#1
I memorized chords instead of making my own within scales? i barley know anyting about scales andhow to make chords. i just have memorized a bunch of em
#2
Learn chords first. Then scales. Too many kids just learn a bunch of licks, and scales before actually learning how to play rhythm guitar which is much more important in the sense of songwriting.
#3
well.. memorizing chords and scales is a great way to start and yes if u no how to find what key a song is in a what scale it uses. u are on ur way to starting something good theory wise which is very handy
#4
i think anyone has a chance at being a succesful musician if they work hard enough at there playing i dont really believe that theory is the end all be all to music there have been succesful guitarists that knew very little theory dimebag darrell chuck schuldiner hendrix knowing theory and all that probally helps in becoming a good muscian but in the end its all really about the music unless your wanting to be a music teacher or a session artits or something than theory is probally a must
#5
iam just starting on music theory myself and i think u should learn a combination of both they are both great to know they will both become very useful
#6
well the 2 go hand in hand sort of, so memorizing the chords isn't a waste of time really, well it sort of is, but it doesn't hurt you. There are just more efficient ways to go about it, which is why theory is important.
#7
Quote by metallica72487
i think anyone has a chance at being a succesful musician if they work hard enough at there playing i dont really believe that theory is the end all be all to music there have been succesful guitarists that knew very little theory dimebag darrell chuck schuldiner hendrix knowing theory and all that probally helps in becoming a good muscian but in the end its all really about the music unless your wanting to be a music teacher or a session artits or something than theory is probally a must



i agree. just express yourself thoroughly through your music. chords, licks, scales, theories, whatever...music is a lifestyle and NOT a job. start with a dream, and continue to build upon it and transform the dream into a tangible reality.
#9
heres my life.

study your chords and scales and theory. once you do this you will become a strict rule follower. you THEN have to learn to break out of this for sake of creativity and complexity and style.
#10
Quote by Minoroffense
I memorized chords instead of making my own within scales? i barley know anyting about scales andhow to make chords. i just have memorized a bunch of em

You COULD be a successful musician, but knowing how to make your own chords/scales is a pretty useful thing. Of course, just memorizing it (D major scale, Cmaj7 chord shapes) would be fine, but all you really need to do that is a knowledge of intervals; and that's pretty easy.

I think the real challenge is applying theory, and how to use it to make your music sound good. For an obvious example; if you want to write a "sad" song, use a minor key. It makes capturing the mood of a song so much easier, in my opinion.
#11
Quote by Minoroffense
I memorized chords instead of making my own within scales? i barley know anyting about scales andhow to make chords. i just have memorized a bunch of em


The fact that you're looking for shortcuts around fundamental skills means that you won't because you don't have the discipline or desire to progress. You only get good at an instrument by putting in some hard work, if you can't be bothered then you don't get very far.

My advice is too get your head round the fact that learning the guitar requires study, practice and old-fashioned hard work. The sooner you accept that the sooner you'll start getting somewhere.
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Last edited by steven seagull at Feb 29, 2008,
#12
Quote by metallica72487
there have been succesful guitarists that knew very little theory dimebag darrell


you are sorely mistaken sir. i don't know why everyone thinks dimebag didn't know any theory. he knew a LOT of it. his father gave him lessons at a young age and he took practice pretty seriously for a kid. he also spent alot of time with country, blues and some rock musicians at the studio and picked up tons stuff from them too.
#13
Quote by z4twenny
you are sorely mistaken sir. i don't know why everyone thinks dimebag didn't know any theory. he knew a LOT of it. his father gave him lessons at a young age and he took practice pretty seriously for a kid. he also spent alot of time with country, blues and some rock musicians at the studio and picked up tons stuff from them too.


thats not true according to what i read in guitar world dime said himself he new very little theory yes he new some theory but not alot he said it himeself that he only new a couple of scales and just about everything he did came from jamming same thing with chuck from death he was a suscessful musicain aswell without knowing much theory just read his bio but dime is probally a better example since he is someone pretty much everyone knows or what about hendrix
Last edited by metallica72487 at Feb 29, 2008,
#14
^Dime knew plenty of theory. It isn't coincidence that his stuff fits nicely into common scales and patterns.

Edit: I had to say he "knew."

Why'd that bastard have to shoot him!!!
#15
I dislike it when people say "there have been succesful guitarists that knew very little theory" and then go and make a list of 5. I could write a hundred names of guitarists who know little theory and failed miserably. Hendrix and co succeeded because of enormous talent, and not everybody has that. Average Joe's can only compete by hard work and learning their instrument.
#16
Quote by metallica72487
thats not true according to what i read in guitar world dime said himself he new very little theory yes he new some theory but not alot he said it himeself that he only new a couple of scales and just about everything he did came from jamming same thing with chuck from death he was a suscessful musicain aswell without knowing much theory just read his bio but dime is probally a better example since he is someone pretty much everyone knows or what about hendrix


