A major
E major
B major
F# major
C# major

the flat scales are:
F major
Bb major
Eb major
Ab major
Db major
Gb major
Cb major

with C major having no sharps or flats.

To find the key signature of the minor scales you use the one of its relative major.
#12
this was origanally posted ina different thread that i made from

Tsunoyukami

he ehlped me learn this stuff i thought it would be easier to post in this thread in stead of link cause there is fighting in other thread


!WARNING! This post is long.

I personally have never found the circle of fifths to appeal to me - I've never really fully applied it to anything and I personally feel that it's not all that useful.

However, I do reccommend learning it anyways, just in case it's useful to you.


I don't quite understand your second question either, but a good place to start would be learning Major and Minor scales and how they are formed. Just before I explain that, I would like show you the difference between a semi tone (or half tone) and a whole tone.


What are Whole Tones and Half Tones?


Code:

Example #1

e|
B|
G|
D|
A|
E|0-1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12

The open E string (when in standard tuning) creates the note E. For each fret you go up, the notes change by a semi-tone. In Example #1 above the notes (in order) are as follows ('#' is pronounced 'sharp'; 'b' is pronounced 'flat'):


Code:

E, F, F#, G, G#, A, A#, B, C, C#, D, D#, E

OR

E, F, Gb, G, Ab, A, Bb, B, C, Db, D, Eb, E


Code:

This is known as the chromatic scale As you can see, some notes have alternate names:

F# and Gb (2nd fret on the E string)
G# and Ab (4th fret on the E string)
A# and Bb (6th fret on the E string)
C# and Db (9th fret on the E string)
D# and Eb (11th fret on the E string)

The distance from one note to the next (one fret) is called a semi (or half) tone. If you go two frets higher than the previous fret, that is known as a whole tone (see
Example #2):


Code:

Example #2

This is a half tone:

e|----|
B|----|
G|----|
D|----|
A|----|
E|2-3-|


This is a whole tone:

e|----|
B|----|
G|----|
D|----|
A|----|
E|2-4-|

Before you continue reading it is important that you understand the difference between a half tone and a whole tone.


Major and Minor Scales

All scales (that will be discussed in this post) contain seven different notes (a total of eight notes) and each ntoe is named after the next consecutive letter (between A and G).

The major scale and minor scale , however, follow slightly different patterns in the construction of them. First, we will look at the major scale.


Code:

Example #3

e|----------------|
B|----------------|
G|----------2-4-5-|
D|----2-3-5-------|
A|3-5-------------|
E|----------------|

That is the C Major scale. It is comprosed of the notes:

C D E F G A B C

As you can see, there are seven different notes (the C is repeating, and therefore is not considered a 'different' note) and they ascend in alphabetical order starting at C.

If you look at the chormatic scale, and rearrange it so that it begins with C instead (the bold notes are in the C Major Scale):


Code:

C, C#, D, D#, E, F, F#, G, G#, A, A#, B, C

OR

C, Db, D, Eb, E, F, Gb, G, Ab, A, Bb, B, C

You can see the following pattern:


Code:

C -> D (whole tone)
D -> E (whole tone)
E -> F (half tone)
F -> G (whole tone)
G -> A (whole tone)
A -> B (whole tone)
B -> C (half tone)

Therefore, the pattern for the major scale is whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half.

If you do follow this pattern starting on any other root, you will get the major scale (of that root).


Practice:
Try creating major scales, such as A Major, D Major, F Major, Bb Major.


Now we will continue with the minor scale.


Code:

Example #4

For the sake of simplicity, I will do the A Minor scale (because it has not #'s or b's):

e|----------------|
B|----------------|
G|------------0-2-|
D|------0-2-3-----|
A|0-2-3-----------|
E|----------------|

That is the A Minor scale. It is comprosed of the notes:

A B C D E F G A

As you can see, there are seven different notes (the A is repeating, and therefore is not considered a 'different' note) and they ascend in alphabetical order starting at A.

If you look at the chormatic scale, and rearrange it so that it begins with A instead (the bold notes are in the A Minor Scale):


Code:

A, A#, B, C, C#, D, D#, E, F, F#, G, G#, A

OR

A, Bb, B, C, Db, D, Eb, E, F, Gb, G, Ab, A

You can see the following pattern:


Code:

A -> B (whole tone)
B -> C (half tone)
C -> D (whole tone)
D -> E (whole tone)
E -> F (half tone)
F -> G (whole tone)
G -> A (whole tone)

Therefore, the pattern for the minor scale is whole, half, whole, whole, half, whole, whole.

If you do follow this pattern starting on any other root, you will get the minor scale (of that root).


Practice:
Try creating minor scales, such as C minor, B minor, E Minor and F# Minor.


Now that you understand both the major and minor scales we can continue and explore intervals and chord construction.


Intervals

At this point, it is important to understand intervals in relation to a key. I will continue to use C Major for the sake of simplicity.


Code:

Example #5

Each note in a scale is numbered in relation to the root.

C Major

C D E F G A B C
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

This can continue up (how you get 9ths, 13ths, etc.):

C D E F G A B C D E F G A B C
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15

As you can see, 8 is the same note as 1, 9 is the same note as 2 and so on.

