#1
Do any of you guys know about Video Lessons for the Main parts of these Songs

Warrant- Heaven, Sometimes she Cries, Cherry Pie

Skid Row- 18 and life

And the solos to:

Warrant- All of the same ones

Skid Row- I remember You

And any other cool 80's Ballady Type songs. i couldnt find any for those (i found a bunch more for other songs) So any help would be great.
#3
Quote by whitenihilist
Have you tried Youtube? they have pretty mutch everything.


They didnt have anything that i could find. Its hard for me to do it by ear (i practice on songs i dont especially like or want to play perfectly) and no one actually teaches it, just covers it.
#5
Quote by Tubyboulin
They didnt have anything that i could find. Its hard for me to do it by ear (i practice on songs i dont especially like or want to play perfectly) and no one actually teaches it, just covers it.

Why is everyone obsessed with video lessons?

It might be hard by ear. but you'll never get any better if you don't try. The guitar is a musical instrument, your ears are at least as imporant as your fingers, if not more so.
Video lessons are great for odd techniques and the basic mechanics, bur for general songs they're pretty pointless. You're learning to play a song, if you focus on the bare mechanics of the process then invariably the end product ie the sound itself will suffer - a quick look at youtube will illustrate that.

Look at the tab, listen to the song and try and match the two up, if it seems too hard then pick an easier song...the more you do it the better you'll get. Plus if you get some basic theory under your belt you'll be a lot better equipped to work things out by ear even without tabs.

However, if you're relying on video lessons then you're never going to get any better, all you're doing is constantly reinforcing your belief that you need them. Best thing to do is ditch them completely for a while and concentrate on developing the skills that you're going to need.
Actually called Mark!

Quote by TNfootballfan62
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#6
Quote by GuitarMunky
Here is a great site for video lessons...

Discover Guitar Online

It doesnt have the songs you mentioned, but you can request them in the forum.

Heres an 80s metal riff:

Ratt: Lay it Down Main Riff


Isnt taht Discover guitar thing a pay website? I tried to watch a video and it asked for a password...

And to Steven Seagul, yeah i do practice training my ear as i said. but i want to learn these specific songs Right, instead of learning them how i think they are, then actually figuring it out down the road and have to change the way i play it which can be a bit difficult depending on how long ive been doing the song.
#7
Quote by Tubyboulin
Isnt taht Discover guitar thing a pay website? I tried to watch a video and it asked for a password...

And to Steven Seagul, yeah i do practice training my ear as i said. but i want to learn these specific songs Right, instead of learning them how i think they are, then actually figuring it out down the road and have to change the way i play it which can be a bit difficult depending on how long ive been doing the song.


Yeah, that did come across a bit harsh, I just feel that you're ultimately creating more problems for yourself with video lessons. With most songs I really don't think there's anything a video can teach you that a tab and the song itself can't. The tab shows you where your fingers go, the song tells you what it's supposed to sound like. Admittedly faster parts can be a bit more difficult to pick out and match to the tab but it's not impossible, you just have to work on them a little more than the slower parts. I wonder if you're not giving yourself enough credit here...you CAN do this, no question. As far as playing something "right" goes, as long as it sounds then to a certain degree it doesn't matter too much how you play it.

Cherry pie is a dead easy song - Warrant were awful! It's pretty much Led Zeppelin's Heartbreaker riff in powerchords. Seriously though, if you listen to the song and learn the tab then you can usually tell if it's wrong. Also, even if there IS a video lesson for it you've got no guarantee that it's correct.

Again, 18 and life is pretty straightforward...I always found it pretty easy to get to grips with a song I knew well. Don't get me wrong, it still took me a while to get there but some of the most valuable learning I did was through the blood and sweat of working stuff out. Forcing yourself to make that connection between the tab and the sound is so much more valuable and rewarding than having it spoonfed to you. It may take a little longer, but you'll learn it far better.

I don't want to be a twat, I just don't want you to miss an oppurtunity to get better
Actually called Mark!

