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#1
Hi everybody.

I'm new at playing guitar, 3-4months or so.
Good thing is I'm really obsessive (at just about anything I may add) so I'm playing whenever I don't sleep or work and I really love it.

I measure my progress by playing "For the love of god", which is what charmed me into guitar playing in the first place.
I've gotten pretty far, but haven't been able to finish it (not that good at sweep picking yet).

Anyways, I've reached a point where I can tell that my Ibanez jumpstart kit sounds like crap.

I'm looking for a good Ibanez guitar and a good amp.
Suggestions about FX pedals are also welcomed.

I mostly play instrumental rock, hard rock and (progressive) metal, so I want warm and clean sound, lots of sustain, a fast neck and a good vibrato bar.

Unfortunately, I lack the necessary knowledge and experience so I'm risking buying overly expensive stuff that I don't need (although I love the idea of having a JEM555BK with Evo2, Air Norton and super distortion pickups :P ).

That's where you guys come in.
Can you point me at some quality hardware?

I don't care if what you guys suggest is, reasonably, expensive or too good for me at the moment if it's something that's gonna last me for many years.

I'm looking forward to your replies and thanks for baring through this large intro.
#2
If you are talking expensive BUT with amazing quality that will last you years and years maybe look at Caparison guitars, particularly the Dellinger or TAT. Personally out of everything ive played nothing comes close, in build quality, playability, tone, feel, looks, everything. (Apart from maybe Blackmachine but thats another kettle of fish), Caparison guitars are fantstic, great trems, amazing pickups, some great finishes as well as plenty of classy finishes....yes they are costly but I dont know your price range!
Diezel, Motherfucker
#3
Thanks for your reply mh400nt.

You're right I didn't specify a price range, by bad.
Well, I'm looking to spend around 1500-1700 euros.
I know it's not a lot but I don't think it's cheap.

By the way, I'd really prefer products available via Thomann.de if possible.
#4
A really nice Ibanez? This is where i have some trouble too. There so damn many to choose from!! A nice amp for you to consider is the Peavey Valveking 112. Also check out these pedals;
EHX Metal Muff
Boss Metal Core

I suggest, as far as guitar goes, just go to your local guitar shop (avoid Dawsons) and play around. Tell a clerk what you're looking for, and he should be able to point you in the right direction
#5
Aye, Valveking 112. But why limit yourself to Ibanez? It's not the only brand out there and there are easily as good guitars as Ibanez for the same price, and sometimes better. Take a look at a Schecter, ESP or whatever.

Ok?
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#6
Indeed Wigert, Schecter, ESP, and Jackson!

Maybe Cos i love these things.
#7
Quote by Wigert
Aye, Valveking 112. But why limit yourself to Ibanez? It's not the only brand out there and there are easily as good guitars as Ibanez for the same price, and sometimes better. Take a look at a Schecter, ESP or whatever.

Ok?


You're right, I'm kinda limiting my options, mainly because my favorite guitarists[1] use Ibanez.

But I'm looking into Schecter & ESP as I write this.

[1] Vai, Satriani and Petrucci
#9
You will get alot of bad critiscm for bringing up The Spider. It's hated here on UG, just so you know. And don't buy a crap amp, buy a 112, The Amp is just as much the sound as the guitar is.

And you don't have to buy a guitar that looks as much as Vai's as possible. CHECK OUT ESP NOW! Or I will have to do something unpleasant to you.

And besides, Petrucci uses Ernie Ball Music Man.
Quote by Brunnis Jetrel, Eve-Search Forums
oh the good old days of launching strawberries at point blank range into people's faces with a ballista... brings back mammaries

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Kick your OWN ass before he has a chance to get to it.

Clicky --->
#11
Quote by Wigert
You will get alot of bad critiscm for bringing up The Spider. It's hated here on UG, just so you know. And don't buy a crap amp, buy a 112, The Amp is just as much the sound as the guitar is.


Hahaha, you can't criticize someone who hasn't even used the product.
I was just asking because I have no idea.
The 112 sure looks good though.

Quote by Wigert
And you don't have to buy a guitar that looks as much as Vai's as possible. CHECK OUT ESP NOW! Or I will have to do something unpleasant to you.

Obviously, I very much like the JEM and RG series but can you blame me?
I've read many reviews and they both got top ratings.
Surprisingly enough the RG2550Z got higher ratings than the JEM555.

