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Informative Article, I'm Interested!
84 62%
Im Interested, But You Talk Too Much :P
15 11%
Nice Article, But I'm Not Really Interested!
30 22%
Pointless Article, Wouldn't Go Near Your Crappy Offer >:(
6 4%
Voters: 135.
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#1
Price update: £40 fully featured including all mods
Interested in sound clips? Check out This_Kidd's profile (https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/member.php?u=307059). Both clips use my CheapScreamer!

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/member.php?u=307059

Okay so heres the deal:
I've been modding tube screamers clones for ages now and all have been successful. A few include many random name overdrives similar to daphon E20OD, soundtank clones like the Daphon E10OD, Behringers, and some others I can't remember. Even a few genuine tube screamers have come my way for modification. Through this I have noticed quite a few variations of the circuit..and some major differences (which need destroyed ) and I came to realise that most of these pedals lack some features which are demanded in the mods. mainly
*True Bypass
*More Drive
*The 'correct' op-amp
*re-housing (cheaper plastic effects)
*sometimes even a blend control


And I thought..

Why not have these on a stock version?
a lot of boutique builders opffer these features but mostly at prices that could make behringer cry. and a lot of guitarists are often short of money so they dont want to be shelling out a fortune for just one effect which is often 'included on amps' and why would ibanez or maxon want to change the immensely successful classic effect? many things then shot through my head......

Why not make it cheaper?
a lot of people ask this..a lot of companies have to advertise their effects, This isnt always physical ads like on tv or posters, it can be small things like 'I want my product to be the first the buyer sees' or 'at the front of the shop' some etc. sopme companies even pay retails a small amount to keep the prices for their product up. this can often cost a lot when multiplied by the amount of dealers they are sold in.
When the effects and such are assembled it doesnt cost the company all that much..especially in huge quantities like 100s of thousands the price becomes tiny. but the company still has to pay for the advertising, transport, returns/repairs, technical support, employee wages etc. etc. etc. which in turn drives the price of the pedal up.

Why not get rid of most of those?
Then youre left with materials, and production costs which is much smaller than retail prices of the pedals.

then...

TUBESCREAMER!
or overdrive effect like Fulltone OCD (Obsessive Compulsive Drive) etc. the pedal that everyone needs to have, no matter what, does wonders for anyones tone.

then:
CHEAPSCREAMER


make a tube screamer 808 clone for as little as possible (but keep the quality) and include the wanted features above for a small amount on top of the cost.

Price update: £40 fully featured including all mods with the basic screamer features and true bypass w/LED also you can ask me for technical support via e-mail or PM and I'll help where I can.

GO poll now!
Last edited by Entrant_21 at Jan 16, 2009,
#2
How about making it 40 quid with all features standard?
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#3
It is very east ti make any commercial TS truebypass and give it more gain. There is no correct op-amp.

Also I doubt you could build them for 25 pounds...

The OCD is not a TSer.
#4
well, i can buy a kit for one with everything i want in it for $60 US. in fact i already did.
but cool.


btw, your not gonna make any money at all selling them for 25 pounds i dont think
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#5
Quote by ExtremeMetalFTW
How about making it 40 quid with all features standard?

I'm still considering it, I havnt even began to price it yet! I'll let you know though!

Quote by kurtlives91
It is very east ti make any commercial TS truebypass and give it more gain. There is no correct op-amp.

Also I doubt you could build them for 25 pounds...

The OCD is not a TSer.

Yes it is easy to true bypass anything..but its not standard. Also youre talking about the commercial screamer which costs quite a lot to begin with.
The correct op-amp for the TS808 is a JRC4558. modern TS9s and some clones etc. use TA74558 (i think?) as well as no name 4558 clones. boutique builders sometimeuse TL072

I dont know about £25 yet I'll see later

Yeah i didnt say it was a tube screamer. It's an overdrive.

