#1
Do most bands write music by writing musicial notation and keeping up with bars and 4/4 time? Or do they just record? If bands usually record songs instead of actually writing it out into musical notations, how come all the songs are able to be written in musical notation when I download guitar pro tabs? Do bands subconsciously follow the rules of time signatures and such when they just record songs and have no knowledge of music theory?
#2
Most bands don't even understand standard notation.

how come all the songs are able to be written in musical notation when I download guitar pro tabs


Because someone transcribed them.

Do bands subconsciously follow the rules of time signatures and such when they just record songs and have no knowledge of music theory?


There are no "rules" of time signatures. Music theory is descriptive, not prescriptive. Most bands write their songs exclusively in 4/4 for two reasons:

a) Most people in the West are far more accustomed to 4/4 than to any other time signature, and it sounds natural to them.

b) They lack the talent/knowledge to write anything in any time signature but 4/4.
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Last edited by Archeo Avis at Feb 4, 2008,
#3
^Exactly.

No point in writing it in standard notation. Sure, they'll keep track of time sigs and (for some) keys, modes and so on, but there's no point in putting it in a medium which maybe half of guitar players can't understand, never mind the fact it'd be useless for drums.
#4
I don't write anything down, and when I do, it's usually in TAB, so the other guitarist knows what I'm doing.

I suck though.
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#5
yes i write tab too
this thread has opened my eyes.
thought rockstars knew notation haha.
#6
Quote by Archeo Avis
Most bands don't even understand standard notation.


Because someone transcribed them.


There are no "rules" of time signatures. Music theory is descriptive, not prescriptive. Most bands write their songs exclusively in 4/4 for two reasons:

a) Most people in the West are far more accustomed to 4/4 than to any other time signature, and it sounds natural to them.

b) They lack the talent/knowledge to write anything in any time signature but 4/4.


and c) people tend to enjoy dancing/jumping to music, and its hard to do that in anything but 4/4
#7

b) They lack the talent/knowledge to write anything in any time signature but 4/4.


I disagree, I see 3/4, cut time, 5/4, and etc all the time. However, you don't see a lot of weird times for a good simple reason, they aren't as good for nodding your head.

I'd also add guitarists tend to follow drummers, and drummers have patterns(like we have progressions) that set the song in 4/4 time. (sub + snare + sub + snare, for example is a pretty classic rock pattern.)
#8
Quote by jimzer
yes i write tab too
this thread has opened my eyes.
thought rockstars knew notation haha.


some do. i know the guys in Dream Theater write stuff out (when necessary)...

also a lot of people in bands are able to communicate verbally what they are doing/what their idea is... so why write it down (unless its complex)?
#9
I disagree, I see 3/4, cut time, 5/4, and etc all the time. However, you don't see a lot of weird times for a good simple reason, they aren't as good for nodding your head.


Where are you looking? I'm talking about popular music here.

they aren't as good for nodding your head.


This is a product of culture, not some magical quality of 4/4.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
#10
depends on style most likely
listen to some death metal bands specifically death (chuck)it self to hear some of the finest strange and dumb time signatures
#11
Dream Theatre has a complete disregard for 4/4 timing, and they're pretty damn popular, right?
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#12
Congratulations for adding progmetal to the mix, of course there are always bands/genres/songs that don't use 4/4 but the majority of songs does.
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#13
Quote by Guitar_Poet
and c) people tend to enjoy dancing/jumping to music, and its hard to do that in anything but 4/4


Head banging in 6/8 lol.


Phish, because of their heavy jazz roots (meaning they actually know what they're doing) have a lot of songs in different timing than 4/4. Their drummer is amazing.
#14
When bands write songs, they don't consciously decide to write in 4/4, they just do because almost everything they're influenced by is in 4/4.

I've written stuff before, and later realised that I have sections of songs in 3/4 etc that I didn't realise when writing it, I just did it that way because it works better.

EDIT: similarly, if you sit down and analyse a song, and what's going on, very little of what is going on is planned, it just happens that way.
Last edited by BrianApocalypse at Feb 4, 2008,
#15

This is a product of culture, not some magical quality of 4/4.


Disagree. Certain rhythms coincide with certain dance types. I can't believe that's entirely coincidence. I'll agree complex rhythms and head nodding aren't mutually exclusive. I've been part of a couple traditional African drum circles and they have an Amazing beat to them with extremely rich rhythm patterns. Some rhythms and rhythm combinations are just better suited to a head bob then others, though. 4/4 is one of them(not that it has to be head-bobbing, but it's fairly easy quality to bring out of 4/4. Same with 3/4.)


Where are you looking? I'm talking about popular music here.


Pop Music. This is a somewhat limited list. For example, I'm sure I could find tons of reggae in 3/4, but I don't have any official reggae tabs. Anyway, without further ado, proof that popular music isn't all 4/4(although a lot of it is)...