Anyways, I like their bridges and their pickups and the way they feel.
And more importantly I have easier access to them.

I don't want an ESP, I can't find one with a H-S-H setup and a good vibrato bar mechanism.

Quote by Wigert

And besides, Petrucci uses Ernie Ball Music Man.

I thought he used an Ibanez, anyways 2 out of 3 is still a good reason.
#12
the Ibanez SA and RG series are probaly the guitars you are looking at with what you want. I almost got a 650$ SA forgot what it is called but I went with a PRS instead. For a good tube amp I would go with either Peavey or Marshall, but if you want a medium sized not stack amp deffinetly go with fender. For FX pedals you may be looking at overdrive if you play anything clean to go soloing, and a metal pedal.
#13
Why do you have the über need for a HSH setup? So it will like as much like Vai's as possible? Petrucci uses a HH just so you know. Listen, just because you get guitars like them dosn't mean you will be able to play like them. Sure, maybe you'll get a similar sound but this IMHO is just fanboying.

But if you insist on a Ibanez HSH with a tremolo, then go with a RG1570. http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_rg1570sdb.htm
Quote by Brunnis Jetrel, Eve-Search Forums
oh the good old days of launching strawberries at point blank range into people's faces with a ballista... brings back mammaries

Quote by SkyValley
Kick your OWN ass before he has a chance to get to it.

Clicky --->
#14
Yeah I'll probably get either a JEM555 or an RG2550Z-GK.

I currently use a Behringer overdrive and distortion pedal but the Digitech multi-FX one I posted earlier seems very good.

So I'm only missing an amp, and by the looks of it I'll probably go with the 112.
#15
Quote by tony.laskir
Btw I was thinking about a JEM555BK or an RG2550Z-GK and a Line6 Spider III 30 with a Digitech RP350.

What do you guys think?
Any personal experience?

There's a reason the RG2550 get's better ratings than the Jem 555...it's terrible, it's a crappy Korean RG with substandard hardware and the shoddy Edge 3 bridge whereas the RG2550 is a Japanese made guitar with a top quality bridge. The Line 6 Spider is also terrible and there's no need for a cheap multi FX if you have a good amp.

Here's what you want....

http://www.thomann.de/gb/search_dir.html?sw=bugera&x=0&y=0
http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_rg2550zgk.htm

honesty, if you get the JEM555 I'l come over there and kick you in the balls
Actually called Mark!

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#16
Quote by Wigert
Why do you have the über need for a HSH setup? So it will like as much like Vai's as possible? Petrucci uses a HH just so you know. Listen, just because you get guitars like them dosn't mean you will be able to play like them. Sure, maybe you'll get a similar sound but this IMHO is just fanboying.

But if you insist on a Ibanez HSH with a tremolo, then go with a RG1570. http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_rg1570sdb.htm


Mate I'm new, not stupid.
And I'll probably won't even get a similar sound either.
Also Satch uses an H-H setup as well.

My current guitar has an H-S-S setup and I'd like to keep it like that with the only difference of a humbucker in the neck.

I'm not fanboying, it just so happens that I like the same setup as Vai's.

And I'm planning to change factory the pickups anyway...
And not to Evo ones.

Thanks for the link though.
The RG1570-SDB seems like a good guitar.
#18
Quote by steven seagull
There's a reason the RG2550 get's better ratings than the Jem 555...it's terrible, it's a crappy Korean RG with substandard hardware and the shoddy Edge 3 bridge whereas the RG2550 is a Japanese made guitar with a top quality bridge. The Line 6 Spider is also terrible and there's no need for a cheap multi FX if you have a good amp.

Here's what you want....

http://www.thomann.de/gb/search_dir.html?sw=bugera&x=0&y=0
http://www.thomann.de/gb/ibanez_rg2550zgk.htm

honesty, if you get the JEM555 I'l come over there and kick you in the balls

Thanks mate that was really helpfull.
The RG2550ZGK is my main choice for the time being.

But I'd like a combo amp instead of a head amp head 'cause if not I'll have to also get extra speakers etc.
Last edited by tony.laskir at Jun 28, 2008,
#19
Eh Tony, in his links there are lots of Combos.
Quote by Brunnis Jetrel, Eve-Search Forums
oh the good old days of launching strawberries at point blank range into people's faces with a ballista... brings back mammaries

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Kick your OWN ass before he has a chance to get to it.

