Poll: Loitering as a law, yay or nay?
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View poll results: Loitering as a law, yay or nay?
Loitering is a law that should exist.
34 35%
Loitering is a law that shouldn't exist.
62 65%
Voters: 96.
#1
Buongiorno pit monkeys.

I have a topic for discussion. Loitering.

Our school has had a problem with people sitting in a car park right out side the front gates smoking. They occasionally (very rarely) cause slight damage to the cars. The new head master has been cracking down on this and has called in policemen to get the smokers to move off. Today a copper showed up, asked for IDs, then told everybody they were going to be fined 100 euros for loitering.

Now, none of these kids were causing damage to cars, they were all old enough to smoke and the only thing they were doing wrong was loitering.

I personally think that this law is bollocks, but I was wondering what you pit monkeys think.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I wasn't there when the copper started to fine people, I only noticed what was happening as I went past. I never even sit outside in the car park, so it doesn't really effect me.
Last edited by blynd_snyper at Feb 25, 2008,
#2
I don't think you should be fined, just moved on.
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#3
Yes they should've been fined. Get the fuck away from my car loiterers.
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#4
Loitering is one of the weirdest laws ever.

I have never really understood it, but if it's a law, you have to obey it, I guess.
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#6
100Euros is way too much for just loitering.

And it's "buongiorno"
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#7
It's people like that causing a waste of police time and stopping them from catching real criminals....damned loiterers
#8
Well it disrupts other people or can even intimidate someone because they can look like a gang or something I dont know.
#9
If I found some assholes had damaged my car darn tootin I wouldn't want them anywhere near it again. And I'm sure other patrons of the car park wouldn't be very keen for one of those very rare damages to occur to their cars.
#12
If I were to park my car and then came back to see a group of young people leaning against it smoking, not only would I be angry, I would more than likely be intimidated. Call me an ass but the loitering law should exist.
#13
As long as they leave the cars alone...who cares?
Something is wrong over at ts' school, we never had any problems like that at my school and there were always at least two dozens of people hanging around the nearby car park.
We don't have such a law here as well, which I am quite happy about.
#17
Quote by TheQuailman
In some countries it just is.


But how can you classify loitering? can't just sitting in a bench, or going out for a walk be considered loitering too?
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#18
Quote by urik
But how can you classify loitering? can't just sitting in a bench, or going out for a walk be considered loitering too?


Walking is not a problem, but hanging around somewhere is, especially when it's not a single person but a whole group. Don't ask me why that law exists in some places, I'm just glad I don't have to deal with it.
#19
Quote by urik
But how can you classify loitering? can't just sitting in a bench, or going out for a walk be considered loitering too?

When a group of a designated number of people or more are standing around not doing anything in particular it is against the law. However, this law is usually only enforced by coppers when the group are looking threatening or doing something bad like causing damage.
#20
Quote by blynd_snyper
When a group of a designated number of people or more are standing around not doing anything in particular it is against the law. However, this law is usually only enforced by coppers when the group are looking threatening or doing something bad like causing damage.


Yeah, I mean, in Israel I used to do it a lot with good friends. At night we go out and buy a coke with chips and doritos, and just sit in a park in some bench and talk or do nothing.
However, yeah. I can see the logic behind that law. Most of the people that do that aren't the most friendly people, and don't just drink coke and eat chips.
But well it all depends on the country. Because in Israel in the weekends there isn't public transport, and there aren't clubs in all the cities, so the youth hasn't got much to do besides loitering.
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#22
unless there are problems like aggressive panhandling, a lot of gang/set activity, frequent robberies or property damage, loitering laws in certain areas are unnecessary.
#23
Quote by MakinLattes
unless there are problems like aggressive panhandling, a lot of gang/set activity, frequent robberies or property damage, loitering laws in certain areas are unnecessary.

You've clearly never been to Austria.

The closest we have to any of that is an unfriendly salesperson at the local Kebab stand.
#24
Quote by the_astronaut
Yes they should've been fined. Get the fuck away from my car loiterers.


Dang nambit!

Also I don't want smoke inside my car.
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#25
Quote by blynd_snyper
You've clearly never been to Austria.

The closest we have to any of that is an unfriendly salesperson at the local Kebab stand.

no, I haven't, but I can dream..

then people loitering there doesn't hold any of the inherent risks it does in other areas.
#26
Quote by the_astronaut
Yes they should've been fined. Get the fuck away from my car loiterers.


What this guy said.
#27
Shouldn't be fined, but moved on. A lot of kids stands around trying to look intimidating, and its a pain in the ass.
#28
hmm that's odd, looks like just standing around has become a crime as well. god forbid anyone smell the flowers, you might get fined for standing in one place too long
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#29
im ok with that. maybe not such a large fine, especially if they hadnt alread been warned.

but if my car was parked there, i wouldnt want a bunch of kids hanging around it all the time. even if the chance of damage is small, its still there.
#30
if there is no time limit to define loitering, wouldn't it be impossible to prove if someone is loitering or not?

for example, i drop my phone while walking in front of a store. i stop for a minute to pick it up and check and see if it still works alright. am i loitering? if that's not loitering, then how long IS loitering? wouldn't you have to witness the person loitering for that amount of time before you could arrest them?

loitering is fun to say
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#31
As an 18 year old, loitering has affected me in a negative way, and so I hate it.


But when I'm 40, I'll want those damn kids to stop hanging around for no reason being menacing - so it evens out in the end.
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#32
I think loitering is just bs. It's all about the establishment's reputation, they don't want hood rats hanging out at tim horton's because then people are going to associate hood rats with tim hortons.
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#33
If you have a problem with the law then you probably loiter yourself. Loser
#34
Yes, they should be fined. Then give all the money made from fines directly to me.
#35
Why do they have to hang around cars?

I'd say as there was damage they shouldn't.
#36
Depends on the area.

Fined/asked to move for loitering in a park- thats just stupid.
Fined/asked to move for loitering in a car park/in front of a hotel or something is more understandable. I wouldn't want a bunch of random people haning around near my car.
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#37
Most places do not have laws against loitering. In the case you described it would fall under trespassing.

Do I think there should be laws against loitering ? No. Because whether you're doing harm is completely subjective and depends on the person (or persons) who owns the property.

If you're on someone else's property and they ask you to leave you are trespassing.
#38
Quote by sock_demon
I think loitering is just bs. It's all about the establishment's reputation, they don't want hood rats hanging out at tim horton's because then people are going to associate hood rats with tim hortons.
The thing is you don't need any laws against loitering to solve that "problem". Tim Horton's is private property and they can ask anyone who is on their property to leave at any time. Failure to comply is trespassing which is against the law pretty much everywhere that I am aware of.
#39
You know what they say, "The devil makes use of idle hands". Sure, you might be just smoking now, but pretty soon you're going to be littering, and then you're going to be key scratching cars in a vengence, and then you're going to be selling crack. That's right, CRACK.


But seriously, don't loiter.
#40
Quote by apollo718
if there is no time limit to define loitering, wouldn't it be impossible to prove if someone is loitering or not?

It's probably one of those cases where something must be done "unreasonably." I get the feeling that it's one of those laws that's designed to give the police more powers to control the public, like laws against disturbance of the peace and suchlike.
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