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#1
Im saving for a new guitar, another Les Paul!

I currently have a Les Paul copy by Vintage (v100) and a MIM strat, and as good as the LP is, it just doesnt feel quite right. It is lighter than my strat and although it sounds amazing in its own right, it doesnt give that thick "Slash-esque" smooth tone im looking for.

Im looking for a better quality Les Paul for just that: the GnR thing! As im still saving, price isnt so much of an issue (if a Gibson Standard is worth saving for i'll save) but i want the guitar with the best sound to cost ratio for my needs. (Eg if an epiphone elitist is within stabbing distance of a gibson standard in terms of sound and quality, id get that as it is cheaper - if you cant my drift)

Ill say it how it is. I play mainly in my bedroom through a Laney LC15r and Vox Tonelab LE (although i do have aspirations to gig and stuff, it is not at the forefront)

I have tweaked and tweaked that thing to get a good marshally sound and at bedroom volumes it really does sound fantastic wouldnt gig with it, id crank my amp instead and use my bad monkey. Tonewise i have gotten that sorta bluesy GnR bite quite well, i just want a guitar to match. My options are:

Epiphone Les Paul Standard + pickup swap - £350
Epiphone Les Paul Slash - £550 (if i can find one)
Gibson Les Paul Studio worn cherry - £550
Epiphone Elitist LP - £650-680 (cant try one though)
Gibson Standard Faded 50s - £999
Gibson Standard 50s - £1395

Im looking for a well constructed instrument that tonally sounds slashesque but for the best price is it worth going for the most expensive or can i find what im after for cheaper? any other suggestions?

sorry for all the text, cheers if you bothered to read
#2
Epiphone elitist or custom would be the best. don't go with the cheap gibsons (aka standards)
...
#3
Wait for it.....

Wait for it.....

Someone has to say it....

(Hint hint.... Someone (oops) will pop in heree and say an Agile copy w/ a pickup swap (Not recommending it or anything, but, hey, you said bang for buck!)
Life is like an Empty Box, there could be something exciting in it at first look, but upon further review, well, it's empty.

#4
Quote by slashs_#1_fan
Im saving for a new guitar, another Les Paul!

I currently have a Les Paul copy by Vintage (v100) and a MIM strat, and as good as the LP is, it just doesnt feel quite right. It is lighter than my strat and although it sounds amazing in its own right, it doesnt give that thick "Slash-esque" smooth tone im looking for.

Im looking for a better quality Les Paul for just that: the GnR thing! As im still saving, price isnt so much of an issue (if a Gibson Standard is worth saving for i'll save) but i want the guitar with the best sound to cost ratio for my needs. (Eg if an epiphone elitist is within stabbing distance of a gibson standard in terms of sound and quality, id get that as it is cheaper - if you cant my drift)

Ill say it how it is. I play mainly in my bedroom through a Laney LC15r and Vox Tonelab LE (although i do have aspirations to gig and stuff, it is not at the forefront)

I have tweaked and tweaked that thing to get a good marshally sound and at bedroom volumes it really does sound fantastic wouldnt gig with it, id crank my amp instead and use my bad monkey. Tonewise i have gotten that sorta bluesy GnR bite quite well, i just want a guitar to match. My options are:

Epiphone Les Paul Standard + pickup swap - £350
Epiphone Les Paul Slash - £550 (if i can find one)
Gibson Les Paul Studio worn cherry - £550
Epiphone Elitist LP - £650-680 (cant try one though)
Gibson Standard Faded 50s - £999
Gibson Standard 50s - £1395

Im looking for a well constructed instrument that tonally sounds slashesque but for the best price is it worth going for the most expensive or can i find what im after for cheaper? any other suggestions?

sorry for all the text, cheers if you bothered to read

Elitist or epi lp custom with pu swap.
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edge11
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Gear:
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Keeley ds-1
#5
cant get agile in the UK im afraid

and since when were standards cheap? £1395 certainly aint cheap! £550 for a studio, thats cheap!

