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#1
This is a thread aimed at those of us that are teachers, and it would mostly serve as a place where new teachers can learn the ropes, veterans can exchange tips, provide some help, standards, recommended books and methods, syllabus, etc. Tell us a little about yourself as well!

Ive been playing guitar for about 3 years, keyboards for about 5 months, drums for about 7 months, and bass for about 3 months. I mostly teach beginner piano, beginner drums, beginner bass, and beginner, intermediate, and advanced guitar. I teach people ranging from 5-60, from all walks of life. Some helpful tips I can provide at the moment:

-I find that alot of young girls (and sometimes even boys!) will LOVE learning the music to the popular Disney movie, "High School Musical". I invested in the sheet music book & CD, and it was definately worth it. Its provided me with many successful beginner piano lessons, and the kids really have alot of fun with it.

-For the first lesson for kids on guitar, I usually have them memorize the EADGBE strings, forwards and backwards, and then have them learn a simple melody such as Twinkle Twinkle, or for the older kids, I have them play an easy version of popular video game songs while I play the rhythm/lead guitar.

-I find that the first time you meet a student, you should determine if they are the kind to be either inspired or crushed by seeing someone alot better than them. If they are gonna be inspired, I recommend you spend a few minutes now and then to do some shredding, and youll know it will work when you see their eyes light up, smile from ear to ear, and tell you that they too want to do that. For the ones that seem a little more fragile, dont play in front of them at all, you might make it look too easy, and upon them trying to play what you did, and have a tough time, they might quit guitar right after that first lesson and never pick it up again, or maybe later down the road.


I hope this thread is useful when it gets contribution!
#2
This topic is interesting. What does it take to become a private guitar teacher and is it possible to make a reasonable living from it if you do it right?
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#3
Quote by radiantmoon
This topic is interesting. What does it take to become a private guitar teacher and is it possible to make a reasonable living from it if you do it right?



Well it all depends on where you live, how much you charge, and how good you are at explaining things.

Location:

You should note that if you live in a dense city, finding people will be easy. Pass out flyers at concerts, post em at supermarkets, downtown, hand out cards, whatever. You could give lessons out of your home or a building, or you can drive to their house. I do both. If you live in the rural areas, you might want to consider how far youd have to drive to get to peoples houses, and if its worth the trip there.

Price:

Some people call and ask for a price. If you give them a price that is too expensive for them, they will hang up immediately, without letting you explain why its expensive. What I do is BEFORE I tell them the price, I explain that we are the cheapest school in our area (which we are), and then I tell them our rates. When I work at the building, our rates are 32/hour, 16/half hour. I get paid 18 dollrs an hour, and 9 dollars a half hour. When I go to their house, or they come to my house, I charge 20 dollars per hour, or 10 dollars per half hour. I get to keep the full 20 or 10 because I dont have to pay taxes or pay my boss or anything.

both at the building and on my own, I let them come for a first lesson, and if they want to come again, I kindly explain that they need to pay me for a full month in advance, plus a deposit, so that they dont ditch me without telling me. After that month, they can just play the monthly payment. At my building, that means they come in, and pay 16 dollars. When they come back the next week, I expect 80 dollars, and the months after that, 64 dollars. When they stop taking lessons, we would use the deposit that they gave me at the beginner for their last lesson, so we dont end on bad terms and its job security, basically.
#4
I have a few question for us people who will be seeking a teacher.

How do you really know if your teacher is right for you?
Well basically i am asking this cause we all learn differently.

How do you really know if they know what their talking about, or if the way they teach you techniques is correct?
I know anything beyond basic techniques i have to trust the instructor. Same with theory, anything beyond basic theory i have to trust the instructor.

Do you have to just experiment with teachers and find out for yourself?
epic7734
#5
Good topic man. I taught one kid guitar last year and im looking to teach quite a few this year as its quite good money.
Quote by funkdaddyfresh
justin, that was easily the most inspiring, helpful piece of advice anyone has ever given me in regards to my musical pursuits.


Screaming Help
#6
One thing I would point out is that it would be a good idea for the teacher to give the student the tools to be self-sufficient as a learner.

I spent seven years learning the piano, and after those seven years, if you asked me to play a C major chord, I would not know what to do. I was unable to read even intermediate rhythms (which I found out when I began reading music for bass a few years later). There were results, certainly; I could play pretty good pieces on the piano, but only after hearing my teacher play, and then memorizing the sounds. I was not given any tools to be able to learn on my own.

So, I would recommend that teachers at least set aside a small amount of time for theory. Certain method books that I've seen integrate theory with the guitar lessons, and also maybe a little time could be spent every now and then sight-reading some rhythms.
(Slightly outdated) Electronic and classical compositions by m'self: Check 'em out
#7
Quote by psychodelia
I spent seven years learning the piano, and after those seven years, if you asked me to play a C major chord, I would not know what to do.
Are you...serious?


If that's not hyperbole, then your teacher must have had one hell of an unorthodox teaching style. ><
#8
Quote by psychodelia
One thing I would point out is that it would be a good idea for the teacher to give the student the tools to be self-sufficient as a learner.

