#1
I now have a 4x12 cabinet for recording, and I'm planning on getting two mics to mic the cab. A Shure SM57, the old stand-by, and the moderately priced, large-diaphragm Audio Technica AT 3035. I plan to shove the '57 right into a cone, and put the 3035 several feet away, in front of the cab (out-of-phase). What are your favorites?

• Shure SM57 $99 USD
• Audio Technica AT 3035 $199 USD

Also, gotta choose a decent, but moderately priced micpre now. Any micpre suggestions as well?
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#3
Gotta be dynamic?

I just use 4 SM57s when I can, otherwise I only use 2.

I'm really anal about it though, I HAVE to have at least 2 mics, or I just tell the soundy where to shove it
Quote by kyrreca
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#4
Quote by Cofflecakes
Gotta be dynamic?

I just use 4 SM57s when I can, otherwise I only use 2.

I'm really anal about it though, I HAVE to have at least 2 mics, or I just tell the soundy where to shove it
Not, at all! I don't really need a dynamic mic at all, because I'm recording at pretty low SPLs. I just threw the SM57 in there because, that's what EVERYBODY since the beginning of time seems to use to mic guitar cabs with. I would actually rather go all-condenser.

Wow! Four SM57s, huh? Where do you place them all? Bet that makes for a nicely complex sound. Do you do two in-phase, and two out? And, by the way, I don't think you can EVER be TOO anal, when it comes to recording techniques.
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Last edited by LEVEL4 at Nov 6, 2007,
#5
You can be, cause I do it live too :P It ****s soundys up the wall when both guitarists want 4 channels. I bring 2 of my own SM57s, and I keep a mini mixer just incase.

Yep, 2 in, 2 out. I record with a cab using G12T-75s and Vintage 30s most of the time, so it gives a really really nice blend.
Quote by kyrreca
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#6
^ i do this to, but the secret is Sennheiser MD421 mic
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#7
I like the Sennheiser e609 more than the SM57; go take a look at one of those .
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#8
A pair of SM57's, one aimed right at a cone, on-axis, and one a few feet back, off-axis. Blend at the mixer to taste.
#9
Quote by FacingUsAll
I like the Sennheiser e609 more than the SM57; go take a look at one of those.
Thanks! Yeah, I was looking at that mic, too. Interesting. But I think I'm going with the old standard, the SM57. I was going to try the Beta 57A, but if it ain't broke . . .

And, I did want to try a large-diaphragm condenser for the "away" mic, so the AT3035 seemed like a decent, but moderately priced mic to go with. Plus, the AT3035 has a greater frequency response than the '57, at 20Hz-20kHz.

Quote by the.spine.surfs
A pair of SM57's, one aimed right at a cone, on-axis, and one a few feet back, off-axis. Blend at the mixer to taste.
Thanks! Yeah, that's pretty much EXACTLY what my friend does in his recording studio. 'Cept he uses a '57 and some hideously expensive Neumann large-diaphragm mic.

Oh, I also want to use the same two mics to mic un-amped acoustic guitars, so that's another reason I chose the large-diaphragm for the second mic, the Audio Technica AT3035 side-firing, condenser.
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Last edited by LEVEL4 at Nov 8, 2007,
#10
SM57 doesn't sound good pointed at the center of the cone. The distortion mostly happens a little outside the center of the cone.

Also, SM57 is a dynamic microphone, for close to medium micing. If you want a room microphone, you should look for a condenser. U87 is a good, but expensive option.
#11
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#12
i would use a condenser to mic my amp, but in a garage the reverb is terrible; really lowers the sound quality.

so i use a good ol' sm57.
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#14
In the studio recently I close mic'd the amp with a 57 and set up a Rode NT-1 in the top corner of the room pointing towards a point just in front of the amp. Blended with the 57 it gave a really nice tone, more "natural" than the 57 on it's own.
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#15
as mentioned a lot, sm57 you can't go wrong with, other things you can try, a 58. sounds stupid, but sometimes they work. sennheiser E609 is a great mic, large diaphragm and really catches a great sound. Cofflecakes, have you treid 2 57s and 2 609s with one on each speaker? seeing as you mentioned 2 and 2, i used this combo with a cab with the same speaker combo as yours but in 2x12 format the last recording i did and got a great sound, you might wana try it.

