#1
Heey guys,

I have a really problem with my right hand (I think). When I play like master of puppets I just can't put enough power anymore behind the notes and I have a lot of pain after like 2 minutes with the main riff. It is really strange because it only happens when I have to play constant 8 notes or 16th. When I play yyz it doesn;t happen.

So I decided that it was just stupid and went practising more, resulting in more pain. So then I decided I should just take a brake.

But guys/girls I love Dream Theater etc. I know some of their songs. But when I can't even play metallica, how the hell will I ever be good enough for the dance of eternity?

So guys, is there something wrong with my technique, have I got some disease, or am I just crazy and should practise more?

ty

ps. I am dutch so please don't go whining about my english!
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#2
Don't be silly, you silly Dutchman The Dutch seem to communicate in English better than the English

Anyways, we can't really crit your technique, as we can't see what you're doing. It's like asking us what your eye colour is without being able to see a picture of you.

Do you warm up before playing? What kind of pain is it? Where abouts is the pain?
#3
No, I suggest playing it slower, yes SLOWER while putting in the power you like, and then builing speed.


No worries, youre determination is simply surpassing your hands physical ability.


I once heard that the in/famous Les Paul passed out on his right hand and awoke with atrophy, thus causing him to rebuild his muscle memory and enderuance. If a man can surpass this, I say you are in no danger, friend.
#4
Quote by Deliriumbassist
Don't be silly, you silly Dutchman The Dutch seem to communicate in English better than the English

Anyways, we can't really crit your technique, as we can't see what you're doing. It's like asking us what your eye colour is without being able to see a picture of you.

Do you warm up before playing? What kind of pain is it? Where abouts is the pain?


I do warm up, by playing some blues scales and then I continue with some easy songs.

Well I have pain in my hand and underarm and my hand just stops playing. Can't move my fingers good anymore, and when you stop. The pain stops and I can just continue.

Quote by killwitneydead
No, I suggest playing it slower, yes SLOWER while putting in the power you like, and then builing speed.


No worries, youre determination is simply surpassing your hands physical ability.


I once heard that the in/famous Les Paul passed out on his right hand and awoke with atrophy, thus causing him to rebuild his muscle memory and enderuance. If a man can surpass this, I say you are in no danger, friend.


Well I wouldn't know about that. But it seems plausible. But I can play the four horsemen and those notes are faster than the main riff of master of puppets (aren't they?)
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
Last edited by Neo Evil11 at Jul 7, 2008,
#7
Quote by Neo Evil11



Well I wouldn't know about that. But it seems plausible. But I can play the four horsemen and those notes are faster than the main riff of master of puppets (aren't they?)



Yes, but your worried about your power, not speed, correct?
#8
Quote by Neo Evil11
I do warm up, by playing some blues scales and then I continue with some easy songs.

Well I have pain in my hand and underarm and my hand just stops playing. Can't move my fingers good anymore, and when you stop. The pain stops and I can just continue.




I feel confident that you are stressing your muscles too suddenly, again, play the riff you have problems with a a prctice speed for a while.


All of metallica have said that they no longer enjoy play MOP because it is just too strenuous.

Seriously, take it easy and then work your way back up, if you try and force yourself, you will have nothing but larger, potentioally more permanant problems at your dismay.
#9
Quote by killwitneydead
Yes, but your worried about your power, not speed, correct?


both, when I play I hit the strings very hard and accurate. But when I can't hit hard I have the feeling I am being sloppy And at that speed it is sloppy really fast.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#10
are you left handed or right handed? I ask this because obviously each hand is used for different things depneding on which you are....I get incredible pain in myfreetting hand (im al efty so that wud be my right). I went to see a physio and was tpol;d that because my thumb is hyper-extensive (its double jointed adn bends back further than normal) when I playing and apply pressure my thumb is weaker because it bends back further, it ahs less support...so i have to do exercises and stretches to build the strengthi n my thumb and fretting hand.

I also used to get pain in myl eft hand when I tried to play parts faster than I actually could, as someone else mentioned before this is your determination wating to do more than you can. Play is slowly as slow as you need to even if it means playing the section at 40% or 30% of full speed till you can play it fine at that speed and then gradually increase the speed until you reach full speed. This works so much better than trying to dive into it headlong at full speed.

