#1
Hey, I play a Ibanez RG321MH with stock pickups through a Peavey Valveking 112.
I absalutely love the lead tone on songs by The Darkness like Christmas Time (Don't let the bells end) , which is similar to the tone on quite a few Queen records.
Am I right in thinking the secret to this is largely down to a Tubescreamer?
What else is it which goes into this tone?
And how could I switch between this and a Heavy Metal (more old school / power metal than the modern death metal stuff) rhythm tone?

Any suggestions welcome
#2
The secret is largely down to a clear and good quality speaker in your case

Seriously, cuts through the mud a bit more.
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#3
so i should change my speaker?
what for, bearing in mind i still want to be able to get metal tones as well?
#4
^Even more reason to change the speaker! IMO the valveking can't do metal without it.

Also, the Darkness (to my knowledge) use Marshall amps, which have a very british voicing. Unfortunatley for you, the Valveking has a very American voicing, meaning you'll never nail it perfectly.
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#5
Is it just down to the amp then, that gets that Darkness/Queen lead tone? I'm sure there must be some kinda pedal involved...
#7
Where can i get treble boosters from? and would a speaker/tube change help with (although not totally solve, but then again, i want to sound like this tone, not 100% imitate it) the voicing of the amp?
#8
Well, speakers can change it, and so can tubes to a certain extent but you're talking about going from what is essentially an American Hi Gain amp into lower gain, British voiced territory. and that's a big jump.

What would make a big difference was if you had EL84 power valves instead of 6L6s. Unfortunatley, I think they're a different plug formation and won't fit. Not to mention biasing will be a pain. Personally I'd just go for a decent vintage ish speaker and turn the gain down, maybe use an EQ. Also run the amp on Class A texture, because that makes it ever so slightly more British.
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#9
Quote by Fraserwatt
Where can i get treble boosters from? and would a speaker/tube change help with (although not totally solve, but then again, i want to sound like this tone, not 100% imitate it) the voicing of the amp?

BBE makes a nice treble booster, from what I hear... been meaning to try one for a while.

A speaker/ tube change would not only get you closer to that tone, it'll pretty much improve your overall tone. I'm pretty sure Justin Hawkins uses Mesa cabs with Celestion V30's, so that might be a good place to start.
#10
Justin Hawkins used Mesa Dual Rectos for his lead tone I think, so you'd be a bit hard pressed to replicate it on a VK. A new speaker would help though.
A dwarf might hear you. What then?

My Music
#11
Quote by timi_hendrix
Justin Hawkins used Mesa Dual Rectos for his lead tone I think, so you'd be a bit hard pressed to replicate it on a VK. A new speaker would help though.


Really? Duuude....

TS: IGNORE EVERYTHING I SUGGESTED IN MY PREVIOUS POST.
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#12
Quote by bartdevil_metal
Really? Duuude....

TS: IGNORE EVERYTHING I SUGGESTED IN MY PREVIOUS POST.

Well, Dan Hawkins used Marshalls (JCM 800's, if I'm not mistaken), and he soloed nearly as often as Justin. If you ask me, Justin's tone is quite Marshally, even if it's through a Recto, so don't be too embarrassed .
#13
Quote by hrdcorelaxplaya
Well, Dan Hawkins used Marshalls (JCM 800's, if I'm not mistaken), and he soloed nearly as often as Justin. If you ask me, Justin's tone is quite Marshally, even if it's through a Recto, so don't be too embarrassed .


I didn't think Dan soloed very often, I think the only solos he did on Permission to Land were get your hands off my woman and the second one in I believe in a thing called love. They sounded more Marshally than Justin's solos, I always thought his sound was a bit too "searing" to be from a Marshall.
A dwarf might hear you. What then?

My Music
#14
Presumably, all the classic sounds of the 80's (Maiden, Priest, etc as well as bands like Def Leppard and Queen), as well as the darkness would have more british voicings, so rather from spending money upgrading my valveking to a shabby half breed, would the dsl401 combo be a good investment to make going that little bit further? (its on www.guitarampkeyboard.com for 475pounds)

Cheers for the input so far
#15
Quote by timi_hendrix
Justin Hawkins used Mesa Dual Rectos for his lead tone I think, so you'd be a bit hard pressed to replicate it on a VK. A new speaker would help though.

To add to everyone else, he did use Marshalls!

I saw an interview somewhere, I'll see if I can find the magazine..
Cam Sampbell's my hero
#16
the dsl 401, whilst being all tube and marshall, is not highly regarded among UGers, you really wanna be asking Gabel about this amp cus he is more knowledgeable about it. However I will say it is quite muddy and lacking that signature raw crunch of the classic marshalls, if an amps swap is what ur going for id suggest maybe a traynor 50blue?
Fender Deluxe Strat HSS
Fender Standard Strat
Fender Highway 1 Tele
Epiphone Les Paul Standard
Orange Rocker 30 Combo
Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Mayhem
Roland Microcube
Boss Micro BR
Korg Pitchblack
EHX Holy Grail
Hohner 3/4 Classical
#17
jcm 800 combo.
Gibson LP w/SD59+PRS Dragon II
Fender 52RI Hotrod Tele
PRS Tremonti SE w/Bulldog Extremist/Black Label

Cornford MK50H & 2x12
Marshall JMP-1

TC Electronics G-System

MacBook + Ableton Live
#18
Quote by PendulousThread
the dsl 401, whilst being all tube and marshall, is not highly regarded among UGers, you really wanna be asking Gabel about this amp cus he is more knowledgeable about it. However I will say it is quite muddy and lacking that signature raw crunch of the classic marshalls, if an amps swap is what ur going for id suggest maybe a traynor 50blue?


thanks, ill bear that in mind.