Also for recording, something like a Neumann u87 or on a real tight budget the Rode NT1 behind the amp (if its open backed) with the phase reversed can sound fantastic when blended in with something like a closemic 57/609 and something like an AKG c1000 or other SDC about 2 feet infront of the speaker.

EDIT: if you're after recording acoustic guitars as well, look away from LDCs and look at SDCs, much better, more precise sound for acoustic guitar and i find they're much nicer for mic'ing the front of an amp with.
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Last edited by hairball at Nov 7, 2007,
#16
nope, sure haven't! I personally haven't got much in the way of mics, just 3 working SM57s, 1 SM58, 1 JTS NX2, 3 Behringer SM58 clones, and Behringer C2 mics.

Believe it or not, the SM58 clones are killer for the price. The C2s work pretty good for overheads, and the JTS is good for the bass drum, but nothing else.

I saved a few of the posts in notepad, so I can try them out when I go into a "real" studio or get some money for some new mics
Quote by kyrreca
If your EQ looks like this your audience will look like this
#17
Lots of cool suggestions, tips and ideas! Thanks! There was an AWESOME article, I mean f*cking AWESOME article, in US/international print edition of the August 2007 issue of Sound on Sound magazine, all about pro cabinet-miking techniques. They interviewed 40 of the industry's most-acclaimed producers, who freely shared their cab-miking secrets. Not sure if they put the complete article in their online version, but the the print version was f*cking amazing. An extremely detailed, and lengthy article.

Sound on Sound, "Guitar Amp Recording: Pro Techniques Put to the Test"

Quote by hairball
if you're after recording acoustic guitars as well, look away from LDCs and look at SDCs, much better, more precise sound for acoustic guitar and i find they're much nicer for mic'ing the front of an amp with.
What are LDCs and SDCs? For acoustic guitar recording, I'm only planning to mic an UN-amplified acoustic. No pick-ups, no amp. I was going to point the 57 at the sound hole, and put the AT3035 (or whatever I end up buying) nearer the neck to catch some fret noise.
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Last edited by LEVEL4 at Nov 8, 2007,
#18
Quote by FacingUsAll
I like the Sennheiser e609 more than the SM57; go take a look at one of those .


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#19
Do Behringer do SM57 clones?
If so, which model are they?
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#20
Quote by Dr. B
Do Behringer do SM57 clones?
If so, which model are they?


They do 58 clones. If you unscrew the pop shield they're essentially 57s.
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#21
shure mics are great
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#22
Quote by LEVEL4
What are LDCs and SDCs?


LDC - Large Diaphragm Condensor - your Neumann U87/AKG C414 etc... the bigger 'square' recording mic's if you will.

SDC - Small Diaphragm Condensor - Rode NT-5/AKG C1000 etc... long thin mic's that are generally seen used for drum kit overheads and hi-hats along with acoustic guitars and strings/pianos.

For acoustic guitars i find the 2 best places for a really good sound, with an SDC (i use C1000s mainly), are around the 12th-14th fret or right in front of the bridge, the problem with the mic being infront of the bridge is it can get in the way of your right hand sometimes.

Quote by Cofflecakes
nope, sure haven't! I personally haven't got much in the way of mics, just 3 working SM57s, 1 SM58, 1 JTS NX2, 3 Behringer SM58 clones, and Behringer C2 mics.

Believe it or not, the SM58 clones are killer for the price. The C2s work pretty good for overheads, and the JTS is good for the bass drum, but nothing else.

I saved a few of the posts in notepad, so I can try them out when I go into a "real" studio or get some money for some new mics


Here's a thought, next time you feel like it and if you have enough cables/inputs to play with, 2 57s, one on each of the speakers, and 2 58 clones on the other 2, that should give you a really rounded sound, you should be able to hear the difference between the 57s and the 58s because there is a lot more difference between them than people say, a 58 without the 'ball' ontop is NOT a 57 for example. also, try one of the C2s right in the centre of the top 2 speakers, right between the 2, about 2 feet away from the amp. mixed together you could get a killer sound from that. seeing as you said you like all of your speakers mic'd up, also try to get your hands on another 57 and go with your 4 (although 3 are clones) 58s right in the centre of the cones, and the 4 57s about 3 inches out from the centre. or even go 2 and 2 for each... with your selection of mics you have a lot of options, you can really have some fun!
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Quote by silhouettica
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Last edited by hairball at Nov 8, 2007,
#23
and some 1000+ nice ribbon mics for distance mic'ing like Page used also - good for a mixdown
#24
Quote by timi_hendrix
They do 58 clones. If you unscrew the pop shield they're essentially 57s.