You said you like Dream Theater? If you havnt already I suggest you get your hands on John Petruccis Rock Disciple book it contains some brilliant exercises to help improve your technique, and if you can get the DVD as well....

...and if you want to go further do stretches before you have a big session...if you go on youtube you can find a short video exert from John Petruccis Rock Disciple DVD that shows you some stretches to do before you play. Hope that helps
#12
Quote by Mihyaeru
are you left handed or right handed? I ask this because obviously each hand is used for different things depneding on which you are....I get incredible pain in myfreetting hand (im al efty so that wud be my right). I went to see a physio and was tpol;d that because my thumb is hyper-extensive (its double jointed adn bends back further than normal) when I playing and apply pressure my thumb is weaker because it bends back further, it ahs less support...so i have to do exercises and stretches to build the strengthi n my thumb and fretting hand.

I also used to get pain in myl eft hand when I tried to play parts faster than I actually could, as someone else mentioned before this is your determination wating to do more than you can. Play is slowly as slow as you need to even if it means playing the section at 40% or 30% of full speed till you can play it fine at that speed and then gradually increase the speed until you reach full speed. This works so much better than trying to dive into it headlong at full speed.

You said you like Dream Theater? If you havnt already I suggest you get your hands on John Petruccis Rock Disciple book it contains some brilliant exercises to help improve your technique, and if you can get the DVD as well....

...and if you want to go further do stretches before you have a big session...if you go on youtube you can find a short video exert from John Petruccis Rock Disciple DVD that shows you some stretches to do before you play. Hope that helps


No there is nothing wrong with my fretting hand, it is my plucking (?) hand.

But John Petrucci is a guitarist? How can he help a bassist with his right hand technique

*to the carpal-tunnel dude, though I have the same symptoms. I don't think there is anything bruised/swollen (?) or something in my wrist. (have read the article in dutch).
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#13
try to use a wristband had some kind of problem too on 8 or 16 notes i had pain in my fingers and now i use 2wristbands both hands so try that !!!!
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#14
Quote by Neo Evil11
both, when I play I hit the strings very hard and accurate. But when I can't hit hard I have the feeling I am being sloppy And at that speed it is sloppy really fast.



I know this feeling. You feel the rythm and don't need to count it, but your right and left hand are feeling something different, I believe you must evaluate exactly what hand is 'sloppy' and lagging and when/why/how.
#15
Quote by polargimp
carpal tunnel?
It could be this. I'd really hope not; the bass player of a band I used to play in developed it and it took quite a while to sort out.
If it does continue I'd definitely suggest asking your doctor about it just to be safe.
#16
Quote by killwitneydead
I know this feeling. You feel the rythm and don't need to count it, but your right and left hand are feeling something different, I believe you must evaluate exactly what hand is 'sloppy' and lagging and when/why/how.


always the right hand actually. I have a really good left hand (technique).
When? when I play fast, trash. Stuff with no breaks for a very long time.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#17
Actually maybe a note to this story: this weekend I went to the musicstore in Köln, germany to test the bongo's etc. That day I guess I went too fast, too soon. But I had no reall pain or something. That came when I stopped, my hands were tingling (?).

Mostly in the skin I guess, might not have anything to do with this at all. But the dude made me afraid with the carpal tunnel stuff.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#18
Quote by Neo Evil11
always the right hand actually. I have a really good left hand (technique).
When? when I play fast, trash. Stuff with no breaks for a very long time.



How much time do you have invested in playing strenous, excersizes lacking breaks?


Of course you may have something needing attention, but I believe (honestly) that either a) you have learned faster than your muscles have developed/adjusted


or b) your muscles are so large that they increase pressure on your tendons and cause discomfort.


I doubt you have developed a medical issue.
#19
Quote by Neo Evil11
No there is nothing wrong with my fretting hand, it is my plucking (?) hand.

But John Petrucci is a guitarist? How can he help a bassist with his right hand technique

*to the carpal-tunnel dude, though I have the same symptoms. I don't think there is anything bruised/swollen (?) or something in my wrist. (have read the article in dutch).


Plucking is a good term. Many people would say picking, but plucking works fine.