The traynor looks pretty good, although im trying to spend less than 500 pounds on it, and my other concern is weather that amp can reach into metal terratory.

Quote by JOn`
jcm 800 combo.

do they still make these? i quick google search didnt really reveal much, maybe i was entering something wrong?
Last edited by Fraserwatt at Jun 8, 2008,
#19
nah, they don't make them any more...but they pop up regularly on eBay and go for cheap.
Gibson LP w/SD59+PRS Dragon II
Fender 52RI Hotrod Tele
PRS Tremonti SE w/Bulldog Extremist/Black Label

Cornford MK50H & 2x12
Marshall JMP-1

TC Electronics G-System

MacBook + Ableton Live
#20
it's a single channel amp, so it's all to do with the pre-amp/volume settings....set it to the highest gain setting you'd want, then when you want a cleaner sound roll off the volume on your guitar.

if you need any more gain than a JCM800 can give you (unlikely), just add an overdrive pedal in the mix.
Gibson LP w/SD59+PRS Dragon II
Fender 52RI Hotrod Tele
PRS Tremonti SE w/Bulldog Extremist/Black Label

Cornford MK50H & 2x12
Marshall JMP-1

TC Electronics G-System

MacBook + Ableton Live
#21
i'm really looking for something that can easily be footswitched between, is there an easy equivilent (maybe even made by a different company) for less than 500 pounds?
#22
I know for a fact that Dan HAwkins uses a Tubescreamer when soloing. And Marshalls.
But Justin is one area i havent got a clue about im afraid. Sorry.
#23
Ah are you a UKer? I dont know if its what you want but im gonna chuck it in there anyway, you can score an orange rocker 30 combo for less than 500 on ebay, i just did, on my way to get it infact...
Fender Deluxe Strat HSS
Fender Standard Strat
Fender Highway 1 Tele
Epiphone Les Paul Standard
Orange Rocker 30 Combo
Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Mayhem
Roland Microcube
Boss Micro BR
Korg Pitchblack
EHX Holy Grail
Hohner 3/4 Classical
#24
by the sounds of things its pretty good, but the ones on ebay at the moment are about 650
#25
TS, most of the lead on that song is harmonised which means there's two guitar tracks being played together, the same goes for what you've heard on Queen records.

If you wan't to sound like that you're going to either need a second guitarist or an intelligent harmoniser....I can't believe everyone else missed this
Actually called Mark!

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...it's a seagull

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i wanna see a clip of a recto buying some groceries.


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#26
Right, so far this is what has been suggested.

  • Peavy Valve King + Speaker (& possibly tube) change
    Pros - I'm on a budget and this will be cheap.
    Cons - Valve King naturally more "american" sound (what exsactly is the meaning of this?)


  • Harmoniser Pedal
    Pros - *that* harmonised sound, live and without having to record a backing
    Cons - off the top of my head, none, unless the pedal i bought sucked tone.


  • Treble Booster
    i'm not too educated on these, could someone explain their sound. Also, wouldnt too much high end result in a unbalanced/unappealing sounding eq?


  • Marshall JCM 800 Combo
    Pros - Supposedly good amplifier, british voicing, inexpencive off ebay
    Cons - Out of production, cannot footswitch between clean & distortion sounds


Are there any other amps out there with an available footswitch which can handle this rock kinda thing, but also be pushed into more metallic areas?
#27
Quote by Fraserwatt

  • Peavy Valve King + Speaker (& possibly tube) change
    Pros - I'm on a budget and this will be cheap.
    Cons - Valve King naturally more "american" sound (what exsactly is the meaning of this?)


The american sound is more deep and dark, leans more towards "scooped" tone.
An ideal way to comprare British and American sounds is to look at a band like Oasis (very British) and a band like Nickelback (very American).


  • Harmoniser Pedal
    Pros - *that* harmonised sound, live and without having to record a backing
    Cons - off the top of my head, none, unless the pedal i bought sucked tone.



Cons: will sound very robotic, not actually like two guitars at all TBH. Fun to use though . An intelligent harmoniser (which you will probably need) costs quite a bit to get a decent one.


  • Treble Booster
    i'm not too educated on these, could someone explain their sound. Also, wouldnt too much high end result in a unbalanced/unappealing sounding eq?



Quite possible. A treble booster boosts the treble frequencies of a guitar (funnily enough ). Brian May used one to make his AC-30 really sing because they already have a very jangly sound. I think he also set his EQ pretty bass heavy to balance it out (Not really a Queen fan though so best research him yourself).


  • Marshall JCM 800 Combo
    Pros - Supposedly good amplifier, british voicing, inexpencive off ebay
    Cons - Out of production, cannot footswitch between clean & distortion sounds



Very versatle amp. I didn't particularly like it because it wasn't British enough - was sort of inbetween when I played it. I prefer amps to openly declare what voicing. like Orange, very British, Mesa, very American.


Are there any other amps out there with an available footswitch which can handle this rock kinda thing, but also be pushed into more metallic areas?


British Voicings
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Orange Rocker 30
Traynor YCV Blue (I THINK that's British voiced)
Laney LC 30

American Voicings
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Mesa F30
Mesa Dual Rec/Triple Rec
ENGL Fireball

Jacks of all trades
---
Peavey JSX
Randall RM
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#28
^The F30's not overly American, it's a bit of both... the tubes are EL-84's. The F50 and F100 are much more American.