#1
I have a Boss Gt-8 with my valve junior head, it sounds good at low volumes, like 7 or 8 o clock, but when it gets loud and breaks up, it sounds harsh and just really bright. I think an effects loop can solve this problem, because the preamps might not clash or anything, but the valve junior doesn't have one, so is there an effects loop mod out there? I already tried the EVJ thread but it's gone or something.
#2
You might just be overdriving your amp at higher volumes... Sounds like you just need a bigger amp if you arent happy with the volume you get before breakup.
#3
Quote by gsr2k6
You might just be overdriving your amp at higher volumes... Sounds like you just need a bigger amp if you arent happy with the volume you get before breakup.


Yeah, it's the poweramp that's overdriving I believe. So an effects loop wouldn't help.
Quote by Lunchbox362
This thread if fail in almost every way imaniganable.
#5
I don't think adding an effects loop is possible due to the design of the amp.....

There are many VJ modders out there so I would assume it would have been already if it were possible.

What type of effects are you using? Loops are really meant for time/modulation effects such as delay, phaser and such.
#6
Well if that's the case I guess I'll try to find a way to get it louder before break up or just mike it. But I heard of a 4 cable method that involves effects loop that gets a better tone out of the Boss Gt-8.
#8
Yeah SEwatt have a mod for that.

It's probably not gonna fix the issue though.

The Valve Junior naturally has those characteristics, i've modded mine to eternity and i'm still unhappy.
The Laney Thread are big and clever. No exceptions.
#9
May want to try a tube change. Mine doesn't start to break up until about 2 o'clock and it's getting pretty loud at that point. What are you trying to do? have you got the combo or head/cab? Chances are you just need a more powerful amp. 5 watts only goes so far.
Dean Icon PZ
Line 6 Variax 700
Dean V-Wing
Dean ML 79 SilverBurst
MXR M 108
H2O Chorus/Echo
Valve Junior (V3 Head/Cab and Combo)
VHT Special 6
Phonic 620 Power Pod PA
Wampler Super Plextortion
Line 6 Pod HD
#10
The pedal will boost the signal going in. Same way a TS or OD would do. Which as designed would make it break up faster. If you want more clean headroom you need a bigger amp or turn the volume down on the pedal.
#11
Quote by Tackleberry
The pedal will boost the signal going in. Same way a TS or OD would do. Which as designed would make it break up faster. If you want more clean headroom you need a bigger amp or turn the volume down on the pedal.


The guitar volume knob may help clean it up a bit also.
Dean Icon PZ
Line 6 Variax 700
Dean V-Wing
Dean ML 79 SilverBurst
MXR M 108
H2O Chorus/Echo
Valve Junior (V3 Head/Cab and Combo)
VHT Special 6
Phonic 620 Power Pod PA
Wampler Super Plextortion
Line 6 Pod HD
#13
^ Nope, that's an FX loop all right.
The Laney Thread are big and clever. No exceptions.
#14
Quote by MrCarrot
^ Nope, that's an FX loop all right.
Normally an FX loop goes between the preamp and the power amp. You could say it's a loop, but it appears to serve no purpose. So why do you say it's a loop?
#15
Because it's an SE amp without a phase inverter, where the hell do you expect it to go?
The Laney Thread are big and clever. No exceptions.
#16
Quote by MrCarrot
Because it's an SE amp without a phase inverter, where the hell do you expect it to go?
So what's the point? Why have a loop at all?
#18
Quote by MrCarrot
Exactly.


Now running an Eleven Rack with Pro Tools 10.3.3 - it's amazing and I'm having ball with it - worth every penny. PT 10 is tops IMO and the Eleven Rack is a work of art!
#19
Hi all,

I'm a bit of a newbie when it comes to guitar tech. I'm interested in having an 'FX loop' on my epiphone VJ head for more versatility. I'm currently using a korg fx unit, though will probably also use other pedals...

From what I understand about FX loops (correct me if wrong) is that generally they allow the guitar output to bypass the VJ preamp stage, as it sounds better to have effects like modulation and delay placed after the preamp distortion instead of before it.

I'm a little confused about some of the previous posts are you saying that the VJ doesn't need an fx loop or doesn't have a proper place to put one??

thank you
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 17, 2008,
#20
try a tube swap to a 12at7 or a 12au7 and try to calm down the preamp section. i run a 12at7 and really like it.
#21
actually now I'm not too concerned about having an FX loop, I read that modulation/time fx are best done miked after the speaker..