So which ones are they?
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#25
Quote by davedoom
SM57 industry standard - can NOT go wrong
Yeah, I know that's true. I really should just buy the '57 regardless. But I kinda wanted to go SDC instead there, too (yeah, like I'm smarter than every professional recording engineer in the world).

Quote by hairball
LDC - Large Diaphragm Condensor - your Neumann U87/AKG C414 etc... the bigger 'square' recording mic's if you will.

SDC - Small Diaphragm Condensor - Rode NT-5/AKG C1000 etc... long thin mic's that are generally seen used for drum kit overheads and hi-hats along with acoustic guitars and strings/pianos.
Wow! Lots of great information and ideas there! Thanks! But, which MODERATELY priced LDC (e.g., $200) would you recommend??? I've GOT to buy a mic and a micpre TOMORROW! I'm getting such weird results from this RE10 dynamic mic I had laying around (it's a mic designed for electronic news gathering), and this stupid $10 matching transformer. I think I'm going to get the large-diaphragm AT3035 so I can capture some real low-frequency stuff right away. That is, unless you can suggest a better LDS in that price range. Also, what cheap SDC would you recommend? I already own a $300 AT835B short shotgun SDC (designed for motion picture location dialogue).
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Last edited by LEVEL4 at Nov 9, 2007,
#26
Excuse the double-post, but I really wanted to update this thread . . .

LARGE-DIAPHRAGM CONDENSORS [LDCs]:

Audio Technica AT3035 $199 USD

Well, I decided to go with the AT3035, and bought one at Guitar Center's Black Friday sale at 20% off, and boy am I glad I did! It's a flat, accurate, side-address LDC, and from initial recordings, it seems to be just what I was looking for in a guitar cabinet-recording mic. I decided against the Sennheiser e609, mainly because I wanted an LDC with a wider frequency response on the low end, and the AT3035 is pretty wide at 20Hz-20kHz, whereas the e609 is only 40Hz to 18kHz.

Now, I'm trying to pick out a moderately priced SDC to complement the AT3035. Although I haven't really checked out all the mid-priced SDCs on the market yet, the new Rode M3 (man, that thing is huge) may be a possibility (also $199). I'm looking to have two mics, one LDC and one SDC, so I can try miking my cabinets and acoustic guitars using the "M-W" technique. Other SDCs I'm now considering:

SMALL-DIAPHRAGM CONDENSORS [SDCs]:

• Rode NT5 $219 USD
• Sennheiser e614 $199 USD
• Sennheiser e914 $379 USD
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Last edited by LEVEL4 at Nov 29, 2007,
#27
Quote by LEVEL4
Excuse the double-post, but I really wanted to update this thread . . .

LARGE-DIAPHRAGM CONDENSORS [LDCs]:

Audio Technica AT3035 $199 USD

Well, I decided to go with the AT3035, and bought one at Guitar Center's Black Friday sale at 20% off, and boy am I glad I did! It's a flat, accurate, side-address LDC, and from initial recordings, it seems to be just what I was looking for in a guitar cabinet-recording mic. I decided against the Sennheiser e609, mainly because I wanted an LDC with a wider frequency response on the low end, and the AT3035 is pretty wide at 20Hz-20kHz, whereas the e609 is only 40Hz to 18kHz.

Now, I'm trying to pick out a moderately priced SDC to complement the AT3035. Although I haven't really checked out all the mid-priced SDCs on the market yet, the new Rode M3 (man, that thing is huge) may be a possibility (also $199). I'm looking to have two mics, one LDC and one SDC, so I can try miking my cabinets and acoustic guitars using the "M-W" technique. Other SDCs I'm now considering:

SMALL-DIAPHRAGM CONDENSORS [SDCs]:

• Rode NT5 $219 USD
• Sennheiser e614 $199 USD
• Sennheiser e914 $379 USD


Well, I have the e609 on the way, and I have tried one extensively before using. Fantastic for cab.
You're worrying to much about frequency response, when you shouldn't have to.

40hz is much too low for guitars already, I mean, that's the frequency of the low E of the bass guitar. Your speakers probably can't even push out frequencies that low, nor will the guitar have those frequencies present. Humans can barely hear 20Khz anyways.
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Last edited by Reincaster at Nov 29, 2007,