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#8
Quote by steven seagull
Yeah, that did come across a bit harsh, I just feel that you're ultimately creating more problems for yourself with video lessons. With most songs I really don't think there's anything a video can teach you that a tab and the song itself can't. The tab shows you where your fingers go, the song tells you what it's supposed to sound like. Admittedly faster parts can be a bit more difficult to pick out and match to the tab but it's not impossible, you just have to work on them a little more than the slower parts. I wonder if you're not giving yourself enough credit here...you CAN do this, no question. As far as playing something "right" goes, as long as it sounds then to a certain degree it doesn't matter too much how you play it.

Cherry pie is a dead easy song - Warrant were awful! It's pretty much Led Zeppelin's Heartbreaker riff in powerchords. Seriously though, if you listen to the song and learn the tab then you can usually tell if it's wrong. Also, even if there IS a video lesson for it you've got no guarantee that it's correct.

Again, 18 and life is pretty straightforward...I always found it pretty easy to get to grips with a song I knew well. Don't get me wrong, it still took me a while to get there but some of the most valuable learning I did was through the blood and sweat of working stuff out. Forcing yourself to make that connection between the tab and the sound is so much more valuable and rewarding than having it spoonfed to you. It may take a little longer, but you'll learn it far better.

I don't want to be a twat, I just don't want you to miss an oppurtunity to get better


Ill give er a shot then, thanks
#9
Quote by Tubyboulin
Isnt taht Discover guitar thing a pay website? I tried to watch a video and it asked for a password...

And to Steven Seagul, yeah i do practice training my ear as i said. but i want to learn these specific songs Right, instead of learning them how i think they are, then actually figuring it out down the road and have to change the way i play it which can be a bit difficult depending on how long ive been doing the song.

The solos are for subscribers... everything else is free.
shred is gaudy music
#10
Quote by steven seagull
Yeah, that did come across a bit harsh, I just feel that you're ultimately creating more problems for yourself with video lessons. With most songs I really don't think there's anything a video can teach you that a tab and the song itself can't. The tab shows you where your fingers go, the song tells you what it's supposed to sound like. Admittedly faster parts can be a bit more difficult to pick out and match to the tab but it's not impossible, you just have to work on them a little more than the slower parts. I wonder if you're not giving yourself enough credit here...you CAN do this, no question. As far as playing something "right" goes, as long as it sounds then to a certain degree it doesn't matter too much how you play it.

Cherry pie is a dead easy song - Warrant were awful! It's pretty much Led Zeppelin's Heartbreaker riff in powerchords. Seriously though, if you listen to the song and learn the tab then you can usually tell if it's wrong. Also, even if there IS a video lesson for it you've got no guarantee that it's correct.



Actually video lessons can be very helpful. I've seen the results myself. I have given my students some of the videos from DGO ....and found that when they came back the next week, they could play song .... like perfectly... and it sounded great too. These same students would learn from tab... and would end up not being able to play the song unless the tab was right in front of them. Even then it sounded like they were reading. Tabs also have a very high rate of innacuracy. At least with the video lesson, you can tell right away if its right or not, becuase you can hear it.

I totally disagree with the notion that learning from a video causes problems... thats completely untrue. Its just a learning aid, just as tabs are..... its just a newer form, that your not used to. And yea, there are some really bad ones out there as well....everyone with a webcam and guitar seems to be making them nowadays... but if you find a good site that is professionally done, there is alot you can learn from them.
shred is gaudy music
#11
Quote by steven seagull
Why is everyone obsessed with video lessons?

It might be hard by ear. but you'll never get any better if you don't try. The guitar is a musical instrument, your ears are at least as imporant as your fingers, if not more so.
Video lessons are great for odd techniques and the basic mechanics, bur for general songs they're pretty pointless. You're learning to play a song, if you focus on the bare mechanics of the process then invariably the end product ie the sound itself will suffer - a quick look at youtube will illustrate that.

Look at the tab, listen to the song and try and match the two up, if it seems too hard then pick an easier song...the more you do it the better you'll get. Plus if you get some basic theory under your belt you'll be a lot better equipped to work things out by ear even without tabs.