I spent seven years learning the piano, and after those seven years, if you asked me to play a C major chord, I would not know what to do. I was unable to read even intermediate rhythms (which I found out when I began reading music for bass a few years later). There were results, certainly; I could play pretty good pieces on the piano, but only after hearing my teacher play, and then memorizing the sounds. I was not given any tools to be able to learn on my own.

So, I would recommend that teachers at least set aside a small amount of time for theory. Certain method books that I've seen integrate theory with the guitar lessons, and also maybe a little time could be spent every now and then sight-reading some rhythms.



Wtf? Damn dude that sucks... What I do is when we work on a song, I dissect it in front of them, but in simple terms. I tell them from the beginning that if they dont understand a word or something I say, they can ask and Ill explain. So basically I used moonlight sonata to explain to them how to make major and minor chords, and then spent the next lesson working on major, minor, augmented, and dim triads, and they had no problem comprehending it, even at 6! I guess its all how you implement it really. If you spend an hour or something telling someone to play a song, they will lack the theory...but if you spend an hour showing them theory and crap, then that will also kill off their creativity and their view of the instrument as fun, IMO.
#9
Im not surprised by that at all pysch. My girlfriend has her grade 8 in piano and can play all that fancy stuff, but if I put 3 chord names in front of her (like worship music or something) she would be so lost.

Its really a shame piano players arent taught how to do stuff like that.
Quote by funkdaddyfresh
justin, that was easily the most inspiring, helpful piece of advice anyone has ever given me in regards to my musical pursuits.


Screaming Help
#10
You guys ever have a student that you felt was way more advanced than you? I had one like that, all the theory stuff I was showing him, he absorbed it so fast, what took me a year to learn he learned in 3 months...luckily I was always one step ahead of him, and later he asked me to show him how to PLAY the guitar, not just work on theory, and that was my specialty so basically I was saved . If he hadnt asked I would have been forced to transfer him to someone else. He recently left for college though. Good kid.


I felt bad cuz I felt like I was cheating him out of an education, but later on realized that while he learned faster, I still knew how to explain it better, and pick up other things faster
#11
Quote by insideac
If you spend an hour or something telling someone to play a song, they will lack the theory...but if you spend an hour showing them theory and crap, then that will also kill off their creativity and their view of the instrument as fun, IMO.


Right, so it's balance. You don't want to make the instrument a chore, but the benefits of learning theory have more than renewed my love for music. When I found out that I could actually interpret and understand music that I and others had written, it made me want to learn more, so I suppose it's like the issue you brought up in your first post. Some will be inspired by theory, and some put off, but it should be an option.


And yawn... it wasn't hyperbole at all, I'm sorry to say
(Slightly outdated) Electronic and classical compositions by m'self: Check 'em out
#12
Well I have a question for Getting a teacher, hope you'll take it
I'm kinda concerned about getting lessons, I just moved to a REALLY small town, from a big city
Well i talked to the guy at the guitar shop and apparentally the guy that gives lessons comes down in october, for about 6 months apparentally he does that every year, and he didn't show up last time, So he doesn't seem that reliable, and he's the only teacher i've heard of in the town so far, so I dunno should I go for it?
I mean are there people that just scam people and teach them bull?
I know a bit but not everything so I could probly get scammed..
Cancer.
#13
How big is the town you are in now?
Quote by funkdaddyfresh
justin, that was easily the most inspiring, helpful piece of advice anyone has ever given me in regards to my musical pursuits.


Screaming Help
#14
I lived in victoria BC, About 500,000 people
Now i live in Yellowknife, 20,000 people..or less
Cancer.
#15
Quote by jesus-squared
Well I have a question for Getting a teacher, hope you'll take it
I'm kinda concerned about getting lessons, I just moved to a REALLY small town, from a big city
Well i talked to the guy at the guitar shop and apparentally the guy that gives lessons comes down in october, for about 6 months apparentally he does that every year, and he didn't show up last time, So he doesn't seem that reliable, and he's the only teacher i've heard of in the town so far, so I dunno should I go for it?
I mean are there people that just scam people and teach them bull?
I know a bit but not everything so I could probly get scammed..



No definately not. Thats 6 months a year...by the time he comes back youll be behind man. If you cant find anyone else, and are still interested, PM me if youd like, Ive been meaning to try doing online classes. Youd just need a webcam/mic and AIM or MSN.


Quote by psychodelia
Right, so it's balance. You don't want to make the instrument a chore, but the benefits of learning theory have more than renewed my love for music. When I found out that I could actually interpret and understand music that I and others had written, it made me want to learn more, so I suppose it's like the issue you brought up in your first post. Some will be inspired by theory, and some put off, but it should be an option.


And yawn... it wasn't hyperbole at all, I'm sorry to say



Exactly! Also I find that you shouldnt even mention any theory at all until they are a good month in or so, so that they are comfortable with their playing ability. The last thing you wanna do is assault a child or a senior citizen with C major scales and progressions and triads and diminished arpeggios . After they figure out how to play, its more fun to learn WHY they are playing that, and why it sounds like it does.
Last edited by insideac at Aug 30, 2007,
#16
Quote by jesus-squared
I lived in victoria BC, About 500,000 people
Now i live in Yellowknife, 20,000 people..or less


Oh shutup buddy, 20,000 people, thats tons. Living in a small town is living in saskatchewan where you have a two room school house. Right now Im in manitoba in a town with about 6,000 people and there are lots of guitar players around here. Just look around man, and take someone you are sure will help you out. But ya, 20,000, you will be just fine.
Quote by funkdaddyfresh
justin, that was easily the most inspiring, helpful piece of advice anyone has ever given me in regards to my musical pursuits.


