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#1
Right, so...lately I've been improving a lot, but I think my guitar is really holding me back (now, before you start saying "don't go blaming your gear" I have every reason to - this guitar is a mess. It's fit for nothing but firewood and the neck is really awkward to play) so I want to get a new 'un. I was looking mainly at Les Pauls, and this caught my eye.

Aglile AL-3000M

I love the colour, and the plain top. And I was just wondering how it compared to the guitars made by other manufacturers, particularly Epiphone. How is it when compared to the Epi LP Standard? And, perhaps, the Custom? Would anyone recommend this? I mean, it's only £220 before shipping, which is cheaper than even the Epiphone LP Studio, so I'm a bit wary, but I've heard good things about Agiles, so...yeah. Any information on that would be appreciated, as would suggestions for alternatives.

Right, that's the first bit out of the way, now on to my next question...

If I were to get that guitar, I would probably want to replace the pickups. My question is, what would be a good versatile set? I'd be looking for something that could handle blues, classic rock, harder rock and even some metal (think Maiden, though - nothing particularly heavy). I'm not really fussed how expensive they are, so I'm willing to look at all manufacturers, including Swineshead, Bare Knuckle, Duncan, DiMarzio etc.

But I have no idea what would be the best pickups from any of them to go for. I had been considering maybe one of the following combinations (bridge first and neck second), but I could really do with some advice:

Seymour Duncan Custom 5 + '59
Swineshead Warthog and Condor
Bare Knuckle Black Dog and Emerald

Again, any help would be appreciated. And I'm sorry that this post is so long - I don't know how to make things short

Thanks in advance, and biscuits for all who reply!
#2
My main guitar these days is an Epiphone Les Paul Custom with Gibson Burstbucker Pros in it. all in all it came to about $1500 AUD (As well as the pickups I replaced the volume pots,pickup selector and jack and got a professional setup done on it). And the thing sounds beautiful and plays amazingly smoothly. The problem with all of these cheap Les Pauls (or any copy for that matter) is that they all come from the factory with everything loose and not really ready to play, not live anyway.

I don't know what the Agiles are like, but if you get it, the first thing I'd do is get a setup done for it, it helps the cheaper guitars immensely. Also replacing the electronics (pots, selecotr, jack) is a good idea since they're usually the first thing to fail.

Pickups-wise I'd steer towards the Gibsons, Burstbuckers or Burstbucker Pros. They just deliver so amazingly. If you want something that can push into the red a bit more, then maybe something like a Seymour Duncan JB in the bridge and a '59 in the neck but for what you've said, I'd really go for the Gibsons.
#3
Hmm... I've heard that the Gibson Burstbuckers are good, but I've also heard that they aren't really great if you're using them as replacement pickups, and that a lot of other pickup manufacturers make better pickups. That said, I'll definitely look into them.

And yeah, I was planning on getting a good setup for whatever guitar I bought anyway.

As for replacing all the electronics...if I think it is necessary, I'll definitely do it. I'm quite handy with a soldering iron, so it should be no problem.
#4
The Gibsons make good replacement pickups in guitars that are like gibsons, I'd never put them in say an Ibanez or a strat. I'd definitely replace the pickup selector straight off, they almost always die on the cheaper les pauls and usually at the worst time lol
#5
Like I said, I'll look into them. But I'm not impressed by the prices. Looking at Thomann's website, they're around £100 per pickup, and if I'm to spend that much on them, they had better be good

I'll keep in mind what you said about the selector switch, too. I'd hate for it to stop working in the middle of a song...
#6
Yeah, they are pricey. I geuss if you want a really versatile set, the JB/'59 combo is widely regarded as a pretty unstoppable combo for rock/hard rock/metal as well as being able to make some nice creamy blues tones. Also a 59 in the bridge and Jazz model in the neck (again from Seymour Duncan) is a very very nice combo.
#7
Quote by Weybl Himself
The Gibsons make good replacement pickups in guitars that are like gibsons, I'd never put them in say an Ibanez or a strat. I'd definitely replace the pickup selector straight off, they almost always die on the cheaper les pauls and usually at the worst time lol


+1, if you find a good Epi or Agile LP, set it up, fix the electronics and put a pair of Gibsons in it, there'd be no difference except for a snazzier sounding headstock, big deal.

Since you're in the UK, the Swineshead would be better value, but if you want the Gibson sound, the Burstbuckers would do the job better.
#8
I'm not particularly after the Gibson sound. I just want something versatile that sounds great. I picked the Les Paul because I really like them. And I prefer the Agile headstock to the Gibson and Epiphone ones anyway, so that's not even an issue

Thanks for the suggestions - I'll definitely look into the Gibsons
#9
Then the Swinesheads are definitively better value for money. What are they, like £50 a pop? Sounds good to me
#10
Yeah. Well, £60 because I want them covered but don't want the hassle of having to take the covers off the stock pickups and put them on the new ones. But still good value, and it would mean that the cost of the guitar (with the electronic upgrades as well) would come to little more than that of a stock Epi Custom. So I'm pretty chuffed about that

#12
Alright, good to know that I'm not buying some more firewood. I'll probably still upgrade all the electronics if only for the experience. I was going to get one of the AL-4000s, but they don't seem to have one with the plain top like this one, and I'd be replacing the pickups and electronics anyway, so I didn't see much point in forking out the extra cash.