Quote by chea_man
well, i can buy a kit for one with everything i want in it for $60 US. in fact i already did.
but cool.


btw, your not gonna make any money at all selling them for 25 pounds i dont think


Could you link me to this? also its a kit..not assembled..theres an idea:P

I just put the price there as a really rough estimate bu I think the first small run would be a cheaper price to see how the response is..then a bigger run will be slightly dearer I think!
Last edited by Entrant_21 at Jun 24, 2008,
#6
generalguitargadgets.com
yeah it is a kit your right, but youll soon see that you wont be able to sell them for as cheap as you think unless you want to make a thousand of them.
Quote by BryanChampine
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Chea_man is the best.
#7
Mate, if they're gonna sound like the behringer TO100 you modified and sold to me, then I'd say these are gonna be sweet products I was blown away with the sound of that pedal B)
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#8
Quote by Dan_Q
Mate, if they're gonna sound like the behringer TO100 you modified and sold to me, then I'd say these are gonna be sweet products I was blown away with the sound of that pedal B)


Thanks dude! These should sound even better than the TO100! it should be fun too!
#9
Quote by chea_man
generalguitargadgets.com
yeah it is a kit your right, but youll soon see that you wont be able to sell them for as cheap as you think unless you want to make a thousand of them.

That's a great deal, but its in the US meaning UK delivery would be expensive and slow (usually ) and like I said it requires assembly which can sometimes be time consuming..as well as error prone!


I'm going to be building a draft version soon, and in that i'll gather the cost and I'll have a better idea of how much to sell it for! so watch this space! Can everyone try and spread the word to support this project? if anybody has any suggestions im happy to hear them! just post here or PM me!
#10
I'd Need to hear one before I bought one really, but yeah. I'd be interested

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#11
Quote by TheFly_1990
I'd Need to hear one before I bought one really, but yeah. I'd be interested


Awesome! Yeah ill be doing soundclips and showing photos of the prototype before selling them.
#12
this sounds great, ill definately be interested if you go ahead with the idea
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#14
Son of a screamer with TB.

Pretty easy to do, already exists.
I say go for it, why not.


Please do NOT use the 4558 hahahah... the TL072 is a much better chip in all respects. Quieter mostly. But the difference is uber subtle.

Have a clipping switch: keep it assymetrical, with 1N4002s and a combo of LED or 1N34s GE diodes. I really like right now two 1N4002s and a 1N34.

Smooth out, flatten out the midrange, add a little bass.

The TS' stock gain is barely useable, it'd need some change to the grain of it, but that's the very easy part.

I've done this on a SD1 ages ago, still use it. My favorite pedal actually.

EDIT: wait you want to do a TS808 clone... nevermind. Yuck. Way too many out there in my opinion. Good luck with it, but I don't think the world needs that. That's just me though.
Last edited by Pott at Jun 25, 2008,
#15
Quote by Pott
Son of a screamer with TB.

Pretty easy to do, already exists.
I say go for it, why not.

Please do NOT use the 4558 hahahah... the TL072 is a much better chip in all respects. Quieter mostly. But the difference is uber subtle.

Have a clipping switch: keep it assymetrical, with 1N4002s and a combo of LED or 1N34s GE diodes. I really like right now two 1N4002s and a 1N34.

Smooth out, flatten out the midrange, add a little bass.

The TS' stock gain is barely useable, it'd need some change to the grain of it, but that's the very easy part.

I've done this on a SD1 ages ago, still use it. My favorite pedal actually.

EDIT: wait you want to do a TS808 clone... nevermind. Yuck. Way too many out there in my opinion. Good luck with it, but I don't think the world needs that. That's just me though.


The Son of Screamer is basically just a minimal verison of the pedal!
I have compared the 4558 and the TL072's performance in the circuit.. I thought the 4558 sounded better, less sterile. if youre interested in an even lower noise TL072 you could try the TL072IP or even TL082..which I believe is in the Fulltone OCD? I read that somewhere.
but then again I prefer the vintage sound of the 4558. the JRC4558DD actually sounds fantastic..I was a bit dismissive of it until I tried it, a higher gain 4558D
I think on my own version I'll have a 3 way op-amp switch of my favourites. these could all come as optional extras, I'm still considering it.