what issue? i've heard/read him say that he knows theory he didn't just actively use it (which is what i do, learn it, apply it, forget it) don't get me wrong, he's said on plenty of occassions that he just played what sounded right which is fine since he knew how to make on the guitar what he heard in his head. he might not have known the name for every scale he knew (and he did know quite a few and was quite well knowledged modally) his father was a country guitarist and ran a recording studio, dime spent a LOT of time up there with his father and other musicians picking things up from them. what you expect me to believe is that dime spent almost his entire youth around music and musicians and knew very little theory. nuh-uh, it doesn't work like that.
#17
In the GW you're talking about Dime said that he didn't know ALOT of theory. Meaning that he didn't know as much as say Satch or Petrucci does, but he know his scales and such, and used it. Hendrix knew the scales and basic theory as well, and before he died he was talking about how he wanted to learn a lot more...
Scales exist and are known even if you don't bother to learn them, and just "figure them out". It doesn't mean that you invented anything new, you just learned the same thing everyone else knows in 2 years, when they read it in 5 minutes... I believe it helps because it allows you MORE freedom to create and more freedom to advance yourself. Obviously thats just what I believe. I look it like this, would John Nash have been able to make his advanced economic discoveries if he was stuck "re inventing" algebra?
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#18
Quote by rhoads4ever
In the GW you're talking about Dime said that he didn't know ALOT of theory. Meaning that he didn't know as much as say Satch or Petrucci does, but he know his scales and such, and used it. Hendrix knew the scales and basic theory as well, and before he died he was talking about how he wanted to learn a lot more...
Scales exist and are known even if you don't bother to learn them, and just "figure them out". It doesn't mean that you invented anything new, you just learned the same thing everyone else knows in 2 years, when they read it in 5 minutes... I believe it helps because it allows you MORE freedom to create and more freedom to advance yourself. Obviously thats just what I believe. I look it like this, would John Nash have been able to make his advanced economic discoveries if he was stuck "re inventing" algebra?


i know that thats what i meant that he didnt know alot of theory thats what i meant that you didnt have to know alot of theory i dint mean not any what so ever knowing little theory and not knowing alot of theory means the same to me
#19
He knew lots of stuff about minor scales, intervals, scale construction, and flattened chromatics (b2 and b5). That doesn't get you a Matsers Degree in music theory, but it doesn't qualify as "just a little knowledge" either.
#20
Quote by Chris_Sleeps
I dislike it when people say "there have been succesful guitarists that knew very little theory" and then go and make a list of 5. I could write a hundred names of guitarists who know little theory and failed miserably. Hendrix and co succeeded because of enormous talent, and not everybody has that. Average Joe's can only compete by hard work and learning their instrument.


you shouldnt dislike that.... because its true. That doesnt mean you shouldnt learn theory. If you want to you should. But you can engage the music in other ways, and still develop enough of an understanding to make good music. Hendrix succeeded becuase he did have that understanding. He developed his understanding through experience with music... listening... playing....... Im sure he spent LOTS of time with music. Alot of people here could probably score higher then him in a college level theory exam. its much less likely though, that those same people will find anywhere near his success as a musician. (although its certainly possible.. who knows)

To me, its just as annoying if people say that you CANT be a successful musician without knowing theory.

The truth is you can be successful with or without a traditional theory background.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Feb 29, 2008,
#21
^ yes but your chances of being successful increase infinately with knowledge as then you're not limited to just "being a guitarist" you can actually start writing for things other than guitar and increase your chances of doing things like commercial jingles, soundtrack recording, writing scores for movies and really ANYTHING thats musically involved. also a potential employer will take you more seriously if you can put down something on a resume along the lines of "self educated in the study of music theory and dynamics for 5 years" instead of "i play guitar", subsequently if you've got a degree to back it up obviously its that much better.
#22
Quote by z4twenny
^ yes but your chances of being successful increase infinately with knowledge as then you're not limited to just "being a guitarist" you can actually start writing for things other than guitar and increase your chances of doing things like commercial jingles, soundtrack recording, writing scores for movies and really ANYTHING thats musically involved. also a potential employer will take you more seriously if you can put down something on a resume along the lines of "self educated in the study of music theory and dynamics for 5 years" instead of "i play guitar", subsequently if you've got a degree to back it up obviously its that much better.



This is all true! As a working musician, a good understanding of music theory will give you a huge advantage. There is certainly nothing wrong with learning theory, and there are lots of benefits. The only thing I reject is the notion that one cant be a successful artist or musician without it. I accept that there is success from those with alot of theoretical knowledge as well as those with little or none.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Feb 29, 2008,
#23
Quote by GuitarMunky
This is all true! As a working musician, a good understanding of music theory will give you a huge advantage. There is certainly nothing wrong with learning theory, and there are lots of benefits. The only thing I reject is the notion that one cant be a successful artist or musician without it. I accept that there is success from those with alot of theoretical knowledge as well as those with little or none.


then why bother learning it if you can be just as good without it?
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#24
Quote by radiantmoon
then why bother learning it if you can be just as good without it?