i would go for elitist in an instant except id have to order it and not play it.... and from thomann too - i cant find anywhere in the UK that stocks them
#6
Get and Agile LP Copy from rondomusic.net. They kick major ass, I've got one, pickup swap is optional.

hehehe

Quote by slashs_#1_fan
cant get agile in the UK im afraid

and since when were standards cheap? £1395 certainly aint cheap! £550 for a studio, thats cheap!

i would go for elitist in an instant except id have to order it and not play it.... and from thomann too - i cant find anywhere in the UK that stocks them


Their website has shipping to the UK, it's a bit more expensive than in US but it's worth it. There really isn't a need to try them out, they're basically Epiphone Elitists
Quote by SG thrasher
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Last edited by rilakam at May 29, 2008,
#7
Quote by edge11
Elitist or epi lp custom with pu swap.



not to be awkward but i dont like the look of customs...haha
#8
Actually these are your options...

esp ltd ec-1000 w/seymour duncans
esp ltd ec-400 w/seymour duncans

End.
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i think ur gonna get flamed pretty bad.

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Peavey 5150 Combo
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#9
Quote by Ghold125
Epiphone elitist or custom would be the best. don't go with the cheap gibsons (aka standards)

I'm not sure where you got your pricing .... in the US, Gibson Standard starts at ~$2300, the Standard Faded starts at ~$1700. The "cheapest" I've seen for a new LP Standard was $1800, during the Memorial Day Sale at GC.

slashs_#1_fan, if you can buy from Japan, look out for the MIJ Epi Elite (not Elitist) Custom, for the domestic market. Some models come with the SD Alnico Pro II humbuckers, which come pretty close to Slash's tone. Some are equipped with BB1/BB2 or BB Pros. They're not available in the Tobacco Burst, but the specs and tone come really close.

Also, they come with the correct headstock.



#10
ermm no... the options are the ones I listed

being my 3rd guitar i only really want it to tune down a half-step and bring out whenever i feel like playing GnR (which is often) - my other guitars will remain my main guitars.... this makes me think not to spend much on it, but at the same time makes me thing if you are going to have a special single purpose guitar, justify it only seeing the light of day every other day by making it a special (read:expensive) guitar

and as it is my "slash" guitar I want the proper Les Paul shape, not an ESP or agile


EDIT: Ippon, my prices are "£" as in Great British Pound. £1395 is about $2800 which is unfortunately what the standards cost here

where can i get one of those elites?
Last edited by slashs_#1_fan at May 29, 2008,
#11
Quote by slashs_#1_fan
ermm no... the options are the ones I listed

being my 3rd guitar i only really want it to tune down a half-step and bring out whenever i feel like playing GnR (which is often) - my other guitars will remain my main guitars.... this makes me think not to spend much on it, but at the same time makes me thing if you are going to have a special single purpose guitar, justify it only seeing the light of day every other day by making it a special (read:expensive) guitar

and as it is my "slash" guitar I want the proper Les Paul shape, not an ESP or agile


EDIT: Ippon, my prices are "£" as in Great British Pound. £1395 is about $2800 which is unfortunately what the standards cost here

The MIJ Epi Elite Custom with SD Alnico Pro II would be perfect.

Agreed! The model I mentioned has the multiple binding on the body, neck, and headstock. The only difference is the brand.




I was responding to Ghold125.


#12
cheers ippon, you have been very helpful

do you know any websites you can get the elites from? i will need to read alot about them before i trust buying something i havent played! im not a fan of the customs look, although i would survive if they came in the right colour

(didnt realise you were responding to ghould there, sorry)
#13
The two best options in terms of getting the most for your money will be with the Epi Standard with a pickup sweap (which is all the Slash signature is anyway, but with an extra couple of hundred slapped on the price tag just since it has his name on it), or an Epi Elitist.