Switches are cheap but again add to the overall price which im trying to keep small..could be an optional extra?

Assymetrical pedal clipping im not so fond of...unless its driving a symmetrical distortion/overdrive in which case its awesome. But in the case of tube amps it's asymmetrical clipping driving asymmetrical clipping which cuts too much of one end of the signal for my liking.

I have yet to try the 134A's as clippers but I've heard good things about them!

SD-1 is a great clone of the TS9 but the buffer leakage is annoying..easily fixed though! have you had problems with it?

This screamer will be true bypass so no problems there

Yeah I agree theres so many, but not so many are in reach of guitarists budgets. Plus its nice to say 'Aw yeah I have a boutique screamer what about you?' also its a circuit that keeps its value!
#16
Nope. And believe me I'm picky. The buffer DOES suck when in bypass though I'll give you that. I'm used to Carl Martin pedals which have an AWESOME buffer so the SD1's disapoint me. I've increased the input impedance to 1M but it didn't do that much. Increasing it more at this point won't help.

Boutique is a catch phrase. It means absolutely nothing.

Heheh sorry for the cynical stuff.. I'm really not a fan of the tube screamer at all. I have a crapload of 4558DDs laying around haha I use TL072CNs and IPs, whatever I have laying around. I see what you mean about the sterile thing, they seem to have a flatter... nhmm... feel to them. Again, the difference is amazingly subtle.

The son of a screamer's a simplified version but I figured it's what you wanted in there.

Casing and switch and pots alone will be around a tenner. Then you'd need to find a way to get the PCBs designed and etched... expensive, but still the cheapest way. Unless you want perfboard or vero?
#17
Quote by Pott
Nope. And believe me I'm picky. The buffer DOES suck when in bypass though I'll give you that. I'm used to Carl Martin pedals which have an AWESOME buffer so the SD1's disapoint me. I've increased the input impedance to 1M but it didn't do that much. Increasing it more at this point won't help.

Boutique is a catch phrase. It means absolutely nothing.

Heheh sorry for the cynical stuff.. I'm really not a fan of the tube screamer at all. I have a crapload of 4558DDs laying around haha I use TL072CNs and IPs, whatever I have laying around. I see what you mean about the sterile thing, they seem to have a flatter... nhmm... feel to them. Again, the difference is amazingly subtle.

The son of a screamer's a simplified version but I figured it's what you wanted in there.

Casing and switch and pots alone will be around a tenner. Then you'd need to find a way to get the PCBs designed and etched... expensive, but still the cheapest way. Unless you want perfboard or vero?


You could make yourself a looper to put the box in? I'm sure you've heard of it. Its basically like a true bypass box. You plug your previous pedal into it and the next pedal's input at the output of the looper and have the pedal you want to be true bypassed in the send/return jacks.

Yeah I know its fun to have that catch phrase though the tube screamer tends to be hated by some peopl but it all depends on your taste of music and style of playing. Personally I think everybody needs one!

Is it the 4558DD that comes stock in the SD-1? a random question!

I'll likely go for dot matrix board. the ones with the copper rings. I always use them and think theyre great. also its about the same quality as P2P (point to point) wiring which many vintage entusiasts prefer in their vintage electronics also I find it more fun and much easier to make changes to.
#18
I have a looper, for my AMT pedal which has a speaker emulator. I use decent/very good buffers aside from the SD1's, my sound is safe. The SD1's buffer seems to thin out the sound more than reduce treble (at least after my mods) so I'm actually happy with it now. I need to build myself another dual looper but I have no way to drill out cases so it's not something I can do easily

And yes, the stock SD1 has the 4558DD.

