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#1
Inspired by the "Is Jackson Dying?" Thread

YTF is everyone saying that Jackson sucks because they're owned by fender? For your information, they've been owned since 2002, and the fact that they are owned by fender does not at all reflect upon their products.

Do you see Jackson producing strats and teles now? NO. They're making the same great guitars they always have. In fact, there was an upgrade around 2003, since when the Pro series now come stock with Seymour Duncan pickups, rather than duncan-designed and EMG Hz.

And the Pro series are some of the best selling axes they have. A lot of UGers have them. They're great value for money.

Sure, it's sad that they don't have any new guitars. But is it their fault that EVERYONE in metal has moved on to ESP?

The fact that Fender owns them hasn't changed anything. They still operate as they used to. Just cos you don't like fender because "OMG dey liek isn't metal enuff bc they hav teh SINGL3COILZorz" doesn't mean Jackson sucks.

Don't judge.

[/rant]
#3
fender also owns a certain acoustic brand now which doesnt feel the same post buyout
idk....i love strats and teles alot

but jacksons post fender dont satisfy my metal head friends like late 90s ones do
Quote by WickedBeast666
Noooooooooooo how could this be! he at all the chocolate in the box
Oh well, now the empty shell of what used to be chocolaty goodness can contain a tasty guitar circuit.


speaking of my homemade pedal
#4
I dislike Jacksons because they play, and sound like crap. Even the high end ones I've tried were poor.

The reason "everyone has moved onto ESP" is because Jackson make sub-par guitars that are not as good as a guitar from the next manufacturer for half the price, generally speaking.

/rant
#5
Quote by Eladamri
I dislike Jacksons because they play, and sound like crap. Even the high end ones I've tried were poor.

The reason "everyone has moved onto ESP" is because Jackson make sub-par guitars that are not as good as a guitar from the next manufacturer for half the price, generally speaking.

/rant

And what makes ESP so great?

They're the most overrated guitar brand out there today, almost more so than Gibson
#6
The current Pro series and higher Jacksons are great guitars. Why have more people moved to ESP's, because ESP is activily marketing their product, Jacksons isn't. That's the only difference. Other than that it's personal preference.
#7
ESP is the best guitar for metal. almost all of them come stock with seymours and they play better than any jackson for a fraction of the price.
#8
Quote by sashki
And what makes ESP so great?

They're the most overrated guitar brand out there today, almost more so than Gibson


I like the ESP's I've played. Same with the Gibsons. It's a personal thing, you no doubt prefer others.
#9
Quote by aces25
ESP is the best guitar for metal. almost all of them come stock with seymours and they play better than any jackson for a fraction of the price.

...so do Jackson. The Pro series and above have Duncans, Active EMG's, Floyd Roses (which are liscenced, but pretty damn good) and really thin necks, if you like that kind of stuff.
Quote by Eladamri
I like the ESP's I've played. Same with the Gibsons. It's a personal thing, you no doubt prefer others.

I've never played an ESP. I like Gibsons. They feel very solid and sound amazing. But that doesn't mean I can't say they're overrated if they are. Most n00bs gravitate towards Gibson cos they think it's the only choice. Sure, they're great, but they're overpriced. You can get the same guitar for half the cost.

And Jacksons are pretty good value for money, in my opinion.
Last edited by sashki at Mar 27, 2008,
#10
Quote by sashki
...so do Jackson. The Pro series and above have Duncans, Active EMG's, Floyd Roses (which are liscenced, but pretty damn good).

I've never played an ESP. I like Gibsons. They feel very solid and sound amazing. But that doesn't mean I can't say they're overrated if they are. Most n00bs gravitate towards Gibson cos they think it's the only choice. Sure, they're great, but they're overpriced. You can get the same guitar for half the cost.

And Jacksons are pretty good value for money, in my opinion.



I've played LTDs I liked more than Jacksons.....
Quote by WickedBeast666
Noooooooooooo how could this be! he at all the chocolate in the box
Oh well, now the empty shell of what used to be chocolaty goodness can contain a tasty guitar circuit.


speaking of my homemade pedal
#11
Quote by fosho
I've played LTDs I liked more than Jacksons.....

Good for you.

This doesn't prove that Jackson sucks because of Fender.