However, if you're relying on video lessons then you're never going to get any better, all you're doing is constantly reinforcing your belief that you need them. Best thing to do is ditch them completely for a while and concentrate on developing the skills that you're going to need.


Your dissing learning by video but promoting tab tab is not ideal at all. I recommend learning to read proper music. Tab shows you one thing, and thats where to put your fingers. Music shows what notes to play and the timing of the notes. Fast sections of the songs you cant quite get down by just listening can be played straight away with music because it shows you how to count it out. You are playing by notes with music and playing by numbers with tab, music is the way to go I believe.
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#12
Quote by radiantmoon
Your dissing learning by video but promoting tab tab is not ideal at all. I recommend learning to read proper music. Tab shows you one thing, and thats where to put your fingers. Music shows what notes to play and the timing of the notes. Fast sections of the songs you cant quite get down by just listening can be played straight away with music because it shows you how to count it out. You are playing by notes with music and playing by numbers with tab, music is the way to go I believe.


I think anyway that helps you learn is the way to go. But yeah, for the serious musician, I would highly recommend reading notation.
shred is gaudy music
#13
Quote by GuitarMunky
I think anyway that helps you learn is the way to go. But yeah, for the serious musician, I would highly recommend reading notation.


I think any musician will benefit from reading music and will progress a lot faster than if they were to just read tabs. Its not even hard to read music, people seem to think that it is.
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#14
Quote by radiantmoon
I think any musician will benefit from reading music and will progress a lot faster than if they were to just read tabs. Its not even hard to read music, people seem to think that it is.

I agree that they will benefit, and I consider it incredibly important for anyone that wants to study music seriously. but for alot of people, especially those that just want to pick up the guitar and play for fun, its not necessary... and from my experience they often progress slower because they are dealing with something that takes work to get good at... and that they dont want to do in the 1st place. Also, the repertoire of music that they will be reading it 1st isn't incredibly inspiring.

when it comes time to study theory though, the person who can read standard notation will have a huge advantage... and will learn faster than someone that just learned from tabs. If thats what you mean... then I agree with you.

So yeah, reading music is good. But for some its just not necessary. for others it is. Just depends on what you want to do.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Dec 11, 2007,
#15
Quote by GuitarMunky
I agree that they will benefit, and I consider it incredibly important for anyone that wants to study music seriously. but for alot of people, especially those that just want to pick up the guitar and play for fun, its not necessary... and from my experience they often progress slower because they are dealing with something that takes work to get good at... and that they dont want to do in the 1st place. Also, the repertoire of music that they will be reading it 1st isn't incredibly inspiring.

when it comes time to study theory though, the person who can read standard notation will have a huge advantage... and will learn faster than someone that just learned from tabs. If thats what you mean... then I agree with you.

So yeah, reading music is good. But for some its just not necessary. for others it is. Just depends on what you want to do.


People want to play the guitar and dont want to put in the work behind it. They start trying to play tabs like little wing when they cant even play the melody to love me tender. With music you have to gradualy progress so that you are always playing at your level. You will find the guitarist who knows 101 bits and pieces of their favourite song because they havent learnt the fundamentals and can never play anything from start to finish. So I agree with you, if you want to be a mediocre guitar player just look up the tabs so you can get instant gratifaction. And i disagree with you on the point of learning slower, once I started reading music I progressed way faster than I ever did from reading tab.
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#16
I guess I don't like video lessons because i see them as being too focussed on the mechanics of playing stuff as opposed to the sound, all "Okay, now put this finger here on this fret and move this finger to here" etc. Even if they do mention stuff like notes and intervals chances are you're not going to be paying attention, having said that maybe I've just seen some crappy ones.

I've seen a few people posting stuff like "I learn visually so i prefer video lessons", and in all honesty if that's the case then it's time to quit, whether you feel you learn better visually or not music is all about sounds. I doubt there's many people who flat out can't learn from tabs or even work things out by ear, they just haven't learned to do it yet.

