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#1
Hello, UG

There are always arguments about pop-punks not being TROO PUNX. Everyone who follows that kind of thing seems to want to become a TROO PUNK, whereas pop-punk is regarded as an almost derrogative term, and is always flamed by people who have never listened to it.

Sure, some bands are pretty whiny and others sound like N*Sync with guitars, but with certain bands, the difference between punk and pop is hardly evident. For example early Sum 41, The F-ups, the Offspring and Set Your Goals.

When you think about it, some pop-punks do all the same things as true punks
-They play a lot of powerchords and simple riffs
-They sing songs about the government and about refusing to fit in
-They sound agressive and offensive to some
-A lot of them start out as a bunch of regular dudes playing music in a garage. Sure, some of them sell out and get their music warped by the industry, but if you listen to their early records, their influences are evident

On the other hand, one of the best-known punk bands, The Clash:
-sound very poppy. I was surprised the first time I heard them.
-Play simple riffs and it's acceptable
-Sing a lot of songs about relationships
-Use the major scale a lot

So why is it acceptable for some and not for others? Everyone hates pop-punk purely for the fact that it isn't REAL PUNK.

So what I'm saying is: Let them play whatever music they ****ing want. The people who told me I was stupid for not liking Hip Hop then go on to bash Blink 182 (usually in the same thread).

No-one's making you listen to it.

Thank you for your attention. TL;DR.
#3
I love the catchy-ness of it all. The vocals and the drum beats. Most of it is feel-good music for me.
#4
Contrary to what Hooked On Phonics has taught you, it is spelt "true".
Quote by RHCP94
It's an option for the "Which one of E Daws parents are uglier?" thread.
#6
1) ^^Pwnt
2) this is about to erupt into flame fest
3) thats why its called POP-Punk, and not regular punk. because it ISNT punk, the same way metalcore isn't metal
/thread.
#8
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
1) ^^Pwnt
2) this is about to erupt into flame fest
3) thats why its called POP-Punk, and not regular punk. because it ISNT punk, the same way metalcore isn't metal
/thread.

Oh wow. I thought it was called that because it was punk combined with pop elemnts to make it catchier. Silly me.
Space reserved for cool quotes.
#9
Oh gods

Some pop-punk is good. Ie The Buzzcocks, The Queers, Screeching Weasel, et cetera. However, what people generally call pop-punk, and what we in the p0nx forum refer to as pop-rock, is generally actually not really anything like real punk, and as such, people get the wrong idea. This annoys the real punks, as there are then loads of annoying children being like "Omg, I'm soo pawnk rawk" when they like Blink 182 or something.

Or something, I'm really tired and sort of lost track when I started trying to find videos for my argument. Johnny Thunders ftw

But yeah, I don't mind the bands, it's just when people think they're punks, but like this new stuff that's rather annoying. Especially when trying to find band members

EDIT: And it leads to annoying stereotypes about punks not being able to solo and stuff.
FUCK YOU! GET PUMPED!
#11
Quote by Deliriumbassist
...

and this constitutes a thread how?

Troo punks =/= pop punk

there's always elitists.

And this thread is asking them to shut up
Quote by ctb
I love the catchy-ness of it all. The vocals and the drum beats. Most of it is feel-good music for me.

I do, too. I prefer it to real punk, actually. Happy music FTW.
Quote by E Daws
Contrary to what Hooked On Phonics has taught you, it is spelt "true".

What is "Hooked on Phonics"?
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
1) ^^Pwnt
2) this is about to erupt into flame fest
3) thats why its called POP-Punk, and not regular punk. because it ISNT punk, the same way metalcore isn't metal
/thread.

Flame fest did not erupt yet. I am aware that it's a whole different genre, and that it doesn't try to be regular punk. But people flame it purely because they think that pop-punks are trying to be punk and failing.
Quote by SuperBlob

But yeah, I don't mind the bands, it's just when people think they're punks, but like this new stuff that's rather annoying. Especially when trying to find band members

I agree, those kids are annoying. I like pop-punk bands, but I know I'm not a punk. Worse than any kind of music is the people that take it too far.
Last edited by sashki at Mar 8, 2008,
#12
Quote by gu1t4rh3r0
Oh wow. I thought it was called that because it was punk combined with pop elemnts to make it catchier. Silly me.



well now you know better.
sort of like how metalcore is metal mixed with hardcore elements

but does that make it metal? nah B ry. that makes it metalcore

o i almost forgot the obligatory
Last edited by DaStrat0blast3r at Mar 8, 2008,
#13
Quote by SuperBlob
Oh gods

Some pop-punk is good. Ie The Buzzcocks, The Queers, Screeching Weasel, et cetera. However, what people generally call pop-punk, and what we in the p0nx forum refer to as pop-rock, is generally actually not really anything like real punk, and as such, people get the wrong idea. This annoys the real punks, as there are then loads of annoying children being like "Omg, I'm soo pawnk rawk" when they like Blink 182 or something.

