#1
Hey.

I want to come up with a cool chord progression that has a sort of Spanish flavour for me to experiment with an A harmonic minor solo.

So I read up that the i VII VI V chord progression has that feel to it. (Corrected)

But I'm slightly confused whether to apply that formula to A Natural minor (therefore by flattening the 7th degree (G) I get a Gb dim chord when applying the formula) or whether to apply the formula to the A Harmonic minor therefore getting a G dim.

My first guess was The harmonic minor but I am not totally sure.

Help please?
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Last edited by Eternal_One at Jun 29, 2008,
#2
You could try a couple of these scales but check my site and I'll transfer them to you.
#3
The first three chords would be from Natural minor, the last from Harmonic. So if it was in A minor the chords would be Am G F and E.
#4
I'd personally myself use in that situation natural minor over chords 1 and 7b and then change it to harmonic minor for the 6b and 5th I can't really explain it.

G diminished
1 3b 5b 7bb=6
G Bb Db E

Gb Diminished
1 3b 5b 7bb=6
Gb A C Eb

A harmonic minor
A B C D E F G#/Ab

So I'd say A harmonic minor works well with Gb diminished triad but not as Dim7
This is a really bad explonation but I couldn't make it any better myself sorry.
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#6
Quote by Eternal_One
Hey.

I want to come up with a cool chord progression that has a sort of Spanish flavour for me to experiment with an A harmonic minor solo.

So I read up that the I b7 b6 5 chord progression has that feel to it.

But I'm slightly confused whether to apply that formula to A Natural minor (therefore by flattening the 7th degree (G) I get a Gb dim chord when applying the formula) or whether to apply the formula to the A Harmonic minor therefore getting a G dim.

My first guess was The harmonic minor but I am not totally sure.

Help please?
Well, personally I'm a little intrigued by your notation. You start with an I(which should be an i anyway) and then start using numbers. Did you get that right off a website or something?

Anyways, IMO, this is better understood/notated with figured bass. i VII VI V is a bit more descriptive. The roots go down the natural minor scale, but the V chord has a raised seventh. Like it's been said, the last chord is the only one that explicitly implies harmonic minor, so over that one you play harmonic minor. Over the others, you can stick to natural.
#7
Ah okay I understand now. Thx for the advice

No I typed it out in a rush so I mixed up my notation. Sorry.
Proud Owner of:

Jackson RR3
Jackson WRMG

Quote by madbasslover
What's the big deal with Gibsons, anyway?
I've heard loads of Gibsons being played before
and they don't sound any more special than
any other guitar.

^UG's King Of Fail.
#8
Quote by Punkismygod
I'd personally myself use in that situation natural minor over chords 1 and 7b and then change it to harmonic minor for the 6b and 5th I can't really explain it.

G diminished
1 3b 5b 7bb=6
G Bb Db E

Gb Diminished
1 3b 5b 7bb=6
Gb A C Eb

A harmonic minor
A B C D E F G#/Ab

So I'd say A harmonic minor works well with Gb diminished triad but not as Dim7
This is a really bad explonation but I couldn't make it any better myself sorry.


I would say he should use Gbdim7 because it has an Eb, which could be a leading tone into Emaj, which he could then lead into Amin.

So he could have something like

Amin --- Gmaj --- Gbdim7 ---Emaj
#9
Quote by beadhangingOne
I would say he should use Gbdim7 because it has an Eb, which could be a leading tone into Emaj, which he could then lead into Amin.
It's better to call it F#dim, but it's another story why. You wouldn't use F#dim because it resolves too nicely to E. Regardless, there is no Gb/F#dim chord in A harmonic minor; it's G#dim.
#10
Quote by bangoodcharlote
It's better to call it F#dim, but it's another story why. You wouldn't use F#dim because it resolves too nicely to E. Regardless, there is no Gb/F#dim chord in A harmonic minor; it's G#dim.


I was playing it and it actually sounded ok. You could go into A Dorian on the F#dim and then play A harmonic minor over the E.
#11
Wtf is going on in here?