Screaming Help
#17
Quote by psychodelia
And yawn... it wasn't hyperbole at all, I'm sorry to say
Ah, well, it's not too bad. I'm pretty much the exact opposite. I learned theory pretty decently, but I suck at piano.

Knowing theory means diddley squat if you can't even play your instrument decently.
#18
haha well 500,000 to 20,000 is a big differance...But when school starts up i'll look around for more guitarists
I think my mom signed me up for a guitar class in school so i guess theres a place i can meet people
Cancer.
#19
Hey folks, cool thread. I have a situation that a lot of people will probably come across sooner or later, one of my friends is asking me to teach her guitar. First of all, I want to make sure I have enough knowledge to do my job, I'm completely confident with my skills, but I don't know that much theory. I know the fretboard, can work my way around the circle of 5ths, know how basic chords are constructed (major minor, 7th but that's about it) and know the penatonics and blues scales as well as all the modes. Do you think I'll be able to do a good job teaching her?
EDIT: ooh, I can also read standard notation easily.
#20
I have a question that I guess would fall under this:
Is it worth it to change up with teachers? I mean I've been going to the same teacher for 2 years now and we get along great and I've been learning quite a bit. But, my friend who plays drums says he is switching drum teachers to try and get knowledge form another source. I think that's an interesting idea, and just wanted to ask what you guys thought the merits of a consistent teacher and changing teachers are?
#21
I'm not a teacher, but I am a student who understands a lot about the way my teacher goes about his lessons.

I remember the first few lessons, what he did was figure out what type of music I liked. Which helped a lot, since he happens to like the same music. The first lesson he obviously showed me the EADGBE string lineup, gave me the "Eat At Dennys, Get Bad Eggs" thing as an easy way to get it engraved in my head at first.

Since I previously had a (not so great) teacher for about 5 months, but made almost no progress with him, I knew most of the basic chord shapes, like G, D, C, etc.

My current teacher usually went about asking what song I'd like to learn (within reason of what I was able to learn). As he'd teach me the song, he'd stop every now and then to show me little tips and stuff along the way. For example, the first song I learned was Under the Bridge by RHCP, he introduced me to barre chords. Among other things, but barre chords were the big one from that song.

Periodically, if I was working on a song and didn't have it down that well by the next lesson, he'd go into some theory.

Overall, his method of teaching is basically, find something the student wants to learn, and teach what you know through the student's wants. Instead of giving it to the student simply by the book, straight up and telling them to memorize it, it's kind of a subconscious learning. You simply pick things up along the way. So far, it's worked.
#22
I'm not currently teaching, but I plan to when I semi-retire. (hopefully not
much longer )

What kind of teacher you'll need will depend a LOT on your current skillset, but I
think there's a couple of observations I could generalize on from my experience:

o If you get a "Song a week" type of teacher, a red flag should go up. While
learning songs is important and may be covered to an extent by a teacher, a GOOD
teacher will be giving you the skills to learn songs on your own. I've tried 2 teacher.
Both of them fell into this category. One of them was a pretty well known Jazz
Guitarist who did a "song a week" and let me exhibit some of the worst technical
habits for two years with barely a comment. I learned almost nothing.

o A GOOD teacher will know what's good for you, even if you don't. A master will
take control and give you VERY explicit practice. Think "Karate Kid" with the
"Wax on, wax off" stuff. It may not make sense to you why you have to do
something a certain way (although it should be explained), but you should be
going to someone whow knows more than you. Put trust in that. A wishy-washy
teacher who does whatever you want, should be another red flag.

On a side note, I'm scheduling a session with Jamie Andreas. She's now doing
WebCam 1-on-1 lessons. $135 for 1/2 hour. Pretty steep. But, based on
what I already know about Jamie I think it'll be worth it. I scheduled an initial
hour to see how it goes. If it goes well, I'll probably do a regular, biweekly
schedule.
#23
Quote by insideac
a lot of stuff


No offense, but I think you should clean up your technique and get a decent theory knowledge before you start teaching anyone seriously. Judging from the posts you've made here and the videos on youtube, you're a beginner too. I mean a lot of stuff you've said about technique is just plain wrong and your playing is really sloppy.

For example these threads

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=628637
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=629470

have an incredible amount of bad information, already pointed out by many people. Why I'm saying this is that when beginners follow bad advice they'll develop bad habits. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to insult you, just make you reconsider the advice you're giving.
#24
Quote by Stratwizard
No offense, but I think you should clean up your technique and get a decent theory knowledge before you start teaching anyone seriously. Judging from the posts you've made here and the videos on youtube, you're a beginner too. I mean a lot of stuff you've said about technique is just plain wrong and your playing is really sloppy.

For example these threads

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=628637
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=629470

have an incredible amount of bad information, already pointed out by many people. Why I'm saying this is that when beginners follow bad advice they'll develop bad habits. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to insult you, just make you reconsider the advice you're giving.