Clicky --->
#20
Sorry you're right, I'm being a retard...
I was on another thomann search page when I wrote it.
#21
Quote by Wigert
Aye, Valveking 112. But why limit yourself to Ibanez? It's not the only brand out there and there are easily as good guitars as Ibanez for the same price, and sometimes better. Take a look at a Schecter, ESP or whatever.

Ok?


I agree. The Valveking 112 is an awesome amp. And I also agree about the limiting of yourself to Ibanez. There are so many good brands of guitars out there. You may only limit yourself to Ibanez and buy one and later on figure out you can't play as well on the wizard neck. Just take a look at a bunch of brands, like Schecter, ESP, Jackson, Dean. Try everything out, because restricting yourself to only using a similiar instrument that your guitar hero does will more than likely end up hurting yourself later on.
#22
The problem over here is that it's very hard to test many different guitar brands.
Maybe when i return to the UK I'll be able to do so...

Btw the Bugera amps seem very pricey, if the 112 is that good it's a prime candidate though.
#25
Quote by tony.laskir
The problem over here is that it's very hard to test many different guitar brands.
Maybe when i return to the UK I'll be able to do so...

Btw the Bugera amps seem very pricey, if the 112 is that good it's a prime candidate though.

The 333 (the one I was supposed to link to ) is only £450....what's pricey about that? If you're going to be in the UK then GAK have them for £400.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/bugera_333_212.htm?sid=6efc26104d649ab79306b18046a93226

You are serious about your playing, right? In which case the golden rule is, NEVER cheap out on the amp.
Actually called Mark!

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#26
Ok then, the amp seems very nice indeed and the foot-switch must be very handy.
Thanks for the info Mark.

I have an irrelevant question though.
Wigert said that the line6 spider series is kinda hatted here, why is that?
They are full of features and Line6 seems like a quality brand to me, of course I have no experience, but from what I've read.
#27
Because they pump it full with über effects which make it seem br00tal 2 teh New Bees.
And because you can get a better bang for the buck.

I have a Line6 Spider III 15 Watt and I think it's perfectly fine for it's price.
But thing is, if you can, you should go for the Bugera or a Valveking 112.
Because they, my precious n00b, are br00tal.
Quote by Brunnis Jetrel, Eve-Search Forums
oh the good old days of launching strawberries at point blank range into people's faces with a ballista... brings back mammaries

Quote by SkyValley
Kick your OWN ass before he has a chance to get to it.

Clicky --->
#28
I got the point about "you get what you pay for".
But I don't know how "brutality" is measured. :P
Can you please explain that to me a bit more?

PS. Freaking excellent responses guys I'm glad I asked here. (I'm being serious)
Thanks a lot.
#29
Ok. Everyone has made some excellent suggestions so far. Here's my two cents.

You can go one of three ways.

1. Buy a small and great sounding clean combo. One that has a warm and sweet sound. The ValveKing amps are a favorite around here in that regard. And I agree. They're amazing for the price. If you go that route, I would personally recommend the 212 combo. It just has more "character" to the sound. Now, will it do br00tal? No. It won't. I know there are people who will disagree with me. But honestly, it won't. Plain and simple. However, it will give you a wonderful clean tone and a very good mid-gain bluesy sound and a classic old school metal sound. Check this demo out to get a feel for the sound.

http://tinyurl.com/57p52g

And this one...

http://tinyurl.com/5btuzv

Depending a LOT on your guitar and pickups, you can get a very good sound out of just the stock amp.

Then, if you really wanna get a full tilt high gain melt-your-face-off metal sound, you simply add a high gain pedal. There are a lot of underacheivers in this area. Indeed, imo many of the really popular ones sound the worst. However, there are also a number of excellent ones to choose from. They vary in price. But these are two of the very best available. Demo them here.

http://tinyurl.com/48n75d

http://tinyurl.com/3rghtw

The Krank pedal is solid state. However, it the THE best solid state distortion pedal I have EVER heard...bar none.

On the other hand, the Guyatone pedal is truly named correctly...it is a MONSTER. It may be expensive. But trust me when I tell you, it will turn your little ValveKing into a Triple Recto. No lie. Basically, it's a high gain tube preamp in a stomp pedal. And SO much better sounding than any of it's nearest competition. It simply blows the Damage Control stuff out of the water.

