#1
It seems like people like Ramones for the same reason they like Green Day or Blink, simply because they're songs are catchy, but people worship The Ramones as punk gods as if they've got divine powers. I personally like both, but I don't really understand why people hate Pop Punkish Blink bands but love The Ramones. To me they're basically the same.
#2
I guess because the ramones were actually somewhat creative and not generic.
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#3
All us punk fans are hypocrites.
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#4
Even though i can't stand either band for more than 2 minutes.
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#7
The Ramones put on very raw, energetic shows, looked pretty awesome, and were pretty heavy and aggressive early on. Blink does have some good songs, and Travis Barker is a good drummer, but alot of their songs are pretty unserious, some of their songs are very poppy, and some just arent punk songs. And the Ramones came in the seventies, and were a very early punk band. Blink was just another pop-punk band in the 90s, but with funny, relatable lyrics.
#8
I love Blink-128, but not as a punk band. I like Green Day as a punk band, but I keep it a secret ( I don't wan't the real punks to find out ).


OH ****!
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#9
Quote by Jx210
It seems like people like Ramones for the same reason they like Green Day or Blink, simply because they're songs are catchy, but people worship The Ramones as punk gods as if they've got divine powers. I personally like both, but I don't really understand why people hate Pop Punkish Blink bands but love The Ramones. To me they're basically the same.

People like the Ramones because they were original and made a statement against the music industry of the time. Blink 182 is a product of the manufactured music industry, they play unoriginal music simply because it's what sells in the current market.
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#10
The Ramones made music that had the social alienation and aggression of punk behind it and while they did have many songs about love they also made several ones about less family-friendly topics like 53rd and 3rd and Scattergun.

Blink 182 were a boy band with guitars who's music is so sugary sweet that listening to it for too long could result in becoming diabetic and had all the aggression of a baby hamster.
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#11
The difference between the Ramones and Blink-182 is actually fairly simple.
The Ramones play punk music heavily influenced by pop structure and and the happy, jumpy sound. Despite the pop influence however, they kept heavily distorted guitars, breakneck live shows, and the punk rhythms.
Blink-182 however are a pop-rock band heavily influenced by punk. The reason for making this distinction is that while they both rely on the traditional pop structure, Blink-182s production, tone, and style is more pop oriented. The The guitar sounds are thinner with less distortion, there are more syrupy vocal harmonies, and the content (while somewhat scattered with naughty language) is very geared towards relating to teens (AKA the pop audience). While the Ramones had some songs about girls, some songs about drugs, some songs about prostitution, etc. Blink has mostly songs about girls...or fucking dogs, which is giggly naughty, but as they're only joking, not offensive the majority, outside of the moral majority.

That being said, I actually like some Blink-182 more than I like some Ramones music. I just never really got into the Ramones, but they are clearly pop-punk, where Blink is more poprock.
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#12
Quote by CowsWithGuns
The Ramones made music that had the social alienation and aggression of punk behind it and while they did have many songs about love they also made several ones about less family-friendly topics like 53rd and 3rd and Scattergun.

Blink 182 were a boy band with guitars who's music is so sugary sweet that listening to it for too long could result in becoming diabetic and had all the aggression of a baby hamster.


You are right.
#13
If you can't tell the difference between Blink and the Ramones then you have a remarkably indiscriminate ear.

But I've always considered Blink 182 to be Pop Punk.
#14
So pretty much because Blink 182 wrote songs about girls, had less distortion, and weren't agressive? I always assumed punk bands didn't need to talk about non-family friendly topics just to be punk, thoguh I suppose I can see the point.

Oh, and I watched parts of Story of a Ramone, and didn't they finally quit in the 90's because they couldn't break into the music industry like some of the more popular punk bands influenced by them had?
#15
Songs about girls are a long standing pop punk tradition.

Punk songs tend to have a more diverse topic range.

But please this argument has been done to death...
#16
Quote by Jx210
Oh, and I watched parts of Story of a Ramone, and didn't they finally quit in the 90's because they couldn't break into the music industry like some of the more popular punk bands influenced by them had?


are you questioning us? what the **** man...i thought you were cool...


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#17
Quote by Jx210
So pretty much because Blink 182 wrote songs about girls, had less distortion, and weren't agressive? I always assumed punk bands didn't need to talk about non-family friendly topics just to be punk, thoguh I suppose I can see the point.

Oh, and I watched parts of Story of a Ramone, and didn't they finally quit in the 90's because they couldn't break into the music industry like some of the more popular punk bands influenced by them had?

well, it's not just what they wrote about. you left out the last two parts of your first sentence which are kind of the roots of punk.
#18
Aggression is one of the biggest parts of punk rock. Punk rock is based off of anger and social alienation.
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#20
Quote by Jx210
So pretty much because Blink 182 wrote songs about girls, had less distortion, and weren't agressive? I always assumed punk bands didn't need to talk about non-family friendly topics just to be punk, thoguh I suppose I can see the point.

Oh, and I watched parts of Story of a Ramone, and didn't they finally quit in the 90's because they couldn't break into the music industry like some of the more popular punk bands influenced by them had?

Yes and no. The simple fact of the matter is that their tone, harmonies, subject matter, vocals, and the way they act all plays into the idea of being a pop band. Yeah, they have punk influence, but that doesn't make them punk.
I don't really care about this debate, I just felt the need to clarify my point after you reworded it...poorly. I'm not saying Blink-182 isn't punk because they sing about girls, don't offend people, and don't use enough distortion. All I'm saying is that the way they composed, sounded, acted, and presented themselves all played into the image of being pop stars.
There's nothing wrong with it. They're still enjoyable.