I have to agree with this. Insideac, I don't really think you're in the position to be teaching "advanced" guitar, and you seem a bit overly confident when it comes to that stuff.

I certainly wouldn't feel right charging students for "advanced" classes after a mere three years of playing guitar. Heck, I wouldn't feel right doing that now. There is too much I don't know enough about yet / am not able to do.
He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt.
He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice.


Remember: A prudent question is one half of wisdom.

Click.
#25
Quote by Stratwizard
No offense, but I think you should clean up your technique and get a decent theory knowledge before you start teaching anyone seriously. Judging from the posts you've made here and the videos on youtube, you're a beginner too. I mean a lot of stuff you've said about technique is just plain wrong and your playing is really sloppy.

For example these threads

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=628637
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=629470

have an incredible amount of bad information, already pointed out by many people. Why I'm saying this is that when beginners follow bad advice they'll develop bad habits. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to insult you, just make you reconsider the advice you're giving.



Well first of all, no one nowadays, especially where I live, wants to learn how to shred. They are interested in learning classical themes (fur elise, moonlight sonata, etc), alternative rock and pop rock (green day, nirvana, etc), classic rock, or Lamb of God type stuff. Very rarely do they come in asking to learn blues, jazz, or funk, and even rarer that they come in specifically asking to shred like Guthrie Govan and Rusty Cooley. About 2/30 students are even remotely interested in playing fast.

The best analogy I can give you is that of a coach and a professional football team or baseball team or whatever. The coaches are usually fat ass old guys, yet they know what they are doing, they can see the final product of how the team's training will pay off, and know what routes to take, and what methods to use to get there. Im not a fat ass old guy, and I know I still have alot to learn, but I also know how to get results out of people and what to tell them to keep them going. How is it even bad advice that Im giving? The only people that had problems in those threads with what I said is the "shredders" because they already got to the "shred" status and didn't take that route, therefore it must not work

Besides, these past few months Ive really cleaned up my playing, and there is VERY little sloppiness to it now. I know that the advice, how I say and explain it, will obviously work, and I am saving these kids years of mistakes and fooling around, by telling them the things they should know without having them figure it out. Of course, I let them figure alot of stuff out, for example when they ask me a question, I ask them a series of questions leading into the answer, so that they answer their own question.

Im pretty sure I can handle teaching 13 year olds how to play green day, and Im also sure that I can teach the more complex students, because I have. You dont even know what I do or don't know of theory. Im always asking theory questions and talking to people about new methods and shortcuts and ideas and all that, because I love to try new methods, instead of the stupid, "yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis" mentality.


Quote by Resiliance
I have to agree with this. Insideac, I don't really think you're in the position to be teaching "advanced" guitar, and you seem a bit overly confident when it comes to that stuff.

I certainly wouldn't feel right charging students for "advanced" classes after a mere three years of playing guitar. Heck, I wouldn't feel right doing that now. There is too much I don't know enough about yet / am not able to do.



Arent you in your mid-30s or something? How long have you been playing? So after all these years, you have NOTHING to show "advanced" students? Doesn't seem like you've been learning much after all these years then, if you don't take in an advanced student because you have nothing to show them. What are the odds that they will be more advanced then you? You can pick at their technique, share all the theory knowledge you have gained over the years, and everything else you know, and it will last you until you learn even MORE, because since you knew more when they came in, you will (hopefully) always be a step ahead of them
Last edited by insideac at Aug 30, 2007,
#26
Quote by insideac
Arent you in your mid-30s or something?


No.

Quote by insideac
How long have you been playing? So after all these years, you have NOTHING to show "advanced" students?


Only a bit over 4 years, so not a long time, actually. And yes, I do have things to show to advanced students, but if they're going to be attending advanced classes, chances are they do too, a lot. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but being just one step ahead of them is a really bad place to be when teaching someone.

I'd CERTAINLY not pay any teacher any money if he were only a few steps ahead of me.

I don't consider myself good enough to teach anything to "advanced" players... I'd need to have a pretty wonky definition of "advanced" for that.


Quote by insideac
Doesn't seem like you've been learning much after all these years then, if you don't take in an advanced student because you have nothing to show them.


Not the case.

Quote by insideac
What are the odds that they will be more advanced then you? You can pick at their technique, share all the theory knowledge you have gained over the years, and everything else you know, and it will last you until you learn even MORE, because since you knew more when they came in, you will (hopefully) always be a step ahead of them


Well, again, I don't think being one step ahead of them and being able to share some theory knowledge and technique knowledge is good enough. If someone's looking for a tutor for advanced guitar lessons, they want someone who's advanced. Not only advanced compared to the guy down the street playing Blink 182 but advanced with regards to the pupil.

Why would I feel justified picking on someone's technique when I've only been playing a bit over 4 years myself? Who knows what kind of bad habits I still have in my playing I might pass on. There simply hasn't been time yet to evaluate.

Someone who's got experience, someone who really knows what to suggest and what not to suggest, someone who's been there and has seen it all. That's what I'd pay for, anyway. I'd feel ripped off any other way.

I'm not down with this as a quick way to make cash. Morals would prevent me from doing that.