I personally don't have a problem with tabs as long as people still learn the theory behind them, bottom line is it's just a different way of transferring music to the printed medium. They're nowhere near as useful as standard notation as they don't contain as much information, and also less versatile as they only apply to guitar, but I don't feel that there's anything intrinsically wrong with using them.
Actually called Mark!

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#17
Quote by radiantmoon
People want to play the guitar and dont want to put in the work behind it. They start trying to play tabs like little wing when they cant even play the melody to love me tender. With music you have to gradualy progress so that you are always playing at your level. You will find the guitarist who knows 101 bits and pieces of their favourite song because they havent learnt the fundamentals and can never play anything from start to finish. So I agree with you, if you want to be a mediocre guitar player just look up the tabs so you can get instant gratifaction. And i disagree with you on the point of learning slower, once I started reading music I progressed way faster than I ever did from reading tab.


1st of all you DONT agree.... because I never said anything about being mediocre, and really Im not sure why you feel the need to insult people that dont learn the same way as you. I know people that can't read a note,but are incredible players.... far above mediocre.

As far as learning to read. Like I said everyone is different.... different situations, different goals. The approach that works for you, is the right approach..... for YOU, but it may not be for someone else.

Advocating something like reading music is commendable, just remember that there alot of players out there that dont read, and many of them are really good. insulting them by saying they are only mediocre because they cant read music is just plain wrong.

I know people that read music very well, but sound horrible...... does that mean reading music makes you mediocre? Ofcourse not, that would be a completely ignorant point of view. You really have to be open minded enough to realize that there are many valid approaches to learning music, and playing the guitar.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Dec 11, 2007,
#18
Quote by steven seagull
I guess I don't like video lessons because i see them as being too focussed on the mechanics of playing stuff as opposed to the sound, all "Okay, now put this finger here on this fret and move this finger to here" etc. Even if they do mention stuff like notes and intervals chances are you're not going to be paying attention, having said that maybe I've just seen some crappy ones.

I've seen a few people posting stuff like "I learn visually so i prefer video lessons", and in all honesty if that's the case then it's time to quit, whether you feel you learn better visually or not music is all about sounds. I doubt there's many people who flat out can't learn from tabs or even work things out by ear, they just haven't learned to do it yet.

I personally don't have a problem with tabs as long as people still learn the theory behind them, bottom line is it's just a different way of transferring music to the printed medium. They're nowhere near as useful as standard notation as they don't contain as much information, and also less versatile as they only apply to guitar, but I don't feel that there's anything intrinsically wrong with using them.


There is definitely not anything wrong with using tabs, video lessons, books, or standard notation (or anything that helps you learn guitar/ music). You get what you can out of any particular lesson / lesson format. I dont feel a lesson has to teach EVERYTHING at once. If you learn a song, but you dont learn the theory behind it, thats perfectly fine. If you really want to learn the theory behind it, you will. There are lots of resources out there, including private lessons and classes, or material on the web. Why knock any of it, when its all beneficial in someway, to someone. I think alot of people get a little too self righteous when it comes to what is the "proper" way to learn. I think its better to be open minded. Share what you know is good, but dont put down others that do it differently.
shred is gaudy music
#19
Quote by GuitarMunky
There is definitely not anything wrong with using tabs, video lessons, books, or standard notation (or anything that helps you learn guitar/ music). You get what you can out of any particular lesson / lesson format. I dont feel a lesson has to teach EVERYTHING at once. If you learn a song, but you dont learn the theory behind it, thats perfectly fine. If you really want to learn the theory behind it, you will. There are lots of resources out there, including private lessons and classes, or material on the web. Why knock any of it, when its all beneficial in someway, to someone. I think alot of people get a little too self righteous when it comes to what is the "proper" way to learn. I think its better to be open minded. Share what you know is good, but dont put down others that do it differently.

I'm just talking about the general concept of "learning to play the guitar"...you can't really learn to play without some theory. Without it all you're doing is learning to mimic movements, it's not much different to a parrot learning to talk...you can reproduce the sounds but you've got no real understanding of what you're doing. Learning a bit of theory as you go along makes everything so much easier as you can see things that are common to lots of different pieces, styles and genres.
Actually called Mark!