I'm actually interested in having an optional clean channel on the epiphone VJ, so instead of using the VJ's preamp distortion I can just use the fx unit/pedal to get the right preamp distortion. Reason being I heard that the VJ's preamp distortion might sometimes be too 'vintage' sounding. However ofcourse I don't want to lose the sound of the VJ's power-amp stage breaking up.
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 17, 2008,
#22
Just try changing the tubes in the preamp. Epi forum recommends 5751's I think. I haven't tried it, but if you don't like it you can always change them back.
Dean Icon PZ
Line 6 Variax 700
Dean V-Wing
Dean ML 79 SilverBurst
MXR M 108
H2O Chorus/Echo
Valve Junior (V3 Head/Cab and Combo)
VHT Special 6
Phonic 620 Power Pod PA
Wampler Super Plextortion
Line 6 Pod HD
#23
thanks,

does swapping the preamp valves keep preamp from breaking up so much, but still allow roughly the same amount of preamp gain to drive the main output (power amp) stage? Don't want to lose the power-amp break up..
#24
They say it stays clean a bit longer. so if you breakup inbetween 12 and 1 o'clock you may be able to go to 2 or something. But like i said I haven't tried it. I like my V3 Vj just the way it is.

Edit: what pedals are you using?
Dean Icon PZ
Line 6 Variax 700
Dean V-Wing
Dean ML 79 SilverBurst
MXR M 108
H2O Chorus/Echo
Valve Junior (V3 Head/Cab and Combo)
VHT Special 6
Phonic 620 Power Pod PA
Wampler Super Plextortion
Line 6 Pod HD
Last edited by scott58 at Sep 17, 2008,
#25
thanks,

the thing is I want the option of using the VJ's preamp distortion and sometimes instead the FXunit distortion (before the VJ preamp).

So I guess I want variable VJ preamp distortion (clean to heavy) whilst still maintaining the power-amp stage distortion at low volumes. Maybe some of the aftermarket kits like bitmo will do this?

Currently an AX1500G, but I also have a Vox valvetronix amp that has a line out, can't wait to try it plugged into my cranked VJ (everyones sleeping at moment).
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 17, 2008,
#26
Quote by scott58
Just try changing the tubes in the preamp. Epi forum recommends 5751's I think. I haven't tried it, but if you don't like it you can always change them back.

the 5751 sounds really good if your using an overdrive but will not get you in to metal territory and is really buzzy with a distortion pedal. but a 12at7 sound much better imo if your using a disortion pedal and get's a great classic rock tone with a od pedal.
Last edited by mmjohn at Sep 17, 2008,
#27
Regarding tubes I'd like to know more about swapping preamp tubes, ok so some tubes have different gain factors and can be used to substitute the 12AX7 like the 12at7..
http://thetubestore.com/gainfactor.html

If a lower gain tube is used, like people are using on here, that would mean that the preamp will break up later or not at all? right?

Also with a lower gain tube I imagine the amplifier be less loud overall?

And if lower gain tube used, what effect does that have on the power amp stage, does the power amp stage break up earlier or later? I guess I would prefer the power amp stage to break up earlier..

Ok so if use the lower gain tube, the VJ preamp distortion can still be made to occur using a overdrive pedal (basically high gain right?) or the distortion can be made solely by a distortion pedal whilst the VJ preamp remains clean?
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 18, 2008,
#28
Quote by Mattlikesguitar
Regarding tubes I'd like to know more about swapping preamp tubes, ok so some tubes have different gain factors and can be used to substitute the 12AX7 like the 12at7..
http://thetubestore.com/gainfactor.html

If a lower gain tube is used, like people are using on here, that would mean that the preamp will break up later or not at all? right?

Also with a lower gain tube I imagine the amplifier be less loud overall?

And if lower gain tube used, what effect does that have on the power amp stage, does the power amp stage break up earlier or later? I guess I would prefer the power amp stage to break up earlier..

Ok so if use the lower gain tube, the VJ preamp distortion can still be made to occur using a overdrive pedal (basically high gain right?) or the distortion can be made solely by a distortion pedal whilst the VJ preamp remains clean?

yes you get more clean headroom wit a 12at7..........stays clean longer. the 12ax7 or a 5751 will not get to a good metal territory even when pushed with an od. even with it cranked and everyone in the house pissed off or the people next door. you can get an attenuator still not a good metal tone IMO with a od pedal. and with a attenuator what if the intro or the bridge or a song is clean?? even when you use a distortion pedals your still getting breakup of the preamp tube. the 12ax7 and 5751 are a little buzzy when you crank it up. the 12at7 has less breakup and sounds really good with a metal muff. you don't need alot of distotion 9 or 10 o'clock on the gain is plenty and the top boost about the same. and it has has a great metal tone even with the epi volume at about 9 o'clock at about bedroom levels not pissing off everyone. i use a bad monkey and get some real good ac/dc to judas preist tones. i don't use the epi cab.............mines a 1x12 with a celestion g12k. so you might have to see which tubes sound best in your case. maybe a 12at7 or a 12au7 or maybe one of the other 2. let your ears be the judge. there is just a very slight volume drop. not enuff to keep it from sayin damn thats loud.
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#29
thanks mmjohn, your reply is really helpful, its good to get a thorough answer from someone with first hand experience.

I read some posts about people saying that should use the amps preamp distortion if its a full tube amp, but I suspect what people don't realise is that its the power amp stage distortion that makes tubes so great, not so much the tube preamp. I'd like to hear others opinions because I'm still a bit of newbie, but I suspect the preamp distortion can be simulated well with pedal( fx units)..

