#1
**Warning: Not for the tl;dr crowd**

So here I draft the great minds of the pit to analyse the following quandary from my debate class. (I'm in first year, or Debate 1)

So in the first part of the class, we're split into two groups (10-12 people each) and we're all given a sheet with 38 "values" on them. These "values" include such things as love, life, acceptance, safety, freedom, knowledge, wisdom, self-actualization, equality, salvation and so on and so forth.

The teacher tells us to work alone, and number these values, 1-38. 1 being the one on the list we value most and 38 the least.

After we do this we come back to our groups and assemble.

From there we build a list of the top 10 "values" of our group (I'll go over this cluster**** of a class activity if anyone would like, but that activity itself is extranneous to the story)

So the two parts of the class have built our lists.

Now the teacher springs upon us that what we just did is a lead up to a certain moral quandary and a debate over it.

The question reads "Is it permissible to kill one person to save the life of many more?"

I sided with idea of killing one to save the whole, but I was chosen to fend for the opposite side.

So I'm pitted against this churchy chick. She listed "Salvation" as her #1 value in life, and our argument goes as such.

Me: How would deal with the idea of making someone immediately face their mortality, reckon with their fate and accept that now is the ultimate end?

Her: Because I believe in salvation, and I'd be perfectly fine with sacrificing someone to save the whole (granted I agree with her short of her salvation spiel) because I believe in salvation so strongly. If they don't want to die, I don't see why they wouldn't want to. I would sacrifice myself because I believe in salvation so if I died right now, I'd like totally be fine with it, because of my belief in salvation.

Me: Quite a lofty thought that, but in all seriousness, salvation is the idea of being saved. Now I get the idea you're thinking of "salvation" in the Christian sense of the word. What do you think is going to save you from an ultimate end?

Her: Because of salvation, maybe you should try believing in it. That means my life doesn't have to end even when I die because I was saved, so I will have an afterlife so I have no worry about ending

*Then rings the ever so timely class bell*

I'm lucky the teacher also doubles as a stenographer!

But what I wish for the intelligentsia of the pit to help me on is this simple question:

Did I win or did I get my ass handed to me by the 700 Club girl? Because this has been grating on me all day. I feel slightly immasculated
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#2
There is no salvation. There is only retribution.
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You should be careful what you say. Some asshole will probably sig it.

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Yup, a girl went up to me in my fursuit one time.

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I can fap to this. Keep going.
#5
girl fails for starting answer with because and sounding like a stubborn....THING.
don't debates usually end with a ****ed up conclusion? something like both sides are right and both sides are wrong kind of things?
#6
I don't understand what she is trying to say

but girl CAN'T be understand ...so..
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Lol at Bender

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I got to warn you for spam though...

Quote by Shredoftheday
Nicely put good sir

I witnessed Night Of The Pear 2
#7
Good god man, was that really a valid argument? you guys drifted off from the real question at hand, and basically talked 'bout something that is completely irrelevant, even though she brought it up. The question was if it was justifiable to kill one person to save the lives of others, and you guys started arguing as if the killing of that one person happened already and are trying to justify his/her death....
Quote by rastaman12
What do people usually do after they **** their sisters?
#8
Quote by Lucky#Slevin
Good god man, was that really a valid argument? you guys drifted off from the real question at hand, and basically talked 'bout something that is completely irrelevant, even though she brought it up. The question was if it was justifiable to kill one person to save the lives of others, and you guys started arguing as if the killing of that one person happened already and are trying to justify his/her death....


I don't see how we were arguing as if they were already dead, I was asking her as if the trigger of the gun placed to said victim's head was ready to be squoze.

I guess it was a dirty tactic, but I tried to make an appeal to her emotions so to speak. Like I said I wasn't actually on the side I was given in the first place. I just wanted to give a half-assed argument and see how it flew, testing the waters so to speak. And I guess my classmates are more formidable foes than I thought
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#9
Quote by Kawzmo118

Her: I'd like totally


She loses.


Quote by bender424
I don't understand what she is trying to say

but girl CAN'T be understand ...so..


...care to reread that?


My mind is going. I can feel it.
Last edited by MTVget0FFtheAIR at Aug 29, 2008,
#10
To be honest, nobody won that one. It went literally nowhere. And I can see why with it being so short... Maybe it would have come to a conclusion if it had carried on for longer but at the moment it is just impossible to tell.
"We must become members of a new race, overcoming petty prejudice, owing our ultimate allegiance not to nations, but to our fellow men within the human community."
- H.I.M Haile Selassie I
#12
Quote by CaptainRon
Dude, you're the reincarnation of Elvis.


