Page 1 of 3
#1
Any of you ever heard of them? Well, a NDE is when a person is clinically dead, and few seconds, sometimes minutes later, comes back to life. While they were "dead", they see an after life. Some see heaven, others see hell. In vivid detail also. Demons torturing humans in ways that even some people who imaging sick things, can't even stand.


Now, as for proof that this happens, click here. http://www.near-death.com/evidence.html

www.near-death.com


This is living proof, there is a heaven and hell, and more importantly, there's a God and a devil.
#2
it just proves that when the brain is deprived of oxygen and your clinically dead for a minute you may have weird hallucinations. i bet people have seen other things besides your "god" as you call him when they die
#3
i've heard of near death experiences, but i always thought it was when somebody nearly dies from an accident or something like that.
#4
Quote by exect4500
it just proves that when the brain is deprived of oxygen and your clinically dead for a minute you may have weird hallucinations. i bet people have seen other things besides your "god" as you call him when they die

You're brain is dead, and therefore cannot produce hallucinations because it's not functioning. If your brain is dead, all senses on your body are dead. It's impossible to hallucinate when there's no brain activity.


And yes, people have seen other things besides my God and heaven, they've seen hell. Quite vividally, and wake up screaming saying "they have me". Obviously, they repress the memory, but never forget the experience.
#5
or maybe those people were just lying....like people who are "abducted by aliens"...
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#6
it's really cool the way the mind works, and how peoples beliefs control every aspect of their life when they are brainwashed to the point of thinking that this is proof of a "God".
All a near death experience proves, is someone nearly died ( wow, that's stating the obvious)
#7
when you die your brain is [shutting down] it doesn't turn off all it once and people sometimes see things. I wouldn't call this hard evidence for any afterlife
#8
Quote by fob12
Any of you ever heard of them? Well, a NDE is when a person is clinically dead, and few seconds, sometimes minutes later, comes back to life. While they were "dead", they see an after life. Some see heaven, others see hell. In vivid detail also. Demons torturing humans in ways that even some people who imaging sick things, can't even stand.


Now, as for proof that this happens, click here. http://www.near-death.com/evidence.html

www.near-death.com


This is living proof, there is a heaven and hell, and more importantly, there's a God and a devil.



Well someone just watched White Noise 2 didnt they.
Hurp De Durp
#9
ya really, just because someone claims theyve seen these things when they are clinically dead doesnt mean they are being truthful, and doesnt mean that it has anything to do with god. since very few people have had these experiences it is very easy for a person to exagerate, as no one else can disagree. i dont buy it.
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#10
hmm well, it seems pretty interesting, but I think i can see a flaw in this research that they are doing. it all depends on how they actually got this information. if they questioned like, what did you see, etc..., there probably was a huge misinformation effect ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misinformation_effect ). theere questions could have sparked "memories" they thought they have seen, but they really didnt, but maybe something similar happened, and these researchers aske the "right questions" to make these people see what they think they have seen.
dude, what about an actual solo in death metal instead of that poof from linkin park. Think of Pulse of the Maggots - Bed Of Razors


#1 MEMEBER OF THE OFFICIAL THRASH METAL FAN CLUB (PM URE FAV BANDS TO ME TO JOIN)
#11
^^ exactly.. you could only truly know if it happened to you anyway
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#12
Quote by Symphonic_Chaos
Well someone just watched White Noise 2 didnt they.

No, actually. I've never really seen any horror movies for that matter.


You know, for such great claims, I would think you guys would have evidence to back it up. Speculation is a given for things like this, but with the proof I just linked, you have to have proof to counter it. No proof, means you guys are just talking out of your butts because you want to keep your minds closed to the possibility that there might be a God.


And all your saying to try to disprove this is the brain this, the brain that. There are 50 other scientific proofs that you keep on avoiding, and if it was just the person going nuts, why did they all say and see similar, if not the same things? Strange for someone who just "died" to have such a vivid imagination and sense of humor upon reentering their body, isn't it?
Last edited by fob12 at Feb 27, 2008,
#13
I dunno..i've always been more of a reincarnation guy...
I figure nature is always recycling stuff eg. water cycle, air currents etc. and i figure if "souls" exist, wouldn't nature recycle them too?
#14
Quote by hell_monkey
I dunno..i've always been more of a reincarnation guy...
I figure nature is always recycling stuff eg. water cycle, air currents etc. and i figure if "souls" exist, wouldn't nature recycle them too?
Souls are unique and precious. Just like every finger print and eye is different, in more ways than one, so is the soul. Each one is different.
#15
actually fob12 the site you linked to didnt present any real proof at all and stated that the scientific community didn't recognize the theory. people saying things is not proof. hearsay won't convict a criminal, dont believe things just because people say them
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#16
Does something inside us, like a soul or a spirit, survive the death of the body? Consider how the first man, Adam, came to have life. The Bible states: "Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life." (Genesis 2:7) Though breathing sustained his life, putting "the breath of life" into his nostrils involved much more than simply blowing air into his lungs. It meant that God put into Adam's lifeless body the spark of life—"the force of life," which is active in all earthly creatures. (Genesis 6:17; 7:22) The Bible refers to this animating force as "spirit." (James 2:26) That spirit can be compared to the electric current that activates a machine or an appliance and enables it to perform its function. Just as the current never takes on the features of the equipment it activates, the life-force does not take on any of the characteristics of the creatures it animates. It has no personality and no thinking ability.

