#1
For those of you that have them: how many springs do you use?

I have a classic fender vibrato (read: untunable), not a floyd-rose, and i put four springs in it almost immediately after i bought it, and then recently put the fifth spring in. I think my guitar sounds much better and the tuning is much more stable, but what do y'all think?

p.s.
I know some people call it a tremelo arm, but that's just wrong.
#2
i personally, tore the bridge out of my stratocaster and replaced it with a fixed bridge. but yeah, the more springs you have on a vibrato, the better the tuning stability will be
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#3
On my old squire i used all five springs in the back, and still used the whammy. I bent 3 bars all to hell, but it sure did stay in tune!

On my american strat I use four springs but I keep it locked down, because to have it whammy proporly it needs to be floating, and I don't like playing shows where I can go out of tune when I break a string. This way if I break one i still stay perfectly in tune.

Vintage Fender bridges can be tunable, with alot of springs in the back, and monster strings (think SRV kinda strings)
#4
i use 3 springs in my strat with hybrid slinkys 9 - 46's handles tuning very well, i found removing string trees improved tuning stability
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#5
I use three, and a floating bridge.
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#6
yes floating bridge also!
Spear Gladius II
Squire Standard Stratocaster LTD ED c/w hotrails
Squire Deluxe Strat c/w Hotrails
Dean Baby V
Tanglewood Acoustic
Bugera 333 Head
Laney Cab Vintage 30's
Dunlop Crybaby
Boss RC-2
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Marshall Jackhammer
#7
I used to have three in the back of my MIM Fat Strat, but I switched from 9's up to 11's and I had to add two more.
#8
Quote by Tedforpresident
I know some people call it a tremelo arm, but that's just wrong.


why is that wrong? what makes your logic so right? they're the same damn thing
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#10
Quote by hawk5211
^lol no they're not......


they do the exact same thing in that they loosen or tighten the tention of the strings (via the bridge) to affect pitch. the only difference beyween something like a bigsby and a floyd rose is the how dramatic in pitch the strings can be affected.
Quote by pedaler466
Shreadhead22 had nothing helpful to say to me. He just immediatly started being a prick.

Quote by Yngwi3
Shredhead's advice is the best in the thread.


-Mesa Roadster
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-'93 Gibby LP studio
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-EB volume
-Shure Wireless
#11
I use 3, staggered tuners and no trees, but I think really it might come down to a combination of the # of springs used, how tight you've got the claw and how heavy the string are.
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#12
Quote by shredhead22
they do the exact same thing in that they loosen or tighten the tention of the strings (via the bridge) to affect pitch. the only difference beyween something like a bigsby and a floyd rose is the how dramatic in pitch the strings can be affected.

Technically, tremolo is a fluctuation in volume and vibrato is a fluctuation in pitch. But seriously, anyone who says either is wrong is just being a pedantic asshole.
#13
Quote by LastAuramancer
i personally, tore the bridge out of my stratocaster and replaced it with a fixed bridge. but yeah, the more springs you have on a vibrato, the better the tuning stability will be


That's just not correct depending on the setup. On a floating bridge, the fewer the better IMO. If you're just locking the bridge to the top, then why even both screwing the arm in?

Also, your tuning will be horrible if you don't learn to set up the guitar properly, learn proper string wrapping technique, and identify and lube all of the pressure points the string comes into contact with. After that, the Strat will stay in tune very well and will withstand a lot of trem abuse depending on the quality of the guitar.
#14
Quote by Tedforpresident
For those of you that have them: how many springs do you use?



Understanding the strat's trem physics requires only to understand a simple law of mechanics, Hooke's Law, and the correct modelling of a strat.

From a physics point of view, a strat is an assembly of 2 systems, or sets of springs, one set being the strings, the other being the trem springs, attached one to another, by a rigid device called the bridge, in extension between the string tuners and the tremolo claw

Hooke says that the force to pull a spring is directly proportional to the length of the extension between both pulling points.

Additionally, this length is multiplied by the number of springs when the springs are attached to each other end to end between the two pulling points (in serie), and divided by the number of springs when all the springs are attached to both pulling points (in parallel).

On a strat, the pulling points of the trem are the claw screwed to the body and the trem block.

If it takes 7 lbs to extent one spring by 1 inch, it'll take 14 lbs to extend it by 2 inches.

If 2 springs, identical to the one above, are attached in serie, 7lbs will extend each spring by 1 inch, for a total extension of 2 inches between both pulling points, and 14 lbs to extend each spring by 2 inches, for a total extension of 4 inches.

If 2 springs are both attached to both pulling points, in parallel, 7lbs will extend each spring by 1/2 inch, for a total extension of 1/2 inch, and it will take 14 lbs to extend each spring by 1 inch, for a total extension of 1 inch.

3 springs in parallel : 7 lbs to pull each spring by 1/3 inch, total extension 1/3 inch, and 21 lbs to extend each spring by 1 inch, total extension of 1 inch.

Now the number of springs surely affects tone, but the reason why Leo made the number of springs optional was to accomodate different string gauges, considering that each different gauge set will have a different amount of total (all strings combined) "pull" at the bridge to stay in tune, some strings sets having more pull than others, as to make the bridge, originally adjusted to float for one set of strings, hit the side of the trem cavity with bigger strings.

Now from the explanation above, for a given gauge set, the number of springs affects the following, more perceivable factors:

- the point of balance of the trem block (any physcial reference point of the bottom of the trem block) from the claw, where balance with all strings correctly tuned is achieved. Whether the trem's freedom is blocked either by the trem block cavity, or because the brdige is sitting in contact with the guitar top, in both cases it means the point of balance is located outide the trem's space of movement.

This point of balance must be located within the cavity of the trem block for the trem to float, that is, for both systems, the set of correctly tuned strings, and the set of trem springs to balance out. For this purpose, the point of balance may be adjusted (back in the space of the cavity and within that space) by tightening or releasing the screws that attach the claw to the body.

- the amount of displacement of the trem block needed to achieve a given lowering of a note at a given fret, (i.e. the note on the higher e string at the 12th fret), is defined by the number of springs in the trem system.

The more springs in the trem system, the less trem block displacement (but the more "push" on the trem bar) it takes to achieve a 1 step drop of that note, maximizing therefor the physically possible amount of lowering or heightening of a note with the trem, limited to the maximum displacement of the trem block in the trem block cavity.
Last edited by ColdGin at Dec 11, 2007,