Im a little confused... my guitar teacher gave me these two scales and told me to figure out what they mean but i cant figure all of it out?

|---------------------------------0-1-3-5-7-8|
|--------------------------0-1-3|
|----------------------0-2----|
|---------------0-2-3--------|
|--------0-2-3---------------|
|-0-1-3----------------------|

Iv figured out that it is like a version of the natural scale but is there more to it?

this is it in notes
|---------------------------------E-F-G-A-B-C|
|--------------------------B-C-D---------------|
|----------------------G-A----------------------|
|---------------D-E-F--------------------------|
|--------A-B-C---------------------------------|
|-E-F-G----------------------------------------|

and the other one is a litle more complicated

|---------------------------------4-5-7|
|-----------------------------5-7-------|
|----------------------4-6-7-----------|
|---------------4-6-7------------------|
|--------4-5-7-------------------------|
|-4-5-7--------------------------------|

and he gave me this right bellow it?
124 124 134 134 24 124
that's e phrygian
The first one is the Phrygian Mode of the C major scale. In other words, you play the C major scale but start and end on E.
2nd one should be Ab locrian, correct me if I'm wrong
ok thanks guys
what are the numbers he gave me at the end?
Quote by bnull24
The first one is the Phrygian Mode of the C major scale. In other words, you play the C major scale but start and end on E.
Modes arent just major scales starting on different notes. For modes you need a root note and tonic. It might seem like I'm being pedantic and annoying, but theres a big difference and its really important.

The first is C major. The second is A major.

Although I dont mind doing your homework, wouldnt it be better for you if you did it yourself?
below numbers are fingering for that scale.
first one: E phrygian (C major starting on its 3rd, E)
second one: G# locrian (A major starting on its 7th, G# - this CANNOT be A flat locrian as the second note would be B double flat)
third one: F locrian (Gb major starting on its 7th, F)

not to question the post above me, but for the sake of simplicity, the seven basic modes are derived from taking a basic major scale and shifting the note from which you start. if you start with a C major scale (C D E F G A B C) and then begin the scale at D, you have D E F G A B C D which is D Dorian. Progressing as such, you would get E Phrygian, F Lydian, G Mixolydian, A Aeolian (natural minor), and B Locrian. Of course, to imply these modes of the C scale you would have to play them over certain chords, etc, but this is basically the gist of modes.
Quote by demonofthenight
Modes arent just major scales starting on different notes. For modes you need a root note and tonic. It might seem like I'm being pedantic and annoying, but theres a big difference and its really important.

The first is C major. The second is A major.

Although I dont mind doing your homework, wouldnt it be better for you if you did it yourself?

well thank you.. i tried to figure it out by myself but i got stuck i figured out all i could about it but thanks
Quote by gbdp54
first one: E phrygian (C major starting on its 3rd, E)
second one: G# locrian (A major starting on its 7th, G# - this CANNOT be A flat locrian as the second note would be B double flat)
third one: F locrian (Gb major starting on its 7th, F)

not to question the post above me, but for the sake of simplicity, the seven basic modes are derived from taking a basic major scale and shifting the note from which you start. if you start with a C major scale (C D E F G A B C) and then begin the scale at D, you have D E F G A B C D which is D Dorian. Progressing as such, you would get E Phrygian, F Lydian, G Mixolydian, A Aeolian (natural minor), and B Locrian. Of course, to imply these modes of the C scale you would have to play them over certain chords, etc, but this is basically the gist of modes.

wow someone knows there S**T thanks
Quote by gbdp54
first one: E phrygian (C major starting on its 3rd, E)
second one: G# locrian (A major starting on its 7th, G# - this CANNOT be A flat locrian as the second note would be B double flat)

yeah, spelling Ab locrian is more complicated than spelling G# locrian, but that doesn't mean Ab locrian is wrong. Bbb is enharmonic with the A in G# locrian. it depends on the context.
Last edited by lupin347 at Aug 31, 2008,
Quote by lupin347
yeah, spelling Ab locrian is more complicated than spelling G# locrian, but that doesn't mean Ab locrian is wrong. Bbb is enharmonic with the A in G# locrian
How many times would you ever see a song in the key of Bbb? That would have 9 flats in it (yes, more flats than notes). How is that not wrong?
every thing you wrote is the C major scale pattern.
Quote by demonofthenight
How many times would you ever see a song in the key of Bbb? That would have 9 flats in it (yes, more flats than notes). How is that not wrong?

you're missing my point. just because there's that many flats doesn't mean it's wrong
Quote by demonofthenight
How many times would you ever see a song in the key of Bbb? That would have 9 flats in it (yes, more flats than notes). How is that not wrong?

Being outside of common usage doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong. Nobody would want to read music in Bbb, but you can if you really do want to for some trippy reason.
Quote by lupin347
you're missing my point. just because there's that many flats doesn't mean it's wrong

It's not wrong, but it definitely isn't right. You're defending a dead point, because how many musicians that you know would write a song in the key of Bbb?

EDIT: Above, refer to my post as well. It's pointless and a waste of time writing a song in Bbb instead of A. And what demon said about the modes is also correct, those are scales, not modal passages. They don't have any context to suggest a phrygian/ locrian mode. The first one even ends on C! How can that be E phrygian?
Last edited by st.stephen at Aug 31, 2008,
Quote by st.stephen
It's not wrong, but it definitely isn't right. You're defending a dead point, because how many musicians that you know would write a song in the key of Bbb?
So is it right or wrong? Lets take this from an objective standpoint.

In all honesty, trolling aside, you would need to use at least 4 or 5 fluent key changes (as in, you not doing something thats unprepared) to get to Bbb, probably more. Otherwise, its best to use A. Why you would have more than 3 key changes in the same movement or part, I have no idea (although theres nothing wrong with changing keys every movement).
To be completely blunt - those tabs are clearly clearly clearly two major scales.

For the TS - the first one is C major. The second is A major. Ignore the modal guff you've been given, as it's simply farrrrrr to complex for you and isn't correct or correctly explained in this thread either.

For the rest of you - please, try and keep in mind the TS's current level of theory knowledge before suggesting crazy ideas like "phrygian this" and "Ab locrian that". He can't recognise an extremely common major scale shape - how are you going to help by insisting on various modal "solutions"?