What's the opinion on combining distortion pedals in combination with the VJ preamp distortion? Is it generally better to just use one or the other seperately ie either use the pedal or use the VJ preamp distortion. If the two are combined together perhaps the sound will get too dirty. Maybe if someone is using the VJ preamp distortion (ie with a higher gain 12ax7) they could use a small subtle amount from a pedal aswell? BUT like you said the VJ preamp can get a bit buzzy...
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 19, 2008,
#30
the basic idea is to create clean head room. and use the pedal for it's metal tone not really for it's gain. and allow the tubes in the vj head to do the work in combonation with the pedal. on my metal muff the level is around noon and the gain is maybe 10 o'clock. and with the amps volume around 11 o'clock it's freakin loud! back the volume on the vj around 8 or 9 and you have good bedroom level. i would suggest a good eq and a good reverb pedal. reverb sound great with the vj. i also have a jj el84 in the power section. the tubes are cheap and easy to change just find the preamp tube that sound good to you. good luck!
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Last edited by mmjohn at Sep 19, 2008,
#31
thanks, what brand 12at7 are you using?

so 'metal muff' is good any other cult/good pedals? I'm into heavier music like tool, placebo, nin, soundgarden, blues...Good allrounder would be good.

hows the eq on the metal muff? I was thinking of getting an eq, maybe even a rack mount like Behringer.
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 19, 2008,
#32
Quote by Mattlikesguitar
thanks, what brand 12at7 are you using?

so 'metal muff' is good any other cult/good pedals? I'm into heavier music like tool, placebo, nin, soundgarden, blues...Good allrounder would be good.

hows the eq on the metal muff? I was thinking of getting an eq, maybe even a rack mount like Behringer.

i'm using a mesa 12at7............and the metal muff is a very good pedal the eq is solid. pretty dark metal sound to 80's metal and if you use the top boost around 9 o'clock it's like early metllica think ride the lightning. boost alittle more and you'll find a pantera tone. i like the fulltone ocd alot also. but a eq is a must it really wakes these amps up.
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#33
I noticed that some of the Bitmo kits have 'gain' 'boost' 'voicing' switches etc...
I wouldn't need all that if have fx pedal, right? Just want to make sure I'm not missing out on anything, lol.

I bought the VJ already fitted with a spanky mod & tweed tone control, new OT...
My fx unit is an AX1500G, its got dual channels per effect, good for clean and dirty switching I guess...
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 20, 2008,
#34
to be honest I don't see how a lower gain tube in the VJ is needed, I mean (correct me if I'm wrong) but if want to get less VJ preamp distortion all you need to do is reduce the level input to the VJ preamp. Yes the amps volume will be less, but it will also be less with a lower gain valve.

I mean if the VJ preamp distorted REALLY easily (even with low level from pedal) then yes a lower gain valve may help, but the VJ preamp doesn't distort that easy, right?
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 22, 2008,
#35
Quote by Mattlikesguitar
to be honest I don't see how a lower gain tube in the VJ is needed, I mean (correct me if I'm wrong) but if want to get less VJ preamp distortion all you need to do is reduce the level input to the VJ preamp. Yes the amps volume will be less, but it will also be less with a lower gain valve.

I mean if the VJ preamp distorted REALLY easily (even with low level from pedal) then yes a lower gain valve may help, but the VJ preamp doesn't distort that easy, right?

then you lose clean headroom....................if you put a distortion pedal thru a distorted channel it usally sounds bad. but if you put it thru the clean channel it sound perfect.
___________________________
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#36
but what I'm saying is on the VJ the clean channel can possibly be obtained by using less level (with the pedal) before the VJ preamp using a 12ax7?
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 22, 2008,
#37
Quote by Mattlikesguitar
but what I'm saying is on the VJ the clean channel can possibly be obtained by using less level (with the pedal) before the VJ preamp using a 12ax7?

just give it a try and let your ears be the judge.............i'm just telling you what i learned. you have to suit you.
___________________________
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#38
that's cool, I don't mind admitting when I might be wrong.
I actually ordered both the 12at7 and 12ax7 from tubestore, so I'll see how it goes.
My thinking is more theory than practical application.
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Sep 22, 2008,
#39
I just got some new tubes, seems maybe that there is more distortion at low volumes now, I'm using a hot 12ax7, maybe too hot for dist pedal??.So I'm thinking of putting in the 12AT7. interesting I knew the hotter 12ax7 had more gain, but I didn't suspect it would be as much at low volumes...
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Oct 30, 2008,
#40
So with the EVJ does a lower gain preamptube with more input signal (ie overdrive pedal), sound better than a higher gain preamptube with less input signal? As one might think that they will sound the same (just substituting the gain of the tube with the gain of the OD pedal?), but the preamp dist being the same either way? I don't know, but I actually like the 12AT7 in at the moment for whatever reason lol

When you used the higher gain tube, did you try simply turning down the volume knob on the amp or pedal to get good sound?
Last edited by Mattlikesguitar at Nov 3, 2008,