#1
Okay, so A Harmonic Minor contains the notes A B C D E F G#. From this scale, we can form many chords, and F major is among them. However, what if instead of F C A, I played F C G#. G# and Ab are enharmonic, so that would be identical in sound to F minor. What would be the proper way to notate this chord in this context? F5 add#9?
#3
because the F is functioning as a major degree in that key, i think it would technically be a #9 chord, whether you want to write maj#9 5add#9 add#9 or whatever, i think that would be 'technically' correct.

it happens a lot with harmonic and melodic chords. diminished chords have a bb7, which is enharmonic to a 6, however anybody caught writing a 6 would be severely punished
#6
Of course you can play it. You can call it whatever you want as well. Its your song. Others would probably call it Fm, but Fadd#9(no3) would be a more correct term for it in this setting. If you write a song with it, it doesnt matter what you call it. Its your music you can do what you want with it, as long as you like the sound, and it makes sense to you how you play it.
#7
It does matter what you call it though.

Blue Strat-Question: If I wrote it as Fm, how would I write the notes out on the staff? Would it be F G# C or F Ab C?
#8
Quote by bangoodcharlote
It does matter what you call it though.

Blue Strat-Question: If I wrote it as Fm, how would I write the notes out on the staff? Would it be F G# C or F Ab C?


But hes writing it to play for himself. To be theoretically correct he would use F G# C, but if hes playing it and not even showing it to anyone else, then he can call it what he wants, and he doesnt even need to write it out, it only needs to sound good.
#10
Quote by bangoodcharlote
It does matter what you call it though.

Blue Strat-Question: If I wrote it as Fm, how would I write the notes out on the staff? Would it be F G# C or F Ab C?



exactly!

you would write it in the staff as a #2 NOT a b3.

Quote by coffeeguy
E#Minor.

You guys think too much.

E# G# B# = F Ab C.


no, i think the problem is that you dont think enough!

A harmonic minor does not have an E#!!!!

It may have a G#, but it does not have a B#!!!

that must be wrong
Last edited by branny1982 at Jan 27, 2008,
#11
How about changing the root of the name? Do you really have to name it off the F?
Founder of Jaco society

[22:08:23] <Confusius> I wish I was a bassist
[22:08:26] <Confusius> you fuckers look cool


Want to know how to play bass in jazz? Read this.
#12
Quote by sinan90
How about changing the root of the name? Do you really have to name it off the F?


Well changing the root name (I assume to E#) would be no better than changing the #2 to a b3. It all depends on the scale intervals, and F functions as a b6, while E# functions as a #5. As long as its only for his playing, he doesnt even need to call it anything, just play it. As soon as others want to learn his song it would be a chord with the formula (1, #2, 5) so maybe Fsus#2 or maybe Fadd#9(no 3). In this context it is not an Fm chord, although it is enharmonically equivalent to one.
#13
Quote by branny1982
no, i think the problem is that you dont think enough!

A harmonic minor does not have an E#!!!!

It may have a G#, but it does not have a B#!!!

that must be wrong



You're kidding, right? So you're saying, if I'm playing in the Key of D, theres no way in hell and it'd be blasphemy if I play an F chord? Because everybody knows nobody has ever done that before, cause it's wrong.... Playing a note out of the key is, of course, completely wrong and punishable by death.

The E# in the key of A harmonic minor is a chord based off of the raised 5th. The notes of the E#m chord are E# G# B#, and noted in a full or condensed score, will be accurate. I have played songs that involved a Cb chord, nobody told be it was a Bsus2(#9) or whatever you guys are trying to call it.
Last edited by coffeeguy9 at Jan 27, 2008,
#14
Quote by coffeeguy9
You're kidding, right? So you're saying, if I'm playing in the Key of D, theres no way in hell and it'd be blasphemy if I play an F chord? Because everybody knows nobody has ever done that before, cause it's wrong.... Playing a note out of the key is, of course, completely wrong and punishable by death.

The E# in the key of A harmonic minor is a chord based off of the raised 5th. The notes of the E#m chord are E# G# B#, and noted in a full or condensed score, will be accurate. I have played songs that involved a Cb chord, nobody told be it was a Bsus2(#9) or whatever you guys are trying to call it.


Of course you can play non-scale tones. However, TS is asking if an Fm chord would fit in A harmonic minor, USING ONLY SCALE TONES. Yes it would fit (as would Fo) however, neither of them would be notated that way, provided you were only playing scale tones.
#15
Quote by coffeeguy9
You're kidding, right?

no, i wasn't kidding.
if I'm playing in the Key of D, theres no way in hell and it'd be blasphemy if I play an F chord?

well, i didn't EXACTLY say that

Playing a note out of the key is, of course, completely wrong and punishable by death.

well, i nearly did say that.... perhaps i exaggerated.


The E# in the key of A harmonic minor is a chord based off of the raised 5th. The notes of the E#m chord are E# G# B#, and noted in a full or condensed score, will be accurate. I have played songs that involved a Cb chord, nobody told be it was a Bsus2(#9) or whatever you guys are trying to call it.


perhaps one of us misunderstood what the TS actually wants to know here.
I am sure he is more than aware that you can have out of key chords in songs.

what i thought he wants to know is how to notate a chord created by the harmonic minor scale. a chord that is created BECAUSE of the harmonic minor alteration.

what you are saying is the harmonic minor equivalent of calling the root chord in C major, B#major.
#16
Quote by branny1982
perhaps one of us misunderstood what the TS actually wants to know here.
I am sure he is more than aware that you can have out of key chords in songs.

what i thought he wants to know is how to notate a chord created by the harmonic minor scale. a chord that is created BECAUSE of the harmonic minor alteration.

what you are saying is the harmonic minor equivalent of calling the root chord in C major, B#major.


I think you hit the nail on the head right there sir.
#17
Quote by isaac_bandits
Well changing the root name (I assume to E#) would be no better than changing the #2 to a b3. It all depends on the scale intervals, and F functions as a b6, while E# functions as a #5. As long as its only for his playing, he doesnt even need to call it anything, just play it. As soon as others want to learn his song it would be a chord with the formula (1, #2, 5) so maybe Fsus#2 or maybe Fadd#9(no 3). In this context it is not an Fm chord, although it is enharmonically equivalent to one.



No I meant formulate a name from the C or G#.
Founder of Jaco society

[22:08:23] <Confusius> I wish I was a bassist
[22:08:26] <Confusius> you fuckers look cool


Want to know how to play bass in jazz? Read this.
#18
Quote by branny1982
what i thought he wants to know is how to notate a chord created by the harmonic minor scale. a chord that is created BECAUSE of the harmonic minor alteration.
Exactly.


Coffeeguy, spare us your crap.