Minor progressions barely ever have bVII chords. They usually have vii0 (full diminished chords). When talking about being in minor or using the minor scale, it usually means using elements of all three minor scales.
A 'minor' progressionis usually based around the harmonic minor scale, using those specially non-diatonic chords. You can write progressions that resolve to an i chord (or vi from the perspective of the major scale) without using non-diatonic chords, but that would actually be a modally aeolian progression (which either me or BGC will explain if anyone is interested).

Minor progressions usually use these chords: i (duh), ii or ii0* (half-diminished), bIII (occasionally a III+ augmented), iv, V, bVI (very rare), vii0 (full diminished).
Not: v or bVII and vary rarely III or III+

*I dont like using the ii0 chord because it resolves too nicely to the bIII chord. You dont want to resolve to the bIII chord because that would mean the progression would be in major (which is actually just as capable of acheiving a sad feeling as a minor progression). The aim of minor progressions is to resolve to that minor chord.

Quote by bangoodcharlote
You wouldn't use F#dim because it resolves too nicely to E
O rly? Why would you say that? If anything the F#dim resolves to either G major, if the chord was half-diminished, or Gminor if the chord was full diminished. Generally.

As a rule, diminished chords almost always resolve upwards by a semitone.
#12
Quote by demon
Minor progressions barely ever have bVII chords.
The bVII would be used where the harmony is decending, because as you've pointed out, the viio would want to move back up to i.
You can write progressions that resolve to an i chord (or vi from the perspective of the major scale) without using non-diatonic chords, but that would actually be a modally aeolian progression
I don't understand. Aeolian is minor...
*I dont like using the ii0 chord because it resolves too nicely to the bIII chord. You dont want to resolve to the bIII chord because that would mean the progression would be in major (which is actually just as capable of acheiving a sad feeling as a minor progression). The aim of minor progressions is to resolve to that minor chord.
You can fix this by using bIII+, which moves to i very well.
O rly? Why would you say that? If anything the F#dim resolves to either G major, if the chord was half-diminished, or Gminor if the chord was full diminished. Generally.
It moves to E nicely as well, 2 voices move down by a semitone and the other down by a tone. Diminished chords seem to ba able to go just about anywhere well.
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#13
Quote by Ænimus Prime
The bVII would be used where the harmony is decending, because as you've pointed out, the viio would want to move back up to i.
But the bVII chord will want to go straight to the III chord. Thus why I dont recomend using it.
Quote by Ænimus Prime
I don't understand. Aeolian is minor...
Not really. Aeolian is modal, its like a dorian progression but instead of pointing and resolving to dorian, it points and resolves to aeolian. The point of minor progressions is to resolve to the i chord. The point of aeolian progressions is to outline and point to the aeolian mode.
Quote by Ænimus Prime
You can fix this by using bIII+, which moves to i very well.
Really? I'll have to investigate...
Quote by Ænimus Prime
It moves to E nicely as well, 2 voices move down by a semitone and the other down by a tone. Diminished chords seem to ba able to go just about anywhere well.
E7 (E, G#, B, D) and G#dim (G#, B, D, F) contain some of the same notes. And that G# diminished chord doesnt really have a tonal center (something to do with the flat fifth). They move well to one another because they're roughly the same chord.
#14
Quote by demon
E7 (E, G#, B, D) and G#dim (G#, B, D, F) contain some of the same notes. And that G# diminished chord doesnt really have a tonal center (something to do with the flat fifth). They move well to one another because they're roughly the same chord.
Weren't we talking about E and F#dim?
Really? I'll have to investigate...
Going from bIII+ to i, the only necessary movement is the leading tone moving up to the root.
But the bVII chord will want to go straight to the III chord. Thus why I dont recomend using it.
Sure you could go the the III, but you could also go to v, or bVI, or iv, or viidim, or iidim. If chords could only move smoothly to one or two chords things would get very predictable.
My name is Andy
Quote by MudMartin
Only looking at music as math and theory, is like only looking at the love of your life as flesh and bone.

Swinging to the rhythm of the New World Order,
Counting bodies like sheep to the rhythm of the war drums
Last edited by Ænimus Prime at Jun 30, 2008,
#15
Quote by Ænimus Prime
Weren't we talking about E and F#dim?
Godamnit. Sorry, I've been making heaps of mistakes lately. I blame the holidays.