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#20
Quote by steven seagull
I'm just talking about the general concept of "learning to play the guitar"...you can't really learn to play without some theory. Without it all you're doing is learning to mimic movements, it's not much different to a parrot learning to talk...you can reproduce the sounds but you've got no real understanding of what you're doing. Learning a bit of theory as you go along makes everything so much easier as you can see things that are common to lots of different pieces, styles and genres.



Again I agree that learning theory is good, and I agree with your listed benefits of it......I just dont understand why you think that someone who doesn't learn theory is like a parrot. It still takes intelligence to play by ear. Your still engaging your mind in it. Your doing more than mimicking movements.... your listening. To listen to something and recreate it accurately....... that takes intelligence. I totally disagree with the statement " you cant really learn to play without some theory"..... you absolutely can, and people do all the time.

Take a listen to Wes Montgomery..... If you know any parrots that can play like that, Id like to hear them. If fact, it would be hard to find someone that knows their theory that could play like that.

The only problem I really have with what your saying is that you seem to think that anyone that doesn't study theory is somehow less of a musician than those that do. Regardless of the benefits of studying theory..... that just isn't true.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Dec 11, 2007,
#21
Quote by GuitarMunky
1st of all you DONT agree.... because I never said anything about being mediocre, and really Im not sure why you feel the need to insult people that dont learn the same way as you. I know people that can't read a note,but are incredible players.... far above mediocre.

As far as learning to read. Like I said everyone is different.... different situations, different goals. The approach that works for you, is the right approach..... for YOU, but it may not be for someone else.

Advocating something like reading music is commendable, just remember that there alot of players out there that dont read, and many of them are really good. insulting them by saying they are only mediocre because they cant read music is just plain wrong.

I know people that read music very well, but sound horrible...... does that mean reading music makes you mediocre? Ofcourse not, that would be a completely ignorant point of view. You really have to be open minded enough to realize that there are many valid approaches to learning music, and playing the guitar.


First off there is no reason to get angry, I do not think I am better than anyone. My point is, Music notation is a lot better than tab, wether you see that or not. Tab gives you one thing, and that is where to put your fingers. Music tells you the notes your playing and the timing of those notes. The right approach for you line is a cop out, you will find that the right approach for most guitar players that are learning is the easy one, just look up the tabs. Guitar playing takes a lot of hard work and many people dont want to put that work in and then wonder why they have got nowhere, or are at the same playing level they have been for years. Ofcourse there are great players who dont read music or have never received a lesson in their life, but for every 1 of those players there are 2 or 3 that are mediocre because the right approach for them was to just learn internet tabs to their favourite songs and have no one there to correct their bad technique. I have seen guitar players refuse to use their pinky because it doesnt feel right to them, realistically they just havent taken the time to let it develop it, should they just neglet it because this is the right way for them? I have seen the same thing with people refusing to learn barre chords because they feel unnatuaral at first, but in the bigger picture barre chords are crucial. What we percieve as the RIGHT way is not always the BEST way. Back to my main point, reading music is superior to reading tab. You can learn off tab, its your choice, but the fact is music notation gives you a lot more information and you will progress at a faster rate with it. Ofcourse, this is all just my opinion
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.
#22
Quote by radiantmoon
First off there is no reason to get angry, I do not think I am better than anyone. My point is, Music notation is a lot better than tab, wether you see that or not. Tab gives you one thing, and that is where to put your fingers. Music tells you the notes your playing and the timing of those notes. The right approach for you line is a cop out, you will find that the right approach for most guitar players that are learning is the easy one, just look up the tabs. Guitar playing takes a lot of hard work and many people dont want to put that work in and then wonder why they have got nowhere, or are at the same playing level they have been for years. Ofcourse there are great players who dont read music or have never received a lesson in their life, but for every 1 of those players there are 2 or 3 that are mediocre because the right approach for them was to just learn internet tabs to their favourite songs and have no one there to correct their bad technique. I have seen guitar players refuse to use their pinky because it doesnt feel right to them, realistically they just havent taken the time to let it develop it, should they just neglet it because this is the right way for them? I have seen the same thing with people refusing to learn barre chords because they feel unnatuaral at first, but in the bigger picture barre chords are crucial. What we percieve as the RIGHT way is not always the BEST way. Back to my main point, reading music is superior to reading tab. You can learn off tab, its your choice, but the fact is music notation gives you a lot more information and you will progress at a faster rate with it. Ofcourse, this is all just my opinion