Thanks everyone
#13
how much money can you get up to? including pickups.

wha's your amp?
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#14
Eh. I guess I could throw up to £100 at each pickup, but they'd have to be well worth it for that. I'd prefer to go cheaper if possible. And my amp is (or rather, will be when it gets here) a Marshall JCM900.

Edit: So I guess my total budget would be around £500.
Last edited by Denthúl at Oct 10, 2007,
#15
order an edwards from japan and be done with it.

with postage and customs, it should still be under budget if you go for one of the gibson or fender copies (as long as you don't go for the es335 copy).

http://www.ishibashi.co.jp/webshop/guitar/esp/edwards/index.htm

http://www.ishibashi-music.com/
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#16
Hmm...how good are they? Better than Epis, I'm guessing? I actually found one I like. It's not got a plain top ( ) but it doesn't look too bad in honeyburst.
#17
better than epis? are you kidding? (assuming you don't mean epi elitists )

mine is nicer than the gibson LP classic antique I tried about a fortnight ago. Seriously, they're downright badass. About as good a "gibson" as you can get without going custom shop, trying about 50 non-CS gibsons and cherry picking the nicest, or buying a Gordon Smith or high-end tokai (both of which would set you back between £800 and £1200, for an equivalent model)... and for about one third the price (of a Gibson LP standard).

the electronics could do with switching, and I'm not much a fan of the jb, but other than that, it's a seriously good guitar (also, the figured top is just a veneer over plainer maple, but that won't adversely affect the tone). You're getting them at japanese prices (you have to add postage and customs to that)- I mean, caparisons go in Japan for about £600-£700... here they go for £1500. We just get gipped on everything here...

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 10, 2007,
#18
No, no - I meant the equivalently priced Epis (like the LP Customs).

That's great to hear. I'll definitely look into one of them, though I'd probably change the bridge pickup for something a little more to my own tastes (that may go for the neck, depending on what I find) but that would probably be a long way off As long as they play well and sound good, I'm not too bothered about the look. Aesthetics are not as important as the quality of the guitar, and I'm sure I'll get over the fact that the top is figured.

And I do agree with you that we have to pay too much over here. But I like these Japanese prices. They make it sound like a lot when it's almost 70-90,000 Yen, but around £3-400 is pretty nice considering how good you say they are

I think I'll be getting this one: E-LP-92SD

Thanks for recommending them.
#19
http://www.ishibashi.co.jp/webshop/guitar/esp/edwards/elp90lts.htm

i'd consider that one instead- it's lacquer taste series, which by all accounts (i haven't tried a non-LTS one) are the ones which have the "mojo". Wider choice of colours too. Only like an extra £20 or so too...

worth thinking about anyway. Though I'd expect a non-LTS one to annihilate an epi too, obviously. Just the LTS one might annihilate it slightly more...

just bear in mind, postage and customs will likely bring the price up closer to £500, but considering you were thinking of an epi with a pickup swap, that's likely to be a similar price for a vastly superior guitar...



EDIT: I'm actually considering the black LP custom with p90's, which isn't LTS, but that's only because it's not available in the LTS... if it were, I'd go with the LTS.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#20
Seems good, and if it's for not much more, I can't see a reason not to get it instead. I'd probably remove or replace the pickguard (single-ply, no matter what colour, always looks tacky to me) but apart from that...I love it. Thanks Dave. Hopefully it won't be long before I'm in possession of one of these things.
#21
just bear in mind, sometimes there's a bit of a wait, and you have to pre-order... i had to wait about 2 weeks before mine was shipped (and it took another week after that)...

also, the binding etc. on the LTS ones is aged slightly (painted orange, basically), and the hardware is matt nickel (i think).

If that affects things. I'd prefer it not to be aged at all, to be honest, but i'll put up with it when it sounds and plays this good...

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#22
Maybe the guitar doesn't need a pickup swap. Sometimes when you buy a little cheaper you may get a pleasant surprise. I have heard nothing but good about the Agiles, and definitely love Japanese guitars.
#23
See, this is where I'd love to be able to try them out, but I'm pretty much buying blind. I do, however, trust the words of people here, so I should be alright. And if I buy anything dodgy, I'm coming for you!
#25
Quote by Dave_Mc
also, the binding etc. on the LTS ones is aged slightly (painted orange, basically), and the hardware is matt nickel (i think).

If that affects things. I'd prefer it not to be aged at all, to be honest, but i'll put up with it when it sounds and plays this good...


I just noticed this...does that mean that the hardware is aged? And...does nickel tarnish and oxidise over time?