Or something, I'm really tired and sort of lost track when I started trying to find videos for my argument. Johnny Thunders ftw

But yeah, I don't mind the bands, it's just when people think they're punks, but like this new stuff that's rather annoying. Especially when trying to find band members

EDIT: And it leads to annoying stereotypes about punks not being able to solo and stuff.



^ this is basically what i am trying to say, but trying to do so in much fewer words.
#14
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
well now you know better.
sort of like how metalcore is metal mixed with hardcore elements

but does that make it metal? nah B ry. that makes it metalcore

o i almost forgot the obligatory

Pantera mixed metal with hardcore elements. Are they METALCORE?
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
^ this is basically what i am trying to say, but trying to do so in much fewer words.

You phail at communicating your ideas.
#15
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
well now you know better.
sort of like how metalcore is metal mixed with hardcore elements

but does that make it metal? nah B ry. that makes it metalcore

o i almost forgot the obligatory

Pardon me, it think I forgot my "/sarcasm"...
Space reserved for cool quotes.
#16
Quote by sashki
Pantera mixed metal with hardcore elements. Are they METALCORE?



No because they're were metal dominated and while they had hardcore elements, they were still mainly metal. metalcore is almost an entirely different style then metal and/or hardcore.
Founder of UG's David Bowie Fan Club. Pm to join.

Founder of UG's "Rockers against being freakishly skinny" Club. PM to join.
#18
One of the biggest factors is that these "pop punks" have vast royalties whereas 'classic punk' perhaps squatted in a tower block and sold records for as little as possible. That's where the difference and not wanting to be associated with pop punks starts. They made the music to supply their fans.
#21
Quote by Craigo
The same argument can be applied to hardcore punk, but anyone who confuses that with pop punk must be deaf.

True. But they're radically different. Whereas listen The Clash's "Lost in the Supermarket". How hardcore is that? Not very. It's still considered punk, though.

I've heard Coldplay and Maroon 5 being classified as rock bands. Jay Z keeps calling himself a rockstar. I can't say I agree with that.
#22
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
well now you know better.
sort of like how metalcore is metal mixed with hardcore elements

but does that make it metal? nah B ry. that makes it metalcore

o i almost forgot the obligatory


Death metal influenced by celtic sounds/melodies...It cant be metal its insane. In flames...Dark Tranquillity, Wintersun....WTF those bands aint metal..

/sarcasm.
#23
Quote by sashki
True. But they're radically different. Whereas listen The Clash's "Lost in the Supermarket". How hardcore is that? Not very. It's still considered punk, though.

I've heard Coldplay and Maroon 5 being classified as rock bands. Jay Z keeps calling himself a rockstar. I can't say I agree with that.

Maroon 5 and Coldplay are Pop/Rock bands, and no-one disagrees with that really. And Jay-Z is a fool

EDIT: A lot of Hardcore Punk is not radically different from punk, but people still alienate them away.
Last edited by Craigo at Mar 8, 2008,
#24
Eh

Basically TROO PUNK sounds gritty, Pop-Punk sounds more polished. S'about it ^__^;
Quote by SteveHouse
Also you're off topic. This thread is about Reva eating snowmen.
#25
Quote by metaldud536
Death metal influenced by celtic sounds/melodies...It cant be metal its insane. In flames...Dark Tranquillity, Wintersun....WTF those bands aint metal..

/sarcasm.

Metalcore is not metal, get over it.
#28
Quote by sashki

I do, too. I prefer it to real punk, actually. Happy music FTW.

Hey, there's happy punk too
http://youtube.com/watch?v=-hzlfdnZbWQ
See
Quote by sashki
I agree, those kids are annoying. I like pop-punk bands, but I know I'm not a punk. Worse than any kind of music is the people that take it too far.

*MSN thumbs up smiley*
Quote by sashki
True. But they're radically different. Whereas listen The Clash's "Lost in the Supermarket". How hardcore is that? Not very. It's still considered punk, though.

I consider London Calling to be more of a post-punk album. Then after that they just went crazy
Also, compare there earlier stuff to Lost in the Supermarket. They went through a lot of radical change, and pretty much stopped being a punk band after Give em Enough Rope.

Also:
Quote by sashki

Sure, some bands are pretty whiny and others sound like N*Sync with guitars, but with certain bands, the difference between punk and pop is hardly evident. For example early Sum 41, The F-ups, the Offspring and Set Your Goals.

Out of the two I've heard out of those (Sum 41 and Offspring), although they may sound somewhat punkier than others, there is still a huge difference in sound. Compare a song by one of them to the Johnny Thunders songs I posted earlier, and, although there's definite influence, you can still hear a rather large difference.


Not that there's anything wrong with that
FUCK YOU! GET PUMPED!
#29
Quote by metaldud536
Omg...Dream theater and Symphony x isn't metal either because theyre mixed with progressive rock elements.........

And....?

Metalcore is so radically different from metal, and you won't understand this until you grow out of it.