EDIT:
Punk obviously doesn't have to be distorted, offensive, angry music.
Example? Television
However, I think we can all agree Blink aren't going for that sort of sound or image.

In terms of pop-punk, The Queers are a really excellent example. They're catchy, fun, and have a simple melody. However, they also have the heavier guitar sound, the more pounding drums, and the snottier vocals.
Blink however have the harmonies, the pop catchiness, the lighter distortion, and the very polished sound.

It's the difference between pop influenced punk and punk influenced pop.
That post was so unnecessary and I apologize.
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Last edited by Jett Diamond at Jul 12, 2008,
#21
Quote by Jx210
It seems like people like Ramones for the same reason they like Green Day or Blink, simply because they're songs are catchy, but people worship The Ramones as punk gods as if they've got divine powers. I personally like both, but I don't really understand why people hate Pop Punkish Blink bands but love The Ramones. To me they're basically the same.


So lets discuss the difference between Jesus and Jerry Falwell
#22
"Intoxicated by the orchids abandoned in the garden"

versus

"I tried to **** your mom in the ass, I tried to **** your dad in the ass"
#23
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So lets discuss the difference between Jesus and Jerry Falwell




Yeah, or the difference between Vinnie Jones (who is hard) and Glenn Danzig (who is literally a little pussy.)
#24
Quote by enemy120
ramones defined american punk

others are crap

Early American punk was much more diverse than what you know as punk (I'm assuming). There was The Ramones, but there was also The Talking Heads, Richard Hell and the Voidoids, The Dead Boys, and Television. And those are just the really well-known ones.

TS, there's a fine line between poppy punk and pop-punky pop. I personally don't care if Blink is discussed here, but the general consensus is that Blink 182 is pop-punky pop. Trust me, you're better off just accepting that and discussing them in the poorly-named Pop-Punk & Emo forum.

I'm about to report this thread, since, surprisingly, no one else has.
#25
Saying that Blink-182 and Green Day are similar to the Ramones because they're both pop-punk is like saying Arsenic and Ice Cream are similar because you can both eat them.

Apparently you missed the whole part about the Ramones making good music and Blink-182 and Green Day churning out the same crap I heard on the radio for the previous 5 years.
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#26
Quote by Jx210
So pretty much because Blink 182 wrote songs about girls, had less distortion, and weren't agressive? I always assumed punk bands didn't need to talk about non-family friendly topics just to be punk, thoguh I suppose I can see the point.

Oh, and I watched parts of Story of a Ramone, and didn't they finally quit in the 90's because they couldn't break into the music industry like some of the more popular punk bands influenced by them had?


Blinks lyrics were very emo (their later **** mostly)

Punk is a very AGRESSIVE genre, so ofcourse if the riffs aren't aggressive, they're not as "punk"...

That being said looking back at the Ramones NOW, they don't sound very agressive at all, but at the time (mid 70's) you had stuff like led zeppelin, the beatles, Pink Floyd (I think) and all that comercial rock, so comparing them to what was around at the time, they were VERY agressive.

At the time punk wasn't as aggressive as it is now

It's the same as comparing Black Sabath or Iron Maiden to a more modern metal band like Slipknot.

Obviously both Sabath and Maiden are metal, but when you compare their sound to a band like Slipknot (i'm probably using a horrible example, but they're like the only metal band i like ) you can hear how much louder Slipknot is.

The music evolves as it goes on, punk gets more agressive, metal gets louder, rap gets ****tier, etc...

Green Day isn't considered to be punk because A) They try WAY too hard (especially now) B) Their music gets worse & worse. (Really...check it out, every album gets ****tier.) C) They do have some aggressive songs, and alot of their songs have the typical punk rock message (politics, mostly) but their vocals are very poppy, and so is the structure of their songs, and when you write a 9 minute song, and when you win a grammy for best Rock Opera Album, you're officially not punk.
#27
^Nobody even asked about Green Day. I fail to see how their music getting worse (which is completely subjective) makes them les "punk."

Sweet Baby was from the same scene as Green Day. Sweet Baby's lyrics, vocals, and song structure were very similar to GD's. The difference was the Green Day got popular. I think that's the only real reason people say Green Day isn't punk.

I'm not saying Green Day and Blink 182 should be allowed here. I really don't care. I just think that this proves that genres are not well-defined, so I don't think people should be so critical of people when they disagree about what band is which genre.
#28
Quote by werty22
^Nobody even asked about Green Day. I fail to see how their music getting worse (which is completely subjective) makes them les "punk."

Sweet Baby was from the same scene as Green Day. Sweet Baby's lyrics, vocals, and song structure were very similar to GD's. The difference was the Green Day got popular. I think that's the only real reason people say Green Day isn't punk.

I'm not saying Green Day and Blink 182 should be allowed here. I really don't care. I just think that this proves that genres are not well-defined, so I don't think people should be so critical of people when they disagree about what band is which genre.


I didn't really explain myself at all by saying their music gets worse & worse.

So I'll do it now, the album "American Idiot" for the most part isn't even pop-punk, it's pop-rock.

St. Jimmy, American Idiot, and Holiday are the only pop-punk songs on the album.

The other ones such as Jesus of Suburbia, Blvd. Of Broken Dreams, etc... Are all pop rock.

and yeah I also agree with you about that 90% of punk bands not being considered punk because of their fame.

but at the same time, have you compared Dookie to American Idiot?

even ****ing good charlotte, compare their 1st & 2nd albums to all their others.

I just don't understand why Anti-Flag is allowed in here, when Green Day isn't, though....probably cause of the fan base,

Also, I don't get why bands like Nirvana, Mudhoney, and Mother Love Bone aren't allowed. (the punk influenced grunge bands)
Last edited by Swap-Meet at Jul 12, 2008,