That's my view on the whole thing, for what it's worth.
He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt.
He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice.


Remember: A prudent question is one half of wisdom.

Click.
#27
Quote by Resiliance
No.


Only a bit over 4 years, so not a long time, actually. And yes, I do have things to show to advanced students, but if they're going to be attending advanced classes, chances are they do too, a lot. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but being just one step ahead of them is a really bad place to be when teaching someone.

I'd CERTAINLY not pay any teacher any money if he were only a few steps ahead of me.

I don't consider myself good enough to teach anything to "advanced" players... I'd need to have a pretty wonky definition of "advanced" for that.


Not the case.


Well, again, I don't think being one step ahead of them and being able to share some theory knowledge and technique knowledge is good enough. If someone's looking for a tutor for advanced guitar lessons, they want someone who's advanced. Not only advanced compared to the guy down the street playing Blink 182 but advanced with regards to the pupil.

Why would I feel justified picking on someone's technique when I've only been playing a bit over 4 years myself? Who knows what kind of bad habits I still have in my playing I might pass on. There simply hasn't been time yet to evaluate.

Someone who's got experience, someone who really knows what to suggest and what not to suggest, someone who's been there and has seen it all. That's what I'd pay for, anyway. I'd feel ripped off any other way.

I'm not down with this as a quick way to make cash. Morals would prevent me from doing that.

That's my view on the whole thing, for what it's worth.



Well ok, but like I said before, how often are you going to be teaching advanced students, in the way that you consider advanced? The people that will be extremely advanced, if they ever come by, I will just tell them to seek help elsewhere, but personally, and in contrast to the other musicians around here, advanced to us here means that you know intermediate theory, have no trouble playing most songs, and learn rather quickly. Pretty much the only other "advanced" people like that, is Kris Sobanski and this 40 year old dude named JC. Besides that, the most advanced student I ever received was one that was into dream theater and wanted to learn to play rhythm guitar like that. The amount of advanced students, or students interested in being advanced is small in comparison to the normal students who just go to learn songs. Its like the spartans vs the persians, the advanced students being the spartans. And, like I said, if an advanced student DOES come in, it basically means he can just learn theory fast, from what I've seen. I dont know what you mean by advanced, but I doubt Ill come across one for many years.

Where I work now, I was a student for a year or a little less, and my teacher said that I was the brightest and fastest learning student he had seen in 21 years.....Think about that for a second. In short, you are nitpicking at nothing because I will probably never enounter a student that is advanced by your means, as long as I stay where I am.


...And im still waiting on your response, Stratwizard.
#28
Quote by insideac
The best analogy I can give you is that of a coach and a professional football team or baseball team or whatever. The coaches are usually fat ass old guys, yet they know what they are doing, they can see the final product of how the team's training will pay off, and know what routes to take, and what methods to use to get there. Im not a fat ass old guy, and I know I still have alot to learn, but I also know how to get results out of people and what to tell them to keep them going.


That's a pretty bad analogy. Even though those coaches might be fat ass old guys, they have a lot of experience and have probably been professionals themselves on some point too. The reason why they see the final product and know how to achieve it is because they have gone through those ways themselves or seen them working.

How is it even bad advice that Im giving? The only people that had problems in those threads with what I said is the "shredders" because they already got to the "shred" status and didn't take that route, therefore it must not work


Do you know why is that? Because beginners don't have anything to compare it to and for a beginner it's also hard to criticise things that they are unfamiliar with. Besides, those who already are "shredders" are most likely somewhat perfectionists when it comes to technique and have obviously used effective practice methods to achieve that status. Instead of ignoring these people, I'd suggest you read their posts and learn something.

Besides, these past few months Ive really cleaned up my playing, and there is VERY little sloppiness to it now.


Really? I find that hard to believe. The stuff you have on youtube and the stuff you've recorded is really sloppy, and if you've cleaned up your playing to a level that it's actually possible to hear WHAT you're playing then I'm surprised. Good example is that someone didn't even know that you were using harmonic minor scale in this video. Quite honestly, me neither. http://youtube.com/watch?v=eAnhqbNRxcQ

I know that the advice, how I say and explain it, will obviously work, and I am saving these kids years of mistakes and fooling around, by telling them the things they should know without having them figure it out.


How do you know it works when even your own playing is sloppy? I mean if it worked, wouldn't it be quite logical, that in the short time that you have played, you would've followed your own advice, the "shortcuts", and become very proficient with guitar?

Im pretty sure I can handle teaching 13 year olds how to play green day, and Im also sure that I can teach the more complex students, because I have. You dont even know what I do or don't know of theory. Im always asking theory questions and talking to people about new methods and shortcuts and ideas and all that, because I love to try new methods, instead of the stupid, "yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis" mentality.


Yes, you can probably handle the 13-year-old Green Day-kids but you can't teach advanced students with skills you have now. Or then your definition of advanced must be quite a lot different than mine.
#29
Quote by Stratwizard
That's a pretty bad analogy. Even though those coaches might be fat ass old guys, they have a lot of experience and have probably been professionals themselves on some point too. The reason why they see the final product and know how to achieve it is because they have gone through those ways themselves or seen them working.