2. You can buy one of the several low cost high gain tube amps that do br00tal out-of-the-box without any need for pedals. Of those, I would consider the Bugera 333XL. The only thing is, the jury is still out with regard to long term reliability. The reports I have heard are mixed. But if they hold up, then this will become a go-to standard for entry level all tube high gain. Or...you could pony up a bit more cash and buy the amp which the 333XL is a clone of...the Peavey JSX. Then you wouldn't have the reliability concerns.

3. You can buy a Spider Valve 112, 212, or head/cab. I know, it's digital modeling, the tubes aren't really generating the distortion, blah blah blah. But the thing sounds pretty darn good. Check it.

http://tinyurl.com/4xeuhr

http://tinyurl.com/3ewre2

http://tinyurl.com/3fjtdd

That last demo is a real eye opener. Sounds amazing. The main criticism I hear of these amps goes like this: "It sounds great at bedroom volume but when I crank it up it sounds muddy." To which I like to answer: "DUHHHHHH!!!" Ever heard of the Fletcher-Munson curve people? Basically, if you tweak a patch to sound good at low volumes, it will be all bass and muddy at high volumes. That's not a weakness of the Spider Valve. That will happen with any amp. Take your Mesa Triple Rec. Turn the master down to bedroom levels. Tweak it until you get a decent sounding tone. Then turn it up. Whaddaya got? MUD. Simple as that. Low volume playing and high volume playing require two different settings. Ever wondered why you have a loudness switch on your stereo peeps? But I digress. Physics lesson over.

Anyway, what a LOOOONG post. My personal favorite recommendation out of the three? Number 2. But then, I gotsta have dem toobz. :-D
Last edited by GeetarSlinger at Jun 29, 2008,
#30
I'd say get an epiphone blues custom, an ibanez tubescreamer, and an ibanez turbo tubescreamer. As for guitar, I really like the epiphone G-400 after a pickup and pot change.
...
Please do not insinuate anything sexual from that.

Quote by cobain_is_king
If your friends don't like your guitar, cover it in stickers and it'll be teh rawks!
#32
Wow GeetarSlinger I really enjoyed the long post.
I can see that the Peavay kicks ass.

As for the Line6 spiders I guess that they are digitalizing the guitar signals and then process them/adding effects instead of the vintage amps who stay analog?

Being in the IT business I can't say I dislike that.

By the way I need something suitable for bedroom practice, I just got a new flat and I don't want to get evicted, hehehe...
#33
Quote by tony.laskir
Wow GeetarSlinger I really enjoyed the long post.
I can see that the Peavay kicks ass.

As for the Line6 spiders I guess that they are digitalizing the guitar signals and then process them/adding effects instead of the vintage amps who stay analog?

Being in the IT business I can't say I dislike that.

By the way I need something suitable for bedroom practice, I just got a new flat and I don't want to get evicted, hehehe...


Hey thought id jump in on the act!

No you have a budget of 1500 euros max and you have a strong vai influence. You also live in a new flat and want to use you amp for bedroom practice.

First of all do not comprimise on you amp. 80-90% of the tone comes from your amp and this is the reason why a Gibson Les Paul sounds crap though a Marshall MG wheras a cheap knockoff les paul sounds markedly better through an origional Plexi.

Amp and Effects

http://www.thomann.de/gb/blackheart_handsome_devil_combo_bh15_112.htm
+
http://www.thomann.de/gb/blackstar_ht_dist.htm
+
http://www.thomann.de/gb/artec_se_eq8_graphic_eq.htm

If you want aditional effects (the likes of which Vai uses etc.) try these:

http://www.thomann.de/gb/electro_harmonix_nano_clone.htm
+
http://www.thomann.de/gb/mxr_1974_vintage_phase_90.htm
+
http://www.thomann.de/gb/morley_vai1_bad_horsie_steve_vai.htm

In my personall opinion that should be a super versatile setup that should get you any sound. I can't begin to tell you how good that would sound + the Blackheart is only 15 watts of tube which even in a bedroom environment should allow you to drive those tubes! Also always choose analogue effects over a modeller the sound gap is quite epic!

Seriously consider this setup. I would also recommend swapping the amp for the Valveking 112 if you feel like it!


Guitar (My weak area of advice!)


  • In this case Ask somebody else but go for quality over aesthetics!