A boost is very useful... a TS is too specific for me though. The gain is nasal and ugly... yuck. I really dislike it. Only TS type pedals I like is the SD1, modded like hell, and the Bad Monkey, which I use as a volume boost mostly, to add a little thickness and grain to the tone.
#19
Quote by Pott
I have a looper, for my AMT pedal which has a speaker emulator. I use decent/very good buffers aside from the SD1's, my sound is safe. The SD1's buffer seems to thin out the sound more than reduce treble (at least after my mods) so I'm actually happy with it now. I need to build myself another dual looper but I have no way to drill out cases so it's not something I can do easily

And yes, the stock SD1 has the 4558DD.

A boost is very useful... a TS is too specific for me though. The gain is nasal and ugly... yuck. I really dislike it. Only TS type pedals I like is the SD1, modded like hell, and the Bad Monkey, which I use as a volume boost mostly, to add a little thickness and grain to the tone.

Hmm comparing the SD-1 schematic to my TS808 schematic it seems the SD-1 has quite a low capacitor in series after the input buffer, 0.018uF if you want to fatten it up you could change it to a 1uF and there a 100k resistor after the capacitor, change that to a 10k that should work if not id advise you consider the tone control's values.
The TS808 tone freq is centered around 3.3kHz where
The SD-1 is around 12.56kHz which is wierd..have I done my calculations right?

But I like the way it uses a W taper for tone control:P may use that!

Also I thought about the way you said the JRC has more noise about it..which is true but if you would go back to it you could make the power filtering better to reduce the noise^^ and the JRC lives on!:P

Has anybody got any spare capacitors/enclosures/switches/diodes/LEDs/opamps/screamer clones they could donate to the project? they would be rewarded greatly when the first run is complete
Last edited by Entrant_21 at Jun 26, 2008,
#20
Parts for a tubescreamer like that cost about $40 per pedal on small runs...I build them

Pedalpartsplus.com and effectsconnection.com have everything you need for pretty cheap.

Mouser.com will be your best bet on components, as you can buy in bulk, which would be the best plan
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#21
Quote by Bloodshed
Parts for a tubescreamer like that cost about $40 per pedal on small runs...I build them

Pedalpartsplus.com and effectsconnection.com have everything you need for pretty cheap.

Mouser.com will be your best bet on components, as you can buy in bulk, which would be the best plan


Everythings cheaper in america! Thanks for the advice mate i'll check them out! I suppose the equivalant over here would be RS components.
#22
Okay I decided that the JRC4558D is going to be the default op-amp in the cheapscreamer. However I will have it in a socket so you can try different op-amps with them without soldering etc.

I'm also going to stick with the two 1N914 diodes like the original 808. Although if you wish I can add asymmetrical clipping at no extra cost, If you would like a switch to change between the two modes then thats extra. I'm considering adding alternative diode options or offering a bag of them for a small fee so you can test different configurations until your hearts content

The blend pot will be stock on all CheapScreamers.. yopu might think this is useless but trust me if you get the right blend and use this to drive a chorus (or any modulation) it sounds awesome. also it adds clarity in high gain situations. (blatty bass notes gone)

There wont be an AC jack on the stock model but if you wish to have one installed it will only be a small fee.

The double gain mod will be on the stock version too, even more gain is available upon request and a switch could be added for the extra gain function for an additional cost.

The stock LED will be a 5mm ultra brite. I havn't decided what colour yet so suggestions are welcome!

And if theres any other features anybody wants in particular feel free to suggest them!
#23
Quote by Entrant_21

The stock LED will be a 5mm ultra brite. I havn't decided what colour yet so suggestions are welcome!


blue
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#24
you can't build a pedal for 25 bucks It cost me almost 50 to make mine
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#25
i just built a pedal based on a lovepedal Eternity (another TS clone..)
used an LM1458N IC and 4 1n4148 diodes for clipping, sounds awesome.
btw, an enclosure and a 3pdt switch are gonna cost around 15$ already.. i really doubt u can sell pedals for 25-30$ and make a profit, even if u buy bulks.
Last edited by Nezek at Jun 28, 2008,
#26
Quote by eddiehimself
blue


I was thinking that too :P blues the coolest! but green would also be awesome! I could find some cheap bi-colours and have a switch inside so you could choose what color you want...hmmm need to price that

Quote by Bostonrocks
you can't build a pedal for 25 bucks It cost me almost 50 to make mine

I'm in the UK so i deal in pounds £25 is roughly about 50$ and as I say im still pricing stuff and that £25 is a very rough estimate.