1st on all, im not angry, and the thing is, im on your side when it comes to pushing the benefits of reading music.... I just choose not too take an elitist attitude about it, which words like "superior" and "alot better" convey. I think the difference between good players and bad players has less to do with whether or not they can read music , and more to do with the individuals themselves.

Your example of how for every good person that cant read, there are 2 or 3 more that are "mediocre" can easily be flipped around and applied to those that can read notation. I've come across alot of people that could read well, and understand theory..... but when it comes to playing.... they just didnt have it.......they didnt sound good. I certainly dont blame that on the fact that they can read.

Another thing to consider is inspiration. I've taught alot of kids that at 1st wanted nothing to do with reading. So they start off learning songs, and things that inspire them. They start getting good and a year or so later, guess what? They want to know how to read! Then they get into reading and do it for real because the want to. Same goes for learning theory.

So who is to say what route a guitarist must take when learning the instrument. There are many paths, take the one that suits you, and let others discover their own.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Dec 11, 2007,
#23
Wow guys, the threadstarter just wanted some video lessons and Munky just wanted to pimp his site!

radiantmoon, I really don't think GuitarMunky is angry.

Powertabs (and even good text tabs) do give the timing of the notes if you cant pick it up by ear.

Obviously people who don't learn to read when they should, don't learn bar chords when they should, and don't use their pinky when they should are lazy. Of course, if they play for a bit of fun and just to relax and kill time then these things may not be necessary. If it's holding them back then it's not the right approach.

Also, your last couple of sentences contradict each other ("the fact is"..."just my opinion")

In case you haven't noticed, I completely agree with Munky. I think it's best to learn from any source you can find.
My name is Andy
Quote by MudMartin
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Swinging to the rhythm of the New World Order,
Counting bodies like sheep to the rhythm of the war drums
#24
1st on all, im not angry, and the thing is, im on your side when it comes to pushing the benefits of reading music.... I just choose not too take an elitist attitude about it, which words like "superior" and "alot better" convey. I think the difference between good players and bad players has less to do with whether or not they can read music , and more to do with the individuals themselves.

Your example of how for every good person that cant read, there are 2 or 3 more that are "mediocre" can easily be flipped around and applied to those that can read notation. I've come across alot of people that could read well, and understand theory..... but when it comes to playing.... they just didnt have it.......they didnt sound good. I certainly dont blame that on the fact that they can read.

Another thing to consider is inspiration. I've taught alot of kids that at 1st wanted nothing to do with reading. So they start off learning songs, and things that inspire them. They start getting good and a year or so later, guess what? They want to know how to read! Then they get into reading and do it for real because the want to. Same goes for learning theory.

I guess my point is that music notation is a better system than tab and you will gain more from it and progress faster from it. Im not trying to sound holier than thou, but music notation is superior to tab. Everyone does learn at their own rate of course, but are you telling me that the bad guitar players you saw that could read music would be better if they were reading tab? It sounds to me like this is a technique related problem. Reading music is not the only thing you need, you need technique training aswell which should be learnt simultaneously with reading music and gradually built up. You can have great technique without learning to read music, but if you can read it will enhance your playing greatly. What sounds better, a guy with great technique who can read tab or the guy with great technique who can read music. I see your point with the inspiration part, the problem is that people always want to play songs above their ability without learning the fundamentals. Try showing someone how to play little wing when they cant play a simple blues progression, sure they might pick up a couple of things but I doubt they will be playing the song from start to finish with great technique and flow, and you will always see flaws in their playing.
radiantmoon is the toughest person I know. He inflects a sense of impending doom upon any who look upon his stone-chiseled face. The children run out of fear, while the men run for they know that the stories are true.