What happens to the spirit when a person dies? Psalm 146:4 says: "His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish." When a person dies, his impersonal spirit does not go on existing in another realm as a spirit creature. It "returns to the true God who gave it." (Ecclesiastes 12:7) This means that any hope of future life for that person now rests entirely with God.

The ancient Greek philosophers Socrates and Plato held that a soul inside a person survives death and never dies. What does the Bible teach about the soul? Adam "came to be a living soul," says Genesis 2:7. He did not receive a soul; he was a soul—a whole person. The Scriptures speak of a soul's doing work, craving food, being kidnapped, experiencing sleeplessness, and so forth. (Leviticus 23:30; Deuteronomy 12:20; 24:7; Psalm 119:28) Yes, man himself is a soul. When a person dies, that soul dies.—Ezekiel 18:4.

What, then, is the condition of the dead? When pronouncing sentence upon Adam, Jehovah stated: "Dust you are and to dust you will return." (Genesis 3:19) Where was Adam before God formed him from the dust of the ground and gave him life? Why, he simply did not exist! When he died, Adam returned to that state of complete absence of life. The condition of the dead is made clear at Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10, where we read: "The dead know nothing . . . In the grave, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom." (New International Version) Scripturally, death is a state of nonexistence. The dead have no awareness, no feelings, no thoughts.

Unending Torment or Common Grave?
Since the dead have no conscious existence, hell cannot be a fiery place of torment where the wicked suffer after death. What, then, is hell? Examining what happened to Jesus after he died helps to answer that question. The Bible writer Luke recounts: "Neither was [Jesus] forsaken in Hades [hell, King James Version] nor did his flesh see corruption."* (Acts 2:31) Where was the hell to which even Jesus went? The apostle Paul wrote: "I handed on to you . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures; and that he was buried, yes, that he has been raised up the third day according to the Scriptures." (1 Corinthians 15:3, 4) So Jesus was in hell, the grave, but he was not abandoned there, for he was raised up, or resurrected.


Job prayed for protection in hell
Consider also the case of the righteous man Job, who suffered much. Wishing to escape his plight, he pleaded: "Who will grant me this, that thou mayest protect me in hell [Sheol], and hide me till thy wrath pass?"# (Job 14:13, Douay Version) How unreasonable to think that Job desired to go to a fiery-hot place for protection! To Job, "hell" was simply the grave, where his suffering would end. The Bible hell, then, is the common grave of mankind where good people as well as bad ones go.

Hellfire—All-Consuming?
Could it be that the fire of hell is symbolic of all-consuming, or thorough, destruction? Separating fire from Hades, or hell, the Scriptures say: "Death and Hades were hurled into the lake of fire." "The lake" mentioned here is symbolic, since death and hell (Hades) that are thrown into it cannot literally be burned. "This [lake of fire] means the second death"—death from which there is no hope of coming back to life.—Revelation 20:14.


Fiery Gehenna—a symbol of eternal destruction
The lake of fire has a meaning similar to that of "the fiery Gehenna [hell fire, King James Version]" that Jesus spoke of. (Matthew 5:22; Mark 9:47, 48) Gehenna occurs 12 times in the Christian Greek Scriptures, and it refers to the valley of Hinnom, outside the walls of Jerusalem. When Jesus was on earth, this valley was used as a garbage dump, "where the dead bodies of criminals, and the carcasses of animals, and every other kind of filth was cast." (Smith's Dictionary of the Bible) The fires were kept burning by adding sulfur to burn up the refuse. Jesus used that valley as a proper symbol of everlasting destruction.
#17
I think maybe this should be closed, because it's becoming a bit of a religion fight. And to the TS the site you linked isn't proof.
WHITE STRIPES

Quote by Placenta_07
I look at boobs and bums and stuff I get really horny and stuff.