In fact, this doesn't prove that Jackson sucks at all.
#13
youre right, if anything Fender saved jackson. The Pro series are much better than what jackson was putting out in the mid 90s. i like fender/jackson because they put stock seymours and EMGs in Jacksons and dont worry about little things like looks or neck thru bodies. I started the "is jackson dying" thread by the way. ESP is just better at marketing.
The Mitch Clem formula
1)make jokes about rancid and NOFX (as if they dont already make fun of themselves)
2)make obvious punk puns, possibly related to food
3)make fun of Rancid and NOFX again
4)??????
5)PROFIT (and an army of internet fanboys)
#14
Quote by Eladamri
Nor does it prove that they don't suck. It's all personal.

If they offer the same features as ESP LTD for a similar price, and ESP are OMG TOTALLY METAL I think it does suggest something.
Quote by Fuzzbox91
youre right, if anything Fender saved jackson. The Pro series are much better than what jackson was putting out in the mid 90s. i like fender/jackson because they put stock seymours and EMGs in Jacksons and dont worry about little things like looks or neck thru bodies. I started the "is jackson dying" thread by the way. ESP is just better at marketing.

Is that serious or sarcastic? Sorry, I really can't tell.

I prefer Bolt-on necks for super-strat type guitars.
#15
Features are only a tiny part of why people buy guitars. I don't buy without picking up and playing the axe in question. I have nine guitars and if I was to find a Jackson that I liked while looking for another one I'd give it equal consideration.

As it stands, I've played a few and didn't like any of them. I have two friends who play one, one who swears by them and one who swears at them.

Quote by sashki
I prefer Bolt-on necks for super-strat type guitars.


Really? Why?
#16
Quote by Eladamri

Really? Why?

I'm used to the feel and sound
I can replace the neck if something goes wrong
I find it useful for orientation
The neck can be any shape you want, whereas all the set necks I've ever tried were invariably thick, for some reason. Probably for stability, cos you can't replace them.

Ask any Fender, Ibanez, Caparison, Vigier, Suhr, Tom Anderson, Cort or Kramer owner.


I think features are quite a big part. You don't just pick up every guitar in the store. You know what you're looking for. It's the features combined with the construction that make up a good guitar.

Would you buy a Gibson Byrdland for playing DragonForce covers?
Last edited by sashki at Mar 27, 2008,
#17
I'll be sure to do that. I much prefer the smoother neck join. And of the two neck through guitars I have (Both ESPs) I think I have only one neck that is thinner than them. One of them is the Viper 7 string and although it's a wide neck for obvious reasons it's not thick at all.
#18
Quote by Eladamri
I'll be sure to do that. I much prefer the smoother neck join. And of the two neck through guitars I have (Both ESPs) I think I have only one neck that is thinner than them. One of them is the Viper 7 string and although it's a wide neck for obvious reasons it's not thick at all.

Good for you.


Jackson does not suck due to Fender.
#20
Everyone moved to ESP because Fender ruined Jackson.
None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
#21
Quote by Eladamri
I dislike Jacksons because they play, and sound like crap. Even the high end ones I've tried were poor.

The reason "everyone has moved onto ESP" is because Jackson make sub-par guitars that are not as good as a guitar from the next manufacturer for half the price, generally speaking.

/rant


What a load of poop.....The only Jackson that I have tried and felt cheap was a JS series, and they are cheap!

Japanese or US built Jacksons are great, and offer far better value for money than any ESP or LTD.

you say you love ESP, I bet you don't even own one, but have a cheap, mass produced guitar by LTD ,who in my book is like comparing epi to gibson, or squire to fender!
#22
i personally like jackson guitars. i think the dinky with the maple neck is one of the nicest metal guitars
#23
Every make of guitar has been overrated at one point or another on this forum...

Play what feels right to YOU, no matter the brand.
Gibson.
#24
Quote by fergus74
What a load of poop.....The only Jackson that I have tried and felt cheap was a JS series, and they are cheap!

Japanese or US built Jacksons are great, and offer far better value for money than any ESP or LTD.

you say you love ESP, I bet you don't even own one, but have a cheap, mass produced guitar by LTD ,who in my book is like comparing epi to gibson, or squire to fender!


You've not played the same Jacksons as me, we can see that.

And I'd like to point out that I didn't say "I love ESP" you just assume that. Fool.

I own one LTD, and one ESP. Both of which are better than any Jackson that I've ever held. Yes even the "cheap, mass produced guitar by LTD".

GTFO Fanboy.

Quote by ThrashIsGreat
Every make of guitar has been overrated at one point or another on this forum...