Do you know why is that? Because beginners don't have anything to compare it to and for a beginner it's also hard to criticise things that they are unfamiliar with. Besides, those who already are "shredders" are most likely somewhat perfectionists when it comes to technique and have obviously used effective practice methods to achieve that status. Instead of ignoring these people, I'd suggest you read their posts and learn something.


Really? I find that hard to believe. The stuff you have on youtube and the stuff you've recorded is really sloppy, and if you've cleaned up your playing to a level that it's actually possible to hear WHAT you're playing then I'm surprised. Good example is that someone didn't even know that you were using harmonic minor scale in this video. Quite honestly, me neither. http://youtube.com/watch?v=eAnhqbNRxcQ


How do you know it works when even your own playing is sloppy? I mean if it worked, wouldn't it be quite logical, that in the short time that you have played, you would've followed your own advice, the "shortcuts", and become very proficient with guitar?


Yes, you can probably handle the 13-year-old Green Day-kids but you can't teach advanced students with skills you have now. Or then your definition of advanced must be quite a lot different than mine.



That video is from December, 2006. And there is a difference between sloppiness, and a crappy webcam mic with distortion guitar. I hear myself in person, and you will hear me on recording soon, and I am indeed very clean in my playing. Take a look at these 2 videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jRNHef5-_k - February 2007
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHePNY_dnYA - June 2007

And listen to hear any sloppiness. Particularly the sweeps. It sounds 100x clearer in person, without the mic fuzzing things up. The songs where I am indeed sloppy, and I will admit it, is the Fermented Offal Discharge video, the stabwound video, and a crapload of my Black Dahlia Murder videos, but those were from 2006, AND I learned most of those songs in a few hours (except for the necrophagist ones).

My playing is not sloppy, and I am quite happy with how fast I learn songs.

Also, yes my definition of advanced is different than yours.


And id like to mention at this point that in the foul body autopsy video, I would not have learned it as fast as I did if I hadn't exaggerated my finger lifts, like I do in the video, the so called bad advice that supposedly holds you back from getting that extra note per second in. It does not slow me down, it merely makes it easier for me to remember what to play, and make me hit the notes more accurately. And I also anchor. And I sometimes bring my thumb above the neck.
Last edited by insideac at Aug 30, 2007,
#30
Quote by jesus-squared
I lived in victoria BC, About 500,000 people
Now i live in Yellowknife, 20,000 people..or less



Yellowknife?? That place on Ice Road Truckers? thats kickass man!
#31
Here's a question for teachers who went to a music school.
Anyone here who has majored in music education? Does it require me to take a foriegn language? To be more specific I want to go to berklee.
Soon you will sit on the bench
of those who deny I have my soul
You sell a dream you create
Condemned by what you condemned before
Smooth are the words you sing down and high
Underground is your joy your laws
#32
Quote by edg
o If you get a "Song a week" type of teacher, a red flag should go up.


I have to disagree with this. A GOOD teacher knows that each student has different needs and different goals, and is flexible enough in approach to accomodate those needs and goals.

There are plenty of times when a "song a week" is completely appropriate.
shred is gaudy music
#33
Quote by justin_fraser
Oh shutup buddy, 20,000 people, thats tons. Living in a small town is living in saskatchewan where you have a two room school house. Right now Im in manitoba in a town with about 6,000 people and there are lots of guitar players around here. Just look around man, and take someone you are sure will help you out. But ya, 20,000, you will be just fine.


Come to New Zealand bro and then you will see what small town populations are. Theres only 4million people in the whole of my country.
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#34
Quote by GuitarMunky
I have to disagree with this. A GOOD teacher knows that each student has different needs and different goals, and is flexible enough in approach to accomodate those needs and goals.

There are plenty of times when a "song a week" is completely appropriate.


I said it's a "red flag" which means it should be something that should make you sit
up and take notice and think about it, not that its always a bad thing. Evaluate
what else you're getting out of it. Because "Song a Week" is a great way for BAD
teachers to put themselves on autopilot and take your weekly check.
#35
How is it even bad advice that Im giving? The only people that had problems in those threads with what I said is the "shredders" because they already got to the "shred" status and didn't take that route, therefore it must not work

The simple fact is that the people who had problems are better informed than most. That you should think about it, but hey, I doubt it will. Anyhoo, what you may just find is that some of us are not monominded automatons, but actually have a pretty decent working knowledge of biology and physiology, and enough physics to know that some things you’re saying are simply wrong. That’s simple fact, and to be honest, your methods have worked for you because you are working a lot harder with methods that are half-baked than most people do with decent methods. Not because they are equally good.

Secondly, I can name another group of people with whom you’d have problems with if they were here to post – truly technically brilliant musicians. Funnily enough, I was just hanging out with John Wheatcroft recently (you know, head of Guitar-X), and also Martin Goulding (you know, the guy who gave some lessons to Muhammed Suiçmez, and who was offered lead guitar in NP?), and I’ve had 20 odd hours of lessons with both at the international guitar festival. Guess what, they subscribe to the stupid

"yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis"

mentality, and would pretty much recommend it to their advanced students, as London’s top guitar tutors.

Im pretty sure I can handle teaching 13 year olds how to play green day, and Im also sure that I can teach the more complex students, because I have. You dont even know what I do or don't know of theory.