Also...I'm not very fluent in Japanese... What kind of payment methods do they accept?
#26
it's kinda aged. it's not beaten up like the way it'd be on a relic, but yeah, it's not really shiny either. Kinda like a matt finish.

http://www.ishibashi-music.com/ (ordering info there)

they accept credit cards, or bank transfers... i prefer CC as you're covered more if anything goes wrong, and you don't have to pay a bank transfer fee (plus a similar fee to ishibashi).

EDIT: oh and i was suggesting the edwards because it's a nicer guitar than the ones you were looking at, plus it has good enough pickups that they don't need to be immediately swapped. I'd prefer bareknuckles or something like that, but for stock pickups, duncans are pretty sweet.

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#27
I like matt finishes, so that's okay. I'm guessing they only accept major credit cards? All I have is a crappy Solo debit card.

And yeah, you're right. Good stock Duncans is pretty good, especially when you look at the price. If I do upgrade them, it'd either be Swinesheads or Bare Knuckles (depending on how much I wanted to spend in a year or so) or maybe even Wizard pickups. I've heard good things about those, too

But now I think it's settled. That Edwards will be mine. All mine!!! *Evil laugh*

#28
haven't tried wizards...

swineys are nice, as are BKP's. I haven't actually tried my swineys since my duncans landed (too lazy to rewire my ibanez ), but yeah, my bareknuckles are nicer. from what I remember, the swineys are nicer too, and I have tried duncans in shops when I was using my swineys regularly, and thought the swineys were nicer. Bulldogs would be worth considering too, and cordy from UG... though the duncan '59 is pretty good for vintage tones. if you don't need modern lead tones out of the neck pickup, you mightn't need to upgrade...

i can't remember if they take debit cards or not, to be honest... but much like the bank transfer thing, it's safer by credit card. credit card companies, by law, have to go to bat on your behalf if you get swindled... banks don't.

i always just use my parents' cards, then pay them back, as I don't have a CC either. And I'll be damned if I use my Debit card over the intarwebs....
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#29
If I could convince my parents, then yeah, it'd be okay and I could use it. But they aren't particularly fond of it, seeing as I should 'get a job and get my own credit card' even though I don't really need one. But I'll have to wait a month or two anyway - have to pay for Christmas
#30
For Clen Sound i reccomend the Seymour Duncan Jazz SH2N Humbucker.

It's not really a just Jazz pick-up. It can do rock and metal - It sounds amazing.


For high gain stuff you should pick up the EMG 81.
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#31
Eh. I don't really want to get into the realm of active pickups, and I'm not a fan of the Jazz, to be honest. It just isn't to my liking.
#32
you're going to struggle wiring the 81 and jazz in the same guitar too, and lose the in-between setting...
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#33
Yeah, I know. But actives are completely out of the question. I dun like 'em that much And I happen to require the in-between setting, too. Honestly, though, I think that from my point of view an EMG 81 and a Seymour Duncan Jazz would provide me with a combination of pickups that would get me everything but what I wanted.

For now, I'll just leave the JB and '59 alone and see how things go. The '59 is a likely candidate to stay, yes, but the JB isn't quite what I'm after in a pickup. It's good, I'll give it that, but it's not for me.
#34
yeah, i was replying more to the guy who suggested them that to you... i know i'd rather have a '59 than a jazz, pretty much unless you only used your neck pickup for cleans/jazz/blues... and even then, the '59 does a pretty sterling job of that. plus considering how warm the '59 is in my edwards, i'd be concerned that a jazz would be too warm and end up being muddy...

but yeah, they're good enough to keep for the time being. I'll swap mine eventually, but not for a while yet.

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#36
http://www.ishibashi.co.jp/webshop/guitar/esp/edwards/elp90lts.htm

in vintage honeyburst

bear in mind, if you want to see them in the different colours, the esp japan website is probably better than ishibashi- http://www.espguitars.co.jp/edwards/index.html (don't worry, those pull-down menus to the left are in english once you pull them down)
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#37
Cool. Well, I think I can trust that I'm getting a good guitar if you own one as well

And thanks for that other link. I actually like the cherry sunburst more than the vintage honeyburst.

I have one final question, and then I'll be done... Does it play well straight out of the box or does it need a bit of tweaking?
#38
i had to loosen the trussrod slightly, and tighten the strings as they were slackened off for shipping. Other than that, it was grand. Could do with lowering the bridge on the bass strings a little, but haven't got round to that yet...

oh, and it took the strings until the next day to settle in so they held tuning decently.

But yeah, it came pretty well set-up out of the box, as long as you aren't scared of a little tweaking.

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#39
Awesome.

Cheers, Dave. You've been a great help, as have the others who posted here

#40
No problem, glad I could help.

Hopefully if more people buy Edwards etc. and give the shops/distributors here the metaphorical finger, we won't get ripped off as much in future.

Of course, what's more likely to happen is Gibson will sue ESP and force them to stop exporting them.

I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
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