Because theory allows you to communicate with other musicians, and eliminates the guesswork involved in writing music.
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#25
Quote by radiantmoon
then why bother learning it if you can be just as good without it?



think of it this way: say you're playing a duet with a pianist, or a violinist, and you play some little riff/melody/whatever and they ask "well what note did you start on, and what key are you in?" and you say something like "the 7th fret 2nd string, and i lost my keys" (this doesn't mean jack squat to the other musician)

but if you knew theory, you would be able to say "it started on F# and then continued up the F# minor scale (or whatever), then they would know what you're talking about.
#26
Quote by radiantmoon
then why bother learning it if you can be just as good without it?


Thats a good question

Quote by Archeo Avis
Because theory allows you to communicate with other musicians, and eliminates the guesswork involved in writing music.

^
and thats a good answer

Quote by linfield44


if you knew theory, you would be able to say "it started on F# and then continued up the F# minor scale (or whatever), then they would know what you're talking about.

^
so is this


Theory allows you to better understand whats been done with music. By learning and understanding what others have done, we open up possibilities for ourselves. We can build upon what we learn, and/or take it in a different direction altogether.

That being said listening, learning and playing music is a way to engage music that can bring a sense of understanding. From an artistic standpoint that is sufficient, even without the book knowledge. For someone that plans on teaching music, or working with other musicians, having a common understanding and being able to communicate ideas is important. Studying music theory is essential in that regard.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Feb 29, 2008,
#28
Quote by ouchies
You would be a better musician if you learned theory.



You might, and you might not. You will definitely have a greater understanding, and be able to communicate that understanding with others. As far as being a better artist or musician. There are alot of other factors that effect that. But it certainly cant hurt.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Feb 29, 2008,
#29
My answer to your question is no. You could learn all the theory you want, and not have an ounce of understanding about the feel of music (this is the case with FAR too many musicians nowadays). Study all types of music and guitar playing, then form your own style out of what you have learned.

Knowing all the modes and chords does help you progress as a musician and even master your instrument, but to master the music itself, you have to dig deeper than theory. I would say I have a very solid foundation of theory, but you can be a master musician without being able to name every chord. Music comes from the heart not from the brain. That is why, I believe, guitarists like Hendrix and Page were far superior to others. They knew theory but they went beyond it.
#30
Quote by food1010
My answer to your question is no. You could learn all the theory you want, and not have an ounce of understanding about the feel of music (this is the case with FAR too many musicians nowadays). Study all types of music and guitar playing, then form your own style out of what you have learned.

Knowing all the modes and chords does help you progress as a musician and even master your instrument, but to master the music itself, you have to dig deeper than theory. I would say I have a very solid foundation of theory, but you can be a master musician without being able to name every chord. Music comes from the heart not from the brain. That is why, I believe, guitarists like Hendrix and Page were far superior to others. They knew theory but they went beyond it.


Studying and understanding types of guitar playing would be much easier if you knew enough theory to analyze, and then apply and practice what you've learned.

Feel in music is subjective.
#31
Quote by food1010


Knowing all the modes and chords does help you progress as a musician and even master your instrument, but to master the music itself, you have to dig deeper than theory. I would say I have a very solid foundation of theory, but you can be a master musician without being able to name every chord. Music comes from the heart not from the brain. That is why, I believe, guitarists like Hendrix and Page were far superior to others. They knew theory but they went beyond it.


thats a great point, that alot of people overlook. There is something beyond theory that makes music worth listening to. Having an understanding of music theory is certainly a good thing, but its not what makes a musician good. It can enhance what they have, and allow them to see and hear things that they might not without a knowledge of theory..... but its the way they express themselves that gives an artists music its quality.

Quote by ouchies
Studying and understanding types of guitar playing would be much easier if you knew enough theory to analyze, and then apply and practice what you've learned.

Feel in music is subjective.


your right if you studied what they do from a theory perspective, you can take that knowledge and apply it. There are things though that you can learn about their playing that have nothing to do with theory, and are still important to learn. Feel IS one of them. While it may be subjective, it still exists, and you will pick up on that when learning how to play their music.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Feb 29, 2008,
#32
Quote by GuitarMunky
thats a great point, that alot of people overlook. There is something beyond theory that makes music worth listening to. Having an understanding of music theory is certainly a good thing, but its not what makes a musician good. It can enhance what they have, and allow them to see and hear things that they might not without a knowledge of theory..... but its the way they express themselves that gives an artists music its quality.


your right if you studied what they do from a theory perspective, you can take that knowledge and apply it. There are things though that you can learn about their playing that have nothing to do with theory, and are still important to learn. Feel IS one of them. While it may be subjective, it still exists, and you will pick up on that when learning how to play their music.


But you must admit it does give you an advantage to know theory.
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#34
Quote by z4twenny
^ i can't think of a single downside to theory.
Learning it is time consuming. If you've got the ear, that time could be better spent on something else, speed, vibrato, phrasing, even something unrelated to music.

I still encourage learning it, though.