Well, what do you know of theory?

Im always asking theory questions and talking to people about new methods and shortcuts and ideas and all that, because I love to try new methods, instead of the stupid, "yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis" mentality.


Here’s an idea for a new method – whenever you want to move up a position, move DOWN one first, and thus you’ll build up muscles in your arm. I’m serious.

Where I work now, I was a student for a year or a little less, and my teacher said that I was the brightest and fastest learning student he had seen in 21 years.....Think about that for a second. In short, you are nitpicking at nothing because I will probably never enounter a student that is advanced by your means, as long as I stay where I am.


Frankly (and don’t take offense) – you’re nothing special, far as I can see. The fact he hasn’t had a better student in 21 years don’t impress me none, the standard of both teaching and playing is abysmally low. I’ve met guys teaching for (and I wish I was joking here) 40 years but who don’t know jack **** about technique.

Is it any wonder that there aren’t any students as advanced as you around? I know for a fact that if I could get people to do an hour a night of real practice, I could have them at your technical level in 3 years. You will meet many students who could potentially be as “bright and fast” as you – but are you actually able to teach them with so little experience?


That video is from December, 2006. And there is a difference between sloppiness, and a crappy webcam mic with distortion guitar. I hear myself in person, and you will hear me on recording soon, and I am indeed very clean in my playing.


That’ll be nice.

Also, yes my definition of advanced is different than yours.


I don’t think that anyone can really be an advanced player with less than 5 years playing. It’s once again the mark of the low standards of society for electric guitar that you think yourself qualified to teach advanced students after just a few years – can you imagine if you were a pianist and tried to pull the same ****? Or imagine you go to a guitar course and tried to teach “advanced” players? I’ve been in a classroom with real advanced players, and they’re just an order of magnitude better than you (and me and resi and strat) – you’re just another amateur guitarist, get over it.

And id like to mention at this point that in the foul body autopsy video, I would not have learned it as fast as I did if I hadn't exaggerated my finger lifts, like I do in the video, the so called bad advice that supposedly holds you back from getting that extra note per second in.


Tell me how it’s physically possible to move greater distances in less time with the same human hands as the rest as us and I’ll stop laughing at the “supposedly”.

It does not slow me down, it merely makes it easier for me to remember what to play, and make me hit the notes more accurately.

Hey, if that helps you remember what to play, that’s honestly your problem.

And I also anchor.


You got a logical argument for why it’s GOOD though, cowboy? Skip along home, sonny.

And I sometimes bring my thumb above the neck.


Yeah, cause that’s never been recommended for rock posture by anyone who’s argued with you.

I think your problem with the monominds is that you just don’t grasp the simple ideas and you have to turn them into laws.
Don’t lift your fingers…at the guitar when practicing lines.
Don’t anchor…but use your common sense – it’s not like your guitar is electrified and will burn your wrist if you EVER TOUCH THAT GUITAR BODY!
Don’t bring your thumb above the neck…unless you want to bend, or don’t need legato or stretching.

Anyway, thats my two cents and some spare change.
#36
Quote by Freepower
Funnily enough, I was just hanging out with John Wheatcroft recently (you know, head of Guitar-X), and also Martin Goulding (you know, the guy who gave some lessons to Muhammed Suiçmez, and who was offered lead guitar in NP?), and I’ve had 20 odd hours of lessons with both at the international guitar festival.

Yeah, I think dropping names is fun too.
Quote by nightwind
You must never double the leading tone ever. Failure to comply will result in a fugue related death.
#37
Quote by Freepower
How is it even bad advice that Im giving? The only people that had problems in those threads with what I said is the "shredders" because they already got to the "shred" status and didn't take that route, therefore it must not work

The simple fact is that the people who had problems are better informed than most. That you should think about it, but hey, I doubt it will. Anyhoo, what you may just find is that some of us are not monominded automatons, but actually have a pretty decent working knowledge of biology and physiology, and enough physics to know that some things you’re saying are simply wrong. That’s simple fact, and to be honest, your methods have worked for you because you are working a lot harder with methods that are half-baked than most people do with decent methods. Not because they are equally good.

Secondly, I can name another group of people with whom you’d have problems with if they were here to post – truly technically brilliant musicians. Funnily enough, I was just hanging out with John Wheatcroft recently (you know, head of Guitar-X), and also Martin Goulding (you know, the guy who gave some lessons to Muhammed Suiçmez, and who was offered lead guitar in NP?), and I’ve had 20 odd hours of lessons with both at the international guitar festival. Guess what, they subscribe to the stupid

"yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis"

mentality, and would pretty much recommend it to their advanced students, as London’s top guitar tutors.


Well, what do you know of theory?


Here’s an idea for a new method – whenever you want to move up a position, move DOWN one first, and thus you’ll build up muscles in your arm. I’m serious.


Frankly (and don’t take offense) – you’re nothing special, far as I can see. The fact he hasn’t had a better student in 21 years don’t impress me none, the standard of both teaching and playing is abysmally low. I’ve met guys teaching for (and I wish I was joking here) 40 years but who don’t know jack **** about technique.

