#1
our PA 'passed away' , so we have to use a guitar amp (60 watt transistor amp) for our vocals at the moment. the problem is that once we go over 12 o' clock witht he master volume of the amp for vocals, the whole thing starts to feedback. => the singer can't get above the drums.

my question is, is the feedback caused by 1) the mic (semi-professional mic, +/- 75 dollars), 2) because of the fact that we're using a guitar amp (so a better mic won't help ? ), 3) or because we're rehearsing in a small room ?

if it's answer number one, then could i get a mic like an SM58 (or a the beta 58A) so we can turn the amp up without feedback ?

any input on this is much appreciated

Last edited by The red Strat. at Apr 2, 2008,
#2
it's porbably coz it's a small room, the mic picks up what's comin out of the amp which causes it to feedback
#3
65 transister means solid state right?.... no idea.
Sharing is caring
Fuck the RIAA

- Gear -
ESP LTD MH-400
Epiphone Les Paul
Vox AD30VT
Zoom G2.1u
#4
Quote by opc100
it's porbably coz it's a small room, the mic picks up what's comin out of the amp which causes it to feedback


no doubt that's part of the problem, but is it the main problem ? will a better mic still start to feedback ?
#5
yeah try turning the amp directly away from the mic to get less feedback
#7
Even the best microphones will feedback coming out of a guitar amp with the master turned up in a small room. It is probably a combination of all 3 things. We are doing the same thing (vocals out of a JC-120) and when we turn the master up, the thing feeds back like crazy....but only when our singer points the mic at the amp. Try moving her farther away from the amp with the mic. If that does not work, try using the gain instead of master... it sounds fine when we do it that way. Try it out.
I've bought, sold, and traded more gear than I care to admit.
#8
technically, small room can be the problem. the closer you're with your mic to the source (amp), the greater the feedback is. good mic should be shielded properly (but 75$ seems "not SO bad". just some idead
My Rig:

+Epiphone AJ100 acoustic
+Fender 60th. Anniversary Stratocaster
+Vox AD30VT
+Vox V847a Wah


look all i wanted was for someone to give me advice on what to do not to slag me off ok

Want advice? Suck yourself off.
#9
well, a better mic could help, but the problem is most likely the amp, combined with the small room.
#10
Quote by Brendan.Clace
Even the best microphones will feedback coming out of a guitar amp with the master turned up in a small room. It is probably a combination of all 3 things. We are doing the same thing (vocals out of a JC-120) and when we turn the master up, the thing feeds back like crazy....but only when our singer points the mic at the amp. Try moving her farther away from the amp with the mic. If that does not work, try using the gain instead of master... it sounds fine when we do it that way. Try it out.

gain ? won't that distort the vocals ?

thanks a lot for the help so far guys !
#11
..And the answer is you are in front of the amp! Microphones are a lot stronger then guitar pickups, and have a larger pickup range. You've moved a guitar too close to the amp right? Well that happens even further away from the amp with a microphone. So sing from behind the amp, or at least level with it, and not in front of the speaker.
...
#12
better mics sounds better, try the 58 if you have the cash but even higher end mics pick up more sounds and so they will feed back too. I think it's the small room.

PAs are for large areas and any monitoring is best done with IEMs if you ask me...

Dont use gain, that distorts vocals (if you are running a guitar amp...)gain on a PA is a preamp for the mics and instruments, that needs to go up to the proper point and then you adjust your master and level knobs
Last edited by moody07747 at Apr 3, 2008,
#13
Quote by moody07747

Dont use gain, that distorts vocals (if you are running a guitar amp...)gain on a PA is a preamp for the mics and instruments, that needs to go up to the proper point and then you adjust your master and level knobs


Umm, actually, the gain on the clean channel of some amps is the same thing as gain on PA. Actually it's the same thing with gain on the dirty channel, but the signal "just happens to" distort with so much gain.

Anyway, I think it might be the guitar amp (it's not made for something that picks the signal up so easily), but probably a combination of all 3.
Quote by Lunchbox362
This thread if fail in almost every way imaniganable.
#14
Probably the small room thing. Try positioning the vocalist so he's not in front of the speakers. That's a key reason for feedback.
Ibanez PGM301
Ibanez GRG170DX
Fender Telecaster MiJ - 1986
Swing T-Through

Ibanez TS9DX
Sovtek Small Stone - c.1985
EHX Big Muff
Kimbara Wah - c.1974
Boss GE-7

Orange Rocker 30 Combo

http://www.myspace.com/paythelay
#15
Note that most of the mid to high grade vocal mics are quite a bit hotter than many other mics. I perform with a Beta 58 but it starts generating feedback entirely too soon to practice in a small space with. For practice I have to use an Audix F10.
ESP LTD EC-256 and a Fender Deluxe VM
#16
Quote by Kurapica
Probably the small room thing. Try positioning the vocalist so he's not in front of the speakers. That's a key reason for feedback.

we have already turned the amp away from the singer, but it didn't help much.

Quote by bartdevil_metal
..And the answer is you are in front of the amp! Microphones are a lot stronger then guitar pickups, and have a larger pickup range. You've moved a guitar too close to the amp right? Well that happens even further away from the amp with a microphone. So sing from behind the amp, or at least level with it, and not in front of the speaker.

no he's not actually

when i move my guitar to half a meter away from the amp and i'm right in front of it on max volume, it just starts to vibrate my D and A string, but i don't get any schreeching feedback. bad example , but i get what you mean .
Last edited by The red Strat. at Apr 3, 2008,
#17
I'm going to blame the room. Consider, also, the other sources of sound in the room (guitar and bass amps) and keep the mix away from them too. If you have amps on tilt back legs or stands, take 'em off, and set the flat on the floor. Just consider all possible sources of amplified sound in the room, and keep the mic out of their way.

Crazy idea: set up your band all facing the same direction, like you're playing a show.
#18
Quote by the.spine.surfs
I'm going to blame the room. Consider, also, the other sources of sound in the room (guitar and bass amps) and keep the mix away from them too. If you have amps on tilt back legs or stands, take 'em off, and set the flat on the floor. Just consider all possible sources of amplified sound in the room, and keep the mic out of their way.

Crazy idea: set up your band all facing the same direction, like you're playing a show.

that would mean placing all the amps in the 'backline', and the mics 3 meters away from the amps. i bet that would get us even more feedback . interesting idea though.


thanks everyone, i think i can conclude that a better mic won't help...

#19
Well, ideally, they'd all be setup to project forward, not up. Assuming you didn't shove the singer wayyy far out in front of everyone, it might work. It's a good way to practice, anyway; to get into the feel of playing in the same direction.
#21
"get wireless mics and have the singer sing outside the building thats what my band does"

Better yet, setup to record and have the singer lay down his part later...after you record the instruments...

you have to turn up a guitar amp louder to get sound out of it when running a mic with it compared to turning up an amp when you have a guitar plugged in because of the ohms difference.
#22
Quote by the.spine.surfs
Well, ideally, they'd all be setup to project forward, not up. Assuming you didn't shove the singer wayyy far out in front of everyone, it might work. It's a good way to practice, anyway; to get into the feel of playing in the same direction.


That works with my theory too. If your singer is standing right next to the amp, but the speaker is pointed at his shins, you might get away with it.
...