#1
So, I don't like much neo-classical, but this piece really caught my ear. I decided to learn it, but after looking at the tab, I almost fainted.

There are a number of techniques that are needed to play this correctly, and I think I've got 'em...

Sweep picking (of course).
Bending/vibrato.
Economy picking/alt picking.
Faster left hand fingering.
Stretches over the fretboard.

I've always been into Gilmour type playing, so I've got bending down pat. No need to even mention it. I've been an economy picker for longer than I can remember, so no problems there.

I get the concept of vibrato, but I'm not all too good at it. Tips and tricks here would be much appreciated.

So, what's left for me to learn and master is sweep picking (Oh lord, take me now...), getting my left hand faster, and stretching over the fretboard.

So, let the anarchy begin.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
#2
paul gilbert lessons are good for stretches. he is a freak at that stuff.
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#4
Question about sweeping...

Do you actually take your fingers off and put them back into place, or do you keep them on the string, but not fretted, to create a "rolling" motion?

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
#5
Quote by MusicalMinority
Question about sweeping...

Do you actually take your fingers off and put them back into place, or do you keep them on the string, but not fretted, to create a "rolling" motion?

You should strive to lift them as little as possible (but enough to mute the string of course) in my opinion. Always try to use as small and economic movements as possible.
#6
Thanks.

I've got some basic sweeping patterns mastered now, save for ones that involve my pinky.

Speaking of which, how does one sweep with pinky anyways? My ring finger always wants to play the string that my pinky is, and I can never keep my fingers on the right strings for more than two sweeps at most.

Now, for a question on stretching/string skipping...
How in the heck do I finger/pick this?

|------10-15p10---------10-11p10----|-------10----------13-11-10----------|
|---------------11---------------13-|-11-13----13-11-10----------13-11-10-|
|*-12---------------12--------------|-------------------------------------|
|*----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|

                                                                         x3
|-----10-15p10----------10-11p10----|-------10----------15-13-11-----------|
|--------------11----11----------13-|-11-13----13-11-10----------15-13-11--|
|-12--------------12----------------|-------------------------------------*|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------*|
|-----------------------------------|--------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|--------------------------------------|


Thanks again for all you people's help.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
Last edited by MusicalMinority at Nov 9, 2007,
#7
well on that first bar i would pick the 12th fret wihta downstroke and also the 10th on the E string with a down stroke then sweep the next 4 notes, thats as far as i feel like telling right now im too tired, but do what feels the best for you
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#8
Quote by MusicalMinority
Thanks.

I've got some basic sweeping patterns mastered now, save for ones that involve my pinky.

Speaking of which, how does one sweep with pinky anyways? My ring finger always wants to play the string that my pinky is, and I can never keep my fingers on the right strings for more than two sweeps at most.

Now, for a question on stretching/string skipping...
How in the heck do I finger/pick this?

|------10-15p10---------10-11p10----|-------10----------13-11-10----------|
|---------------11---------------13-|-11-13----13-11-10----------13-11-10-|
|*-12---------------12--------------|-------------------------------------|
|*----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------|

x3
|-----10-15p10----------10-11p10----|-------10----------15-13-11-----------|
|--------------11----11----------13-|-11-13----13-11-10----------15-13-11--|
|-12--------------12----------------|-------------------------------------*|
|-----------------------------------|-------------------------------------*|
|-----------------------------------|--------------------------------------|
|-----------------------------------|--------------------------------------|


Thanks again for all you people's help.



thats wrong, its in standard tuning.
#9
Quote by sk8rMeTaLhEaD27
thats wrong, its in standard tuning.


It's tabbed for standard playing, but it's in Eb standard.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
#11
dude start playing rockschool grades they really help getting your techniques down nicely. a lot of people skip certain grades but it is really worth the effort. especially if youhave a teacher. i'm over seas now and trying to get a piece down by myself and it hard but a good experience
#12
Quote by sk8rMeTaLhEaD27
thats wrong, its in standard tuning.


What are you talking about?

You can play that in E or Eb. The sound of each notes just changes when you tune down the strings.
Get baked, study theory.

Quote by :-D
Why are you bringing Cm into this?
#13
Quote by jimmypage1904
dude start playing rockschool grades they really help getting your techniques down nicely. a lot of people skip certain grades but it is really worth the effort. especially if youhave a teacher. i'm over seas now and trying to get a piece down by myself and it hard but a good experience

Link, perhaps? I'm definitely interested.

If it's mostly theory-based, I'm not going to be in much use of it, since I've been studying piano/theory for like 9 years now.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
#14
If you can economy pick, you should be able to pick up sweeping quickly.. theres a couple lessons on this site you can look at that would be helpful.

Also, you never learned vibrato? The MOST important and fundamental technique? You don't even know what it is?
#15
Quote by MusicalMinority
I get the concept of vibrato, but I'm not all too good at it. Tips and tricks here would be much appreciated.

Yup. Also, let me further clarify.

Vibrato is something I can do, and I use it well and often. Think Gilmour or Gilbert wide vibrato runs. Now, how do I refine my raw technique to be able to manipulate all types of vibrato?

Here's a list of specifics I'd like to learn...
-Wide, sweeping, slow vibrato. Got it down pat. No problemo.
-Narrow, piercing, rapid vibrato, like what happens when you push down the strings behind the tune-o-matic bridge and in front of the stopbar, but only using fingers.
-An in-between vibrato, for things that are brownish, not really wide, nor norrow.
-Anything else?

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE
#16
Marty and Jason had quite agressive vibrato sometimes, so just really dig in and rape the string, lol. also they used alot of different dynamics and little articulations that i find gave their melodies alot more flavour, like sliding down into your target note very quickly/fluently from some other note above, and adding some sweet vibrato, so listen closely for things like that. and Marty's uniqe bend technique was another great element, he prebends the string from an interesting note, drops it down very quickly and then bends back up. and his vibrato IN bends i havent picked up on well yet, because it can be so damn intense, my fingers are blistered from learning Devil Take Tomorow lol.
yea so just focus on things like that and it should help you get the song down well, good luck!
#17
have a look at the sweeping on altitudes, its not as hard as you might think plus it helps loads with all the other stuff, and the vibrato at the beginning is really good
#18
The wide vibrato will serve you well with these guys. Honestly, use whatever vibrato you feel like when you're playing something, it's just your style. For stretching, I worked on finger stretches with "Message in a Bottle" by The Police, then worked with Gilbert's stuff. I still do MiaB as a finger stretcher in warm-ups. Left hand speed will only come with practice, and if you aren't already using a metronome go get one.
#19
Make sure you stretch out your hands and warm at least 15 minutes or so before attempting any wide stretch patterns to avoid injury.
One way I got very wide patterns down was to run symmetrical shapes descending and ascending like index finger on the 9th fret, middle on the 12th, and pinkie on the 15th. This really helped me get used to that kind of stretch. You could also move that to higher frets like start with you index on the 12th fret to start and then 15 for middle and 19 for pinkie.

Check out the third solo in Nevermore's Enemies of Reality for an example of this as well. (I believe its the third solo i could be wrong)
#20
Joe Satriani's Endless Rain is also a great stretching exercise. Just make sure to warm up properly first, as the guy above me said.