Quote by Nezek
i just built a pedal based on a lovepedal Eternity (another TS clone..)
used an LM1458N IC and 4 1n4148 diodes for clipping, sounds awesome.
btw, an enclosure and a 3pdt switch are gonna cost around 15$ already.. i really doubt u can sell pedals for 25-30$ and make a profit, even if u buy bulks.

Sounds cool! I havnt heard of the lovepedal eternity..but I seen the schematic and its just about th same as the TS without the buffers etc. (which im hopefully planning to build along with a few of my own modifications) do you think the 4 diodes have much difference on the tone compared to the usual 2/3? and as I say im talking pounds i.e £25 and its still a rough estimate.

EDIT: Decided on the knobs I'll be using:

Theyre the same type as boss DS-1 knobs, will be using 4 of these in a 'TS9DX' style arrangement.
Last edited by Entrant_21 at Jun 28, 2008,
#27
Anybody got any other ideas for the pedal?
I'm thinking of adding the 'hot' switch from the TS7
and possibly offering an option for bass guitarists too
#28
Just to let you know, I'm interested :P
Once I get a tube amp I'll be wanting a good OD so keep me informed :P
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#29
Quote by Jayyy
Just to let you know, I'm interested :P
Once I get a tube amp I'll be wanting a good OD so keep me informed :P

Great! this pedal will sound fantastic through a tube set-up!
#30
Has anybody got any ideas for the tone control? I'm considering changing the tone circuit to match keeley's mod as its much more flexible, although it is still just an RC network. I have a Digitech Bad monkey coming in the mail and I'm interest by it's low & high tone controls and thinking of implementing them.

Also considering a speaker sim output like the bad monkey, at an extra cost.

A large parts shipment should be arriving soon so I can get the prototype up and running with some sound clips and photos! watch this space!
#31
Quote by Entrant_21

Sounds cool! I havnt heard of the lovepedal eternity..but I seen the schematic and its just about th same as the TS without the buffers etc. (which im hopefully planning to build along with a few of my own modifications) do you think the 4 diodes have much difference on the tone compared to the usual 2/3? and as I say im talking pounds i.e £25 and its still a rough estimate.

well.. it's a lot louder than the ts808 i had, my guess is it's because of the IC and/or lack of buffers..
the 4 diodes sound really good, this pedal has more harmonics than a stock TS.
1 thing though, my TS808 worked great with my OCD after it for some mid-heavy high-gain-ish distortion, this one doesn't like another OD after it.. i guess that's because it doesn't have an output buffer, not sure though.

i wanna try and mod it soon - gonna try different clippers, heard MOSFETS give some cool results..
#32
Quote by Nezek
well.. it's a lot louder than the ts808 i had, my guess is it's because of the IC and/or lack of buffers..
the 4 diodes sound really good, this pedal has more harmonics than a stock TS.
1 thing though, my TS808 worked great with my OCD after it for some mid-heavy high-gain-ish distortion, this one doesn't like another OD after it.. i guess that's because it doesn't have an output buffer, not sure though.

i wanna try and mod it soon - gonna try different clippers, heard MOSFETS give some cool results..