Is it any wonder that there aren’t any students as advanced as you around? I know for a fact that if I could get people to do an hour a night of real practice, I could have them at your technical level in 3 years. You will meet many students who could potentially be as “bright and fast” as you – but are you actually able to teach them with so little experience?


That’ll be nice.


I don’t think that anyone can really be an advanced player with less than 5 years playing. It’s once again the mark of the low standards of society for electric guitar that you think yourself qualified to teach advanced students after just a few years – can you imagine if you were a pianist and tried to pull the same ****? Or imagine you go to a guitar course and tried to teach “advanced” players? I’ve been in a classroom with real advanced players, and they’re just an order of magnitude better than you (and me and resi and strat) – you’re just another amateur guitarist, get over it.


Tell me how it’s physically possible to move greater distances in less time with the same human hands as the rest as us and I’ll stop laughing at the “supposedly”.


Hey, if that helps you remember what to play, that’s honestly your problem.


You got a logical argument for why it’s GOOD though, cowboy? Skip along home, sonny.


Yeah, cause that’s never been recommended for rock posture by anyone who’s argued with you.

I think your problem with the monominds is that you just don’t grasp the simple ideas and you have to turn them into laws.
Don’t lift your fingers…at the guitar when practicing lines.
Don’t anchor…but use your common sense – it’s not like your guitar is electrified and will burn your wrist if you EVER TOUCH THAT GUITAR BODY!
Don’t bring your thumb above the neck…unless you want to bend, or don’t need legato or stretching.

Anyway, thats my two cents and some spare change.



I know for a fact that if I can get my students to practice CORRECTLY for an hour a night, theyd reach my level in less than 3 years, because it took me 3 years to get here, including 1 year wasted on shenanigans and only 2 summers worth of serious practice. The problem is getting all your students to practice for an hour every night. Just because you yourself are intelligent and have the discipline of the karate kid does not mean that all your students will, either.

The other day I was hanging out with Michael Keene (you know, from The Faceless), and of course, Muhammad Suicmez (you know, from Necrophagist), and Chris Bradley (You know, from beneath the massacre), and I was talking with them about guitar playing and crap. The faceless dude had been playing for 5 years, is self taught (mostly), and when I asked him what he did to practice, his response was basically (I just did whatever worked best for me), and went on to tell me that when he was being taught, he left because his teacher was trying to force the "standard" methods unto him. Muhammad said he mostly reads books now and molds them into his liking, and Chris Bradley said that his technique got his teacher pissed off, especially his legato style, and yet look what he does now. So basically they wouldnt play like they do today if they stuck to the " "yep u hav 2 do this exctly like dis" mentality.

I also know enough theory to hold conversations with theory enthusiasts and local jazz musicians, and enough to hold my own in case someone says something wrong.

And my argument as to why anchoring is good is because it lets me palm mute all the strings I want with the utmost ease, not to mention its easier for string skipping licks and phrases. And I am aware that some stuff should be used while in different context, but the way you, Resilience, and Stratwizard all are, is that youre uptight about what everyone does with their technique. I see you all trying to dissuade people from anchoring at all, and Ive never seen you tell anyone to anchor. Same goes for moving your thumb to different positions, etc. Thats why Im here, telling them to do otherwise, to make them realize they have a choice.
#38
Quote by LonelyHashBrown
Yellowknife?? That place on Ice Road Truckers? thats kickass man!


Well it does get like that in the winter..the great slave lake freezes over, and the mackenzie river freezes over....cool show
but yellowknife sucks.
Cancer.
#39
Quote by edg
I said it's a "red flag" which means it should be something that should make you sit
up and take notice and think about it, not that its always a bad thing. Evaluate
what else you're getting out of it. Because "Song a Week" is a great way for BAD
teachers to put themselves on autopilot and take your weekly check.



Definately! EXACTLY this. One of the teachers that worked where I am working now (he was recently fired), used to do this to most of his students. They would come in, and hed spend a week or two on a song, and move on to a new song. While is is all fun and good for a little while, maybe a month or two, after you spend 3 years with a teacher like that, and play with others who have been playing for less, and realize that you lack the essentials, then youll know that youre in trouble. Its good if a teacher teaches you the songs you want to know, but he also explains the thoughts behind the songs (if there is any), and goes into detail to make sure you understand why something is there.
#40
Insideac,

I don't want to pile on you more. I think this horse has been beaten. You have
talent, but still a lot to learn. You might just want to think about some of this
stuff and file it away for future reference. Where there's smoke there's fire...

In a way I know where you're coming from because I've been there. Zen Masters
have a thing called "Beginners Mind". I'm sure you can look it up for meaning.
You never get so good or advanced that learning something new or thinking
about something old, no matter how trivial or "newb" it might seem, is beneath
you. I've done lots of that. Believe me -- thinking I knew something but really
not having much clue. With guitar that can be a fatal flaw.

So, 30 years later I find myself doing slow chromatic pulloffs or picking between
2 notes for hours because I never really was doing them right -- at least not
right enough to get where I wanted to go. But at one point you could have
screamed until you were blue in the face and I'd still think I was right.

At any rate, I think you have the natural talent that'll pull you through the rough
spots where others would just stumble and give up. Consider yourself lucky.
Eventually I think you'll figure some of this stuff out with time....
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