Chords are created from various intervals. When speaking in proper terms we would call each of these the following:

C = perfect prime (perfect root)
D = major second
E = major third
F = perfect fourth
G = perfect fifth
A = major sixth
B = major seventh
C = perfect octave

As you can see, the first, fourth, fifth and octave (eigth) are perfect, while the
second, third, sixth and seventh are major. However, sometimes we
augment (sharpen) or diminish (flatten) various notes in chords:

C = perfect prime (perfect root) OR diminished second
C#/Db = augmented prime (augmented root) OR minor second
D = major second OR diminished third
D#/Eb = augmented second OR minor third
E = major third ORdiminished fourth
F = perfect fourth ORaugmented third
F#/Gb = augmented fourth OR diminished fifth
G = perfect fifth OR diminished sixth
G#/Ab = augmented fifth OR minor sixth
A = major sixth OR diminished seventh
A#/Bb = augmented sixth ORminor seventh
B = major seventh OR diminished octave
C = perfect octave OR diminished ninth

This pattern also continues.

!IMPORTANT!

Perfect notes become 'diminished' when the pitch is dropped one half-tone (ie. F
down to E = diminished fourth) while major notes become 'minor' when dropped one
half-tone (ie. B down to A#/Bb = minor seventh) and are considered 'diminished'
when they are dropped two semtones (ie. B down to A = diminished seventh.

When any note is raised by one semi-tone, it is considered 'augmented' (ie. D up to D# = augmented second).


Chord Construction

Before we continue, it is important that you understand intervals. All chords are made up of intervals and different intervals result in different sounds.

If you understand intervals, it should be very easy to understand chord construction. Different chords (such as major 7th, minor 9th, augmented, sixth) have different formulas.


Code:

Let me start by explaining the forumlas for simple chords.

A major chord is composed of three different notes: the perfect root (1), major third (3) and perfect fifth (5).

A minor chord is composed of three different notes: the perfect root (1), minor third (also written: b3) and perfect fifth (5).

When you see an interval alone (ie. 4), you assume that it is major or perfect (depending on what interval it is). If you see the number written as 'b3' you then call it minor or diminished (depending on whether it would be perfect or major narturally.


Code:

Example #6

Here we will learn more about the formation of basic chords.

Major: 1 3 5
Minor: 1 b3 5
(Dominant) 7th: 1 3 5 b7
Major 7th: 1 3 5 7
Minor 7th: 1 b3 5 b7

If we continue to use the C Major Scale we can match the intervals with the notes (let me refresh your memory):

C D E F G A B C
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

If we use this information, we can discover that the C Major chord is composed of the notes C, E and G (1, 3 and 5, respectively).

C Major: C E G
C Minor: C Eb G
C (Dominant) 7th: C E G Bb
C Major 7th: C E G B
C Minor 7th: C Eb G Bb


All the information given above can be used in a similar fashion to create much more complex chords. Below is a list of formulas for various chords (not all).

Code:

Any part of a chord name in brackets may not be pronounced (depending on the individual). Any interval in brackets is a note that does not have to be in the chord.

Also, in the "Diminished 7th" chord, the 7 is supposed to be written as bb7 - that is not a typo.

Major: 1 3 5
Minor: 1 b3 5
Suspended 2nd: 1 2 5
Suspended 4th: 1 4 5
Augmented: 1 3 #5
Diminished: 1 b3 b5
5th (also known as a Power Chord): 1 5 (8)
6th: 1 3 (5) 6
(Dominant) 7th: 1 3 (5) b7
Major 7th: 1 3 (5) 7
Minor 7th:1 b3 (5) b7
7 Suspeded 4th (also known as 'Sus') 1 3 4 (5) b7
Diminished 7th: 1 b3 b5 bb7
(Dominant) 9th: 1 3 (5) b7 9
Major 9th: 1 3 (5) 7 9
Minor 9th: 1 b3 (5) b7 9
Add 9: 1 3 (5) 9
6/9: 1 3 (5) 6 9
(Dominant) 11th: 1 3 (5) b7 (9) 11
Major 11th: 1 3 (5) 7 (9) 11
Minor 11th: 1 b3 (5) b7 (9) 11
(Dominant) 13th: 1 3 (5) b7 (9) (11) 13
Major 13th: 1 3 (5) 7 (9) (11) 13
Minor 13th: 1 b3 (5) b7 (9) (11) 13

I hope this post helps explain how chords are formed and such. If you have any more questions I will try and answer them to the best of my ability.
Last edited by lbc_sublime at Jul 3, 2007,
#13
thanks for posting all that ill read all of it when i have time
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#14
I was going to tell you how to read music, but I just stared at your avatar for an hour and gave up.
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#15
lol, i pretty much understand the just of reading it as where the notes and stuff are and i think i understand key signatures now but some of the symbols im still not sure of
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#16
yrah go through it it will teach you maj and min scales and chords its a good post for sure
#17
lbc sublime i just noticed but that rly doesnt have much to do with READING music thats more theory and i know most of that stuff about formulating chords but thanks for the effort
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#18
what symbols dont you understand. im learning it too but i think im a little further ahead
To a shredder, a second is a long time.

Member of the UG Gentlemen of Higher Thought Establishment.

Invite only, if you want to be considered, contribute well to UG, and respect others as much as possible!
#19
well im sure i could easily figure out what the symbols were by using google lol
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.
#20
Then what do you need to know? Once you know what the symbols mean the rest is just long hard gruelling and tbh sometimes boring practice!
Quote by cakemonster91

*chuckle* A peanut. With a face.



Go to your staff paper and re-write this song a half step down so on the paper it'll be like you have a "C" just move it down to a "B#"




Know your theory, then play like you don't.

#21
yeah, i think i pretty much got it yeah haha ive been sight reading some rly simple songs, the first succesful one was "when the saints go marching in" lol its a lot easier to sight read on piano than it is on guitar
<Raven> I got so baked last night
<Raven> that I WOKE UP high o_o
<Raven> Do you have any idea how euphoric that is?
<Raven> I felt like I was being born.