I'd go with the Elitist if I were you. Better than any of the low and mid-range (aka affordable) Gibsons, and although it is annoying you can't try them before you buy, the Elitists go through much better than either other Epiphones or Gibsons, so it's not like there's a risk of getting a bad one.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
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#14
dangerous game to play though!.... what exactly is a "bad one" could i send it to a tech to touch up to make it a "good" one or would it always be naff if i got a naff one?....if that makes sense
#15
Quote by slashs_#1_fan
cheers ippon, you have been very helpful

do you know any websites you can get the elites from? i will need to read alot about them before i trust buying something i havent played! im not a fan of the customs look, although i would survive if they came in the right colour

(didnt realise you were responding to ghould there, sorry)

Sh!t ... I had you confused for an Aussie who was planning a trip to Japan. D'oh!

Since you're in the UK, you need to visit shops which carry MIJ LP copies. Watch out for the following: Burny, Tokai, Greco, Orville (Japanese Gibson brand), and Edwards.

Respected forum member and 2007 UGer of the Year Dave_Mc bought his MIJ Edwards LP copy from Ishibashi in Japan. I believe he paid £400 before fees, VAT, and those other hideous add-ons inflicted on UK citizens. Bottom line, his transaction went well and he's happy, even after the honeymoon stage. I believe he still sleeps with his LP.

Send him a PM, he's quite helpful. At least you can learn how to navigate buying direct from Japan. I'm paranoid so I play them for hours before committing to buy.

#16
Last edited by slashs_#1_fan at May 29, 2008,
#17
Quote by slashs_#1_fan

That looks very nice and kinda similar to Slash's signature .... and at £145, the price is right. Yamaha is Japanese but they do have manufacturing in Korea, too. Perhaps an expert on Yamahas can provide more info.



Sexy!

#18
Japanese Tokais would be amazing for that.
http://search.stores.ebay.co.uk/Rich-Tone-Music-Ltd_tokai_W0QQfciZQ2d1QQfclZ3QQfsnZRichQ20ToneQ20MusicQ20LtdQQfsooZ1QQfsopZ1QQfsubZ2QQsaselZ38660718QQsofpZ0
Every one of those from £500 up are more than a match for a Gibson LP standard.
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#19
it has been sold already i hope it wasnt a UG'er!!! haha - i couldnt understand how to buy anyway, it brought up a box when you click order (or the button i assumed was order) and the box it brings up doesnt get translated.

back to the drawing board.

im not an MIJ expert, but are ARIA PRO II's good?

pics wont wonk, but link is

http://imageevent.com/chingo123/may/ariaproiilpstdcrsb3211

looks nice


im assuming one of these at like £350 or so would be better than epiphone?
#20
still gutted about that yamaha....

here is a bit of a noobish question, but are all Orville Les Pauls good? I read somewhere that Orville can make exact Les Pauls in Japan for Gibson for the japanese market until 1998 when they started making them for epiphone. What would the quality of a 1990s orville be comparible to? Are the orville epiphones such as this better than the 1990s orvilles?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Epiphone-Japan-Orville-Les-Paul-STD-CHERRY-BURST-2001_W0QQitemZ330238890981QQihZ014QQcategoryZ33037QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


the 90s orville: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&Item=290233607518&Category=33040&_trksid=p3907.m29


does anyone have good orville knowledge? how do both of these compare to gibsons and normal epiphones? Should i go down the orville route?
#21
Quote by slashs_#1_fan


and as it is my "slash" guitar I want the proper Les Paul shape, not an ESP or agile




If you want to miss out on getting a guitar way better than any Epi below the Elitists for £379 because you want to look like Slash, that's your (stupid) choice.

http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/66316

A dwarf might hear you. What then?

My Music
#22
i dont like the look of those guitars. looks is a big thing, i dont want to hold something that i dont like the look of. I like the traditional les paul shape. thats why all of the choices i listed have it

...plus i want a thick neck, they have thin necks. and anyway, like i said, it is a 3rd guitar specifically for the purpose of playing GnR and Snakepit. I already have 2 great electrics i would use more than it, but i want another les paul to keep tuned down and bring out when i play GnR, hence me wanting the proper Les Paul shape
Last edited by slashs_#1_fan at May 30, 2008,
#23
Quote by 123-Trav
Actually these are your options...

esp ltd ec-1000 w/seymour duncans
esp ltd ec-400 w/seymour duncans

End.