PARTY OF SPECIAL THINGS TO DO
#18
Quote by fob12
No, actually. I've never really seen any horror movies for that matter.


You know, for such great claims, I would think you guys would have evidence to back it up. Speculation is a given for things like this, but with the proof I just linked, you have to have proof to counter it. No proof, means you guys are just talking out of your butts because you want to keep your minds closed to the possibility that there might be a God.


And all your saying to try to disprove this is the brain this, the brain that. There are 50 other scientific proofs that you keep on avoiding, and if it was just the person going nuts, why did they all say and see similar, if not the same things? Strange for someone who just "died" to have such a vivid imagination and sense of humor upon reentering their body, isn't it?



First of all, get of your high horse. I didn't say anything about not having an open mind to this. I actually find it interesting, and the only reason I mentioned the movie was because NDE's are what the movie is about.

Now we all know everything we read on the internet is real yeah?
I'm not for or against you, but your "proof" is a website. Could have been made by anyone.

/rant.

EDIT:

Quote by jack_the_ripper
I think maybe this should be closed, because it's becoming a bit of a religion fight. And to the TS the site you linked isn't proof.


THANK YOU.
Hurp De Durp
#20
cudos to you man, you started a religious thread without getting reported by people for not using the search bar. I'm impressed
#21
Quote by jack_the_ripper
I think maybe this should be closed, because it's becoming a bit of a religion fight. And to the TS the site you linked isn't proof.

Based on what facts? There are 51 scientific evidence that these NDEs happened.

Daysoftheblue: The Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, and no one knows the soul and after life more than God. If he decided to give someone a second chance, Christian or not, then it's His choice and no one can explain why. God works in mysterious ways.


By the way, this isn't a religious thread, or about to become a debate about religion. As the title states, this is about NDEs, and your ignorance in this matter proves nothing against NDEs.
#22
Quote by fob12
You're brain is dead, and therefore cannot produce hallucinations because it's not functioning. If your brain is dead, all senses on your body are dead. It's impossible to hallucinate when there's no brain activity.


And yes, people have seen other things besides my God and heaven, they've seen hell. Quite vividally, and wake up screaming saying "they have me". Obviously, they repress the memory, but never forget the experience.


Actually, it is said that the brain releases DMT(chemical that causes dreams) in large amounts when you die. DMT will dilate time in the person's mind, so for that split second that the brain releases it, the person is "tripping" on DMT. So whatever is in that person's mind (death, will I go to heaven/hell, etc...) will be part of their "trip".
Thats as simple as i can make it
JOIN THE SANDWICH GROUP!!!!

GROUP!
#23
Quote by OG610
Actually, it is said that the brain releases DMT(chemical that causes dreams) in large amounts when you die. DMT will dilate time in the person's mind, so for that split second that the brain releases it, the person is "tripping" on DMT. So whatever is in that person's mind (death, will I go to heaven/hell, etc...) will be part of their "trip".
Thats as simple as i can make it

Of course. But, explain why they all saw almost exact same "dreams", and why some of them came back from the "dead"?
#24
Based on what facts? There are 51 scientific evidence that these NDEs happened.


not true. there was tons of theories and many possibilities, but nothing that is considered legit by science.
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#25
Quote by fob12
Based on what facts? There are 51 scientific evidence that these NDEs happened.

Daysoftheblue: The Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, and no one knows the soul and after life more than God. If he decided to give someone a second chance, Christian or not, then it's His choice and no one can explain why. God works in mysterious ways.


By the way, this isn't a religious thread, or about to become a debate about religion. As the title states, this is about NDEs, and your ignorance in this matter proves nothing against NDEs.


Yes, the site named near-death.com sounds REALLY scientific. More sources if your actually going to start a religious and closed minded flame war.


EDIT:

Quote by TS's Source

An even more fascinating phenomenon occurs when the experiencer actually appears in spirit to someone, usually a loved one, during their NDE and it is verified to be true by the experiencer and the loved one. It is evidence such as this, if scientifically controlled, that can provide absolute scientific proof that consciousness can exist outside of the body. A scientifically controlled NDE that can be repeated which provides such evidence would be the scientific discovery of all time. However, science does not yet have the exact tools to accomplish this. But, science is coming very, very close. This kind of evidence and others provide very strong circumstantial evidence for the survival of consciousness.


Oh. So no proof yet?
Hurp De Durp
Last edited by Symphonic_Chaos at Feb 28, 2008,
#26
Quote by Symphonic_Chaos
Yes, the site named near-death.com sounds REALLY scientific. More sources if your actually going to start a religious and closed minded flame war.

Oh yeah and people will believe a discussion like this, or anything else for that matter, is going on in a website that has the title "ultimate guitar". It's just a title.

