If the 13th note in a scale is the same note as the 6th (which i think it is), then is a chord with the notes C E G A be Cmaj13 or C6.

Also, Why have 1-3-5-7-9-13 to build a chord when it could just be 1-2-3-5-6-7?

Thanks
i think it depends on the octave. i THINK. like if you play a C, then the 6th note up, it would be a C6. if you play a C, then the 6th note an octave up, it would be 13. dont quote me on that one. ill wait for confirmation. lol
Originally posted by primusfan
When you crank up the gain to 10 and switch to the lead channel, it actually sounds like you are unjustifiably bombing an innocent foreign land.

╠═══════╬═══════╣
τλε τρπ βπστλεπλσσδ
╠═══════╬═══════╣
Quote by 12345abcd3
If the 13th note in a scale is the same note as the 6th (which i think it is), then is a chord with the notes C E G A be Cmaj13 or C6.

It's a C6, when you have 13 chord it is implied that the 7, 9, and 11 are also played. It could be considered a Cadd13, depending on whether it was one tone up from the G, or an octave and one tone up from the G

Quote by 12345abcd3

Also, Why have 1-3-5-7-9-13 to build a chord when it could just be 1-2-3-5-6-7?

Because each number is based on a scale degree, if the degrees in a triad became 1-2-3, as opposed to 1-3-5, it would confuse people as the 2nd note in the scale is not supposed to be in the chord.
Dissonance is Bliss

Signal Chain:
Carvin CT-4
Ibanez TS-9
TC Electronics G-Major
Mesa/Boogie 2:90
Ear Candy BuzzBomb

Member #4 of the Carvin Club
Quote by 12345abcd3
If the 13th note in a scale is the same note as the 6th (which i think it is), then is a chord with the notes C E G A be Cmaj13 or C6.

That would be a C6, as there's no 7th/9th/11th to suggest it otherwise.

Quote by 12345abcd3

Also, Why have 1-3-5-7-9-13 to build a chord when it could just be 1-2-3-5-6-7?

Thanks

I'm not sure what you mean by this... but you'd call it a 11th or 13th because of the pitches of the certain notes... or perhaps just for simplicity's sake and continuing the odd numbers. Also, you wouldn't ever really use all the notes of a 13th. All you need are the 3rd, 7th, and 13th (I believe) to make a 13th a 13th. As I'm sure you can tell, all the notes of the major scale played at once doesn't sound too good.
Nor less I deem that there are Powers
Which of themselves our minds impress;
That we can feed this mind of ours
In a wise passiveness.
--Wordsworth

last.fm
If you have a 7th, you call it by the higher octave (11 or 13 ex. C13, Dmaj11, etc). If you don't have a 7th, you call it by the lower octave (4 or 6 ex. Cadd4, Dadd6). You can call a chord D6 rather than Dadd6.

You use "9" whether you have a 7th or not.

Naming follows these rules; it doesn't matter where you play the notes.

Quote by Thursdae
All you need are the 3rd, 7th, and 13th (I believe) to make a 13th a 13th.

The notes for a 13 chord are often written as 1 3 (5) b7 (9) (11) 13.
Quote by bangoodcharlote
If you have a 7th, you call it by the higher octave (11 or 13 ex. C13, Dmaj11, etc). If you don't have a 7th, you call it by the lower octave (4 or 6 ex. Cadd4, Dadd6). You can call a chord D6 rather than Dadd6.

You use "9" whether you have a 7th or not.

Naming follows these rules; it doesn't matter where you play the notes.

The notes for a 13 chord are often written as 1 3 (5) b7 (9) (11) 13.

I dont think there is an add4 or add6 chord. but your right, If the 7th is in there, you see those tones as upper extensions.

and just to reiterate

13th chord = 1 3 (5) b7 (9) (11) 13
6th chord = 1,3,5,6 (but can and often is played without the 5th)

the 13th chord btw is a dominant 13.... if you want a Maj 13 the 7 would not be flat.
Just to clarify, in most functions, a C6 chord is better expressed as an A minor 7th chord in first inversion.
And +1 to bangoodcharlotte
Quote by National_Anthem
Just to clarify, in most functions, a C6 chord is better expressed as an A minor 7th chord in first inversion.
And +1 to bangoodcharlotte

well not necessarily.. its good to realize they share the same notes, but if the chord is C6, and the bass is playing C.... your playing C6 and should think of it that way.
Quote by GuitarMunky
well not necessarily.. its good to realize they share the same notes, but if the chord is C6, and the bass is playing C.... your playing C6 and should think of it that way.

The bass note of an A minor first inversion chord is a C...
And I did say in most functions, anyway, obviously there will be exceptions.
Quote by National_Anthem
The bass note of an A minor first inversion chord is a C...
And I did say in most functions, anyway, obviously there will be exceptions.

Yeah Im aware inverted chords. Im just disagreeing with the "most" part. If you see C6 in a chart, that shape will be functioning as C6.

Its good to know they are the same shape though. Lots of chords are like this. F#m7b5 for instance could function as a D9 chord.
Quote by GuitarMunky

I believe there is an add4 chord, what would you call this chord for example? C E F G
Quote by :-D
I believe there is an add4 chord, what would you call this chord for example? C E F G

I wouldn't play it. I guess it could exist, I've never played it and have never seen it written that way.
Last edited by GuitarMunky at May 10, 2008,
Quote by GuitarMunky
I wouldn't play it, and have never encountered it in 4 years of college. Have you seen that chord anywhere? dont get me wrong you can play whatever you want, but is that a common chord, and have you ever seen a chord named add4? I haven't but if you can find 1 in a legitimate piece of music, that would be interesting.

I've never encountered it in my 1 year of college or any other year personally, but it just seems like it theoretically should be called an add4. There's no seventh and it's not more than an octave higher than the root so I would hesitate to use add11, but I've personally never seen an add4.

There's more than likely something that I'm entirely overlooking though.
Quote by GuitarMunky
I wouldn't play it. I guess it could exist, I've never played it and have never seen it written that way.

Why is it so odd?
I always thought that an add4 chord was just a sus4 that doesn't resolve, maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's not particularly odd, and it is entirely plausible.
Quote by National_Anthem
Why is it so odd?
I always thought that an add4 chord was just a sus4 that doesn't resolve, maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's not particularly odd, and it is entirely plausible.

Na, I take it back. Now that Im playing it, it makes sense. Just seemed weird when I 1st saw it. actually sounds pretty cool.

Quote by :-D
I've never encountered it in my 1 year of college or any other year personally, but it just seems like it theoretically should be called an add4. There's no seventh and it's not more than an octave higher than the root so I would hesitate to use add11, but I've personally never seen an add4.

There's more than likely something that I'm entirely overlooking though.

yeah I never encountered it in school. its not something your likely to find in a classical or even a standard jazz piece. It does make sense though.
Quote by National_Anthem
Why is it so odd?
I always thought that an add4 chord was just a sus4 that doesn't resolve, maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's not particularly odd, and it is entirely plausible.

I would say it's a chord where a fourth is present directly above the third, like the example I listed above.
Quote by bangoodcharlote
If you have a 7th, you call it by the higher octave (11 or 13 ex. C13, Dmaj11, etc). If you don't have a 7th, you call it by the lower octave (4 or 6 ex. Cadd4, Dadd6). You can call a chord D6 rather than Dadd6.

So is this the main rules for naming or are there others?

Thanks for all the answers, the reason i gave the Cmaj13 example was because in another thread somebody said playing an Am chord over a C chord would give you Cmaj13 (and i think everyone agreed) but why would you not call it C6 as it doesn't have a 7th?