LTDs are pretty poor value in the UK, unfortunately...

Quote by Ippon
Sh!t ... I had you confused for an Aussie who was planning a trip to Japan. D'oh!

Since you're in the UK, you need to visit shops which carry MIJ LP copies. Watch out for the following: Burny, Tokai, Greco, Orville (Japanese Gibson brand), and Edwards.

Respected forum member and 2007 UGer of the Year Dave_Mc bought his MIJ Edwards LP copy from Ishibashi in Japan. I believe he paid £400 before fees, VAT, and those other hideous add-ons inflicted on UK citizens. Bottom line, his transaction went well and he's happy, even after the honeymoon stage. I believe he still sleeps with his LP.

Send him a PM, he's quite helpful. At least you can learn how to navigate buying direct from Japan. I'm paranoid so I play them for hours before committing to buy.


haha, thanks ippon. the only problem with getting an edwards now is that in the last few months the pound has devalued quite a bit compared to the yen- when i bought my edwards, one pound bought you almost 240 yen... now it'll only buy you around 200 (and with the current economic climate, it could fall even more, which is a bit of a risk when you often have to pre-order from e.g. ishibashi and wait a few weeks/months before you're charged). i'm not saying not to do it, but it's certainly not as attractive a proposition as when I did it, my guess is that could add around £100 to the price (and then you have customs and postage on top of that).

I'd be inclined to look into japanese tokais (make sure it's japanese-made- there are cheaper korean and chinese-made ones which aren't as nice and which are cheaper), as jimbob said. and you can try those first.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#24
oh yeah, orvilles are meant to be good, i think they were made in the fujigen factory? never tried them though.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#25
Quote by Dave_Mc


I'd be inclined to look into japanese tokais (make sure it's japanese-made- there are cheaper korean and chinese-made ones which aren't as nice and which are cheaper), as jimbob said. and you can try those first.


where can i try tokais?
#26
guitar shops. there are a bunch of tokai dealers here... i know of at least two in northern ireland for example. it depends on where you are in england to be honest... i know that one of the denmark street shops is a tokai dealer... not much help considering you're in the north-east though.

that richtone music dude on ebay seems to be based in sheffield... i think he has a shop:

http://www.richtonemusic.co.uk/

guitar guitar are also dealers, i think anyway- their website seems to be down at the moment so i can't check. www.guitarguitar.co.uk

alternatively you could contact the tokai uk website to find your nearest dealer: http://www.tokai-guitars.co.uk/main.htm
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#27
Have you considered buying some Japanese copies from 70's like Burny, Greco from EbaY? they sound great and cost only few bucks...
Or maybe i will recommend you Gibson '96 LesPaul studio... that's a good year... they sound really fat...
Or some Epiphone Custom might be a good choice...
#28
Look at Tokai, great guitars, look for the Japanese ones
"Breathe, breathe in the air
Don't be afraid to care"

Fender Strat/Tokai LS80>few pedals>Orange Rocker 30
#29
Quote by Dave_Mc
oh yeah, orvilles are meant to be good, i think they were made in the fujigen factory? never tried them though.

Yes they were made in Fujigen gakki, it was the Gibson brand in Japan except now they make the Epiphone models for both the Japan market only and elsewhere (Elitist model).
#30
Quote by kokotpojebany
Have you considered buying some Japanese copies from 70's like Burny, Greco from EbaY? they sound great and cost only few bucks...
Or maybe i will recommend you Gibson '96 LesPaul studio... that's a good year... they sound really fat...
Or some Epiphone Custom might be a good choice...

Sorry for the double post, editing crashes my comp.