And jordan, quit coming in here blazing your ignorant guns when you didn't even read the entire, if not at all, article. You just want to say it doesn't exist and be right. Read it, then come back to me.
#27
I don't disagree with the POSSiBILITY of NDE's, im just saying im skeptical, and especially so of the things people claim to see
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#28
^ good find. also that split second could be interpreted as a long passage of time. ever slept for an hour, but felt like a dream was going on for several hours??

its very hard to prove subjective data as well :-D
dude, what about an actual solo in death metal instead of that poof from linkin park. Think of Pulse of the Maggots - Bed Of Razors


#1 MEMEBER OF THE OFFICIAL THRASH METAL FAN CLUB (PM URE FAV BANDS TO ME TO JOIN)
#29
daysoftheblue i agree with you i think...i think that when a body dies their spirit soul life force whatever you wanna call it will do one of two things...cease to exist or go to the place jesus prepared for his children in his fathers kingdom. Im christian through and through and i believe every word of the bible but as we all know the bible uses a lot of metaphors and symbolic images and the lake of fire is one. However the only thing that gives me problems with this is when God cast lucifer out of heaven, the bible states that the devil influences everyone and even that a person can be possessed so therefore there has to be somewhere that they are. are they one earth with us, is there an actual burning hell idk...but i pray to God i dont find out
#30
Quote by fob12
Of course. But, explain why they all saw almost exact same "dreams", and why some of them came back from the "dead"?


Well because thats probably what they were thinking of what they were about to die. The way DMT and most hallucinogens for is you 'see' what you think of. I'm sure not every single NDE saw heaven or hell. Also, since the brain used up most of the DMT in the body, the person had a massive dose of the chemical, which makes the hallucination more intense and more 'real'.

Some of them come back from the dead because the doctors are giving them electrical pulses and doing anything they can to revive them.
JOIN THE SANDWICH GROUP!!!!

GROUP!
#31
and i did read it. it was a bunch of stories about isolated incidents where ppl claim they were similar to those other ppl have had even tho they weren't even that similar. and im not ignorant so don't claim that.
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#32
Quote by fob12
Based on what facts? There are 51 scientific evidence that these NDEs happened.

Daysoftheblue: The Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, and no one knows the soul and after life more than God. If he decided to give someone a second chance, Christian or not, then it's His choice and no one can explain why. God works in mysterious ways.



John 3:16 says gold loved the world so much he gave his son for us right?means he really loves us right?so if we sin we spend eternity get boned in the ass by demons?No.
#33
im of the belief that you cease to exist when you die, nothing else seemes plausible to me thus far
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#34
Quote by DaysoftheBlue
John 3:16 says gold loved the world so much he gave his son for us right?means he really loves us right?so if we sin we spend eternity get boned in the ass by demons?No.

If you don't believe the One and only Son he sent down died on the cross for us, then yeah you're going to get boned in hell.


Symphonic, the evidence is that patients can describe what was happening in the room at the time of their soul leaving their body. Obviously, their clinically dead so their senses aren't working. Even if their senses were working, how can they know what's going on in the room if they're eyes are closed to begin with? The NDE patients sometimes describe what was happening in the room as their soul was leaving their body.
#36
Quote by OG610
Well because thats probably what they were thinking of what they were about to die. The way DMT and most hallucinogens for is you 'see' what you think of. I'm sure not every single NDE saw heaven or hell. Also, since the brain used up most of the DMT in the body, the person had a massive dose of the chemical, which makes the hallucination more intense and more 'real'.

Some of them come back from the dead because the doctors are giving them electrical pulses and doing anything they can to revive them.

That makes no sense. Why would a non-believer, think he's going to hell before he's going to die? Non-believers are usually Atheist, which means that they don't believe a heaven or hell, God or devil exist period. Why in their last seconds on Earth, would they imagine themselves going to hell?
#37
If you don't believe the One and only Son he sent down died on the cross for us, then yeah you're going to get boned in hell.


not true.. you read that in a fictional book. it is just as legitimate as believing there are rings of power and a dark lord sauron
"every prince has to slay a few dragons before he meets his princess"
#38
actually that does make sense for a non-believer to fear death and wonder if he made the right choice, im on your side as far as christianity goes but i would think only the most hardcore of atheists would not fear death
#39
Quote by jordanzio
not true.. you read that in a fictional book. it is just as legitimate as believing there are rings of power and a dark lord sauron

2000 Years of people can't be wrong, can they? Just so happens that 2000 years ago, these events took place. Give or take a couple years. Amazing coincidence? And, in Rome, there's history books dating back over 2000 years, which has proof that Jesus existed.
Page 1 of 3