Play what feels right to YOU, no matter the brand.


Correct.
#25
In any case ESP is a rip-off of Jackson. And they have the most gay headstock!
#26
In the late '50s everyone stopped playing Gibsons because they hadn't updated their designs in years. Either Jackson will make some better and more fashionable stuff or they'll disappear like so many once great guitar brands.
#27
Quote by nebiru
Everyone moved to ESP because Fender ruined Jackson.

Oh god... what is wrong with you people on this forum today...

First, people used to say "fenders suck get a jackson". now when they realise jackson are owned by fender, rather than think "oh right, maybe i judged fender just because of the single coils. well that was dumb", they shout "omg jackson sucks, they are owned by fender who sucks lolz get ESP!!!!".
I like analogue Solid State amps that make no effort to be "tube-like", and I'm proud of it...

...A little too proud, to be honest.
#28
Guitars go through phases back in the 80's the guitar to have was a kramer, now its moving to the ESP guitars
#29
http://www.thomann.de/gb/jackson_dk2m_dinky_sw_upgrade.htm made in japan
http://www.thomann.de/gb/esp_ltd_kh202bk_lh.htm made in korea

I mean, in this price range, Jackson just rips. Anyway, imho a set neck isn't really something to pay alot more for. I think Jackson offers alot more for the same money as ESP, but enough comparing the two. The main reason ESP is blooming right now is cause of their very clever marketing schemes and making many iconic guitarists/bands use their brand for muneh, whilst jackson hardly has any advertising.

Each to his own, i doubt Jackson has gotten worse just because they switched owners. Actually, since fender hugely improved their build quality in 2005-2006, i don't think Jackson was left unaffected. I think they've got a nice selection in the 400-600 euro price range with guitars which have great build quality, decent features and so on.

I doubt that a 1200 euro ESP is actually twice as 'good' as a 600 euro jackson. Don't compare guitars in different price ranges. And as for the USA jacksons, they're amazing.
#31
Oh yeah, and what the heck is wrong with fender? If something is owned by fender, how does that make something worse?

And don't give me that bullcrap about fender being 'boo-hoo same old design for 50 years.' well, goddamit, try to think of a more ergonomic shape than a strat. Plus, just cause they don't have a line of 1 000 000 shred guitars in different colours, shapes with and without glitter and lights doesn't make them worse than any other company. Their guitars are all classics which are directly associated with the fender brand. Countless players like them and just cause they're not metal enough for certain individuals is a dumb reason to disrespect the brand. A Fender Strat uses the same technology as modern guitars. Not much has changed over 50 years, and everything in guitar building still revolves around the same principles.

A classic is a classic.

It's like calling a car company reissuing Muscle cars **** because they don't make cars that look like they could fly to the moon, but still ride on with an engine and 4 wheels.
Last edited by zwound at Mar 27, 2008,
#32
Quote by sashki
If they offer the same features as ESP LTD for a similar price, and ESP are OMG TOTALLY METAL I think it does suggest something.

Is that serious or sarcastic? Sorry, I really can't tell.

I prefer Bolt-on necks for super-strat type guitars.

Have you ever played a USA soloist?
The neckthru joint (notice i didnt say neck joint, because there isnt one) is heaven. 24th fret access? Not a problem. And definitely the 2nd best action'd guitar i've ever played, second to a JS 1200.

And Eladamri, i'm not seeing how a guitar can "sound like crap" if it uses high quality wood, and top of the line pickups.
Gear:
Ibanez RG550 20th RFR
Traynor YCV50
Fender FMT HH Tele
Mesa Boogie 2ch Triple Rectifier
2 1x12 custom Theile cabs
ISP Decimator
Krank Kranshaft
Boss BF-2 Flanger
BBE Sonic Maximizer
Last edited by kool98769 at Mar 27, 2008,
#33
I love my Jacksons. My "mid-grade" SLSMG is my favorite guitar I have ever owned. The craftsmanship on the Pro series is on par with USA select. The hardware is where they differ. BTW, all those artists moved to ESP for more than one reason. Jackson takes too long to get custom guitars out and Jackson doesn't pay people to play their guitars like ESP does.

edit:

Several Jacksons didn't get upgrade hardware like OFRs and real Duncans/EMGs until Fender came along. I think Jackson is responsible for their "downfall" but new models being announced this Spring and I'm sure they'll have a better marketing campaign as well.
____________________________________________
Jackson SLSMG Ibanez Jem7v Jackson SL3

Line 6 Spider Valve 212

Ibanez Weeping Demon Wah
Last edited by isaac311 at Mar 27, 2008,
#34
i completly forgot that Fender brought Jackson.