The MIJ Burny and Greco models aren't exactly cheap, specifically if you're looking at the '80s models. Some copies are manufactured in Korea and those are relatively cheap.
#31
Quote by Gibson*Fender
Yes they were made in Fujigen gakki, it was the Gibson brand in Japan except now they make the Epiphone models for both the Japan market only and elsewhere (Elitist model).


that's what i thought, thanks.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#32
If you're in the UK check out Gordon Smith. They're hand crafted, hand made pickups etc. Really nice guitars. I got mine a few months ago, I love every bit of it. As good as any gibson i've played.
#33
^ ah, that'd also be worth a look, good call. i've heard that their QC can be a bit spotty, though (none of the ones i've tried, but i've heard it), so you'd ideally want to try the one you'd be thinking of buying. they are nice guitars, though, if you get a good one.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#34
From what I hear, the guy who makes them will gladly take a look at any problems. I've not tested this yet though, but i've been meaning to for a while because mine came with a bit of a bow in the neck, presumably from the guitar sitting in a shop for a few months before i bought it.

Anyway TS, if you can get to Manchester, lots of guitar shops there seem to have them in store to try out if you're interested
#35


(also if you're in the north-east, i think guitar guitar in newcastle is a gordon smith dealer too (as well as tokai), though i don't know how many they keep in stock)
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#36
awesome, cheers for all the posts - a trip to newcastle sounds like it is on the cards!

im not too big on ordering guitars, if i found an MIJ 80s Les Paul at a steal i probably would, but id rather play something first. Turns out my local music shop is a tokai dealer and i never knew... their prices are criminal though! Be good to try one though. Which Tokai models are good then? Are the brand new tokais good? are they closer to gibsons or epiphones? there are loads on ebay at like £299, are they the korean made ones? how can you tell?

wow, lots of questions, sorry. cheers for everyones help though!


edit: it seems the cheaper ones have the gibson style open book headstock, and the expensive ones have a slightly different one, are the ones that dont look like gibson ones the japanese ones?

edit again: proved my own theory wrong. found one with the non-gibson headstock that was made in china. seems wierd that their £300 custom has a gibson style open book headstock but the expensive ones dont
Last edited by slashs_#1_fan at May 30, 2008,
#37
Quote by slashs_#1_fan
awesome, cheers for all the posts - a trip to newcastle sounds like it is on the cards!

im not too big on ordering guitars, if i found an MIJ 80s Les Paul at a steal i probably would, but id rather play something first. Turns out my local music shop is a tokai dealer and i never knew... their prices are criminal though! Be good to try one though. Which Tokai models are good then? Are the brand new tokais good? are they closer to gibsons or epiphones? there are loads on ebay at like £299, are they the korean made ones? how can you tell?

wow, lots of questions, sorry. cheers for everyones help though!


edit: it seems the cheaper ones have the gibson style open book headstock, and the expensive ones have a slightly different one, are the ones that dont look like gibson ones the japanese ones?

edit again: proved my own theory wrong. found one with the non-gibson headstock that was made in china. seems wierd that their £300 custom has a gibson style open book headstock but the expensive ones dont
The Epi Elitist is MIJ but doesn't have the Gibson "open book" headstock. The MIJ Epi Elite I posted, has the Gibson "open book" headstock, binding, etc.

In the spirit of confusing you even more ... the following are all MIJ.



#38
i was refering to the headstocks on tokais... that is helpful info though, you really know your stuff. Are Aria Pro II LS700 Les pauls good?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Aria-Pro-II-LP-Standard-LS-700-Sunburst-Guitar-MIJ-80s_W0QQitemZ320256693956QQihZ011QQcategoryZ112668QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

...oh and are the more recent MIJ guitars like the burnys (with 3 screw tuss rod cover) and brand new edwards guitars good? what do they compare to?
Last edited by slashs_#1_fan at May 30, 2008,
#39
An Agile Al-3000 with stock pick ups rivals an Epiphone Elitist. It's about the same or better with a pick up change. You can find sound clips on youtube.
#40
Quote by slashs_#1_fan
i was refering to the headstocks on tokais... that is helpful info though, you really know your stuff. Are Aria Pro II LS700 Les pauls good?

linky ..

If you don't erase that link, I'll bid on it ... same thing with the £380 Orville.

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