The IC is a LM1458..i think which would have less noise..not sure about the output though, I'd say its more likely the 4 diodes that increase the input.
The would also decrease the amount of overdrive though. Hmmm something I need to look into

That seems strange about the OCD after the lovepedal..could you describe how it sounds when the lovepedal is in front of it? Could quite possibly be the lack of buffer which causes it! Because the lovepedal has no buffers!:O

I'm considering a JFET input buffer on the CheapScreamers and the standard 808 output buffer. The input buffer isn't necessary but gives a higher signal impedance increasing clarity and the output buffer is good because it's a buffer

Oh and the MOSFETs are awesome clippers..different character from the standard silicon diodes! In fact its MOSFET clippers that are used in the OCD (along with a 1N34A germanium in some versions)
#33
i'd skip the input buffer and keep the output.. i think the lovepedal is more touch-responsive than a normal TS, and from my fuzz-experience (i have a subdecay fuzz with a bypassable input buffer), i learned that that input buffer takes away some touch-response.. that's still a guess though i'm totally un-educated, just trying stuff out.

the ocd with the lovepedal infront sounds kinda like a gated fuzz.. gets a lot better if i set the gain on both pedals really low.. but that's kinda defeating the purpose of using 2 OD pedals :P

btw, if u do like the OCD, try using the voodoolabs OD schem, that's what the OCD is based on.
the coolest thing about the OCD (imo) is it's dynamics.. no TS clone has that.
I read somewhere that it has something to do with it's IC input that's connected directly to the guitar input.
#34
Quote by Nezek
i'd skip the input buffer and keep the output.. i think the lovepedal is more touch-responsive than a normal TS, and from my fuzz-experience (i have a subdecay fuzz with a bypassable input buffer), i learned that that input buffer takes away some touch-response.. that's still a guess though i'm totally un-educated, just trying stuff out.

the ocd with the lovepedal infront sounds kinda like a gated fuzz.. gets a lot better if i set the gain on both pedals really low.. but that's kinda defeating the purpose of using 2 OD pedals :P

btw, if u do like the OCD, try using the voodoolabs OD schem, that's what the OCD is based on.
the coolest thing about the OCD (imo) is it's dynamics.. no TS clone has that.
I read somewhere that it has something to do with it's IC input that's connected directly to the guitar input.


Yeah sometimes buffers can do that, but it tends to be bipolar input buffers that do the most damage, theyre fine as output buffers though IMO which is why I was considering trying out JFET input buffers to sharpen the sound, I have a few lying about so il try them in the prototype what have I to lose?:P

Hmm intrigues me that does..It's likely that the OCD doesnt like unbuffered inputs? have you tried putting a buffered effect before it, but in bypass mode? like your TS for example? If your sound is still clear it most likely shows the lack of out buffer in the lovepedal is the problem.

I already got an OCD V4 clone planned out, I'm gonna build one after I get the CheapScreamers produced! The Voodoo labs OD is a great pedal though and if the OCD is anything like I've heard it is I don't think ill ever have it off!
#35
lol i sold my TS808 right after i built the lovepedal clone :P it just sounds way better..
i tried my EQ pedal between the 2 though.. on or off they still dont like each other.. dunno what's the deal
#38
I'm interested i must say, but i don't know a great deal about guitars, amps, or pedals for that matter. Is it only worth my while getting one of these if i have a tube amp or what? (at the moment playing on a crappy peavey amp which was like £40 second hand(was ripped off badly) so i don't know it it's worth it)
#39
Quote by metalaxxe11
Are you still doing these?

Never started..have it all planned out, but never got the time (or money) to get round to making them. However if you're interested I can make one for £35? (would be cheaper, but not buying in bulk)

Quote by abhorsen12
I'm interested i must say, but i don't know a great deal about guitars, amps, or pedals for that matter. Is it only worth my while getting one of these if i have a tube amp or what? (at the moment playing on a crappy peavey amp which was like £40 second hand(was ripped off badly) so i don't know it it's worth it)


Essentially what the tube screamer does is model the tone you would get from an overdriven tube amp. If your peavey has a nice clean channel then this pedal will sound great on it also its an investment for the future as when you get a better amp this will sound even better on it!

If anybodys still interested PM me and depending on the amount of orders I'll decide on prices but they wont be any more than 35 posted!
#40
Quote by kurtlives91
The OCD is not a TSer.

Correct, the OCD is based on a mix of the ProCo RAT and Voodoo Labs Sparkle Drive
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