What the hell are you talking about?
"We must become members of a new race, overcoming petty prejudice, owing our ultimate allegiance not to nations, but to our fellow men within the human community."
- H.I.M Haile Selassie I
#13
Quote by IDread
What the hell are you talking about?


it may have a slight bit to do with my default, but that would be a hell of a stretch.
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#14
Well she's stupid if thats how she worded her arguement. And Is it permissible to kill one person to save the life of many more?" is that how it was worded?
#15
Quote by masterohumans
Well she's stupid if thats how she worded her arguement. And Is it permissible to kill one person to save the life of many more?" is that how it was worded?


Well it had the word "Resolved" at the beginning, I left that out

At the moment the teacher hasn't set any rules of engagement so far. She's doing things like this to learn about our styles of debating as individuals, unfettered and free of rules and such.
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#16
Quote by Kawzmo118
it may have a slight bit to do with my default, but that would be a hell of a stretch.


Nah I think he might just be a troll... I've seen that same post in some other thread since he posed that last one...
"We must become members of a new race, overcoming petty prejudice, owing our ultimate allegiance not to nations, but to our fellow men within the human community."
- H.I.M Haile Selassie I
#17
Quote by IDread
Nah I think he might just be a troll... I've seen that same post in some other thread since he posed that last one...


Damn right I'm a troll.

I saw everyone else doing posting stupid things so I figured I'd give it a try.
#19
You brought it off topic farther than she did, she at least says something in her argument, you just asked two simple questions, but dragged them out.
Soon you will sit on the bench
of those who deny I have my soul
You sell a dream you create
Condemned by what you condemned before
Smooth are the words you sing down and high
Underground is your joy your laws
#20
if its the entire class, does that make it a mass debate?
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Your post was the only bright spot in this disgusting piece of thread.

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You have balls. I like balls....(awkward silence)

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I waited for the rape.

...


...but the rape never came
#21
Quote by MedicreDemon
You brought it off topic farther than she did, she at least says something in her argument, you just asked two simple questions, but dragged them out.


It was a baiting tactic. She already started on that so I figured "Let's see just how much damage I can do in 3 minutes".

But oh what's the point of trying to tell you, you wouldn't believe me
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#22
Quote by Kawzmo118
It was a baiting tactic. She already started on that so I figured "Let's see just how much damage I can do in 3 minutes".

But oh what's the point of trying to tell you, you wouldn't believe me



She had the idea that whoever was sacrificed would go on to a better afterlife anyway, you could of just asked her what if the person wasn't being saved.
Soon you will sit on the bench
of those who deny I have my soul
You sell a dream you create
Condemned by what you condemned before
Smooth are the words you sing down and high
Underground is your joy your laws
#23
Quote by MedicreDemon
She had the idea that whoever was sacrificed would go on to a better afterlife anyway, you could of just asked her what if the person wasn't being saved.


Ahhh, a missed opportunity.

I was going to ask her how she would feel playing God, but I realise that would backfire on me, because how would I feel playing God with 30 people instead of only one?
Call me: Will

Gear that I'm using most, in their respective colors:
Squier MIJ '62 Strat reissue
Orville '62 SG reissue
1972 Fender Musicmaster Bass Amp with various kinds of pedals.

My band, Cusche!
#24
She was too repititive, you won anyway buddy, cause she got DQed 4 bieng out of the kitchen
I think its time to pack your things lets go,
To a place where we both know,
And dont worry, I'll drive real slow,
Spend some time before we go..
#25
Quote by Kawzmo118
Ahhh, a missed opportunity.

I was going to ask her how she would feel playing God, but I realise that would backfire on me, because how would I feel playing God with 30 people instead of only one?



Well it must be hard to argue basically against yourself. We all agree that one person should be sacrificed to save more than one, or however many.

Even after it was dragged off topic you could have asked again, if the person(s) dying were going to a better place, then why did it matter who died?
Soon you will sit on the bench
of those who deny I have my soul
You sell a dream you create
Condemned by what you condemned before
Smooth are the words you sing down and high
Underground is your joy your laws
#26
Quote by CaptainRon
Damn right I'm a troll.

I saw everyone else doing posting stupid things so I figured I'd give it a try.


In that case you a both a tool and an idiot.
"We must become members of a new race, overcoming petty prejudice, owing our ultimate allegiance not to nations, but to our fellow men within the human community."
- H.I.M Haile Selassie I
#27
One of the unfortunate things about religious people is that there is no way of proving there is no salvation. Though I do like to say "Man created God in his own image, not the other way round" and see what evidence they can come up with to support the idea that God is essentially human with very high moral standards and if we meet those standards we get to float around in heaven.
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Wiggy = legend.

Devil's Advocate