I think that ESP Fender and Jackson rule all. They all are good for Metal.

I mean Fender well they are the most versitle things ever.
#35
this esp vs. jackson is a really pointless argument. esp people are gonna say that jackson's are cheap bolt-ons and jackson owners are gonna say esp's are overpriced signature guitars that play like crap. well your both wrong. if someone prefers esp let them play esp. if someone prefers jackson let them play a jackson. stop arguing over this every time a jackson or esp thread comes up
#36
Quote by ironman1478
this esp vs. jackson is a really pointless argument. esp people are gonna say that jackson's are cheap bolt-ons and jackson owners are gonna say esp's are overpriced signature guitars that play like crap. well your both wrong. if someone prefers esp let them play esp. if someone prefers jackson let them play a jackson. stop arguing over this every time a jackson or esp thread comes up

ESP doesn't really have anything to do with the thread. This is about people dissing Jackson purely for the fact that it's owned by Fender.

I've seen a lot of people who are like "hmm...alder body...an OFR, that's nice...duncan pickups, w00t!...and...WAIT! They're owned by Fender. Jackson sucks, dude"
Quote by kool98769
Have you ever played a USA soloist?
The neckthru joint (notice i didnt say neck joint, because there isnt one) is heaven. 24th fret access? Not a problem. And definitely the 2nd best action'd guitar i've ever played, second to a JS 1200.

I haven't played a USA soloist, but I have played other neck thru's, like the Schecter C-1 Classic, Gibson Firebird and some "Vantage" guitar, which I'm not familiar with.
Yes, the absense of heel is nice for some people. I'm just not used to it. I need to know where the heel is so I can "feel" where I am.

If there are 24 frets and no heel, I'm like "WOAH, where does this neck END?"

It's just a preference, really. And you do realise that the JS 1200 is a bolt on with a pretty big joint. Satch could have asked for any guitar he wanted, and he wanted his sig to be a bolt-on.
Quote by nebiru
Everyone moved to ESP because Fender ruined Jackson.

Very useful contribution to the thread. Care to explain why?
Last edited by sashki at Mar 27, 2008,
#37
Quote by Eladamri
I dislike Jacksons because they play, and sound like crap. Even the high end ones I've tried were poor.

The reason "everyone has moved onto ESP" is because Jackson make sub-par guitars that are not as good as a guitar from the next manufacturer for half the price, generally speaking.

/rant


lol thats funny.

don't call me a fanboy either, I didnt buy the jacksons I own because they were jacksons, i bought them because they felt better to me than anything on the market.

play and sound like crap huh? thats news to me but ok, feel and sound are subjective...so ill let that one go.

making sub-par guitars however is just false. in fact they make some of the highest quality instruments out there. they dont slap cool paintjobs and ****ty hardware on their guitars like the majority of lower end LTDs.

i have played plenty of custom shop jacksons, and plenty of custom shop ESPs, and I have loved them all. If you ask me Jackson and ESP (NOT LTD series) are the only brands out there making truly quality products.

Even though sound is subjective...saying jacksons sound liek **** is a retarded statement. Anyone can say all of your ESPs sound like **** too..what the hell will you say to that?

Get over yourself man...jackson makes extremely high quality products, and I'm sure when CJRocker sees this thread, hell make some extravagant post which will disown you completely so i'll stop here.
Jackson KV2 USA Snow White/Black Bevels
#38
Maybe they feel it's the same situation as the CBS Fender thing
(Since the guitar quality went down while owned by CBS)
I don't even shred
#39
Quote by Nebjy
Maybe they feel it's the same situation as the CBS Fender thing
(Since the guitar quality went down while owned by CBS)

But Fender aren't exactly owned by CBS anymore...are they?

Also note that Fender owns Gretsch. GRETSCH, DAMMIT. No-one complains about them sucking due to being pwned by Fender.
#40
At least Jackson doesn't dress up their guitars with piles and piles of tacky abalone binding.

Jacksons are metal (not br00talz though, except the Warrior!), but still classy and they feel great.
Gear:
- Bugera 333
- VJ & VJ cab
- Jackson JS30
- TS9

Bugera Users Militia. We are horrible people. With a sprinkler fetish.
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