Some things can be applied to both guitar and bass, like stretching... you're using the same muscles after all, just in a slightly different way.
#20
I used to get serious pains in my second finger of my right hand when I played for more than an hour. I just kept playing (but not for more than an hour) and now it's completely gone. I think that the key is to play bass parts that don't cause you pain and just let yourself build up strength and stamina.
#21
Quote by AtticusNathy
Click your fingers before you play.
Its works for me...?

or is that just me?

xx


Clicking joints is bad and can lead to early arthritis. I wouldn't reccomend doing it at all ESPECIALLY on your hands, this is something that could stop your playing completely.
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i can only keep it up for about 30 seconds before my fingers cramp up =[

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#22
Petrucci's stretching exercises can help you! They actually helped me! I had a problem with my left (plucking) hand fingers and when I applied his exercise (on both hands really) it was like magic, I was able to play for 3 straight hours without stopping!!! (No kidding)

By the way the problem with my fingers was that they simply couldn't play faster things after an hour of play (no pain, no nothing, simply they were fatigued and couldn't move as fast), but that was of course before I learned everything about warm up exercises
#23
Quote by fortysix&2
Clicking joints is bad and can lead to early arthritis. I wouldn't reccomend doing it at all ESPECIALLY on your hands, this is something that could stop your playing completely.


It's never been proven that clicking joints can lead to arthritis. (http://student.bmj.com/back_issues/1097/data/1097ed2.htm) that article says that "clicking joints is probably harmless".

And I've found when you click your fingers they become easier to move and more agile, so I happily do it, I know it may lead to some problems but I've been told not to worry about it.

Also I used to experience pain when trying to play HARD and FAST I countered this by developing my technique so I played softly yet fast, to sort out the volume difference just turn up your amp a little bit and don't put as much power into your finger strokes.
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#24
Quote by Rywad
And I've found when you click your fingers they become easier to move and more agile, so I happily do it, I know it may lead to some problems but I've been told not to worry about it.


Still, I hate the bloody sound of clicking fingers, it makes me puke, so I do it rarely
#25
I can't go a whole day with cracking my fingers, wrist, neck, knees, ankles, elbows, and sometimes my back.

I doubt it sounds too pleasant to bystanders, but it feels damned good =P

I also recommend John Petrucci's DVD

The left + right hand excersises, especially if you play with a pick, can be a wonderful help with your reach and coordination.
#26
Get checked out by a doc for carpal tunnel syndrome. I found out i'd developed it about a month ago when i kept losing feeling (well, all feeling except for blinding, hand-on-fire level pain) in my picking hand to the point that i couldn't hold a pick. Switching to finger style, wearing a wrist brace at night/around the house, and a prescription for a steroidal anti-inflammatory to take before practice and/or shows keeps me going well enough to practice, gig, and record with 2 bands
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#27
Quote by Deliriumbassist
Don't be silly, you silly Dutchman The Dutch seem to communicate in English better than the English

sadly this is true.

but I'd keep practicing. your body gets used to it.
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#28
how long have u been playing for? and how high up do you wear ur bass? if u wear ur bass low to the point where u barely have to bend ur plucking arm, ur muscles can relaxe easier and therefor work at a faster speed. oh and if u feel tingling sensation on ur finger tips, thats cos theres too much friction and a blister might be developing, or theres just a **** load of blood going into ur fingers.
#29
I think i have had the same thing and i fixed it by warming up more, but i dont know how long you warm up.
#30
Quote by Neo Evil11
Heey guys,

I have a really problem with my right hand (I think). When I play like master of puppets I just can't put enough power anymore behind the notes and I have a lot of pain after like 2 minutes with the main riff. It is really strange because it only happens when I have to play constant 8 notes or 16th. When I play yyz it doesn;t happen.

So I decided that it was just stupid and went practising more, resulting in more pain. So then I decided I should just take a brake.

But guys/girls I love Dream Theater etc. I know some of their songs. But when I can't even play metallica, how the hell will I ever be good enough for the dance of eternity?

So guys, is there something wrong with my technique, have I got some disease, or am I just crazy and should practise more?

ty

ps. I am dutch so please don't go whining about my english!



Uh dude you can play yyz. That's your problem.
Last edited by ccam555 at Jul 8, 2008,
#31
Id say its because you dont warm up enough or havent practiced it enough. You have the ability, but not the endurance, know what I mean?
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