Regards,
Mad
'05 Fender Speed Shop So-Cal Stratocaster
'95 Squier Standard Strat

OLP MM1
Washburn X200v Pro

Tanglewood TW145-SC
Yamaha C40

Orange Dark Terror + PPC212
Jet City JCA20H + JCA24S
Last edited by Madsalty at Jun 29, 2008,
#34
Quote by Madsalty
the Blackheart is only 15 watts of tube which even in a bedroom environment should allow you to drive those tubes!

Umm, actually...
A 5W into a 12" speaker is about where bedroom volume with power amp overdrive ends, depending how much OD you use. if it's cleanish blues, jazz, or country, a 15W is bedroom volume, but if you're pushing something harder, like AC/DC, etc. a 15 W will get cops called on you, depending on how bitchy the neighbors are and whether you go for the 1x12 or the 2x12. However the handsome devil DOES have a 7W switch, which might be just what you need.
For 200 bucks more than the blackheart 15W head and 12" cab, you could also upgrade to the epiphone blues custom, with higher quality speakers, tube powered reverb, 2 separate channels, and class A and A/B settings. It also has a master volume, which I'm not sure is an attenuator or just adjusts the power amp output.
...
Please do not insinuate anything sexual from that.

Quote by cobain_is_king
If your friends don't like your guitar, cover it in stickers and it'll be teh rawks!
#35
Thanks for the info Mad and Iansmitchell.
I'll try to go with the Bugera 333X, I think.
But, including the Digitech RP350, I've gone over my budget.
I've seen many demos of it on youtube and I've been wonderfully surprised!

Otherwise I'll get the Valveking 112.
#36
Quote by Iansmitchell
Umm, actually...
A 5W into a 12" speaker is about where bedroom volume with power amp overdrive ends, depending how much OD you use. if it's cleanish blues, jazz, or country, a 15W is bedroom volume, but if you're pushing something harder, like AC/DC, etc. a 15 W will get cops called on you, depending on how bitchy the neighbors are and whether you go for the 1x12 or the 2x12. However the handsome devil DOES have a 7W switch, which might be just what you need.
For 200 bucks more than the blackheart 15W head and 12" cab, you could also upgrade to the epiphone blues custom, with higher quality speakers, tube powered reverb, 2 separate channels, and class A and A/B settings. It also has a master volume, which I'm not sure is an attenuator or just adjusts the power amp output.


MY bad on the 15w i meant 5 honest!

Quote by tony.laskir
Thanks for the info Mad and Iansmitchell.
I'll try to go with the Bugera 333X, I think.
But, including the Digitech RP350, I've gone over my budget.
I've seen many demos of it on youtube and I've been wonderfully surprised!

Otherwise I'll get the Valveking 112.


Good choice!
'05 Fender Speed Shop So-Cal Stratocaster
'95 Squier Standard Strat

OLP MM1
Washburn X200v Pro

Tanglewood TW145-SC
Yamaha C40

Orange Dark Terror + PPC212
Jet City JCA20H + JCA24S
#37
Quote by tony.laskir
Thanks for the info Mad and Iansmitchell.
I'll try to go with the Bugera 333X, I think.
But, including the Digitech RP350, I've gone over my budget.
I've seen many demos of it on youtube and I've been wonderfully surprised!

Otherwise I'll get the Valveking 112.


There's little reason to get the RP350, you'll have plenty to keep you occupied with the guitar and amp. Just purchase effects as you go along, it's not like they're essential...nice to have, but it's not like you can't play without them.
Actually called Mark!

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#38
Well that's true...
And I already have overdrive and distortion pedals, but said amps will probably take care of these 2.
It'd be cool though to have wah, delay, phaser etc in one pedal.
Anyways, I'll probably buy it later.
#39
You're on the wrong forum.

If you need help picking Asian made equipment for low money this is Mecca
#40
^any particular reason you're acting like a knobhead or do you have something helpful to contribute?

Quote by tony.laskir
Well that's true...
And I already have overdrive and distortion pedals, but said amps will probably take care of these 2.
It'd be cool though to have wah, delay, phaser etc in one pedal.
Anyways, I'll probably buy it later.


The most useful things for you would be a chorus and a delay, any other stuff can wait.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/electro_harmonix_small_clone.htm
http://www.thomann.de/gb/electro_harmonix_1_echo.htm
Actually called Mark!

Quote by TNfootballfan62
People with a duck for their avatar always give good advice.

...it's a seagull

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i wanna see a clip of a recto buying some groceries.


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