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#1
Alright, I have just finished reading arguably the most politically influential book of the 19th and 20th century. However, I struggle to see why there are still Marxists around today.

I mean, I couldn't see it working back when it was more relevant and I don't see why people see it being so important today thanks to liberalism.

I mean, sure, things aren't perfect, but we can still improve and without resorting to such nonsense.

I know there aren't many Communists around today, nor socialists, but, I still just don't see why they hold their opinions.
#3
There arent socialists around today? If people werent so caught up in the imagery of Mr. Obama they would realize the center of all his ideals fall squarely in socialism. Redistribution of wealth is becoming a good thing again. IT DOESNT WORK!!!!
#5
Quote by metal4ever6328
There arent socialists around today? If people werent so caught up in the imagery of Mr. Obama they would realize the center of all his ideals fall squarely in socialism. Redistribution of wealth is becoming a good thing again. IT DOESNT WORK!!!!

Socialism =/= Communism. There are many types of socialism.

Also, how do you place socialism with him?
#6
It's simple: Capitalism sucks


You fool. Socialism is for the weak. Pure capitalism is the path to self expression and a better society. It may sound good on paper, but the fact is, socialism will never work. Capitalism encourages competition and growth.
#7
Quote by metal4ever6328
You fool. Socialism is for the weak. Pure capitalism is the path to self expression and a better society. It may sound good on paper, but the fact is, socialism will never work. Capitalism encourages competition and growth.

When in control.

Laissez faire
capitalism should never happen, nationally or internationally.
#8
The basic reason for these still existing, is the fact that many countries and groups of people see capitalism as undesireable..... and at times I think rightfully so... within a year i hope to be teaching Economics at the highschool level...so this is what I went to school for. With the way current things are going open market free trading capitalism is what seems to the the trouble with the current American economy. Prices go up.... we get scared... we stop spending.... the economy slows down.... prices go higher....we get more scared.... we stop spending more....the economy crashes... though eventually, the economy will correct its self. These fluctuations are caused by the people... no the people in charge of the country. In times like this you need to keep spending money like you normally would, thus enhancing the economy and correcting the high prices. Though with the current economic struggles, it would not suprise me at all to see an increase in socalist and marxist ideas floating around.....
Total Failure

If every dream is a wish, then to dream of zombies is to wish for an appetite without responsibility
#9
Also, how do you place socialism with him?


He wants to take money TAKE money from oil industies and drug companies and redistribute them to people who didnt work for it and just plain dont deserve it. If you are stupid enough to believe that these idustries are responsible for price hiking, your just not looking at the big picture. True socialism does differ from communism, you got me there.
#10
Quote by MetalGS3SE
It's simple: Capitalism sucks.


yes it does, but owning things rocks so most people stick with it
#11
communism is just a form of socialism

extremes such as socialism only work when countries have nowhere else to go
they turn to extremism, either on the extreme left or right
the extremist government gets that country back on it's feet, makes it stronger and wealthier etc. then after that the government has no reason to be extreme so it basically crumbles

far left or far right wing movements only succeed when countries are experiencing dire poverty or are being treated terribly by existing regimes (and no, i don't just mean being shafted by high taxes)
Rockin' shit
#12
Quote by Slovak_Ghost
The basic reason for these still existing, is the fact that many countries and groups of people see capitalism as undesireable..... and at times I think rightfully so... within a year i hope to be teaching Economics at the highschool level...so this is what I went to school for. With the way current things are going open market free trading capitalism is what seems to the the trouble with the current American economy. Prices go up.... we get scared... we stop spending.... the economy slows down.... prices go higher....we get more scared.... we stop spending more....the economy crashes... though eventually, the economy will correct its self. These fluctuations are caused by the people... no the people in charge of the country. In times like this you need to keep spending money like you normally would, thus enhancing the economy and correcting the high prices. Though with the current economic struggles, it would not suprise me at all to see an increase in socalist and marxist ideas floating around.....

One word.

Liberalism.

A free market can never be a safe one, but we can control it without going to the extremes of socialism.
#13
Quote by metal4ever6328
You fool. Socialism is for the weak. Pure capitalism is the path to self expression and a better society. It may sound good on paper, but the fact is, socialism will never work. Capitalism encourages competition and growth.


At no point did I endorse socialism.

It was the only task I would undertake...

I P R O G
...to reap the harvest that was mine


- [ P R O G - H E A D ? ] -
#14
Quote by metal4ever6328
He wants to take money TAKE money from oil industies and drug companies and redistribute them to people who didnt work for it and just plain dont deserve it. If you are stupid enough to believe that these idustries are responsible for price hiking, your just not looking at the big picture. True socialism does differ from communism, you got me there.

That's not socialism. That's called tax and welfare, and it's an awesome thing.
#15
Quote by jimmyhotpants
communism is just a form of socialism

extremes such as socialism only work when countries have nowhere else to go
they turn to extremism, either on the extreme left or right
the extremist government gets that country back on it's feet, makes it stronger and wealthier etc. then after that the government has no reason to be extreme so it basically crumbles

far left or far right wing movements only succeed when countries are experiencing dire poverty or are being treated terribly by existing regimes (and no, i don't just mean being shafted by high taxes)

Yep, but we can sort things out much better progressively.
#18
People believe in socialism because they believe in such things as free education, healthcare and social security for those who are unable to work because of disabilities.

It most certainly is different to communism.

Communism = Everyone is equal, theoretically.

Socialism = Everyone deserves an equal chance.
#19
It's still pretty relevant I think. People with money have more power than people without. That's undemocratic.
#20
Quote by Foo'
People believe in socialism because they believe in such things as free education, healthcare and social security for those who are unable to work because of disabilities.

It most certainly is different to communism.