Police
in 7/8
- Mother

Led Zeppelin
in 12/8
- Dazed and Confused
- You Shook Me
- I Can't Quit you Baby

Pink Floyd
in 6/8
- A Couple of The Parts to "Shine on You Crazy Diamond"
in 12/8
- The Thin Ice
- In The Flesh
in 7/4
- Money

Beatles
in 2/2
- For No One
in 3/4
- Love You To
in 5/4, 4/4, and 3/4
- Good Morning Good Morning
in 7/4
- All You Need is Love
in 9/8, 5/4
- Happiness Is a Warm Gun


Buck Cherry
in 2/2
- Beautiful Delilah
- Mabellene
- Memphis, Tennesse

Bon Jovi
in 2/2
- I'll Be there For You

RHCP
in 2/2
- Road Trippin
- They're Red Hot!
in 3/4
- BreakingTheGirl
in 6/8
- Porcelain

Nirvana
in 3/4
- Where Did You Sleep Last Night

Radiohead
in 5/4
- 15 Steps



all together they use 2/2, 3/4 5/4, 7/4, 7/8, 6/8, 9/8, and 12/8
Last edited by capiCrimm at Feb 4, 2008,
#16
Certain rhythms coincide with certain dance types. I can't believe that's entirely coincidence.


Do you see many African tribes performing the twist? Dances are cultural inventions.

Pop Music. This is a somewhat limited list. For example, I'm sure I could find tons of reggae in 3/4, but I don't have any official reggae tabs. Anyway, without further ado, proof that popular music isn't all 4/4(although a lot of it is)...


Which wouldn't refute my point at all. The concept of 4/4 is ingrained in the West, and to most people, anything outside of it will sound off. This isn't true in other cultures.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
#17
Do you see many African tribes performing the twist? Dances are cultural inventions.


Do you see many people preforming the twist to African Rhythms? That's my point. I know music and dance are human inventions. Basically this is a nature-nurture argument. I think it's a mix, as it normally is. Certain tempos/notes draw themselves to be dance music or not, regardless of culture. So you have a large pool of possible dance music innate to all humans, and each culture picks and chooses out of that pool. That's my argument. From what I read you think it's pure nurture. That is to say, you could theoretically teach a child that TV static is the ultimate dance music. I disagree.

Which wouldn't refute my point at all. The concept of 4/4 is ingrained in the West, and to most people, anything outside of it will sound off. This isn't true in other cultures.


Since when in reggae or latin music not pop music? I shot the sheriff? The mamba?

The west was not built on 4/4. Pop music might be, but western music uses a handful more.(otherwise why would sheet ever have included time sigs)
#18
I almost always write in 4/4, but I'm very partial to 6/8 and 12/8. I have a prog metal song I wrote with 13 different times in it.
#19
Do you see many people preforming the twist to African Rhythms? That's my point. I know music and dance are human inventions. Basically this is a nature-nurture argument. I think it's a mix, as it normally is. Certain tempos/notes draw themselves to be dance music or not, regardless of culture. So you have a large pool of possible dance music innate to all humans, and each culture picks and chooses out of that pool. That's my argument. From what I read you think it's pure nurture. That is to say, you could theoretically teach a child that TV static is the ultimate dance music. I disagree.


Genes code for proteins, not time signatures. Different cultures have different musical conventions and different art forms, and the individuals within those cultures because accustomed to those norms. If you told someone from Bulgaria that insane time signatures (only insane from a Western perspective) weren't suitable for dancing to, they wouldn't know what you were talking about.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.
#20
Quote by lpmarshall
Do most bands write music by writing musicial notation and keeping up with bars and 4/4 time? Or do they just record?


Some do, most probably dont. It really depends on what genre of music your talking about, and which musicians specifically. Different artists take different approaches. Some are music literate, other arent.
Quote by lpmarshall

If bands usually record songs instead of actually writing it out into musical notations, how come all the songs are able to be written in musical notation when I download guitar pro tabs?


Someone else does that after the fact. The band in most if not all cases has nothing to do with guitar pro or any written sheet music. If a song is popular and there is demand for it.... someone ends up tabbing it or selling sheet music for it.


Quote by lpmarshall

Do bands subconsciously follow the rules of time signatures and such when they just record songs and have no knowledge of music theory?


Some do, some dont. It really depends on who your talking about. Great music has been written with and without knowledge of music theory.
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#21
Quote by GuitarMunky


Someone else does that after the fact. The band in most if not all cases has nothing to do with guitar pro or any written sheet music. If a song is popular and there is demand for it.... someone ends up tabbing it or selling sheet music for it.




Yeah I already know that bands don't write their own tabs, but my question is how come if bands that don't know music theory that write a song is able to be transcribed into sheet music smoothly? Because music theory you have complete bars and follow the tempo thing like quarter notes and 1/16th notes.
#22
I've wondered that myself. I think you're looking at it the wrong way, though. They might not have used theory to write the song, but theory can be applied to anything. People who transcribe music make it fit into measures. That's why we have tied notes and the like, so you can fit beats in a tempo.
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#23
Because music theory you have complete bars and follow the tempo thing like quarter notes and 1/16th notes.


What gives you that idea? Music theory is descriptive. It describes music, it doesn't dictate how it's written. You don't have to do anything.
Someones knowledge of guitar companies spelling determines what amps you can own. Really smart people can own things like Framus because they sound like they might be spelled with a "y" but they aren't.