Modern pop has influences from jazz (it grew off from jazz) but it doesn't make it jazz does it? Why not? It's radically different.

Note: Also, I still enjoy a VERY, VERY selective group of metalcore bands (which you probably haven't heard of and won't like). Still, I'm not being an elitist pig, I'm just saying it has it is.
#31
Quote by Craigo
And....?

Metalcore is so radically different from metal, and you won't understand this until you grow out of it.

Modern pop has influences from jazz (it grew off from jazz) but it doesn't make it jazz does it? Why not? It's radically different.

Note: Also, I still enjoy a VERY, VERY selective group of metalcore bands (which you probably haven't heard of and won't like). Still, I'm not being an elitist pig, I'm just saying it has it is.


Metalcore is way closer to metal than to hardcore punk. As I lay dying, all that remains, KSE, darkest hour, Trivium, The human abstract, protest the hero. Breakdowns were not a thing invented by punk rock, it's a metal element.

I dont need wiki to show me anything. I HEAR the similarities.
#32
Quote by SuperBlob

Out of the two I've heard out of those (Sum 41 and Offspring), although they may sound somewhat punkier than others, there is still a huge difference in sound. Compare a song by one of them to the Johnny Thunders songs I posted earlier, and, although there's definite influence, you can still hear a rather large difference.

Not that there's anything wrong with that

If you're even slightly interested
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=2233518
www.myspace.com/setyourgoals

One thing which annoys me is this

I'm not saying I'm well informed on the subject, but whoever controls that site clearly has no idea. Their slogan is "music mends broken hearts". The Sex Pistols would be proud.
Last edited by sashki at Mar 8, 2008,
#33
for the most part pop punk is not excepted as real punk for the fact that it goes against the main belief, thou shalt not go mainstream, as is the case with MOST pop-punk bands, i.e- Blink 182, Good Charlotte, Simple Plan and what not. but there are pop-punk bands that don't break that rule such as the Queers. but to make money off of punk is against our rules and regulations. and we have no tolerance towards it. we're not elitist, we don't like "bands" making money off of something we hold near and dear to our hearts.
fender aerodyne jazz bass>mxr el grande bass fuzz>boss odb-3>dunlop crybaby bass wah>randall rba 500 es/ampeg 8x10
#34
Quote by sashki
Pantera mixed metal with hardcore elements. Are they METALCORE?


no because pantera didn't mix hardcore elements until the albums TGSTK and Far Beyond Driven. up till that point they were absolutely 100% unadulterated metal. groove metal to be exact.
#35
my god. look what i started. lets just get this overwith. METALCORE by definition is not metal. ask any bandmember from any metalcore band, and they will tell you that they aren't a "metal" band. they are a metalCORE band. and to that otherguy, its known as progressive metal. you could even call Opeth progressive metal.
edit: sorry about double post, i thought i saw someone post ahead of me
#36
You have no idea what you're talking about.

First of all it's "Tr00 p0nx *-)"

Second, How many punks do you know that diss pop punk? I certainly don't and there's rarely ever any of it going on int he punk forum.
BRIGHT LIGHTS PUT ME IN A TRANCE.
but it aint house music that makes me want to dance.
#37
there is no such thing as "tr00 punks" anymore in the way you're thinking of it. punk is dead. it's been dead since the mid-80s. it's a lot like grunge in that it was a time and a place and an atmosphere in addition to music. there are bands today that could have been grunge bands, but they're not because it was an era. punk was an era and that era ended in probably 1985 or 1986.

there are still punk scenes around but it's a lot different than stuff in the 80s. there's stilla lot of good punk music around too. but there's not really "tr00 punks" anymore like you would have seen in 1982.

there's nothing wrong with pop-punk. there's a problem with people labeling pop-rock as "pop-punk".

edit: and i'm pretty sure the queers make money. they may not make much, but they do make money.

you know what else is funny about the crazy genre-ising is that rage against the machine is pretty much by definition a rapcore band. but no one considers them that at all.
#DTWD
#38
Quote by DaStrat0blast3r
my god. look what i started. lets just get this overwith. METALCORE by definition is not metal. ask any bandmember from any metalcore band, and they will tell you that they aren't a "metal" band. they are a metalCORE band. and to that otherguy, its known as progressive metal. you could even call Opeth progressive metal.
edit: sorry about double post, i thought i saw someone post ahead of me


I will ask Howard from KSE and he will say ...Massachusetts metal. Look dude its metal. It's metal mixing influences from other genres. The same way heavy metal is influenced by psychedlic rock and rock in general.
#40
I have somethings to say before this thread gets closed.

1. Spelling word the wrong way does not in anyway way make it cool aka "Troo Punx", "Nu Metal".

2. I've never really understood why their is a divide between Pop-Punk and punk. I though when music was classified, it was put into a certain group because it sounded the same as other music in that group. Musicly there similar 3/4 chord songs, played pretty fast and lyrically, they sing about many of the same topics.

So personally I think The Clash, Green Day, Minor Threat, Blink 182 and Social D are all punk.
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