Communism = Everyone is equal, theoretically.

Socialism = Everyone deserves an equal chance.

Equal chance is bullcrap, but we can get closer to it through liberalism.

Having state education and health care isn't necessarily socialism. I mean, you guys in the states have state education, state police, state fire force, and you never stop and say that you guys have socialist policies.
#21
Look, no-one's got any system right yet. We never will. You know why?

WE SUCK!

No matter how hypothetically perfect anything is, someone always goes and corrupts it or screws it up.

Communism probably would have been alright if it wasn't for corruption amongst the rulers, just as most governments would be.
#22
Quote by Donaldguitar
It's still pretty relevant I think. People with money have more power than people without. That's undemocratic.

It bloody well is. It's shame how the majority swallow up the rule which will benefit the minority, just because they're too scared of liberal policies.
#24
Quote by fleaflicker182
Look, no-one's got any system right yet. We never will. You know why?

WE SUCK!

No matter how hypothetically perfect anything is, someone always goes and corrupts it or screws it up.

Communism probably would have been alright if it wasn't for corruption amongst the rulers, just as most governments would be.

Communism does not have rulers. Read the Manifesto some time.

And yes, no system is perfect but when has anything ever been perfect?
#25
Quote by Donaldguitar
It's still pretty relevant I think. People with money have more power than people without. That's undemocratic.

That's capitalism
#26
Quote by Donaldguitar
Liberalism is a completely free market. Or at least the classic definition from Adam Smith's time is.

I'm using liberalism in the context of liberal ideas

I know it can be used to define other things though.

A regulated market is the only free one anyway.
#29
Quote by Craigo
I'd also like to add in here;

John Stuart Mill; On Liberty

I don't it but I might check it out.
#30
Quote by MetalGS3SE
It's simple: The human race sucks.


Fixed.

Seriously, political systems are only as fallible as the people. We could have a perfect and fair communist, socialist, or capitalist society if many people weren't naturally inclined to be arseholes.

Anyway, I'd also like to point out that a lot of people who say they're communist/socialist in this modern day and age are idiots with less political knowledge than they claim, who think they're cool by having "out-there" political views when really liberalism is probably a more rational option.
I play by my own rules. And I have one rule; There are no rules... but if there are, they're there to be broken. Even this one.


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#32
Quote by break-me-in
Fixed.

Seriously, political systems are only as fallible as the people. We could have a perfect and fair communist, socialist, or capitalist society if many people weren't naturally inclined to be arseholes.

Anyway, I'd also like to point out that a lot of people who say they're communist/socialist in this modern day and age are idiots with less political knowledge than they claim, who think they're cool by having "out-there" political views when really liberalism is probably a more rational option.

I've got some radical political beliefs. My ideal world would be an anarchist one. But I know that it just isn't gonna happen.
#33
Quote by Craigo
Bingo.

If you really think that's socialism, well, I guess I live in a socialist country.


Well, if you think back to when the Labour party first introduced the NHS, I'm sure a lot of people would have been saying that we were a bunch of raving socialists and it would never work.

Since then, people no longer consider it socialist because it has become an accepted standard, same as the minimum wage etc.

Despite this, you can't say that such things aren't/weren't socialist policies at heart.
#34
Quote by Foo'
Well, if you think back to when the Labour party first introduced the NHS, I'm sure a lot of people would have been saying that we were a bunch of raving socialists and it would never work.

Since then, people no longer consider it socialist because it has become an accepted standard, same as the minimum wage etc.

Despite this, you can't say that such things aren't/weren't socialist policies at heart.

It isn't socialism. Simple as.
#35
Quote by Foo'
Well, if you think back to when the Labour party first introduced the NHS, I'm sure a lot of people would have been saying that we were a bunch of raving socialists and it would never work.

Since then, people no longer consider it socialist because it has become an accepted standard, same as the minimum wage etc.

Despite this, you can't say that such things aren't/weren't socialist policies at heart.

Not at heart, but had, and still do, have socialist properties. That doesn't make a country socialist.
#36
Quote by Donaldguitar
I've got some radical political beliefs. My ideal world would be an anarchist one. But I know that it just isn't gonna happen.


Why? Anarchism couldn't possibly work. Ever. We could maybe make communism work, but anarchism is so far gone in terms of idealism that it's just ridiculous.

And I think people should learn to separate their political beliefs from their political ideals. Beliefs would be the reasonable, feasible things you believe, and ideals would be your ideal situation. It would cause much less confusion, and force people with radical beliefs to pick a part in the current society.
I play by my own rules. And I have one rule; There are no rules... but if there are, they're there to be broken. Even this one.


Confused? Good.

Quote by CrucialGutchman
Sigs are wastes of my precious screen space.

^ Irony

Quote by RevaM1ssP1ss
LET ME HUMP YOU DAMMIT
#37
Quote by break-me-in
Why? Anarchism couldn't possibly work. Ever. We could maybe make communism work, but anarchism is so far gone in terms of idealism that it's just ridiculous.

And I think people should learn to separate their political beliefs from their political ideals. Beliefs would be the reasonable, feasible things you believe, and ideals would be your ideal situation. It would cause much less confusion, and force people with radical beliefs to pick a part in the current society.

If Communism could work, modern Anarchism could work. However, it's the process that makes it so bloody hard to happen.
#39
Quote by Craigo
If Communism could work, modern Anarchism could work. However, it's the process that makes it so bloody hard to happen.


I just personally believe anarchism is harder to execute.
I play by my own rules. And I have one rule; There are no rules... but if there are, they're there to be broken. Even this one.


Confused? Good.

Quote by CrucialGutchman
Sigs are wastes of my precious screen space.

^ Irony

Quote by RevaM1ssP1ss
LET ME HUMP YOU DAMMIT
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